[Closed] What track saw?

I'm super happy as a more serious DIYer with the Makita 36v. Worked out £240 for the bare tool via a german tool distributor on one of ebay's 10% off days. Track about £45.

A lot of the time you want an extractor hooked up so not quite untethered freedom but it's one less thing to snag and plug in, I had the batteries anyway and sometimes handy to do a quick cut without the extractor outside. Apparently the Mafell dust bag fits and works perfectly but I've not tried that yet.

Skillbuilder on youtube reviewed/compared loads recently and there's endless other reviews out there. The Titan one from screwfix looks OK for a cheap mains one, uses Festool/Makita track too.

I do love a cordless tool but I've gone for mains as I mostly use it with a dust extract so cordless doesn't add much (other than a lot of cost). I've got the Festool HK55. Picked it up when it was on special a while back, couldn't justify it at full price. Great tool. Lovely cut. Much easier to use than my old method with a straight edge of MDF and a much better finish. Thoroughly recommended. Got it from FFX who are usually good but they are currently £80 more than I paid

I have a Bosch track saw but am looking to replace with Festool as the dust extraction is much better with the Festool.

At the other end of the scale, noticed Aldi had one in last week. Anyone got one?

I have the Makita 36v. Can't recommend it enough really. Brilliant saw.

Has a facility to make a score cut at the flick of a button which is handy. It also has a little tab that stops it falling off the track when doing mitre cuts and having it canted over.

I think you want 4 or 5 amp hour batteries with it really. I loves it.

The Triton one seems good for the money but comes with pretty short tracks. It's really nice to have an uninterrupted section.

Peter Millard rates it.

I have a Bosch track saw but am looking to replace with Festool as the dust extraction is much better with the Festool.

That is something I have noticed. I have several rotating saws (circular saw, chop saw, etc) and the festool rail saw is by far the best for dust extraction.

That is something I have noticed. I have several rotating saws (circular saw, chop saw, etc) and the festool rail saw is by far the best for dust extraction.

I think they design for it right from the start, whereas everyone else just tags on a dust port at the end and doesn't care how well it works.

Although, having said that I have the Festool Kapex Chop Saw and the dust extraction is OK, but not great - have to say I'm a bit dissapointed on what was the best part of a grand's worth of saw...

I've just bought the Makita too. Deliberated about whether to go for the cordless (I have a drill and impact driver with 2x4A batteries).

In the end I decided to go with the corded version. My thinking is that its not going to have a particularly hard life - so I will be expecting it to last me a long time.... longer than the batteries last and the platform is supported. I think if you're a tradesman who can justify something this expensive every other year, platform longevity is less important.

As for performance, it's awesome. Made a few basic Melamine units/carcases and its super quick and easy to get bob-on cuts. The scribe function is great (not sure if the others have that - the festool maybe?), and worth noting that it ships with a really good 40 or 42 tooth blade too.

The only other one I really considered was the Bosch - its apparently a clone of the Mafell.

I got the Aldi one, happy with it for 80 quid!

It's probably nowhere near the quality of Festool, but I'm just a garage bodger and not a pro so I reckon price+my skill=value for money

I have a Bosch track saw but am looking to replace with Festool as the dust extraction is much better with the Festool.

Its worth noting that there are two Bosch Track saws - the more recent 'GKT' version is a clone of (well actually made in the same factory as) the Mafell rail saw and is equally awsome - including in the extraction department. But quite a lot cheaper

To my mind unless you're working without an extractor theres not much point in paying a premium for cordless as you're attached to a hose anyway and lose the option to have auto stop/start without faffy bluetooth stuff. Tools that use pair of batteries can cause their own issues too and get into all sorts of problems with charging if they're out of sync.

In my experience the maffel rail its just tons better than the Festool one, so unless you're invested in other Festool stuff that uses the same rails then the Bosch is a much cheaper way of having a saw that uses Mafell's style of rail

Tools that use pair of batteries can cause their own issues too and get into all sorts of problems with charging if they’re out of sync.

Never had the slightest problem to be honest. I'll often pick a battery from two different tools that have had different use, and so different charge levels, wang them on the plunge saw together, no issues. They both then get charged and all is good.

In terms of extraction,  most rail saws perform fairly well as the blade cuts upwards and is so enclosed and so allows efficient collection. However, if you're cutting right on the edge of a board trimming off a thin strip, then you get a lot of dust.

