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OK, hot off the press... Wiggle and CRC are to make a return. We honestly don't know what this corporate speak below actually means, so we've reached ...
By stwhannah
Get the full story here:
https://singletrackmag.com/2024/03/frasers-group-to-relaunch-wiggle-and-chain-reaction-websites/
Do Frasers actually know anything about bikes?
I'm expecting a load of cheap tat covered in Muddy Fox logos....
I suspect we'll see a rebranded Evans. I'll be very surprised if they were to come up with anything genuinely new, there's simply not the time to do it.
We honestly don’t know what this corporate speak below actually means
It's not that hard. They are saying they want to utilise the brands they bought along with Chiggle.
But how they'll do that is unclear.
Does that mean DHB & Nukeproof logos on the crappy Muddyfox clothes they currently sell? Or ordering some of the successful lines that were previously sold / even developing new ones with Chiggle's suppliers?
In the short term, I'd absolutely expect a white-labelled version of the Evans website with CRC and Wiggle branding.
We honestly don’t know what this corporate speak below actually means, so we’ve reached out
Oh the ironing....
@thegeneralist I nearly wrote (see what we did there…) but gave you more credit 🙂
but gave you more credit
Careful, it was that sort of behavior by the parent company that got them into this mess.
stwhannah
Full Member
@thegeneralist I nearly wrote (see what we did there…) but gave you more credit
The Edinburgh defence knows no bounds 😉
" I nearly wrote (see what we did there…) but gave you more credit 🙂"
I was 90% sure you'd reply saying that.
and 80% sure it would be in truth 🤣
But a little nagging part of me...,..
Can't wait to send it on a new Nukeproof BSO bought from my local Sports Direct.
Can't imagine it'll be anything more than a re-skin for the Evans website...but I do like 'Managing Director of Wheels'.
Surely they shoudl just be able to start selling DHB gear or Nukeproof bikes in Evans shops without a middleman and make more profit? Seems like a winner to me?
They are however experts at selling things so surly thats all you need for an online bike parts retailer ?
Does depend what they decide to sell and which bit of the market they target.
Like the bike spares rack in most Decathlons is like going back in time 30 years with 6 and 7 speed cassettes on the racks...
My hope would be that they'll re-launch the brands and re-employ the people behind them. From a business, if not ethical, perspective it makes sense as the employees get made redundant (and paid redundancy) then you can pick the ones you want to offer roles too under your own T&C's without having to TUPE the whole company.
I wonder if they bought all the remaining stock in the end?
I read the statement from Frasers to be that Wiggle and CRC will quickly re-launch and therefore the product offering will be what's already stored in Shirebrook and for sale on Evans.
Nukeproof, DHB, Ragley, etc are all up for sale/rent
My hope would be that they’ll re-launch the brands and re-employ the people behind them. From a business, if not ethical, perspective it makes sense as the employees get made redundant (and paid redundancy) then you can pick the ones you want to offer roles too under your own T&C’s without having to TUPE the whole company.
I read it as they will have a look at doing something like this but are also happy for another group to come along and stick a name on their kit? Doesn't necessarily mean BSO and could easily be similar to what went before. Let's be right, plenty of the CRC/Wiggle brands were decent but pretty basic. Shouldn't be too hard for a competitor to buy the same catalogue frames and put a Vitus decal on them.
Nukeproof, DHB, Ragley, etc are all up for sale/rent
All sold as part of the deal I thought?
Surely if they own the IP etc they can just speak to the factories and order more of the same stuff?
That's what I'd do.
They should have a good idea how bad the industry is still over-stocked on both soft goods and bikes.
Stick some orders in for popular Chiggle lines, informed by that.
They're probably still working it out TBH.
Do Frasers actually know anything about bikes?
Does it matter? It's just another website to flog stuff through.
I imagine they've only just got the keys to the website and so They'll probably be lobbing together a group composed of various Frasers/Sports Direct/Evans people to figure out what to actually do with the trainset they've just been handed.
If it was me I'd start by looking at current stock the group hold for cycling (and other sports) that could go on there, while deciding how best to exploit the brands they've just acquired, including "cheap tat covered in Muddy Fox/DHB/NP logos", but also looking at picking up with some (probably not all) former Chiggle suppliers' to pick up some of their legacy product lines...
