[Closed] Yay! UKIP employing Latvians to deliver their election leaflets.

What's worrying is everytime one of these FAILS is publicised, their poll ratings appear to go up 😯
Has someone put something in the water?

Isn't he the bloke who drinks pints?
and who's light aircraft don't stay in the sky...

Surely its 'Fast Leaflet' employing Latvians, not UKIP?

The more they get criticised, particularly by the irritating politically correct left, the greater their vote will be...

In this instance had UKIP ironically had their way that company would have had to try and employ the lazy uneducated English work force, that in all probability would turn its nose up at such a menial task or charge so much UKIP couldn't have afforded it.

Lazy journalism for a more outrageous headline, innit. Of course its fast leaflet employing the latvians, what political party would go through the bother and HR cost of employing their own deliverers of leaflets for such a short length of time when they could purchase these services from someone who specialises in this work.

Gavin Barwell, Tory MP for Croydon Central, told HuffPost UK: “Ukip’s hypocrisy knows no bounds. They say they are against Europeans taking our jobs and then, when they have a chance to offer some British people work delivering their leaflets because they can’t find volunteers to do it, they employ European workers. You couldn’t make it up!”

Though this mp doesn't exactly help clarify this arrangement with his use of "employ", he does seem to have a point.

politically correct

You mean normal people who like the idea of being nice to each other? 😀

Lazy journalism for a more outrageous headline, innit.

From the HuffPo? Who'dathunkit?

El-bent - Member
politically correct
You mean normal people who like the idea of being nice to each other?

No I mean abnormal people who make us [s]normal peoples[/s] Daily Mail readers lives a misery. 😉

No I mean abnormal people who make normal peoples lives a misery.

How so?

How so?

How long have you got?

Do you not real the Mail?

derekfish - Member

The more they get criticised, particularly by the irritating politically correct left.....

You're at it again derekfish .......[i]Gavin Barwell, Tory MP for Croydon Central, told HuffPost UK: "Ukip’s hypocrisy knows no bounds".[/i]

Only you would describe a Tory MP as "the irritating politically correct left".

As Gavin Barwell points out the problem for UKIP is that they can't find volunteers who are committed to their party's policies to do their leafleting for them.

But then how can anyone have any real commitment to UKIP when no one really knows what UKIP policies are ? Their supporters are as clueless of UKIP policies as their candidates are loopy.

How long have you got?

Well go on then, spit it out, I fancy a laugh.

ernie_lynch - Member
derekfish - Member
The more they get criticised, particularly by the irritating politically correct left.....

You're at it again derekfish .

You know I didn't mean that poor desperate Tory MP, and the PC quip was aimed closer to STW home than that my fine fettered red flag following friend.. 😉

El-bent - Member
How long have you got?
Well go on then, spit it out, I fancy a laugh.

Well now let me think, what about todays latest.. How is it my youngest child having benefited from a fine state education, followed even by a spell in the private sector and all her friends, know all about the five pillars of islam, but nothing of Magna Carta - as a for instance.

Only you would describe a Tory MP as "the irritating politically correct left".

To be fair, to UKIP the Torys [i]are[/i] the irritating politically correct left.

...when they have a chance to offer some British people work delivering their leaflets because they can’t find volunteers to do it, they employ European workers. You couldn’t make it up!”

Though this mp doesn't exactly help clarify this arrangement with his use of "employ", he does seem to have a point.

Well, for a start it would be illegal under EU law for UKIP to contract a firm and say they could only use British workers, and on top of that it would be illegal under EU law for 'Fast Leaflet' to employ only British workers

So the fact that they were unable to contract or employ only British workers to do it due to EU law actually reinforces UKIP's point surely

[i]British Jobs for British Workers[/i] as a certain former prime minister said!

Given UKIP's scare mongering about foreign labour streaming into the country, if I was Nigel Farage I'd damn well be checking that I wasn't making a **** of myself when engaging a contractor, it's fairly common practice these days to take responsibility for your supply chain, just makes them look like the amateurs they are.

Please stop under-estimating and trivialising UKIP. Stop classifying them as the "far right", they are attracting voters from the right, the centre and the left.

if I was Nigel Farage I'd damn well be checking that I wasn't making a **** of myself when engaging a contractor, it's fairly common practice these days to take responsibility for your supply chain

As pointed out above, what do you expect him to do? Break the law?

UKIP aren't Far Right but Far Weird.

