We’re heading there in May for our annual trail centre fix, arriving mid day Tuesday and leaving early Friday so we’ve got two and a half days riding. Thinking of doing Minor taur when we arrive but it’s a long while since we’ve been so not sure what’s the best trails. Also is The Gwydir Mawr ( Marin Trail ) worth a visit? It’s been 18 years since I last rode it. Ta.
Used to ride it in 2001ish so thought we'd revisit with kids in 2018 in their wee ride seats. Minotaur was fun but tame, quickly moved into the reds making our own routes via the river for obligatory stone throwing. Go red!
Who are you going with? Kids, mates etc?
My boys were 10 and 13 when we went last summer.
We stayed entirely East of the A470. The stuff the other side of the road has a consistent element of extra brutality about it.
We deliberately avoided the black routes almost but not entirely.
I came up with a "super red" that picked up a couple of flowy bits of the blacks (they were on the black routes but really only red difficult).
I also went with the more regular riding group last year. We are middle aged sensible Southerners and about half the group found the blacks rideable but past that point where challenging for sense of achievement had turned into "please make it stop" and the other half were mostly around the sense of achievement, bit uncomfortable point.
There's a couple of bits of trail that I've never ridden on one of the reds (North East tip of the trails and one off the side as you do the long drag from the southern most point of one of the reds) as it just looks like there's sooooo much road/fire road for very little Singletrack. Forget the section but it'll be obvious on the map.
I’m going with two mates and my grown up son, we don’t mind a bit of technical stuff just such a long while since any of us were there we’ve forgotten what trails we rode!
We stayed entirely East of the A470. The stuff the other side of the road has a consistent element of extra brutality about it
Yep, the Red Bull on the west side has loads of rocky picky stuff that isn't flowy at all, and just tricky enough to be a tad frustrating. When I first did it years ago i was chuffed to clean almost all of it. But on a modern trail bike its in a bit of noman's land.
MBR is the best bit I reckon
Unless you're into a fast mission for a couple (+) hours, in which case the beast is the one.
Except part of it closed due to tree work. It's just the Pointless Fireroad of Pointlessness that's closed ( mentioned by the poster above). Doesn't miss any good singletrack, but does mean a timed blast doesn't really work.
The red trail called (but in Welsh) Red Fox is nice to warm up on it's the least tech of the reds but when I go it's that or Minor Taur just to settle the legs and brain. It also crosses over with Minor Taur somewhere and makes quite a good hybrid loop.
That's exactly what we did with kids in weerides garage-dweller so it can't be too gnarly, flowy I recall.
That’s exactly what we did with kids in weerides garage-dweller so it can’t be too gnarly, flowy I recall.
Think it was last summer we bumped into a guy with his little one in a wee-ride or similar on a rigid single speed doing that combination. You're right it's flowy but single speed and rigid that's parental dedication!
Adams Family sections are my absolute favourite TBH. Fast twisty rockiness.
DRAGONS BACK...
When you cross the river at post 86/87 (after Pink Heifer) you can go left on the road and then right by post 210 to join Minor Taur at Buwch Bren. You'll hit a fire road around post 212. Go left onto the fire road and you're back on the Dragons Back without the bash up the road.
It's this loop we skip the North East corner of and follow the road up and then take a fire road to pick up Gomez.
Thanks, I’m book marking this page so I can take some notes a bit nearer the time.
Rode Brenin (Dragons back then MBR) and Gwydir afew months back, Preferred Gwydir TBH. Enjoyed Brenin in the past but seemed like endless fireroad this time round! MBR had some decent bits though.
Thinking of doing Minortaur when we arrive
Are you going with young kids? The trail is excellent, but it's named that for a reason. Don't think we've done it since they hit double figures.
Minotaur is a blue I think - my two kids coped with it on their balance bikes when they were 4ish. Probably not worth doing unless you've never ridden off road before and even then, it's all pool table smooth...
Brenin's great. Do Dragon's Back or The Beast (and try to avoid the pointless fireroad of pointlessness - there's a route to skip a fair bit of it).
Gwydir/Marin is ace too. As is Penmachno which is close if you're near Betws (if you're doing the Marin they're very close to each other).
Yep, the Red Bull on the west side has loads of rocky picky stuff that isn’t flowy at all, and just tricky enough to be a tad frustrating.
Funny, i think Tawr has the best bits. If you're creative with the map, its really easy to cut alot of the dull fireroad out too.
Has Gwydir/Marin been shortened, I seem to remember it being a lot longer years ago?
