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Just wondering I know about the “weight doping” but there seems to be loads of people who can bang out 3,4 5w/kg no bother! Is that normal?
I reckon it overestimates mine. I just put in my true weight as I don't see the point in trying to cheat it as I'm trying to keep it as realistic as possible.
The sandbagging is a bit much, did a C race so 2.5-3 wkg, winner was pushing out 5.9 wkg and the first 120 odd were over the upper limit, don't see the point.
I'm not sure I get the question in the title vs what you've put in the post.
FTP is measured on Zwift from the power recorded on a ride, or FTP/ramp test. It just calculates FTP from the power numbers. If the input power is wrong, it'll give a wrong result. I think they use the .95 of 20 min average power as their general calculation.
3,4,5 w/kg is power to weight at a point in time, not FTP. Are you asking if it over measures power to weight?
Everybody is 45kg on Zwift!
Yeah sorry not very clear! I think I was looking to give the benefit of the doubt that people’s quoted FTP, and or w/kg are higher in zwift than in the real world due to the programming as opposed to anything else.
What makes you think 3 to 5 w/kg is wrong?
Just a lot of liars I think.
I've never seen so many 5w/kg racers outside of pro ranks but you get 4000 a day racing in D on Zwift lol.
Last C race I averaged 303w for the race and for smashed into pieces by riders averaging 5w/kg.
What makes you think 3 to 5 w/kg is wrong?
It's not wrong, for some riders, sometimes, but day in day out that many on Zwift? It's fishy
Zwift doesn’t measure power, it gets the measurements from whatever device you are using. There is a lot of info of accuracy of different devices on line if you care.
For weight, well of course some people are optimistic. For example I can say mines accurate because my scales are linked to zwift, but in reality I weigh myself in naked instead of wearing riding kit, so it’s going to be under.
I have a Stages power meter on my zwift setup and one on my road bike and I find that my FTP from Zwift sets tough zones on the road.
My tested FTP is about 25W lower on Zwift than it is outdoors, so I’m pushing lower w/kg on Zwift than I could in real life. But I figure I’d still get shelled out the back even if I had my outdoor numbers. Plenty of people doing it legit on Zwift, and Zwiftpower does a good job at sorting out the sandbaggers if you’re interested in seeing how you really stack up.
There seems to be a lot like
Who seem to just make up their power (and who no doubt weighs no more than 12kg too)
I'm no pro and 3-4w/kg isn't really a challenge.
Case in point just did over unders with the club on Alpe duzwift alternate corners doing 3w/kg easy efforts 4w/kg hard efforts
When I race for an hour it's 3.8w/k average with some extended efforts in the high 5s low 6s
Output correlates with my 4iiii on the TT bike when doing IRL racing.
And im carrying about 10kg extra. @85kg. Which my FTP works out at 3.8w/kg If you put my output in 75kg you'd be at 4.2. 68 kg is not unimaginable at my height. ....
Once you start getting beyond. 5.5 w/kg for an hour I'd start to get suspicious. There are alot of fit people out there and alot of gifted people. -i know a guy who can run a sub 19min 5k on spec and doesn't run at all for training
Generally the output of an FTP test would be lower indoors - some coaches recommending having indoor and outdoor zones. Indoor is harder (no micro rests) and hotter.
So basically, Zwift is full of liars.
Even me. My Zwift weight is 69kg, I'm 70 at the moment in reality!
Seems a bit bogus to me - not even talking about the jokers with fantasy set-ups, but guys on zpower with supposedly accurate data. FTP of 5+ W per Kg on an amateur rider is not the club strongman, that's a straight beast who could mix it in a national level race. Guess there's a lot of national-level guys on zwift!
Depends on your build / absolute power I suppose - really slight fellas can hit 4 W kg without being considered unusually strong riders, but a big lad pushing 400 W hour power but would be quite rare ISTM.
But Zwift recalculates your ftp based on actual riding, I put mine as 256watts as this is what I got from a Sufferfest 4dp test and EXACTLY the same from a trainer road ftp test over a year ago. After 2 months on Zwift at a high usage rate including some cat C races (where I was finishing mid pack) it recalculated my ftp to................. 261 watts 🙁
People who should be cat B and want to stay Cat C would be overstating their weight to keep their ftp\kgs lower.
