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https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1018494440648859648?s=19
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1018497953051258880?s=19
Summary of the tweets there. Musk seems to have left the conversation after that though. Looks like a massive twitter spat there
I like the guy. Seems OK to me.
Apparently, being a British ex patriot in Thailand is "sus" and grounds to slander someone.
Cock.
He was asked to help - he did/tried. It shouldve ended there, but folks with an agenda asked the question “why was Musk there?” The diver respinded honestly and Musk made the mistake of responding. It was a dick move and he’s likely to get sued for slander and rightly so.
https://twitter.com/boring_as_heck/status/1018534489251704834?s=19
How do you embed tweets like in the first post?
Edit: It's done it!
Bit of a dick? Yes of course he is, people in his position and the millions of other high achievers who don’t get even near to what he’s done with his life fall into 2 camps IME, total ego driven dicks, and people who have learned to hide it. Really the best you can hope for is someone who can turn it off when they’re not working, but they never really are.
Doesnt make them bad people per-se, they’re just not easy people to like. They’re rarely friendly, rarely want to adhere to social norms like chit-chat and never, ever, for even a moment think your time is more valuable than theirs.
Unfortunately it’s the dicks of the world that do the big things, even if there’s an army of slightly less dickish people working behind the scenes to make it happen, leading a bigger army of even less dickish people etc.
As for the Sub, my 2p did he do it for just publicity? No.
Did he think, well I’ve got a sub and a load of sub experts and I can have them there in a day, it might help, it might not, but I’ve got the chance to help (and massively stroke my ego). Probably.
The last think someone with his personality wants is to have someone call him a fraud, it would likely get under his skin more than someone calling him any swear word you like, I mean he’s very vocal on Twitter, he probably gets called all sorts every day.
Is the sub electric ? Is there a charge point outside the cave ? Has he built a power station to provide the leccy?
Bet he hasn’t.
He offered/tried to help so I do not see any problem with that.
Well done to Elon Musk for trying and offering help.
Elon Musk - a male chicken of massive proportions. Unable to think beyond technology. Constantly mistaking his tech driven "solutions" for the world's problems for actual solutions which includes alsorts not least people. The guys a one trick pony. And it was a shit trick (though one that made him 💰).
He offered/tried to help so I do not see any problem with that.
Claiming Musk offered to help so his lack of self control and slanderous behaviour is ok is ridiculous. Aside from his feeble motivations the reality is that he has slandered those who actually helped.
Claiming Musk offered to help so his lack of self control and slanderous behaviour is ok is ridiculous. Aside from his feeble motivations the reality is that he has slandered those who actually helped.
His motivation is not important during the rescue mission so long as the children are rescued. If his technology was used, fine, but it was not used so I do not see a problem in that.
I have to admit, I was secretly disappointed that he didn't get to deploy his thunderbirds bullshit to save those kids, that'd have been ace. So I can understand why he too is peeved.
He offered/tried to help so I do not see any problem with that.
It was wildly misguided "help".
In much the same way that the army of massive ****s outside Alder Hey hospital thought their actions were in any way "helping" any of those kids (Alfie Evans, Charlie Gard....) with terminal illnesses when their plights went viral.
One glance at a map of the cave system and the water depths would have told anyone that a submarine was not the answer. To "help" in that situation you leave it to the world's foremost expert cave divers and perhaps give a load of your money to the hospital helping the kids, to buy some food / supplies for the rescue crew etc. Or maybe offer to charter a plane to fly those experts there quickly.
It was a massive publicity stunt, same as all his tech ideas. He just got in the way.
Puts up own money, time, employees, R&D to try to help while world leaders offered "thoughts and prayers", and he has been constantly attacked for it ever since, can't blame him for losing the rag.
How much money did you stump up Captain?
It's not about the offer of help, it's about the slander.
He's a cock.
If he wanted to offer help, why not do it anonymously, so the Thai management team were not wasting valuable time dealing with his publicity machine? If the submarine had actually been useful, he could have Tweeted about it to his heart's content after the kids were rescued.
The Thai response was polite, but made it pretty clear that Musk's technology was not actually of any use in the rescue. It was their operation, their call, and Musk should probably just learn to keep quiet sometimes. He does occasionally come across as being a bit petulant and immature.