We're off there in June too, so very interested in this thread as we've got a day before Dyfi in the area so we're very much thinking that a few hours there the day before is a top plan. Only thing we need to work out is getting the right amount of bikes in the van as we're taking another mate of the lads and his DH bike, so it's an extra DH and Enduro.... but it's a big van 😀
We’re off there in June too, so very interested in this thread as we’ve got a day before Dyfi in the area so we’re very much thinking that a few hours there the day before is a top plan
Are you just looking for a sign posted route to follow? If not then I'd take a look at the Corris bit of the Dyfi and put together a route (most of the climachx isn't that great so you can ignore most of that) - strava heatmap and segments will show you the good stuff.
Are you just looking for a sign posted route to follow?
In truth, not really sure matey. We're staying about 30 mins away near Tonfanau so were looking for something to ride and last time up there the lads rode Brenin area so i assumed that's where we'd play again. Well, either that or a day at the beach 😀
we’ve got two and a half days riding.
Unless you don't mind riding the same things again, I don't think there's two and half days worth of riding at CYB. Now, don't get wrong there's enough trails there, but lots of it is green and blue that's not worth the trip unless you've got young kids in tow.
But there's Gwydir, Penmachno, Antor Stiniog (dunno if they're open midweek though) all in that area though.
Has Gwydir/Marin been shortened, I seem to remember it being a lot longer years ago?
Nope. There's an additional section added about 5 years back. There's two loops possible, a short one you can knock out in about 1.5 hours and the longer route which is 3-5 depending on fitness.
Follow the red one - it's all good 🙂
Gwydir/Marin we rode in September and to be honest, was nowhere near as good as I remember it being from the last time I rode it years previously. A few really good bits but what seemed like mile upon mile of fire road.
Don't think I'd bother doing it again...
When we went there a few years back for 1 day of riding (we were doing Antur Stiniog the following day for uplift then Snowdon the day after) we did 2x blacks back to back either side of lunch.
Think it was Tarw Du before lunch and the MBR after lunch. For me that felt like too much rocky battering over a day and I seem to remember a massive fireroad climb that felt like it went on forever towards the ends of the day.
If I went again I think I’d do one of the blacks in the morning and then a slightly more chilled red in the afternoon.
On our 3 day summer trips we normally try to make one of the 3 days an uplift day to give the legs a breather from so much pedalling.
Also is The Gwydir Mawr ( Marin Trail ) worth a visit?
Nope. Only the last trail is worth doing, the rest is crap. Especially in comparison to Coed Y Brenin. Pen Machno is well worth doing though, especially in summer/warmer months.
One thing about the Marin trail, I think theres a fair bit of off-piste in the area. Loads of videos on YT, stuff on Strava and loads of trails going off all over the place as you climb up so I assume you could do a really good up/down ride at Marin without going more than a mile from the car park!
One thing about the Marin trail, I think theres a fair bit of off-piste in the area. Loads of videos on YT, stuff on Strava and loads of trails going off all over the place as you climb up so I assume you could do a really good up/down ride at Marin without going more than a mile from the car park!
This. But do some research as some of the off piste stuff requires your tech A game.
If in the area for 2.5 days and you don't want to do maps, I'd do a DH day at Antur Stiniog in the middle. Not as full-on as it sounds and lots of different trails. Other tourist stuff also on same site and pretty close to CyB if you're staying nearby. I'm local so have soft spot for the Marin, but Penmachno is also a fave. New revamped section 4/5 of the way through also a lot of fun and feels very un-UK (alpine bike parkey), which can be easily looped.
MinorTaur is quite fun on a gravel bike. I rode it on my Fugio with 700c wheels and really enjoyed it.
Having read the replies it looks like Penmachno is a defo, and maybe Gwydir/ Marin as well. We’ve plenty of time so want to fit as much in as we can.
A few really good bits but what seemed like mile upon mile of fire road.
That's my everlasting memory of the Marin trail. Really disappointing.
Never bothered again.
Penmachno is better.
Also, consider a ride up Cadair Idris.
The top loop of the minortaur is fab. This is a trap, because the rest of it isn't, and not worth it for the climb out.
I bloody love the Beast and Tarw. They're old and they absolutely show it, but they're absolutely rammed with character and bloody awkwardness that you just don't usually get in a modern trail. The entire proposition of the place is different and that'd almost make it worth the visit even if it wasn't also great fun, if fairly hard work. Fitness definitely helps as some of the trails benefit a lot from pedalling like an absolute bastard to keep the speed up, or working hard to attack climbs and gradient reversals rather than doing the more modern "slow up fast down". The skills area is fab, too.
The Marin also has an oldschoolness about it, in that you absolutely must not do the climb vs descent maths. Don't even let it in your head. Because as soon as you do, the Marin is absolutely terrible. But if you don't, it's pretty lovely.
Antur is a very good way of balancing this all out, add in a day of fairly standard issue riding, but with much less effort. It's really good in its own right, of course, but it also helps round out a holiday imo.