Prob frustrating if you're the competative type, I just race against me. Do enjoy doing Zwift races. Sure have a look at Cat D results. Bet you get some real bangers in there 🙂
In Zwift, as in life, no matter how good you are there is always someone better.
So in reality the only person you are racing is yourself - are you riding as hard as you can? If some people want to drop their weight to hit silly W/kg figures, they are only fooling themselves.
But Zwift recalculates your ftp based on actual riding, I put mine as 256watts as this is what I got from a Sufferfest 4dp test and EXACTLY the same from a trainer road ftp test over a year ago. After 2 months on Zwift at a high usage rate including some cat C races (where I was finishing mid pack) it recalculated my ftp to…………….. 261 watts 🙁
That barely even registers as more than measurement drift after all you can change your chain lube and win 5w
but equally you'll push harder racing than testing. That's a highly studied phenomenon
but equally you’ll push harder racing than testing. That’s a highly studied phenomenon
That's very true, I peel myself off the bike after a race, and it's not like I'm threating the podium, just trying to pass a rider, not get dropped off the back of a group, not get passed by too many but realistically just not finish last.
Some good points here thank you! It’s a great training or entertainment tool at the moment been enjoying the training programmes! I think being able to see the W/Kg just got me thinking what was normal what was above that. Previously W/kg was just so thing I read about with relation to the pros the infamous 7w/kg for the tour etc. There just seemed to be a lot of people chucking out 4-5w/kg on a regular basis. It’s all a fun activity I’m only interested in getting fitter and hopefully will be able to ride further faster etc. I was just interested to see so many able to push what I assumed would be a high output.
Now that I think about it, my ftp is 261watts and weight is 84kgs which puts me at 3.1 w/kg. I'd consider myself reasonably fit as in I can do a 5hr cycle but would be no racer. As stated I'm very much a mid pack finisher in Cat C on Zwift and would consider that to be correct for me given the Cat I race and where I finish in real world XC races (I've never done a real world road race of any description). And when I say "race" XC I use the term in it's loosest definition 🙂
Another thing to think about is. The trainer.
We had a local lad show up to our club organised Wednesday ride.
Handed us all our arzes by a long way .....averaged 7w/kg
Turned out he was running speed and cadence sensors on a turbo that wasn't on the list.....just picked a close one.
Even with legit trainers no two read the same ..... Wheel ontrainersxjust introduce a whole new level of inaccuracy and power curves a third level
That's before you start weight doping.
I'm reliably informed a tacx neo is worth a few watts
I’m reliably informed a tacx neo is worth a few watts
Don't they also have a motor that kicks in on the downhills to enhance the real world experience?
The other thing I discovered (for myself) after my first race on Zwift when I did about 10kms solo is that drafting makes a big difference.
I was a mid-pack B on zwift last year and I'm a mid-pack crosser (V50 though, not open) in real-life. Might be a tiny bit better at something a bit more constant as I don't have much above "diesel".
err, what was the question again ?
I reckon if you're a genuine upper-half A on zwift you'd possibly be a pretty decent racer (depending on the mix of your skillz - certainly isn't all about FTP unless maybe you're a 25 mile TTer)
Go watch Alex Dowsett on YouTube
He’s been Zwift racing and TT’inh during lockdown and he’s getting beat in every race.
His Mrs rips the Michael out him also while he’s doing it so it’s an interesting watch.
But good insight into what numbers a Pro can put out and the interesting thing is it not massive so it kinda shows the issue isn’t maybe Zwift but people lying to themselves.
If you’re running a wheel off decent turbo then the power is the power no-matter what you’re weight is.
Weight synced to Zwift from Withings scales via TrainingPeaks every couple of days or so, I’m just under 63Kg at the moment so 250w for 4w/kg is easily attainable.
Everyone wants their numbers to look good so nibble off a bit of weight here and there and squeeze another step out on the ramp test and you’re soon 4.2
I’m reliably informed a tacx neo is worth a few watts
Your havin’ a laugh. Check out the Dc rainmaker or gp llama reviews. They’re supposedly the most accurate trainer you can buy and don’t require any calibration. I’d trust someone on a Neo more than any other trainer.
Are you sure your not confusing it with a Vortex?