I wouldn't expect anything too exciting, but Frasers as a group have clearly recognised the value of specific brands and online retailers in the cycling market, considering this isn't their first acquisition in the bicycle retail niche.
Russell Merry is a smart bloke, time served in the bike industry. Watch this space I reckon.
I want a crc pint mug
Chiggle
Reported
Nukeproof, DHB, Ragley, etc are all up for sale/rent
Are these not just sales brands though, not actually a unique brand themselves
When you look at the list of creditors it’s mainly far east bike manufacturers or bike related factories that clearly churn out a product that you stick your own brand name on.
i could be wrong but I assume they have bought wiggle/crc and related brands so they just go to any factory and ask them to start making DHB clothing or Nukeproof bikes.
I could be talking BS though but that’s what the creditors list looked like
Dhb, fohn , nukeproof and prime stuff is already being listed on the Evans site.
Can't see any bikes yet
They are however experts at selling things so surly thats all you need for an online bike parts retailer ?
They're going to start selling Surly bikes?
unexpected!
If they run these new retail businesses like the ones that their group already own then they’ll be efficient, keenly priced and offer a broad range of products.
The sports direct model built a very successful empire, let’s not forget that.
As Brant says, watch this space. There's some background stuff in all this and I'm interested to see how it plays out.
‘Online drop ship’
Maybe they’re going to take off and nuke the entire site from orbit - it’s the only way to be sure!
Looking at the knockdown prices Ashley was flogging 5 / 10s for it seems he thinks of them as just another far east pair of daps to flog ? Either no concept of the legacy of the brand or just doesn't care .Or were they vastly overpriced in the first place ? I understand they haven't been as good since Adidas bought them ?
Karrimor is one brand in particular that comes to mind among others.
They'll have been priced on what is a good return on what they paid for them not some romantic notion of what they used to be valued at 20 years ago. Grumpy stuff is being "devalued" but also grumpy if the business makes money.
As for Karrimor, both the kid and I have shoes by them and they've outlasted everything else in terms of waterproof and wear and tear while also being cheaper than the competition.
Neither me nor my child are your wife and we don't have a dog but thanks for that.
I’m sorry if I’ve caused offence. I’m just trying to say that we found that the value stuff from Decathlon lasted better for the same price
People will still buy stuff from them and they'll be unaware of the buyout. Not me personally and god help anyone who buys a bike from them that develops problems.
This just be turned into the UK version of Aliexpress.
commercial partnerships to enhance and expand these own-brand lines through development, sales, licensing, and international distribution opportunities.
Translates as “Sell a bunch of cheaply manufactured low quality tat under their newly acquired brand names” - same as they did with their other acquisitions - see Karrimor etc
🤔 Well that's two websites I'll try to avoid in the future 🤷♂️
Based upon their previous acquisitions, you'd have to imagine a £5.99 delivery fee etc. I can't see them not selling half decent bike kit/spares (in addition to driving their own brands into the ground with inferior quality etc) as they'll easily rank on Google for anything they list.
I think what lots of folks forget is that Ashley's shops specialise in selling to the general public what the general public want, and they're very good at it. As as been mentioned on the thread already, Sports Direct is a money making machine. In a away that [conspicuously] CRC-Wiggle, as it turns out, wasn't.
There's probably enough online kit sellers who specialise in the sort of kit that folks on this forum want to buy, if there are too many, another over-leveraged one is going to go bust soon, if there are too few, then maybe resurrected CRC-Wiggle will get back into the specialist market again. But as that isn't Ashley's AoE, I doubt it frankly.
Maybe Nukeproof will become another BSO brand, maybe dhb will suddenly be in the Ath-leisure wear market, maybe they won't, if they have the things that I want to buy, I'll buy them, if not I'll get my 12 speed just-so-labelled-product that meets my niche requirements for acceptance the trail head car park from somewhere else...
Sad demise of CRC.
I doubt Mike Ashley will lose any sleep over losing a customer base who can’t have been profitable. They focus on low cost items and that’s a formula they are annoyingly successful at.