I don't think Festool have a monopoly on good dust extraction. I've got the big 12" Bosch chop saw and it's brilliant for collecting dust. My Makita plunge saw works great for that too.

Festool are nice but they ain't the be all and end all. A bit like Santa Cruz... 😂

The Mafell has the best dust extraction , due to the blade change system there is no hole in the guard for the arbor bolt. The Skillbuilder and other reviews demonstrate it quite well.
The tracks are better if you need to join them , but are not compatible with anything apart from Bosch, The Mafell saw will run on the Festool/Makita track but you need to be careful of the slide strips not tilting the saw slightly, or use the older no slip strip Festo/Festool rails.
I own both the Festool and Mafell corded saws + the Lidl Parkside saw , the expensive ones were bought second hand - well used so its interesting to compare them after they have been worked for a few years, basically the Mafell is better built , more sturdy by quite some margin.
So my view - unless you work mostly on-site cordless is an expensive option as the tool is life limited, Festool are nice and light, slightly under powered , Mafell a tool for life , has scoring as well , I had my hands on a Makita corded and that felt good - reputed to be powerful too.
The Parkside (Lidl) is remarkable - works on the Festool/Makita tracks and is more similar in build to the Festool than the Mafell, yes its £70 not £400 , but it does the job.
Tracks and track length are quite important , the short 700mm supplied with the cheap saws are a bit of a pain as getting a smooth accurate run with the joined track takes a bit of setting up,
1.6m std rails from the Mafell are too long and unwieldy for general use , the 1.4 from Festool are only a bit better , so its really advisable to have something like 3 rails - 2 long 1.4/1.6m for cutting down sheets and a shorter 800mm/1m rail for all the shorter work.
There is a lot of choice out there , and the basics are covered by pretty much all the offerings - its down to what you need them for and how they best fit your need.

The Aldi one looks to me like a Scheppach. Not compared the specs like for like to see which version. Possibly this one
https://www.screwfix.com/p/scheppach-pl55-160mm-plunge-saw-240v/8781g which I bought 6 years for ago for ~ £120 in order to build the units in a VW campervan. It had a lot of use for 2 years and more occasional use since then. Still going fine.
I did get a different blade (for finer work) and had to spend a bit of time resetting the 90deg angle stop but for the amount of use I needed it for I couldn't justify the likes of a Festool.

If using outside, then I guess the cordless one might be useful, otherwise I always have a vacuum attached which means you may as well be corded. The amount of dust is trivial with the vacuum attached.

My Makita has been flawless.
My only minor gripes are
1) that the mm depth measurement doesn't start at the underside of the track, so when cutting 15mm ply you have to set it to roughly 19mm, etc and it becomes a guessing game - always worth checking anyway, but it annoys me as nobody is going to use the saw without the track.
2) I think the tracks are a touch short. When cutting full sheets, you have to start the cut on top of the workpiece and plunge, rather than plunge off the piece and then push through into the workpiece.

Other than that it's totally transformed my workflow and taken all the effort out of making square pieces of wood on demand. An absolute revelation. My yearning for a table saw has completely gone.

I have the festool cordless. Does a good job of dust extraction with the bag attached. Handy when you need to cut down longer lengths to get it in the van

AlexSimon

In response to your gripes:

I use my saw without the track if the large circular saw is not handy. Is easy to add on 5mm to the cut depth and you get a better finish if the blade projects below the item being cut, just use something as a sacrificial base.

It sounds like you are centering the rail on the board, you need to have the rail biased towards the start of the cut. You only need about 50mm rail overhang at the end of the cut.

I prefer using a table saw for lots of repeat cuts, saves having to measure, mark and then set the rail repeatedly. Although my Bosch table saw's rail is a bit shit and moves, so I generally have to do two runs, a rough cut and then a finer cut where I'm more careful not to load the fence as it slips quite easily.

Peter Millard rates it.

Logged in to link to that very video..!

As an amateur bodger I treated myself to the Festool TS55 (+ extractor) for my 40th birthday. Doesn't get nearly the use it deserves, but my principle was that tools that are way better than me mean only I am to blame for failing to measure twice before cutting....