From the events I've done on zwift watts per kilo is kind of irrelevant, it's all about how many watts you can put out. I have an ftp of 4 watts per kilo (at 66kg) and I get absolutely smashed in zwift. Gave up the group rides as I'm ruined after 5 min, and in the tts I'm usually well down my group results, despite usually having one of the higher w/kg
From the events I’ve done on zwift watts per kilo is kind of irrelevant, it’s all about how many watts you can put out.
NOt so much, it's really both... but within certain limitations. Watts are watts and high watts bring high speed... but only on flat courses. On hilly courses you can have the watts but the 70kg rider will stil blow out the 100kg rider usually.
But again, if you can't put out the watts, you won't be in the game anyway.
Overall it's quite frustrating at the moment and the reason i'm doing STW social rides not racing currently, i don't mind racing ANYONE who's a fair racer, but someone putting out 5w/kg in a C race, is just pathetic. Sadly in a Crit race at the moment, the top 15 on the road will all be high 4's in C..... if not more. It spoils it for racing as you try and go with the lead group, knowing you can hold a 'fair' lead group, but then find out the lead group are all enough to win As...
Your havin’ a laugh. Check out the Dc rainmaker or gp llama reviews. They’re supposedly the most accurate trainer you can buy a
Spoil my fun why don't you the latest gen neos are reporting -2 to -5% out on dcrainmakers tests. Basically exasperating the issue the op is experiancing.
As for w/kg not coming into play. I assume you only ride flat. On the flat it's power power power. Up a hill it's w/kg
Dowsett got pumped in the TT because zwift doesn't account for the fact be was altitude nor does CDA - basically zwift proves IRL -position is a vast majority of time trialing.
I don’t bother racing anymore. I’m a B, 69kgs and 271ftp. Was getting battered by most B before lockdown, but it felt reasonably fair. Flat courses I’d get dropped and hilly courses were very hard but I’d do ok and only get dropped later in the race.
Since lockdown the races I’ve done are crazy. Gave up racing B so did a C to see how I fared. 281 watts average and 4.1w\kg. I finished 15th.
I also did a D group ride, was meant to be a nice easy ride at 2-2.5w/kg, not a race, but I finished it in 43rd place at 3.7w/kg average. My 20 min average was 4.0w/kg and that’s just a D group ride. I wasn’t in the front group, tried to bridge across thinking they won’t be holding 4.5w/k for long but they did.
Those feeling they are getting pumped by the flats try an alpe d'huez race.
I'm seeing alot of the low power coupled with low weights giving high w/kg. That metrics only good for climbing.
Fwiw I'm 320 @85 kg.
I have no top end. Comparing power curves on ZP after events is funny. You see all those that give it beans at start putting out waaaaaay too much power for their ability to try and hold on and get shelled out the back.
My power curve it's pretty flat. Even come the end sprint I have to wind up for the finish from about a 1km out have any chance of a decent finish and ditch those with a good sprint but who are in the limits of their endurance
Race your own race don't be trying to *stay* with the front pack.
If the race is anygood it'll be on zwift power anyway and they will be expunged.
I gaveup on on Zwift after a few week, just to hectic and people flying around at twice my pace. Switched to Road Gran Tours. Did Stelvio yesterday didnt see a soul apart from a couple of bots!! I have noticed on a group ride with a few people that are much quicker than me on the road I was able to mix it with them quite well. My knackered hips mean I have a very unaero position in the real world but it doesnt hinder me online. Anyway I can smack out 8w/kg (for about 10s). RGT doesnt estimate ftp like Zwift so not done a test imagine its about 3-3.5
I’m reliably informed a tacx neo is worth a few watts
The Neo has historically *underread* very slightly, but outside of an independent dual-sided power meter is about as accurate as you're going to get.
Using the road feel (motor etc) actually makes it harder to hold onto the pack downhill because you have to get it in top gear and pedal like crazy, whereas a normal trainer will just take any power input and increase your speed. On top of that, road feel robs power over cobbles and gravel sections.
At the end of the day it’s a game, take it a face value which is it’s a great way to distract from the fact you’re on a turbo which let’s face it, a turbo is dull as flip.
What I’ve rediscovered with Zwift is I can lose an hour on the turbo, work hard and enjoy it 😳😳
For me just that is brilliant. I’m not an athlete, I’m a 44 year old fat git and so is my avatar.