Well now let me think, what about todays latest.. How is it my youngest child having benefited from a fine state education, followed even by a spell in the private sector and all her friends, know all about the five pillars of islam, but nothing of Magna Carta - as a for instance.

So what you are saying that they should not know something about one of the world religions over the value of something other than in its historical context, has been replaced by other legislation?

Did they learn any other history? How about WW1? Or the civil war? Or the reaffirmation?

El-bent - Member
So what you are saying that they should not know something about one of the world religions over the value of something other than in its historical context, has been replaced by other legislation?

Did they learn any other history? How about WW1? Or the civil war? Or the reaffirmation?

Pandering to Islam is just one irritating politically correct instance. Why Islam? Why not the Hindu Faith, or Buddism, both peaceful religions, both with representation here, but beyond that, the Magna Carta is the root of the freedoms and basis for our Justice System, which has been exported far and wide, pretty fundamental that kids know about it rather than some aggressively bigoted religion like Islam.

[s] the [/s] Magna Carta

Corrected for pedantry

It's quite funny but tbh this sort of thing just distracts from the sort of madcap stuff they actually do totally of their own volition, so it's probably counterproductive.

...aggressively bigoted...

Aren't aggressively bigoted folk just horrible to be around?!

deadlydarcy - Member
...aggressively bigoted...
Aren't aggressively bigoted folk just horrible to be around?!

Ask those 200 Nigerian girls.

Derekfish

It's a matter of balance. As a teacher, I raise awareness of the Muslim faith before those others, to counter the constant barrage of vitriol that kids are exposed to from certain areas of the popular press. Though I'm sure your daughter gets to form her own opinions, encouraged by those around her to keep an open mind.

El-bent
I think you meant Reformation.

boxelder - Member
Derekfish

It's a matter of balance. As a teacher, I raise awareness of the Muslim faith before those others, to counter the constant barrage of vitriol that kids are exposed to from certain areas of the popular press. Though I'm sure your daughter gets to form her own opinions, encouraged by those around her to keep an open mind.

As a teacher do you know of the events surrounding Magna Carta? Can you enlighten pupils about the facts surrounding our Civil War, Cromwell and the resulting powers granted to parliament?

None of these kids know the first thing about any of it.

I have to agree with Derekfish on the lack of knowledge about the development of our own constitution - personally I think its a fascinating subject, but I'm a geek like that. (Horrible Histories should be mandatory reading & watching)

Pandering to Islam is just one irritating politically correct instance. Why Islam? Why not the Hindu Faith, or Buddism, both peaceful religions, both with representation here, but beyond that, the Magna Carta is the root of the freedoms and basis for our Justice System, which has been exported far and wide, pretty fundamental that kids know about it rather than some aggressively bigoted religion like Islam.

Oh come on, that didn't take very long to show your colours. No fun.

Surely you should contacting the history department of said schools, and asking why Magna carta isn't on the list? We do have a rather large amount of history to cover after all.

And surely its not a bad idea for them to get to know something about one of the worlds religions(with a million+ followers in the country) rather than listening to the rantings of their father?

I suppose they could have learnt about the Christian faith and how peaceful it is...oh, hang on.

One of my local Potential MEP's is Amjad Bashir - UKIP

I think him and other Ukips members will get pretty good support if i'm honest.

Derekfish, I dislike you as much as beardy suicide bomber types. In fact, I'm half imagining you as some sort of Anders Breivik loon.

Keep fighting the power, bro.

[img] [/img]

I shall vote UKIP for MEP for some entertainments rather than the traditional spineless lot.

As for the MP and local council I shall vote for the opposition (whoever is the strongest opposition) to those who are currently in power.

They are all zombie maggots regardless of the party I vote for.

Oh come on, that didn't take very long to show your colours. No fun.

Surely you should contacting the history department of said schools, and asking why Magna carta isn't on the list? We do have a rather large amount of history to cover after all.

And surely its not a bad idea for them to get to know something about one of the worlds religions(with a million+ followers in the country) rather than listening to the rantings of their father?

I suppose they could have learnt about the Christian faith and how peaceful it is...oh, hang on.

All of that has the fundamental basis in history, from Magna Carta, through the civl war, the conquest of half the world and the loss of it all to the US and various other countries. I seem to spend almost all of my waking hours whenever these kids come round explaining it all to them.

They even have sessions boning up on minor little things I think they should know, you know like being able to name three or four English counties, never mind naming all of them and telling me where they are.