They will also create some jobs probably for those made redundant.
Quote (editing functions seem to be missing on STW) "Based upon their previous acquisitions, you’d have to imagine a £5.99 delivery fee" quote
Just been looking for a specific pair of running shorts. Available at, and with delivery charge of:
Sports Direct - £9.99
Field and Trek - £5.99
Frasers - £4.99
Go figure. 🤔
Well that's it resurrected and full of crap
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/falcon-xc18-mountain-bike-821793#colcode=82179308
Well that’s it resurrected and full of crap
As predicted, it's a reskinned version of the Evans site.
On the plus size you can sort by discount now....
This is the bit i don't understand.... WHY ? If you have the Evans site, what's the point of creating a new webiste with the CRC name ? There must be something i'm missing here other than them having 2 websites selling the same thing.
Because it gives a bigger market share. If 5 of the top 10 Google results point to 5 of your shops and your competitors have one each then you're more likely to get the sale.
But surely that depends on you actually selling the things people are Googling for ? If they stop selling the things, then no amount of searching will bring up their site. If they go to the lower end market of stacking crap and selling cheap, then does it matter how many websites you have ?
a bigger net catches more fish
Why would they "stop selling things"?
Actually have a look at what they are selling, the site is chock full of Adidas, endura, Trek, Cannondale.
I'm fairly sure one of the most successful high street businesses minds knows how to spend and make money.
Any news on nukeproof warranty. Are the New CRC just going to tell you to do one? All a bit confusing if you bought something 8 months ago and were oblivious to the changes
On the plus side, you can now sort by highest discount. Boom.
And it's a sad day when the only bike brand being sold by CRC/Wiggle that appeals to me is Brompton. No interest in Trek, Whyte, Cannondale, PInnacle or Cube, especially compared to the bike brands we've lost (Nukeproof, Vitus, Ragley).
Not just a rebranded Evans (though the products are and I'm sure the tech is). There looks to be consistency with the old sites structure and a different mix of products between the sites.
But now I know where to buy my new 'breaks':
Tried to log in and thankfully neither of my log ins works any more, so they haven't got hold of our historic details.
I clicked on a Trek Rail
"SORRY – THIS PAGE COULD NOT BE FOUND
You may have entered an incorrect URL or the page you were after no longer exists.
Worry not though, let us help you get back to where you need to be."
Nice that they've kept some of the CRC features 😀
(oh that's on Wiggle, the CRC one works ok. CR selling Trek and Spesh eh? whatever next? Muddyfox?? 😂 )
Guess which "Fox" brand's products you get when you click on this on the homepage...
...the team behind this site clearly have no knowledge of their products.
The Fox link with the Fox head logo takes you to the right products. Oh, I see what you mean.. yeah the "brands" list only has one Fox - to the clothing... they have some work to do 🙂
The Fox link with the Fox head logo takes you to the right products. Oh, I see what you mean.. yeah the “brands” list only has one Fox – to the clothing
Errr, I'll be honest, I'm not sure I knew that they were two different brands, and I've got Fox forks and a load of Fox clothes/gloves.
That's fine bails... you're not running a "bike shop".
Guess we now know where some of the CRC stock went as well. Some prime, nukeproof and lifeline on the 'new' CRC site. No pictures yet as you'd expect.
Just had a quick flick through the Wiggle site and was intrigued to notice that the Nut Butter section of their Sports Nutrition sections is offering chamois cream, yum!
https://www.wiggle.com/nutrition-and-body-care/sports-nutrition/nut-butter
This is the bit i don’t understand…. WHY ? If you have the Evans site, what’s the point of creating a new webiste with the CRC name ? There must be something i’m missing here other than them having 2 websites selling the same thing.
The brand names are worth a fortune alone. Less applicable to the seasoned buyers here, but there will be plenty of people unaware of the changes who are buying into the reputation of the brand.
Just as big though, is search engine optimisation. Both CRC and Wiggle feature heavily at the top of search listings, and probably way above Evans. That's huge. They'll likely take a hit with the sites changing, but if there have been any changes to the site (I've not really looked), it'll be to optimize that. Lots of consideration around URLs, redirects and metadata. Virtually everyone who searches for bikes/parts/clothing will be exposed to one of these brands.