My avatar does now have grey dreads. (I don’t 😀)
I have an Elite Direto, i keep it calibrated in the app and it’s supposed to be +\- 2% accurate but I’ve nothing else to compare against. I’ve seen a few posts where people track a Direto against other PMs such as cranks and pedals and it seems to be similar.
Before the Direto I had a tyre driven wheel on Tacx and it was far from accurate and when o switched to the Direto I lost about 100watts overnight.
The Neo has historically *underread* very slightly,
that was the joke.
+1 what tiger said. we did a 3 hour 100km club ride on sunday , We have a whats app group running along side and one of the lads sorts out a spotify play list and we have a good old time since we cannot get out on our group rides on a sunday morning.
I tend to only do the big 'official' zwift races, like the Tour of Watopia etc. Which appear to be slightly more casual, until you get spanked from the start. Thankfully I use it as a tool to push myself, rather than getting disappointed with only finishing in the top half.
Although since signing up to Zwift power, I can see that I am clearly too 'strong' for Cat D races, despite only cracking the top ten once or twice. So any future events I will enter Cat C and enjoy coming in the bottom 10.
I can only assume those that do cheat get some sort of thrill from top, despite it being fraudulent?!
Zwift are in the process of introducing anti-sandbagging rules which are being beta tested in some selected races. Although quite why people want to enter races they are clearly too strong for beats the hell out of me.
Go watch Alex Dowsett on YouTube
He’s been Zwift racing and TT’inh during lockdown and he’s getting beat in every race.
I was going to mention Dowsett. It's kind of hilarious. To be fair he is at altitude which puts him at quite a significant disadvantage to start with, but he's getting some serious virtual kickings.
More generally, there are plenty of very strong riders in the world, and right now pretty much all of them are going to be on Zwift, but as above, it's the guys putting out a steady 6 w/kg who aren't pros that I'd be more suspicious of than folk riding at 4 w/kw.
Also possibly an element of confirmation bias?
You're looking at the 6W/kg numbers, which people are maintaining for a minute at the front, then dropping back, and someone else pulls up so the leaders in the group always seem to be doing 6W/kg. Whilst you're hanging on at the pack doing a consistent 4W/kg.
Doesn't Zwift DQ you if your FTP exceeds the class? So it's basically geared towards sprinters as anyone capable of a so breakaway will be forced to race against people with a similar FTP, who can then sprint to the line.
My trainer estimates my FTP at 325W (I wish!), Strava's equally inaccurate but less optimistic average power on a 2h road ride is ~190W, with ~220-230W being a reasonably consistent number on longer segments up hills (i.e. where you'd expect it's guesstimate to be most accurate).
Don't take it seriously. At best it's a game! Go ride a sportive if you want to do some pretend racing after a lockdown 🤣
Quite an enlightening thread - I’ve been getting quite depressed with how poor my ftp is on zwift - using a cheap tacx thing on virtual power (Bluematic I think it is on a resistance level 3 as zwift recommends). Even if I wreck myself I can’t get past an ftp of about 160. Now thinking I might just need a new trainer 😀
do you use zwift tinas ?
no zwift doesnt DQ you - ZP does if the race org has enabled it .
when yu look at end results you often see people who hold 6 w/kg ave.
More OFTEN than not i notice they dont have a lightening strike next to their name meaning they are on estimated power from sensors and an estimated curve rather than actual power.
seems somewhat pointless to me.
As I said earlier C category race 2.5-3wkg, winner was over 5wkg for the full hour. I'm not that fussed as never going to be troubling the top spots but when you're pushing out pretty much double the acceptable figure I don't understand what the attraction is.
Not sure if many of you have seen this chart from Trainer Road, showing the distribution of w/kg of their users.
Interesting graph that, imagine pushing 5.5w/kg for an hour!!! Bonkers. Puts me pretty much in the middle which seems about right, although I'd have thought trainer road would attract stronger riders, I've never trained in my life! Bit concerned some are below 0.25w/kg....should we send an ambulance!!
do you use zwift tinas ?
I tried it for a while, preferred Sufferfest. Actually preferred trainer road but the story lines in Sufferfest keep me amused even if TR has better training programs.