The slander is out of order, but you either bend to the world (see Crazy-Legs post) or you try to make the world bend to you. Elon Musk does the latter and we need folk that do.
Copy and paste still doesn't work on Android/Chrome.
Anyone who thinks musk is a one-trick pony hasn't followed much that he and his organisations have been up to. You can question his motivation all you want, but to deny the achievements made by space--x, Tesla etc. is blinkered to say the least.
Is the submarine as hideously "styled" as his cars?
He's a PR mastermind which is getting a bit thin and obvious, imo. Plus he is a dick on twitter.
Elon is a tech nerd bellend in the same vein as Zuckerberg, who in their egotism,lack of self awaremess and ignorance ; - feel that they always have the answers for questions or experts in other fields.
www.nytimes.com/2018/07/14/opinion/sunday/elon-musk-thailand-hubris.html
Others agree.
The diver could have been a little more gracious.
The diver could have been a little more gracious.
I guess he wouldv'e been if he hadn't realised it was all for publicity.
& Musk couldv'e said, 'well the offers there should you need it' & kept his gob shut after that.
Seems like calling the diver a "pedo" is taking being a cock to a whole new level.
Can't say I follow what is going on here but I'll take a punt and say he is a cock. Most people with that kind of money are, you really need to be in order to get it in the first place.
By all means argue about the value of the sub, and whether it;s provision was just a PR stunt, but calling one of the divers (with very little in the way of provocation) a "pedo" just seems bizarrely petulant.
Given his number of followers, and the attention this has garnered - he'd better get his checkbook out, this is going to be expensive.
Edit: Assuming the chap isn't actually a paedo of course.
PEDO.. is that like P.A.D.I ?
He risks, of course, a visit from the 'British ex-pat guy' who might be inclined, as Alexei Sayle once claimed he did in his argument with Descartes, to argue 'empirically'.
Something about Twitter isn't there... Encourages people to put the first (and/or biggest) dickish thing they can think of out in public. Everyone has dickish thoughts, but too few these days seem to want to keep them to themselves.
Did Musk actually call the bloke a Pedo?
Bit odd, Shirley a typo.
The grammar and spelling types would be all over that..
His motivation is not important during the rescue mission so long as the children are rescued. If his technology was used, fine, but it was not used so I do not see a problem in that.
Elon clearly doesn't care much that they've been rescued, because he's still banging on about it. He cares more about about his ego, and that anyone dared to suggest he didn't have a better solution.
If he cared, he should have flown over there personally and presented his ideas. Not just throw a tweet out there that says 'Umm, err, guys....I can do this better than you'.
I've supported Musk, despite the endless reports of him being a complete dick, treating his staff like shit and all the rest of it. But this is serious Donald Trump territory.
I generally like Musk and think his initial offer of help etc. was genuine and he didn't deserve all the shit about it only being for PR. But to say that about one of the rescuers makes him a complete tosser, I hope he apologises or someone pays to help the guy sue him.
I'm surprised people are jumping to the defence of Musk, who has a history of this stuff. And has even admitted that he has an issue with twitter. He's called a bloke a pedo because his offer of help was turned down, that is "being a dick".
How it should have gone.
Musk: I've a mini submarine that you could use to rescue the kids
Rescuers: How small is it?
Musk: five metres long
Rescuers: No, we mean width and height
Musk: two metres by 1.5 metres
Rescuers: It's much too big, the smallest passage is 0.5m by 0.5m
Musk: Ah. That won't work then. Let me know if I can help in any way.
Rescuers: OK. Thanks anyway.
Love Tesla and SpaceX, however it seems that much like Steve Jobs and other successful entrepreneurs, he's a bit of a weapon.
The guy he called a 'pedo' knew the caves, correctly predicted where the kids were to within 200M and was who got the other British divers over, you know, the ones who actually found the kids.