Or I rip the piss out of them and they worry about coming round to take her out for fear of being lab led 'moron' which quite frankly I can do all too often and shouldn't given they are bright kids, supposedly well educated.

So what has this to do with UKIP, I hear you wonder? Fundamentally it is the root of the reason parties like UKIP can breed, on the fear brought about by lack of education, the reason why there are so many folk from other countries here and why they're here, pretty much all of their countries have either been invaded by us, or fought over in times past, but our kids don't know all this, or about basic freedoms that have been fought for, so in teaching religious trivia, rather than history, we are causing the problem.

Great, Chewkw has turned up, there goes the neighbourhood. 😉

Tom_W1987 - Member
Derekfish, I dislike you as much as beardy suicide bomber types. In fact, I'm half imagining you as some sort of Anders Breivik loon.

Keep fighting the power, bro.

PS that bloke can't be all bad, he hasn't got that big a beard

They're not at school to learn about religion per se, they're there to learn enough about themselves to carry out an existence. Part of that existence is knowing who you are, where you're from, why so many people from other countries want to come here.

LOL.

if I was Nigel Farage I'd damn well be checking that I wasn't making a **** of myself when engaging a contractor, it's fairly common practice these days to take responsibility for your supply chain

ninfan - Member

As pointed out above, what do you expect him to do? Break the law?

Nope, I don't expect him to break the law.

It's purely toughshit that he doesn't have enough volunteers to hand out the leaflets, doesn't mean he has to compromise his own principles, unless he doesn't actually have any.

So what has this to do with UKIP, I hear you wonder? Fundamentally it is the root of the reason parties like UKIP can breed, on the fear brought about by lack of education, the reason why there are so many folk from other countries here and why they're here, pretty much all of their countries have either been invaded by us, or fought over in times past, but our kids don't know all this, or about basic freedoms that have been fought for, so in teaching religious trivia, rather than history, we are causing the problem.

So teach them about empire, and how we killed an awful lot of them in a gun beats spear kind of way, but don't teach them about what you refer to as "religious trivia". So they are ignorant of one of the worlds biggest religions. And this is a way to neutralise UKIP?

Hate to say this, but this argument I've come across before, from the EDL.

Beats me why UKIP would bother sending extra leaflets out . Every political party taking part in an election be it Euro,national or local gets a free leaflet delivery via Royal mail. The correct number of leaflets for each postcode area is delivered to the sorting offices so they can be delivered to every property in that area.Returns are not allowed as only the correct amount should be supplied (although the UKIP ones were about 3500 too many).
We had UKIP last week, today we recieved Labour and the Green party leaflets arrive tomorrow

El-bent - Member

Great, Chewkw has turned up, there goes the neighbourhood.

😆 [b]You lot are thinking too much.[/b]

Regardless of who you choose you will always choose zombie maggots from the four main parties i.e. Tory, Labour, Lib Dem or UKIP(MEP only).

My rationale:

Tory - they have only been back for one term so give them a chance. How much worst can that be by comparison to previous govt under Labour?

Labour - they were in govt for 3 terms and power really got to their heads. Should be out for at least 3 terms.

Lib Dem - King maker? They are cartoons aren't they? Apart from Vince who I think is a nice guy.

UKIP - someone to voice up against EU zombies because the other three main parties simply do not have the guts to do so. Ya, ya I hear you saying delicate negotiations to lead whatever etc ... sort that. Nobody is going to die of starvation en mass.

🙄

My rational:

You didn't need to type any more beyond this point.

It used to be the duty of the church to teach religion, or you opt in to RI.

No more than I want my kids to be indoctrinated into the CofE, or Catholicism, I don't want them taught about another meaningless belief. As an extra add on? Fine, but only after they've been taught enough about the UK to understand our founding principles.

Thereby a basis for judgement can be made.

Which inevitably will be that most religions are the root of all evil.

But that freedom and justice are worth fighting for and protecting.

http://www.shouldivoteukip.co.uk/

El-bent - Member

My rational:

You didn't need to type any more beyond this point.

😆 I know I have some.

So there are not enough UKIP supporters to hand out the leaflets.

Looks like less of a up welling of public support than they like portray it

Rationale

Education should prepare kids for the future. Understanding Islam will be far more use than Magna Carta.

Young kids find Political/constitutional history as dull as....

Ive just used a UKIP flyer as a cat litter liner.
Anyone have a photo of Derek?