That and the curve on my trainer seems compressed, apparently I can maintain 325W, but can barely do 2.5x that in a sprint, so even if I did ride in a 3.5-4.0W/kg group I'd be left for dead in the last kilometer.
no zwift doesnt DQ you – ZP does if the race org has enabled it .
when yu look at end results you often see people who hold 6 w/kg ave.
More OFTEN than not i notice they dont have a lightening strike next to their name meaning they are on estimated power from sensors and an estimated curve rather than actual power.
seems somewhat pointless to me.
I don't know the ins and outs of it, could you not just look at the results on zwiftpower and ignore the sandbaggers/weight dopers?
Interesting graph that, imagine pushing 5.5w/kg for an hour!!! Bonkers. Puts me pretty much in the middle which seems about right, although I’d have thought trainer road would attract stronger riders, I’ve never trained in my life! Bit concerned some are below 0.25w/kg….should we send an ambulance!!
Hopefully an anomaly, like 0.1% have put the decimal point in the wrong place on their weight or something!
It'd be interesting to see a graph showing the spread relative to power meters for other ways of estimating power. e.g. powermeter Vs tranier curves, powermeter Vs Strava estimates etc. You would assume that Strava/Zwift/TR/SF etc update the profiles each time someone rides that trainer or bit of road with a power meter but there must still be a spread even between different setups with the same model. But it would be interesting to know if when Strava says I've done an 250W effort up a 20minute climb, how likely is that to be accurate (ignoring things like the days it says you did 300W+ because there was a tailwind)?
The ramp test overestimates FTP for me, ordinarily I'd expect to complete the 400W interval if I'm fit and giving it everything, which would give me an FTP of 300W+.
My best ever 20min effort is 313W from March 2019, 95% of which is 298W. I managed 311W for 20mins at Richmond iirc in a 1-lap race back in early Feb. Due to lack of training and possible COVID-19 illness, I'm back down at ~269W.
There's a lot of accuracy variance with power between turbos and power meters, they measure from different points in the drivetrain system and so results can vary massively.
I've compared my Neo Gen 1 & a SRAM Red Quarq twice, not much in it
I don’t know the ins and outs of it, could you not just look at the results on zwiftpower and ignore the sandbaggers/weight dopers?
You can't though because you're in a race, with a group of 30 of you.
So lets say you ignore the group and wait for the next group, you then missed the first 3 places on Zwiftpower as 3 of the others hung in with the bunch... But if you try and stay with the bunch the potential is, you get blown out near the end.... How do you decide ?
When i was racing C it was a simple affair for me because if you could pull away from me on the Crit circuit you were not a true C. Sure in the last 1km i'd get beaten by a few Cs at times, but not in the lead up to it. But as i say, you can't really just let people pull away from you if you're in a race, can you ?
if your not able to keep up then it should be a reasonable measure that your not going to finish at the front of the group anyway
as i said - race your own race not that of others.
its not the world champs its not win or go home without a pot to piss in . its a bit of fun
My best ever 20min effort is 313W from March 2019, 95% of which is 298W. I managed 311W for 20mins at Richmond iirc in a 1-lap race back in early Feb. Due to lack of training and possible COVID-19 illness, I’m back down at ~269W.
to be fair - 20 minute power is an estimated FTP anyway. and as such people train to improve that measure of FTP which improves your 20 minute power but not as much your actual FTP.
FTP is not the be all and end all.
they extrapolate from 20 minute power because a true FTP test is a thing of horror and VERY hard to pace.
a 25mile time trial event is a good FTP gauge as itll likely take you round an hour.
My ramp test on trainer road gave me 256. I have subsequently ridden for an hour on turbo non stop and I think the number was 263, so pretty good way of estimating.
My mate rides zwift with a wheel on tacx which is meant to be 'smart' and his numbers are all over the place, tt power varies between 230 and 260 watts. Even my flux power is totally inaccurate when compared to my stages, which is what I take my power readings for zwift, tr etc.
I do find that power indoors is far harder to come by than power outdoors. I reckon I'm about 5% lower on the turbo. Anyone else find this?
I do find that power indoors is far harder to come by than power outdoors. I reckon I’m about 5% lower on the turbo. Anyone else find this?