As above it comes down to a bigger net catching more fish.
Good job I've acquired enough bike spares in the fire sale to last me about five years then
(slight exaggeration but also not)
A load of garbage then. Pinnacle and other naff tat coupled with a dreadful returns policy.
Also, who is buying a Bontrager stem?!
Pinnacle are great bikes and not long ago had a big generally positive thread in this forum.
Also on the site are a metric shed load of 5:10 which despite not being as amazing as they were when everyone bought them for 20p were also the subject of a largely positive thread here not long ago.
But obvs it's cooler to be an ill informed snob.
I'm far more concernes about Nukeproof and DHB than I am about the websites. Fingers crossed something is happening there.
Errr, I’ll be honest, I’m not sure I knew that they were two different brands, and I’ve got Fox forks and a load of Fox clothes/gloves.
Two brothers who competed in MX set them up IIRC and it was literally a heads/tails decision on the logos.
A load of garbage then. Pinnacle and other naff tat coupled with a dreadful returns policy.
Pinnacle made some really good mid-market bikes for quite a while and were ahead of the curve with gravel bikes. R&D seems to have halted since the takeover but there's still nothing wrong with an Arkose.
Also, who is buying a Bontrager stem?!
I've got Bontrager bars on not-a-Trek.
Stooge bars on my Vitus.
And Nukeproof in the spares box.
So I think the answer is "people who are happy with the right part for the job rather than getting hung up on which parent company owns them"
Not dissing Pinnacle, used to have a very quick hybrid back in the day.
Have also got a bike with various Bontrager parts (non-Trek!)
My comparison is simply one of the Wiggle before and this, they aren't the same and any such 'relaunch' is more of a re-brand IMO.
Pinnacle are great bikes... But obvs it’s cooler to be an ill informed snob.
Who is ill-informed?
Pinnacle were great, when (was it Jameso of this parish?) designed them and Evans was Evans.
Looking at the range currently online there's only a few bikes and I don't think any of them have been redesigned since 2020 ish. It looks to me like Fraser Group are just running their stock down so they can replace them with more catalogue bikes stickered up as Muddy Foxes (or more likely Nukeproof & Vitus now).
Pinnacle | Bikes & Clothing | Evans Cycles
If Pinnacle were great when they came out then they surely still are great because as you pointed out... they are exactly the same bikes, just a bit cheaper.
If Pinnacle were great when they came out then they surely still are great because as you pointed out… they are exactly the same bikes, just a bit cheaper.
you obviously don’t work in manufacturing podge. I’ll draw a parallel with the website to illustrate. If an investor buys out a website but not the actual bike business behind it, and the people behind it, they get a website. One that sells fox clothing under a fox forks banner. If an investor buys a bike brand & IP but not the design team, supply chain team, and expertise behind it, they get to ask a factory to make that design. Is what comes out the factory any good? They’ve no idea. Is it a fox fork or a pissing glove? No idea! Let’s go and ask the Nukeproof qa manager. Oh no, wait, he was laid off. What about the guy that designed it? Nah he’s collecting the dole.
But obvs it’s cooler to be an ill informed snob.
we’re not I’ll informed slobs, we’re just angry (and sorry, don’t mean to direct that anger at you) and disappointed that once good companies have gone.
Perhaps direct your anger towards the people that broke your once loved companies and not invent some random fantasy scenario where one of the UK's largest & most successful sports retail businesses, one that already has a vast number of brands and products made all over the world, has no idea what it's doing.
Podge find me a great Pinnacle mountain bike currently available from Evans?
Oh no, they've sold out, what a damming reflection on how terrible they are that everything has been bought.
Pinnacle established themselves with the Arkose, which you can still buy if you don't mind being unfashionable by 30 seconds and the Lithium is a great little hybrid, I know because there's one in my house.
😀
If you want to persist in believing Pinnacle remain a good current brand under Fraser Group, have at it.
FWIW I have a 2015 Arkose in my garage, I also think it's great.