[i] but only after they've been taught enough about the UK to understand our founding principles.[/i]

Thing about the UK is that it wasn't really founded, it just sort of happened, mainly by accident. And there certainly aren't any founding principles.

From memory, Magna Carta is mainly about preserving the power of individual aristocrats, and putting down the Jews.

somewhatslightlydazed - Member

From memory, Magna Carta is mainly about preserving the power of individual aristocrats, and putting down the Jews.

So you don't know anything about the basis of the freedom of the individual and the right to trial then.

I don't want them taught about another meaningless belief.

You may think it is meaningless, I might think it is meaningless, however several billion people don't. Might be useful to be aware of this, no?

putting down the Jews.

Ah well, of course thats where constitutional history gets interesting - as the relevance of the reference to Jews in Magna Carta was of course the fact that they were main money lenders, since lending money with payment of interest was prohibited under Christian doctrine, as it still is under Islam.

So there we see the histories of big contemporary issues such as international finance, the regulation of banking, the concentration of money in the hands of the wealthy, the roots of future persecution and an exploration of the theological ties between Christianity and Islam - all these things tie into teaching an understanding of this historical bit of paper! Marvellous 😀

muddydwarf - Member
Ive just used a UKIP flyer as a cat litter liner.
Anyone have a photo of Derek?

I'm taking names here.. 😉

You and Tom will be the first into the 'showers'

Nick - Member
I don't want them taught about another meaningless belief.
You may think it is meaningless, I might think it is meaningless, however several billion people don't. Might be useful to be aware of this, no?

That's me out.
Very poor taste there derekfish.

ninfan - Member
putting down the Jews.
Ah well, of course thats where constitutional history gets interesting - as the relevance of the reference to Jews in Magna Carta was of course the fact that they were main money lenders, since lending money with payment of interest was prohibited under Christian doctrine, as it still is under Islam.

So there we see the histories of big contemporary issues such as international finance, the regulation of banking, the concentration of money in the hands of the wealthy, the roots of future persecution and an exploration of the theological ties between Christianity and Islam - all these things tie into teaching an understanding of this historical bit of paper! Marvellous

Pandering to Islam is just one irritating politically correct instance. Why Islam? Why not the Hindu Faith, or Buddism, both peaceful religions, both with representation here, but beyond that, the Magna Carta is the root of the freedoms and basis for our Justice System, which has been exported far and wide, pretty fundamental that kids know about it rather than some aggressively bigoted religion like Islam.

NURSE, he's out of his bed again!!!!!

boxelder - Member
That's me out.
Very poor taste there derekfish.

Post reported. Seriously not acceptable.

Born '74

I had a library card!

several billion people might want to come here and why UKIP supporters might not want them all here.

Yeah yeah yeah, but several billion people won't come here, however many times UKIP, BNP, EDL and you say that they want to.

[i]So you don't know anything about the basis of the freedom of the individual and the right to trial then[/i]

I know it states that no freeman can be punished except through the law of the land. But why should I give a shit? I'm a serf. And a woman.

CaptainFlashheart - Member
Post reported. Seriously not acceptable.

Really? Not even with the obvious wink? You do take yourself very seriously...

[i]Maybe, but only after they have an understanding of Magna Carta, the Civil War, [/i]

The point about history, your real history rather than the Alf Garnett/UKIP view spouted by certain people, is there might (just possibly) be more than one way of "understanding" something like Magana Carta or the Civil Wars.

But don't let proper historical debate get in the way of your propaganda.

somewhatslightlydazed - Member
So you don't know anything about the basis of the freedom of the individual and the right to trial then

I know it states that no freeman can be punished except through the law of the land. But why should I give a shit? I'm a serf. And a woman.

Yes, really. And if you think I take myself seriously, then you're not only deeply offensively unfunny, but utterly ignorant as well.

That wasn't funny. It wasn't gallows humour.

somewhatslightlydazed - Member
Maybe, but only after they have an understanding of Magna Carta, the Civil War,

The point about history, your real history rather than the Alf Garnett/UKIP view spouted by certain people, is there might (just possibly) be more than one way of "understanding" something like Magana Carta or the Civil Wars.

But don't let proper historical debate get in the way of your propaganda.

I think you may be mistaking my take on all this, seriously I'm not here to promote the likes of UKIP, I'm merely indicating why they are suddenly rising up in popularity, so, it's not 'propaganda' it's the reason through errors of Political correctness that a pendulum has been set in motion, and my over riding point is that it is to do with education or the lack of it.