Just bought the Aldi saw. Down a tenner at £70, the Declaration of Conformity is by Scheppach, and the model is Workzone (Aldi tool brand) PL55...the Scheppach PL55 is around twice the price, so could have struck lucky, and there's a 3-year warranty

I think the only real catch with the Sheppach / Workzone/ Parklife (?) is when you tilt the blade. Most other brands arrange things so that when the blade is tilted the top of the cut is still on the same line as it would be if the blade was straight - ie against the splinter guard. With the Scheppach the blade moves off that cutting line when its tilted - infant IIRC it moves the blade so that it cuts into the splinter guard so as well as being a problem for any bevelled cuts after you've made those cuts you've no longer got the splinter guard tight to the blade for future 90deg cuts

@maccruiskeen Thanks, I'll guard against for that 🙂

I’m using a b&q cheapo circular saw and a home made track. It’s more faff than the bought options discussed above that I’m watching with interest but only use it to rip sheets down.

@footflaps - the rail on my Bosch table saw has adjustable tension to stop it moving located at the opposite end of the clamp. Once set It’s pretty good. I can’t fault it, any error is mine.

does anyone just draw a line and use a plain circular saw when cutting sheet? I've been looking at tracksaws but so far I've not had any issues with free cutting, I find the blade wants.to cut in a.straight line so much easier than I expected.

Yes, was using one before the tracksaw. Freehand fine for rougher work (like chopping down a sheet of OSB for the roof of the kids' playhouse) but not if I was cutting for a shelf or bookcase.

I made a simple guide/track thing to simplify cutting straight lines (mark in how far you need on either side, put the track down on the two marks) but still needed faffing about clamping it and was easy to wander off the other way if you weren't paying attention. Good cheap solution though if you already have a circular saw.

Tracksaw saves all the clamping and faff, put it down where you want the cut, whizz it along, done.

There is one very specific reason why the track saw is an advantage,
a normal circular saw has a sole plate same as track saw , however there is no guarantee that the edge of the sole plate is parallel to the blade - hence the varying experiences with a guide in some cases its actually quite dangerous if the two are out of parallel - adding the inherent safety of the enclosed blade and plunge spring makes the plunge track saw the default choice except for some specific uses.
Then you can debate about whether the track saw has a riving knife or not , whether its safe to use off track etc. That is quite complicated as the big names do have very different approaches re riving knife use - ie retracting for Festool - no physical knife for Mafell - but an electronic kickback technology instead.

Lots of great info, thanks!

Looking at the relative costs, I'm tempted to get a Lidl Parkside saw first just to see what they can do.... but how do I get my hands on one? Are they only in stores when there's an offer on?

Only in Stores when offer on - and certain stores that seem to have stock of offers way after they have run out elsewhere - so its somewhere like Ebay where they are sold at varying prices - sometimes at original price , the Workzone is available online at Aldi with free shipping and the (like Lidl) 3 year warranty - cant go wrong at the price.

I make fitted furniture and I've used 3 different saws, a £30 B&Q cheapo, a Makita non-rail saw and my current Festool TS55

You can get a perfectly clean cut from all of them as long as you follow a few basics - learning to make a 2mm score often helps, cutting with the finished edge underneath often helps. Some materials are more prone to chipping than others.

Even a non-rail saw can be made into a rail saw by making a "fence" (no, not that sort) out of 2 pieces of scrap.

It's also important to have a simple method of marking accurate 90 degree lines to cut along. If you have an old kitchen cupboard door, well that's close enough, screw a piece of wood on the bottom as a guide and you have a T square that's more accurate than a £50 bought one and it's free. I now use an MFT-style board,benchdogs and an integrated rule to keep my cuts square, and it lets me make repetitive cuts quickly and accurately so I don't need a chop saw.

Take a bit of time to learn to get the blade running at exactly 90 degrees and with the right amount of toe-in which will improve results enormously.

Dust extraction is so important if you're doing a lot, or you're working in a place where you son't want it getting everywhere.

Ear Defenders are an absolute must.

I've been using the Screwfix Titan track saw for a few years now. Great bit of kit, and probably my most used tool. I don't have room for a proper table saw, but the track saw allows me to do pretty accurate plywood cutting for various DIY projects.

Looking at the relative costs, I’m tempted to get a Lidl Parkside saw first just to see what they can do….

Personally I'd say go for the Titan from Screwfix for that area of money. It's well regarded.

