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I need some help and advice on a tubeless setup. So far it has claimed four tyre levers, one tyre and several hours of my life.
This is not the normal for me; until now I have had a good experience with tubeless and set up loads of wheels including for friends and family I have changed them at home, in a car park, on the trail.But this really did have be beaten.
The components are:
- Stans Arch EX 27.5”
- Bontrager XR4 27.5” 2.35” (previously used and now ruined by blowing it off the rim which seems to have stretched it as well as damaging my ears!)
- Stans Fluid
- Two wraps of Gorilla tape (later reduced to one but it didn't really help)
- Muc-off tubeless valves
The main issue has been just how tight the tyre is on the rim, I know how to get the tyre bead into the central lower section of the rim and can normally remove/install tyres by hand or with a single tyre lever but this setup is ridiculously tight!
To maintain my sanity I gave up and put an inner tube in with conventional rim tape and a used Maxxis Minion DHR but that was still very very difficult. Before round three I would value recommendations on:
- The best tyre levers for difficult tyres/rims
- The best rim tape for Stans Arch EX or is there a bespoke rim strip I can buy?
- The tyre that will give me the best chance of reasonable installation whilst being good for trail riding and not blowing the budget (so <£40 and 2.2” or more) particularly interested in Specialized as that went on the same rim at the front with less fight and there is a sale at the minute
- Technique or tips to make it easier (heat the tyre, freeze the rim – that sort of thing!)
Thanks in advance!
This works for me:
Pedros levers
Tesa tape off eBay (get the right width for you rim)
Isopropyl alcohol
Wet and Dry paper
Clean the rims with IPA and lightly rub with IPA wetted wet & dry
2 wraps of Tesa tape on the clean rims (pulling taut)
Fit valves
Bit of soapy water on the tyre bead
Double check tyre logos aligned to valves (this is critical 😉
Pump up the tyre till the bead pops onto the rim (check all the way around rim)
Deflate - add Stan's sealant - reinflate and swoosh sealant around
Worked for me on multiple rims & tyres - always used Maxxis DHR or high roller or Spesh Butcher or purgatory (tubeless ready always)
For ease of use though the Stans rim strips are hard to beat and save the tape faff
Take it to a shop and get them to do it.
If the tyre is that tight that you cannot get it onto the rim there is probably nothing you are doing wrong (especially as you are not inexperienced).
I have come across a few very tight tyres but they go on with tyre levers and as tubeless no risk of pinching the tube so can be heavy handed.
Stans rims are a bit closer tolerance than some and the bead well is also shallower. It makes tight tyres even more apparent. Two layers of gorrilla tape is going to be quite a bit thicker than the Tesa tape they recommend. It could be just the difference you need, especially if the tyres are tight.
@richwales - thanks a great set of tips there 🙂 I'd not heard of Tesa tape so will order some of that. And of course I will align the tyre/rim logos! I was thinking Specialized so good to hear those are what you use.
@yourguitarhero - I need to be able to get it on/off trailside so not interested in a shop doing it tbh. Besides despite the struggle I would rather do it myself so planning to tool up with the right bits and get it done.
Never had serious problems with Bonty tyres so it may be one of those tyre/rim combos that is problematic.
If possible I unfold the tyre at least a day before I'm going to fit it so it gets closer to its proper shape. Have everything warm. Get the tyre onto the rim and work the beads as close to the rim edge as possible. (Have never bothered with soapy water). Remove valve core, inflate until the tyre seats, I use an airshot. Add sealant through the valve. Replace valve core. Inflate to desired pressure. Go ride.
You shouldn't need to remove a tubeless tyre until it's time to completely replace it. The only cases are a sidewall cut that anchovies won't deal with and dinged rims. Everything else can be dealt with with the tyre still mounted.
Stans rims and Bonty tyres are a bit of a nightmare combination - as Scienceofficer says, they both have pretty tight tolerances, so even an additional wrap of thick tape could push it beyond what's easily doable
Gorilla tape isn't helping, the thicker the tape the harder it is to fit, i'd take the gorilla tape off, clean the rim, then check the next tyre you want to install on the rim without any tape, if it's all good then try one wrap of proper stans or the likes, prep the rim properly before taping to reduce any leaks that'll require a second wrap.
Some great tips here and looks a significant factor was picking the tyre/rim combo I had to hand.
I broke three tyre levers (the blue park tool ones) bent two and snapped a third trying to get a tight tyre on about a month ago. I took it to the LBS in the end and watched the mechanic struggle with it. He warmed the bead up with a blow torch and used a huge tyre lever wwhich I then bought off him!
If it was that tight to fit, how are you going to remove/refit on the trailside?
Are you carrying the 'huge tyre lever' in your backpack?
If it was that tight to fit, how are you going to remove/refit on the trailside?
It will probably be a bit of a struggle, and yep I do carry the tyre lever with me.
I just had to give up on a tyre for the first time yesterday. Took it to a shop and watched the mechanic put it on in about ten seconds with no tools.
Good gloves help a lot in my experience. I use the kind that have sort of foamy rubber coating on the palm side: good grip and some cushion.
I normally get one fine with this sort of thing having used wtb rims / DT Swiss rims with a variety of tyres - Maxxis / Oneup / Specialized / Schwalbe.
However I nearly got beaten putting on some new Specialized tyres for a mate onto wtb sti23 rims recently.
The Specialized 2.3” purgatory grid was tight but relatively ok once I sprayed the bead with a bit of water to get it to seat properly.
However the 2.3 Butcher Black Diamond was a right bugger. Once on the rim it seated ok ish, but getting it ok was a nightmare. Tried stretching it round the rim to give me some slack and getting it into the well etc but even with tyre levers I was on the verge of giving up.
So my suggestion is avoid black diamond sidewalls if you go Specialized and have had issues with your rims being tight.
Also suggest thinner tape as per above - stan’s / wtb / Tesa tape is all the same stuff as far as I’m aware. Always gone on well for me - just really stretch it as you pull it down onto the rim to get it to form into the angles of the rim. 1 wrap works fine just with a few inches overlap either side of the rim.
I've found specialized TLR tyres to be a really easy setup, although not tried them on that rim (used them a lot on stans 26 rims though). So that is a good range to be looking at IMHO - good reliable tyres and usually decent prices.
Soapy water can really make the difference in lubricating the bead. Had a bitch of a road tyre to go on a disk wheel that was hard to mainipulate - a team of orangutans couldn't have got it mounted. Just a small amount of soapy water all the way around the bead was enough to get it on.
Tesa 4289 is what people are referring to BTW.
Applying the tape: I find stretching taut and 'walking' into the well helps - sort of wiggle left to right (a bit like moving a washing machine) with a thumb press into the well in between changes of direction.