Nope, my best power figures for 5-60mins have all come from indoors (although a very quick look at this year shows I've done ~315W indoors and outdoors for ~10mins).
Outdoors for me gets messed up by factors including junctions; traffic lights; undulating terrain; wildly unstable climb gradients on relatively significant cat3/4 hills.
However, when I haven't turboed for several weeks, it takes me the best part of ~3 weeks of regular intensive sessions (~30mins+ with a vast majority at z4+ power, 3+ times a week) to allow my body to heat adapt to indoors and then match my outdoor stats. To begin with, my heart rate for any given power ~z3+ is significantly higher than outdoors.
I was one of the riders Dowsett was complaining about on the TT video (this race https://zwiftpower.com/events.php?zid=376569 )
Zwift has gifted us both with perfect CDA’s and he’s at altitude....
The difference with those guys is they can do those watts in a TT position or 6 hours GT, not just a 20-60 min race.
One thing I've noticed on Zwift is that I record higher maximum heart rates than I ever manage on the road. 193 Vs 186 BPM, using the same HR strap. Weird.
HR is just adrenaline and racing....
My highest HRs were when i raced local XC stuff and Zwift races of old
On a local loop I just can't mentally push myself the same
Same, I can’t get my HR up to the same levels I can achieve outdoors...
Using the road feel (motor etc) actually makes it harder to hold onto the pack downhill because you have to get it in top gear and pedal like crazy, whereas a normal trainer will just take any power input and increase your speed. On top of that, road feel robs power over cobbles and gravel sections.
I have a Neo, and have ridden a couple of events recently where I was pedalling flat out on big descents to try and keep up with other riders who were pulling away from me while freewheeling at zero Watts, so obviously different trainer setups work in very different ways.
Of course people will be "cheating" on Zwift, but there's not much point in worrying about it. It's an entertaining way to use a turbo trainer and a useful training aid for real life cycling. I'm nowhere near the pointy end of the events I ride, but I usually find a group I can ride with and where I have to put in a decent effort to keep up with the others.
HR is just adrenaline and racing….
I get as much adrenaline from a good Zwift race as i ever did from racing outdoors 🙂
To some, Zwift is a game... but when you're in the mix in the last 3km of a race with 20 others, it's SO not a game 🙂
@kcr you know about the super aero crouch thing on big hills? If you're putting out no power and it's steep enough you crouch and it's super aero, so sometimes not pedalling is faster.
It's not quite a game, but it's certainly not real racing. And I dont get anywhere near the buzz of rocking up to start line of a proper tt when im on zwift..nor do I particularly care where I place online either....the results are largely irrelevant, a bit like strava times.
It's a decent way to stay fit during winter and lock down, but I can't understand people who race online but not in real life..
t’s not quite a game, but it’s certainly not real racing. And I dont get anywhere near the buzz of rocking up to start line of a proper tt when im on zwift..nor do I particularly care where I place online either….the results are largely irrelevant, a bit like strava times.
It’s a decent way to stay fit during winter and lock down, but I can’t understand people who race online but not in real life..
I've done both, road circuits, XC, XCM, etc.... Zwift is just like it but without it being in the arse end of winter, cold, wet and muddy 🙂 Zwift racing has all of the positives and none of the negatives 🙂
I can race any time of the day, on courses that suit me, finish the race and 2 mins later i'm in the bath or sitting down with the family.... brilliant 🙂
It’s not quite a game, but it’s certainly not real racing. And I dont get anywhere near the buzz of rocking up to start line of a proper tt when im on zwift..nor do I particularly care where I place online either….the results are largely irrelevant, a bit like strava times.
It’s a decent way to stay fit during winter and lock down, but I can’t understand people who race online but not in real life..
I sort of agree but think it's huge for road racing, and can fully understand people preferring e-crits to real ones. Crashing is a very real thing in closed circuit road racing and personally I aint got time for that. People riding like bellends with the traffic is also a very real thing in open road racing AFAICT.
If I crash in a cyclocross race (which I do, frequently) then 9 times out of 10 it didn't hurt too much, my bike isn't broken, and, critically, it was likely my fault - I made a technical mistake so that's on me. Crash in the bunch sprint of a crit 9 times our of 10 is going to hurt like fk and maybe worse, decent chance of wrecking your bike, and often will be nothing to do with you.