Also there was a good post from the Aussie anaesthetist dude. Here's an exert regarding the Brits
By the time we arrived on site, local divers like Ben Reymenants and the awesome foursome from Britain (John Volanthen, Rick Stanton, Jason Mallinson and Chris Jewell) had already been doing the most extraordinary dives through the cave and laying the very robust rope which made all subsequent dives to the soccer team not only possible, but safe. The efforts and skill of these guys in blazing this trail cannot be underestimated. Following someone else’s line is very much easier than finding your own way. Rick and John not only found the children and coach alive, but conveyed the gravity of the situation to the rest of the world and thus the rescue started in earnest. The 4 Brits then did further supply dives to the soccer players, the coach and the four Thai Navy Seals which allowed them to prepare and sustain themselves for the rescue ultimately.
The whole thing is worth a read
The grammar and spelling types would be all over that..
The americans (south africans?) don't understand ligatures, so miss out the A. Similar to Coeliac, or Diarrhoea
CFH why are you so incensed at this?
Parents ex-pats or similar?
You seem to be taking it a little personally.
Weapons-grade bell-end IMO.
However well meaning it was pretty obvious a sub was not the solution, and having to deal with Musk and his ideas will have taken time and energy away from dealing with the real issues.
Sad it's descending into a playground slanging match;
"we don't need your torpedo"
"well maybe YOUR-a-PEDO"
playground slanging match
That's exactly what it is. Best ignored, like 99.9999% of Tweets.
Did Musk actually call the bloke a Pedo?
Yes, and when he was challenged, he sent another two Tweets repeating the slur.
If he cared, he should have flown over there personally and presented his ideas.
According to Unsworth, the diver, Musk did visit, and “was asked to leave very quickly”
If you look at the video of the "submarine" that Musk released, it looks awful like a metal tube with oxygen cylinders strapped to the outside, being pushed and towed by two divers. It's difficult to imagine how that would have fitted through the cave system described by the rescuers.
I was about to share the above link. Elon's not coming across well.
Male chicken.
It’s difficult to imagine how that would have fitted through the cave system described by the rescuers.
Well, I seem to recall he offered his boring (drilling) equipment first, so I guess the intention was to drill a new "cave" big enough for his sub. It was one idea offered when there was also the thought of the boys being stuck in the cave until October when the rainy season had subsided. Which idea was the most stupid?
WTF does Elon Muck know about cave diving, never mind cave rescues?
A massive publicity stunt and I hope the diver sues him for his ridiculous tweets.
Did Musk actually call the bloke a Pedo?
Bit odd, Shirley a typo.
he actually did, and then doubled down on it, and now the diver is considering suing. I hope he does.
Cause if there's one thing America needs, it's another petulant, thin-skinned billionaire who hates the press, can't take criticism and has a mob of faithful disciples who'll shout down anyone he wants to set them on
:/
Musk has previous for this sort of behaviour. When JC slated one of his early electric cars on TG many years ago Musk went after him and tried to sue him in course. He's like many other successful people, a classic Psychopath. He goes full tilt for whatever objective they have in mind and don't care who they trample on to achieve their goals. They are without empathy or sympathy, totally focussed on their goal. This clearly was a publicity stunt, he might very well have had some genuine desire to help on some level, but never asked the question "can he actually help", and instead focused on the potential opportunity for a bit of marketing and reinforcing his reputation for approaching problems with innovative solutions - though the reality is with these things for every successful idea there are a thousand failures, and this clearly one of the failures. And as soon as someone starts to criticise him he gets into them aggressively to discredit and take them out of the picture. Much like Trump in that respect.
There is much to be admired with Musk and his ilk in challenging and pushing the realms of what's possible through their sheer determination and single minded drive...often what is needed to make breakthroughs as you can't always rely on governments to progress very quickly - or at all. But like everything, a sensible check and balance needs to be applied because it is inevitable they'll go too far.
Yeah he's not coming across well at the moment. Very Trump-esque.
I work in the automotive industry, and lots of people don't think very highly of his over-sold and mis-named "autopilot" tech either. It's already killed a few people, and the company that designed the original version (MobilEye) refuse to deal with Tesla anymore.
It was meant to be a behind the scenes safety net but Tesla are selling it as an autonomous car you have to keep an eye on. Hence people watching videos on their laptop, or getting in to the passenger seat whilst the "autopilot" is on.
I'm not sure whether he just saw it as a publicity stunt or a genuine opportunity to help, but...