I never thought i'd even come close to defending derekfish but that was clearly a joke. I myself have used the similar 'first against the wall come the revolution' joke on here, probably no funnier then but it was a joke. I hope its obvious I would never actually advocate the execution of anyone.
That is about all I could defend tho.

CaptainFlashheart - Member
Yes, really. And if you think I take myself seriously, then you're not only deeply offensively unfunny, but utterly ignorant as well.

That wasn't funny. It wasn't gallows humour.

Well I thought it was exactly 'gallows humour' as a reaction to having my picture used as a cat litter, I have to say I'm disappointed and surprised by your reaction, you are one of the posters here that I have found amusing and enlightened, so take that in the manner that it is intended.

It always staggers me that people can actually be right wing. Why on earth would you want to be unpleasant to other people, ignorant of damage you are doing to the world and generally downright mean when the alternative is being nice?

Sweepy, the 'first against the wall' trope is just that. It's non specific, non offensive. Joking about a massacre like the Holocaust? Not funny.

CaptainFlashheart - Member
Sweepy, the 'first against the wall' trope is just that. It's non specific, non offensive. Joking about a massacre like the Holocaust? Not funny.

Not wishing to irritate any further but the logic for using "Nazi-esque' gallows humour is precisely because of the parallels drawn between the rise of UKIP and fascism. It also clearly hasn't sunk in, that rather than promoting UKIP I am pointing out that it is precisely the excesses of the left that have caused it and education being just one of them.

Hell how bad is it when you have to explain a joke..

I'll be honest Flashy, is you looked deep into my posting history you would find a holocaust joke. Its the only one ive ever found funny or acceptable. I think it even got a laugh out of TJ tho he did call me evil, lightheartedly I hope.
Do take your point tho.

Joking about a massacre like the Holocaust? Not funny.

When you have to explain a joke, it isn't funny.

Really Flashy I'd never had you down as one of the 'outraged and offended'

I shall leave you to it with a quote from your very own Guardian columnist who's name I always forget..

"[i]I hate offended people. They come in two flavours - huffy and whiny - and it's hard to know which is worst. The huffy ones are self-important, narcissistic authoritarians in love with the sound of their own booming disapproval, while the whiny, sparrowlike ones are so annoying and sickly and ill-equipped for life on Earth you just want to smack them round the head until they stop crying and grow up. Combined, they're the very worst people on the planet - 20 times worse than child molesters[/i]

[i]I am pointing out that it is precisely the excesses of the left that have caused it and education being just one of them.[/i]

I don't see that the left has been any more excessive than the right (or anybody else for that matter).

e.g Ignoring Magna Carta is just as bad as turning into so sort of cornerstone of the English way of life. Michael Gove's attempt to re-invent WW1 is just as bad as basing your views entirely on "Oh what a lovely war"

I reckon part of UKIPs popularity is because the English love loonies. Just look at Boris Johnson.

Shirley with the obvious hypocrisy and logical fallacies spouted by UKIP and its collection of anti-PC heroes/ biggoted idiots (depending on your opinion)
People who vote for them are the ultimate example of poor education

derekfish - Member

The more they get criticised, particularly by the irritating politically correct left

What do you find irritating about political correctness?

How is it my youngest child having benefited from a fine state education, followed even by a spell in the private sector and all her friends, know all about the five pillars of islam, but nothing of Magna Carta - as a for instance.

No idea, did you speak to her teachers at the time?
Perhaps your daughter just isn't very bright?
Maybe she just wasn't paying attention?

Anyway, you paid for her education - you probably should have picked a better school.

Pandering to Islam is just one irritating politically correct instance. Why Islam? Why not the Hindu Faith, or Buddism, both peaceful religions, both with representation here

Buddhism isn't a religion.
Again, perhaps you both should have paid a bit more attention in school.

Personally I'd sooner they were taught about the Hindu faith, which is open and encompasses lots of teachings, but then Hindu's don't go around bleating victim on one hand whilst bombing, torturing, discriminating, hell bent on world domination with the other, but that isn't the point.

Didn't teach you or your daughter much about the history of religious conflict in India either, did they?

They even have sessions boning up on minor little things I think they should know, you know like being able to name three or four English counties

You don't seem to know much about the role religion played in Magna Carta either.
Perhaps, as ninfan says, you'd benefit from a library ticket.