Just don't catch Antur on a day when the wind is barreling up the valley at 100mph.
Been there before where you had to use all your effort to pedal downhill.
Not good. 😀
... it looks like Penmachno is a defo, and maybe Gwydir/ Marin as well. We’ve plenty of time so want to fit as much in as we can.
That's the spirit. Back in the days when I was exceedingly time poor (very young kids), I dropped the missus off at MAN airport, did the Marin, did Penmachno then drove to CyB and did the MBR too.
Oh to be young and fit again 🙁
There's so much truth in the following:
I bloody love the Beast and Tarw. They’re old and they absolutely show it, but they’re absolutely rammed with character and bloody awkwardness that you just don’t usually get in a modern trail. The entire proposition of the place is different and that’d almost make it worth the visit even if it wasn’t also great fun, if fairly hard work. Fitness definitely helps as some of the trails benefit a lot from pedalling like an absolute bastard to keep the speed up, or working hard to attack climbs and gradient reversals rather than doing the more modern “slow up fast down”.
Well said
but they’re absolutely rammed with character and bloody awkwardness that you just don’t usually get in a modern trail.
This is basically how I like all my riding. Spoon fed modern speed on obviously lines is absolutely fine - ai do my fair share of that- but the satisfaction of acheiving 'tech-flow' trumps it.
There’s so much truth in the following:
There is. But every time I ride Snap Crackle and Pop these days I wonder how I managed it the first time I went to CYB in 1997 on my '92 fully rigid Eldridge Grade.
The answer is slowly! Same for in '99 on a 60mm headshock with no rebound damping.
Things Iove about the Gwydir
1. You often have the place to yourself, and It feels remote even though it's not really.
2. It does feel like a ride as opposed to a trail
3. the off-piste stuff that I stumbled across last time I was there.
4. It's not a knee deep stream for 11 months of the year.
What @nickc said, but to add to that I like the knee-deep stream of 'machno too.
Middle of the heatwave last year, grass was yellow, was having to pot water to the geese three times a day because all the water had dried up, sheep up and down the country were not coming into season (lamb could well be expensive this year) because of the heat and lack of water.
Got soaked at 'machno.
Things Iove about the Gwydir
Some of the views are pretty spectacular to be fair!
It’s a couple of years since I’ve been, and yes it’s not 100% action packed single track, but it’s still a damn good ride. The short version is great too, same but condensed.
Snotrag that dosent look too shabby! The views were one of the things I do remember about the Gwydir.
I ride both Gwydr mawr (Marin) and the beast a few weeks back. For the first time in about 10 years and enjoyed both.
The Gwydr seemed longer than I remembered, but had a nice remote feel and a good amount of tech (ish) Singletrack. I quite like a long fire road warm-up to deliver more tech descent. Not a single other cyclist did I see. (It was raining)
Beast seemed the same as when I last rode it. But, more like riding up a river, as it was raining that day too.
Best trail in N/W in my view is Penmachno. It’s always like riding up/down a stream, so you know what you’re getting. All rocky, more technical and remote. Lovely.
Aye we are definitely doing Penmachno, looks ace on YouTube just got to work out our days. Want to fit as much in as we can.
I'd do the Beast but swapping in the first couple of sections of Minotawr instead of the red sections, which seem to be just to help you check you've got your suspension set up properly.
Higher up, avoid the pointless fire road loop by turning left at the first marker post after leaving the big road climb and contouring round on fire-road instead.
Thanks for the info, I’m making notes!
The PFOP was closed 2 weeks ago anyway, so may not be any need to make a diversion.
( the Beast/DB one, not the RedBull one)
Just keep an eye out on Penmachno. We went through what looked like a puddle, but it was actually up over our knees ! Stopped us dead. We did laugh, but the bikes looked like swamp things. You'll need to give everything a good service after that, definitely check BB, hubs jockey bearings.
Bookmarking this for a future trip planing.
This is basically how I like all my riding. Spoon fed modern speed on obviously lines is absolutely fine – ai do my fair share of that- but the satisfaction of acheiving ‘tech-flow’ trumps it.
Swings and roundabouts, I enjoy the last few descents down to Glyncorrwg at Afan because they're steep, rocky and technical, but achievable.
Conversely there's a few flatter bits early on where it's just "can I please just have this with some momentum to make it enjoyable?"
I enjoy a good technical descent, and I enjoy a good technical climb, but contouring round something just breaks my soul!
I rode the obvious mix of Temtiwr and Cyflym Coch yesterday (do it as a figure of eight to avoid the dull fire road return on on Cyflym Coch) starting from Cae'n y Coed. It means when it's done it's easy to add the decent bits of the blue in or climb up the fire roads for the Adams family sections of red or False teeth and Bugsy off the blacks.