If you look at the video of the “submarine” that Musk released, it looks awful like a metal tube with oxygen cylinders strapped to the outside, being pushed and towed by two divers. It’s difficult to imagine how that would have fitted through the cave system described by the rescuers.
I can't see how, even if it would have fitted through the cave system, it would have been any better than a breathing cylinder/face mask (which I know they were talking of using rather than just mouthpiece as it was more intuitive to use for newbie divers).
It's typical of Musk's bell endery to have some bit of tech and insist it's the solution, with total overconfidence- look at the performance of the various Tesla innovations. They're not that great, they're a sketchy consumer tech solution applied to an area that needs in depth well tested engineering solutions.
Calling the guy a pedo because he said what most non-fanboys thought of the whole exercise, and said it wasn't helpful anyay, and because his solution wasn't the best is just odd. At least challenging the leader of the rescue on his expertise, whilst misguided, was kind of understandable with his inflated ego and "my way is the best way" attitude and lack of understanding of the situation. Saying it to his twitter followers in the way he did just shows him for what he is - a massive thin skinned bully who thinks he has all the answers but in reality understands little.
I work in the automotive industry, and lots of people don’t think very highly of his over-sold and mis-named “autopilot” tech either. It’s already killed a few people, and the company that designed the original version (MobilEye) refuse to deal with Tesla anymore.
It was meant to be a behind the scenes safety net but Tesla are selling it as an autonomous car you have to keep an eye on. Hence people watching videos on their laptop, or getting in to the passenger seat whilst the “autopilot” is on.
Yes, this is the sort of thing I was referring to when I said about selling flaky consumer tech in an application that requires a thorough and well engineered solution. He just doesn't understand that making something like a car requires a bit more care than making an iPhone app or something.
After watching Incredibles2 at the weekend,maybe Musk is secretly THE UNDERMINER !
So he could have drilled down and saved those kids. 🙂
I like the guy. Seems OK to me.
That's pretty much where I was until a day or so ago.
I feel some sympathy for embarassed Morrissey fans now - we've ignored so much and "it's just Elon, you know, he's like that" and you make allowances and focus on the innovation and the excitement and then, rather like those fans who can no longer ignore the elephant in the room when it's promoting "Britain First" and calling for the release of Tommy Robinson, so it is when Musk, with apparently not a shred of evidence, accuses someone of being a paedophile in a fit of pique because his shiny toy wasn't any use.
He's off my Christmas card list now.
It’s almost as if some people posting in this thread haven’t even spotted that Musk called the guy a ‘pedo’.
This is not about a submarine, guys!
Musk's companies had technology that [i]possibly[/i] could have helped...but probably not in the time frame or the physical constraints - male chicken of biggest order with ego to match that shouldn't be apologised for
Musk called the guy a ‘pedo’.
Exactly, a guy who gave up his holiday, volunteered his services, genuinly helped out with the rescue operation and didn't seek any reward or publicity. Just because he was on holiday in Thailand at the time does not make him a 'pedo'..........
IMHO Musk is a cock-womble of the highest order..........
he actually did, and then doubled down on it, and now the diver is considering suing. I hope he does.
Is astonished.
Male Chicken, not free range nor organic.
Weapons grade male chicken.
I think part of his problem is the rabid fans who cheer on whatever he comes out. Must help remove any semblance of reality.
He might be pushing forward with advertising new tech but he is by all accounts a male chicken.
there may well be a reason people only work for him for short periods....
Musk called the guy a ‘pedo’.
Exactly, a guy who gave up his holiday, volunteered his services, genuinly helped out with the rescue operation and didn’t seek any reward or publicity. Just because he was on holiday in Thailand at the time does not make him a ‘pedo’……….
It's not that bigger deal either way, but I got the impression Vern Unsworth lives very locally to the caves and knows them like the back of his hand and therefore instrumental in not only persuading the Thai authorities to ask for outside specialist help, but gave the international rescue effort/Thai Navy divers invaluable info about the caves. So, he wasn't on holiday, I believe.
No, he lives there and has been exploring the cave system for six years.