I haven't read many of the other comments but I've used a lot of different ones and my preference is the Festool TS55, can't see point of cordless as I always use mine with an extractor so is never tether free anyway.

Personally I’d say go for the Titan from Screwfix for that area of money. It’s well regarded.

I stopped by Aldi this evening and they had their Workforce saws down to £70...so I bought one! The saw looks like it's a re-labelled Scheppach PL55. Worth sticking with it, or should I consider the Titan instead?

my preference is the Festool TS55

If I was committing (a lot) more money, I'd go for the Festool TS 55 too.

I will see what use I get out of the cheaper saw first

I stopped by Aldi this evening and they had their Workforce saws down to £70…so I bought one! The saw looks like it’s a re-labelled Scheppach PL55. Worth sticking with it, or should I consider the Titan instead?

Well, if what Maccruiskeen said about them is right then I'd definitely take it back.

I think the only real catch with the Sheppach / Workzone/ Parklife (?) is when you tilt the blade. Most other brands arrange things so that when the blade is tilted the top of the cut is still on the same line as it would be if the blade was straight – ie against the splinter guard. With the Scheppach the blade moves off that cutting line when its tilted – infant IIRC it moves the blade so that it cuts into the splinter guard so as well as being a problem for any bevelled cuts after you’ve made those cuts you’ve no longer got the splinter guard tight to the blade for future 90deg cuts

...Scheppach the blade moves off that cutting line when its tilted

I've cut some 9mm ply down at 90° and the results were very good with the 24T blade. There's a very slight step where the track is joined, I don't know if that's normal, but it isn't entirely smooth when cutting
Trend make a blade with a 2.4mm kerf so spares will be available at a reasonable price (the Scheppach blades are more expensive)
I'll try a 45° cut when it's daylight, but measuring suggests that the blade may "move" 2mm off the splinter guard rather than into it, but I'll try that properly and report back...

If it cuts into the guide like that I would take it back - do they all do that ? That sounds like a defective saw rather than by design . Any of the cheap saws will need some checking/setup ,
even the expensive ones are out of tolerance sometimes , its easier to get them adjusted by specialist dealers or dedicated service depts - thats what some of the higher cost goes into.

You are suppose to trim the "splinter guard" strip on first use (if we're talking about the same thing). Peter Millard does that in the video up there ^

But, if when tilting off 90 deg the saw then cuts into the guard strip after it has been trimmed that's not right. Nor is it moving off the line of the trimmed guard strip.

The saw I bought is still in it's box. Will have a look later

Has anyone watched the BOLTR teardown of the Festool TS 55?

EDIT: If you own one, perhaps don't watch it.

Yes , but I did not make the same mistake as he did and took the brushes out before splitting the field/armature , I got 3 of them as spares/repairs/broken , i can confirm that the armatures are a weak point , as all 3 were gone , + brushes/holders melted and one with a melted field coil as well,
2 saws were clearly heavily used - end of useful life , one is in very good looked after condition.
its not surprising the Festool saws are the most common and have been in daily use for years.
Best indication of mileage is the sole plate , the coating wears off and the metal underneath wears down under heavy use , cutting plasterboard wrecks them.

Tested the 45° cut...the blade doesn't cut into but cuts under the rubber splinter strip. That means that if you drop the splinter strip onto your pencil line the 45° kerf at the top surface will be part inside the line and part outside.
@maccruiskeen, thanks for pointing that out
Most of my work will be 90° cuts, so for the money I'm more than happy

EDIT: If you own one, perhaps don’t watch it.

Not really sure what he was expecting to find, a solid gold body, diamond encrusted bearings? It's a nicely designed tool, fit for purpose and well liked by its users.

So you pay a premium for a 'quality' brand, same as DeWalt, Makita etc.

The guy behind BOLTR seems to really know a fair bit about electronics, mechanics and materials. However, of the few videos I've watched, they follow the format of: Unbox, dismantle, slate construction/mechanics/electronics, leave item in pieces on workbench for a bit (weeks sometimes), put it back together, use for the first time then be surprised that the item is better than he expects/predicts.

So you pay a premium for a ‘quality’ brand, same as DeWalt, Makita etc.

Makita SPJ600, box and rail - £299

Festool TS55, box and rail - £441

You pay a premium for quality tools but for Festool, the price is even more premiumerer...

Festool make good tools for sure, but they're overpriced. Difficult to see £140 worth of better in their track saw for instance.