My rule of thumb is that anyone going faster than me is probably cheating. To be fair, sometimes they are cheating inadvertently - eg: trainers with dodgy power outputs - but I do find it hard to believe that so many people an be faster than me. On my local loop, I have never been passed by anyone. Go figure 🙂
you know about the super aero crouch thing on big hills?
No, I wasn't aware of that at all! I did notice the other avatars going into the super tuck position.
Zwift racing has all of the positives and none of the negatives
Zwift is good fun, and they've done a decent job of simulating the feel of riding a bike (if you are using a smart trainer) but it's a long, long way from the cut and thrust of real world racing, and the buzz you get from racing flat out in a real world bunch.
HR is just adrenaline and racing….
Could be that. In my last race, it became critically important to come 25th rather than 26th! Thought I was going to pass out afterwards.
but it’s a long, long way from the cut and thrust of real world racing, and the buzz you get from racing flat out in a real world bunch.
For you.... not for everyone 🙂
For you…. not for everyone
Fair enough. For me, sitting in my garage pedalling in a straight line is a long way from manoeuvring around a fluid bunch, trying to read what my opponents are up to, negotiating terrain, corners and weather conditions and using them to best advantage, pushing my limits where getting things wrong could have real consequences. For me, a Zwift road race can be just as demanding as the real world in terms of simple Watts output, but it is nowhere near real life in terms of racing skills and mental intensity.
Similar to Dowsett, worth looking at Zwift Insider and Kevin Bouchard and Ted King do an A Cat race. Interesting take on the tactics they use, especially on use of drafting and being at the front at the start of the race.
Zwift Insider Video Link
Never done a Crit or any sort of road race (unless we include Ride London 😂 )
I’ve done a few TT and they are a lot of faff for 30 or 60 mins of cycling.
Done a few XC races
Zwift is easier than a TT and less faff and not much different in terms of technicality
XC racing is a lot muddier
Zwift is easier than a TT and less faff and not much different in terms of technicality
XC racing is a lot muddier
It's night and day different from the technicality of a real TT, tiger, as there is no aero. Means no position, means not all that interesting or relevant as squaring the power / aero circle is the essence of testing. What is my most powerful, most aero position, that I can safely sustain? Doesn't get any more technical than that - no single cycling technique is studied in more depth.
The other technical side of TTing is total conservation of momentum over the road undulations (v difficult skill to master IRL) but you do get at least a simulation of this in zwift.
Wow, this thread is a window into a world I was aware of, but don’t quite understand.
I got a cheap turbo just before lockdown and have started using Zwift to follow a training plan to hopefully come out of this fitter than I went in. I didn’t realise the racing thing was quite so serious & caring about what others are doing on it!
As for estimating FTP, I have no idea how accurate mine is. I did a ramp test, it came out at 245W and it bases the workouts around that which seems to be working OK.
I didn’t realise the racing thing was quite so serious & caring about what others are doing on it!
Don't ever look at the Zwiftpower forum then.
People care, deffo. I certainly care. Although since I moved to B and obscurity I care less
How accurate are the power readings from the cheaper tacx wheel on smart turbos?
I rode with my mate up alp d zwift yesterday, and he put out 265 watts for the climb. Which is as much as he's ever put out in any of the 20 min tts we do.
So either he's improved overnight, or these wheel on turbos vary from day to day fairly substantially..
If they're on a Flow it's +/- 5% you can see the variance here
I'm on a Flow at the moment and considering an upgrade, I was going to get a 2nd hand cross bike post lockdown but coming to the conclusion would get more value from improving my Zwift set up.
I'm not too worried about noise as in an detached insulated garage and ride with noise cancelling headphones, but would like to improve the accuracy and gradient reproduction.
If it makes any difference prob 80% ERG and 20% Racing/Free Rides.
So do I just drop some cash (when they're back in stock/people flogging them post lockdown) on a Kickr or Tacx Neo, or would an entry level direct drive plus a power meter and head-unit be a more flexible solution. Or maybe even keep the Flow and get a rear wheel power meter.
https://whatsonzwift.com/workouts/build-me-up/week-1-pre-training-plan/ isn't bad as a rough and ready way of gauging if your FTP is in the right ballpark, if doing it on when your legs aren't dead.