Rachel
<span style="font-size: 0.8rem;">Well, I seem to recall he offered his boring (drilling) equipment first, so I guess the intention was to drill a new “cave” big enough for his sub. It was one idea offered when there was also the thought of the boys being stuck in the cave until October when the rainy season had subsided. Which idea was the most stupid?</span>
Mr Musk appears to disagree, and was convinced his "mini sub" could get through the caves without drilling:
"Based on extensive cave video review & discussion with several divers who know journey, SpaceX engineering is absolutely certain that mini-sub can do entire journey & demonstrate at any time,"
Pedalo, he meant pedalo.
Based on extensive cave video review...
😆
Utter male chicken.
Massive **** imho.
I'm not even that impressed by the stuff he has done as the government seems to have paid for a lot of it.
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-hy-musk-subsidies-20150531-story.html
Until he gives as much away as Bill Gates I'll hold my current view.
He has behaved like the very end of the bell.
Simple solution, put him in the sub and let him navigate the cave system to where the kids were.
He can crow about it when / if he makes it out alive.
I admit I'd not really looked into his background and reputation, and been impressed by Space X stuff and the car in space, but now I'm seeing him for the **** he really is. Totally lost any respect I had for him now after this spat, his tweets and the more I look into him.
He's just a high-tech Trump.
Full of shit PR stunts, spouts rubbish and insults on twitter and has loads of money.
Reading more into it, I'm hearing Tesla is a bit of a balls up on the finances, isn't really a viable product range, failures and poor work environment. Space X is sort of okay as a private space venture but beyond being a space truck for supplies, the rest is fluff. The car apparently missed its planned orbit and was pointless anyway. The landing of the launch stage rockets is impressive but I can't help feeling that's just for show also. I wonder what the real cost saving is compared to parachute and recovery with refurbish (though that wasn't much of a saving either with SRBs with the shuttle as it was practically a replacement of every part to refurbish it).
The cave thing has echoed Trump like ego. He's even saying he'll go to the cave with his sub anyway to prove he was right. Prize cockwomble.
Opinion revised. He may be a decent innovator, but he is a bell end for actually calling the dive rescuer a pedo.
Just imagine if Elon's sub had got stuck at some nasty tricky pinch-point in the cave, having accidentally ripped out the guide rope - you would then have to send some more divers down to try to unwedge it, underwater, in pitch black, with time running out to rescue anyone from the now-inaccessible far end of the cave.
My next car won't be a Tesla.
Pedo? Isn’t that what Pete Docherty calls himself now? You know, like JLo.
Pedo? Isn’t that what Pete Docherty calls himself now? You know, like JLo.
😆
Who said Thunderbirds? This is Team America made real.
Elon Musk has done some good stuff, but this isnt' it.
Can't wait to see how Musk is portrayed in the hollywood film of the cave rescue....
BinDun..
Replace the aeroplane box thing with a sub and a cave, keep the main character profile..
Male Chicken, not free range nor organic
Oh I'd say organic. Massively so.
Tesla shares down 3% this morning apparently -$295m loss. Whatever that means. As EM's personality is a huge part of the valuation if I owned shares I'd be slightly worried.
I'm starting to change my opinion of him.
Just imagine
Why?
I’m starting to change my opinion of him
I'm not. I didn't have one on the first place and I still haven't. Much bigger male chickens to fry in this world, if you get my drift.
Maybe he was trying to give the guy a back handed compliment?
He might , mistakenly, think the guy is a paedo but he clearly thinks he's the most skilled and dedicated paedo the world has ever seen. Back in the day, hanging about a school playground with a bag of sweeties and a vague promise of seeing some puppies was enough....but not for this guy.
As far as Elon Musk is concerned, If this guy is going to target kiddies he's going for the most difficult ones in the world to reach, whilst under the spotlight of the world media.
Musk clearly respects this level of commitment and dedication.
He is a prize cock. When it was pointed out that calling someone a 'pedo' was a little inflammatory if untrue, he insisted it was and would bet 'a signed dollar' that it was.
He later deleted it all, no doubt after legal advice, but the genie is out of the bottle.
It's reasonable to assume the diver guy does not have these proclivities, so his extended holiday in Thailand just got a big new sponsor.