Festool make good tools for sure, but they’re overpriced. Difficult to see £140 worth of better in their track saw for instance.

There is a simple solution to this, don't buy one!

I don't, I haven't. Well, except the Domino, but that's only because they are exclusive to them. I just struggle to see why they are so praised and so expensive. They're good of course, but I've never seen the price justified above others personally.

Festool make good tools for sure, but they’re overpriced. Difficult to see £140 worth of better in their track saw for instance.

I got the Festool HK55 (with a box and rail) for less that the price of that Makita. In fact almost enough change to buy a second rail, so not really a premium price

The track saw is one of their most competitively priced products.. , the others are more expensive, you do get 3 years warranty and 3 years theft insurance which is quite attractive for mobile workers , originally there were no competitors Festo brought out the modern track saw in 1980 ,
It took time for them to become popular and then workers soon saw(sorry) others using them and how much faster and more accurately they could work especially in a mobile environment - add to that the dust extraction - a very real long term worry that Festool made a point of having a solid solution for each application it was and still is a major selling point.

I assumed this was going to be about folding saws for track maintenance....

Should have realised when it was in the Chat forum 😳

The track saw is one of their most competitively priced products.. , the others are more expensive, you do get 3 years warranty and 3 years theft insurance which is quite attractive for mobile workers , originally there were no competitors Festo brought out the modern track saw in 1980 ,

Didn't know that. That's very good, and yes they undoubtedly innovate.

Still blummin expensive though 😂

Mafell mt55 if you want rolls Royce performance.its better than the ts55 festool which I used to think was great
It's not cheap but i can't afford to buy cheap tools.
3 year warranty and German manufactured

For anyone looking at the Scheppach PL55 track saw then Screwfix have it done to £135 for today only.

The Aldi PL55 saw (made by Scheppach) is £70 in store or £80 online

Probably a good place to ask....

I'm after a decent square for DIY stuff. Got a couple of cheaper small ones, but would like something a bit bigger , 30cm +, and want some recommendations.

Thanks in advance

Si

Dewalt premium 12 inch rafter square is good. £20 in screwfix
Stanley plastic one isnt too bad either

The rafter squares etc. have all turned out to be too inaccurate for my work. Peter Millard has a Youtube feature on making your own.

I use 2 only - the little 150mm Bahco Combination square which is a real gem, and a kitchen cupboard door. Get a nice B&Q square edged MDF door, screw a piece of hardwood onto the bottom edge so you can butt it up against the piece you're cutting and there you go.
As a further refinement you can cut it into an L shape (makes it lighter) and the offcut can be re-cut into a smaller framing square.

There's a sure way to see if it really is square. Use it to make a right angled line on a board, turn it over and draw a second line a few mm away. If the lines are parallel, it's square. If not, not.

Thanks guys - great info there. Never thought of that really simple check for the squares I have. Doh!
Guess what I'll be doing tomorrow....

Can anyone recommend a cordless track saw that’s not too eye wateringly expensive? I could do with a track saw but don’t have access to electric points sometimes.

What's eye-watering in terms of price to you?

If you're already invested in a battery platform then that one, providing the brand make one.

I'm not sure there is really that many options for them currently.

As I say above, I'd certainly recommend my Makita, but it's by no means cheap.

Cheapest way might be to find the bare tool, then get eBay batteries, but it's a risk and probably a false economy.

I bought a Lidl one last year - Very impressed. It doesn't cut into the splinter guard when canted over (but does undercut it very slightly (<0.5mm) at full tilt which you can allow for when cutting 45 degree bevels). Seems better made / "nicer" than the Titan one in Screwfix. For @AlexSimon it has double markings on the depth stop - for use with / without the track.

I bought a Freud blade for it at the same time but the blade that came with it was pretty good, TBH (I was cutting laminated plywood and melamine faced chipboard). Extra track sections are available cheaply so I have two sections accurately aligned and permanently joined / epoxied together for a 1.4m track, along with the original 700mm long one. (Either that or get a Makita / Festool compatible track). Makita track clamps also fit the Lidl track and I have a pair of these for extra insurance when cutting £130/sheet laminated ply.

I used it pretty much every day for 3 months last summer and it's still like new. It's not a professional quality tool (no soft start, no blade brake, no quick scribe cut, mediocre dust capture, etc.) but it's pretty damn good. It beats the hell out of the DIY guide / circular saw that I had been using previously in terms of accuracy, speed, ease of use and edge quality.

For @AlexSimon it has double markings on the depth stop

Win

Peter Millard has produced a series of videos on using a Track Saw. He seems to be using the Aldi saw, going from setup to techniques to use on projects. Well worth a watch

Thought I’d ask here rather than start a new thread - I picked up the Aldi track saw recently and I’m looking for additional track for working with full sheets. Has anyone found a source oF inexpensive compatible track?

The Peter Millard channel on YouTube will tell you everything you need to know.
You will lose 10 hours of your life. He really is that addictive. I'm on a 4 week holiday in Sri Lanka and I keep checking for updates!

I’m looking for additional track for working with full sheets

The Aldi saw is actually a Scheppach PL55. Google Scheppach tracks, make sure it's one for PL55 and not PL45, which I don't think is compatible

The cheapo track saw I mentioned on page 1 failed at the weekend. I think I paid about £60-70 for it and when I think of how little it’s been used, combined with slop and how some of the guide parts fared, have written of cheapo tools as false economy. The guide rail I made worked well but was clunky and a pita compared to a proper track

I got lucky and replaced it with a Dewalt DWS520 that for £95 (display model) and a 1.5m track for £60.

It’s a revelation. Much easy to use, so accurate and way better built (no slop, quality knobs etc).

I've decided that I need a better blade (160x20) for my Aldi/Scheppach tracksaw as I'd like a smoother cut, what should I buy?

I’ve decided that I need a better blade (160×20) for my Aldi/Scheppach tracksaw as I’d like a smoother cut, what should I buy?

Based on Peter Millard's demonstrations I bought this blade from Trend:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Trend-Saw-blade-fine-trim-165mm-x-48-teeth-x-20mm-for-plunge-saws/253066524478

Not fitted it yet though

Would the extra 5mm on that blade make any difference?

Yes , the zero stop on depth will be 2.5 mm out , on some saws you can adjust for that , the later Festool and Mafell for sure - others not sure apart from Parkside (Lidl) which you cannot .

"Would the extra 5mm on that blade make any difference?"

Would it even fit in the housing??

I might have overlooked something then. Is the Aldi saw definitely 160mm?

Aldi saw is 160.

The depth gauge is out on that anyway, you have to add extra for the thickness of the track.

If the 165mm blade fits into the saw housing then setting the depth gauge to the material thickness plus 5mm for the track will give an ideal cut. Going only 2-3mm past the required depth means the saw teeth don't break out of the material (another Peter Millard tip).

I might see if the Trend blade is available in 160mm as it gave a really good cut on birch ply in Peter's video, comparable to a Festool blade (albeit a used one)

Machine Mart have them...

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/c/circular-saw-blades-2/?blade-diameter-mm=160

That's not quite the same one. It was the Waveform one that Peter Millard used

What does the waveform one do different then?

What does the waveform one do different then?

No idea! 🙂

But I think this is the one:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TREND-160MM-48T-2-2MM-TCT-SAW-BLADE-FESTOOL-TS55-PLUNGE-SAW-FT-160X48X20A/303039813679?epid=16011373602&hash=item468e94982f:g:mI8AAOSwXIdcSeML:rk:1:pf:1&frcectupt=true

Another blade option from Key Blades, this gave a great cut too as I remember and the reviews back that up

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B07C6GCVBW/ref=ox_sc_act_image_1?smid=A1O7JDUV0MLJ2O&psc=1

Re cheap extra track - I've got the Lidl parkside saw and have just ordered another 4 700mm lengths of track and joiner bars for £30 delivered direct from kompernass who deal with all the Soares and servicing of parkside tools.

I dont know if the Aldi saw is compatible with the Lidl track - I know my saw will run on festool rails but I was shocked at how cheap the replacements were.

Perhaps Aldi can offer replacements for their saw at a similar price?

I make a living out of fitting kitchens. For many years I used a Skill circular saw and a piece of 6x1 with clamps as a guide rail and it worked well. But times move on and I bought a Dewalt plunge saw and rails soon after they came out. It was a step up but when it packed in I bought the Festool. This is a different world! But at a price that most diy'ers could not justify. since then every new power tool I have bought has been Festool. - Dust extractor, 10.8volt drill, 1/2" router.