[Closed] WWSTW Do - A Supplier With A Bad Attitude

So your initial response was 'harsh words', a rollocking and a demand for compensation rather than a 'hey guys, what's gone off here. Can we sort this out, we all know how it works'.

No wonder he won't deal with you.

Erm, bypass him and go straight to the owner. You owe dickhead guy nothing, otoh he’s getting in the way of your ability to work

I thought geographic sales territories between suppliers were illegal under the competition act or enterprise act as they can be anti-competitive

I thought geographic sales territories between suppliers were illegal under the competition act or enterprise act as they can be anti-competitive

That one.

 

on the same page as the muffin. If your very first reaction was to have harsh words...reap what you sow et etc.

@the-muffin-man - not initially, that whats it evolved to after cloak and daggers and lies from the guy responsible. Lies that were backed up by my customer who thought something was amiss and came straight to us.

@sgn23 - not in this instance. It's all agreed and like i say, has worked fine with us collaborating on certain projects etc and carving the rest between us.

My company has agreed geographical territories with one of our suppliers which has worked for the last decade and if i get an enquiry which is in their area i pass it on and vice versa.

How is this agreement actually documented?
Is there a contract, a memorandum of understanding, an email, a signed napkin?

Basically how formal and therefore enforceable is your agreement?

Could this have been triggered by that there Brexit? seeing as they're in the EU and you're now out (I'm assuming that's the case)?

Either way I'd say your agreement might be over and you have a new competitor, but also some potential new territories to sell to...

I'd not go in shouting at a key supplier so much that they stopped working with my company, nor would I be broadcasting a potentially anti-competition/market fixing arrangement on a public website.

If I had I'd be brushing up my CV and looking for new jobs.

@cookeaa - The contract has been agreed (their doing!) with teh caveat that if this happens then an agreed % of compensation will be paid. The owner was incredibly apologetic and it hasn't tarnished the relationship between us, but matey boy has really taken umbridge about it!

The owner was incredibly apologetic and it hasn’t tarnished the relationship between us, but matey boy has really taken umbridge about it!

Except you don't actually know what the owner said to the employee - nor what the owner said about to, behind your back.

You should be having this conversation with the supplier, really.

But do you know if the employee has a chimney on his house?

Sounds a lot like a Cartel. Hope no US Antitrust breaches involved or it'll be 50 years in Guantanamo.

I would make sure I was the 1st whistleblower.

Cartel……

not in this instance. It’s all agreed

Agreed with whom?

@lamp - why does this supplier need you if you're just a reseller?

not in this instance. It’s all agreed and like i say, has worked fine with us collaborating on certain projects etc and carving the rest between us.

But that's exactly what a company in a cartel *would* say...

Wouldn't mind getting in on some of this cartel action. We're in the bazaar business and I can tell you, it's a crowded marketplace.

@lamp the fact that "it's all agreed" just reinforces that it's illegal. What you are doing is preventing the purchaser from being able to have two suppliers compete for their business so that they pay a higher price. This is anti-competitive.
I highly doubt that any lawyer would have seen the contract you say exists as it is illegal.
You've incriminated the company with this post, you'd better hope there's no way to identify the company in your post history.

I suggest you agree to meet half way (geographically) and have a fight.

I'm confused (easily done). They're your supplier but also a competitor (but you've come to some sort of non-compete agreement with, of dubious legality)? I take it what they supply you with aren't the same items they also sell themselves in (potential) competition with you, otherwise you're a bit screwed if you screw up the relationship with them?

Regardless it sounds like the guy is being a dick and you either put up with it or get the owner to have a word so he sorts out his attitude (or the owner replaces him).

Sounds like exactly the sort of thing I've just done a course in.

Don't know what industry you work in, but in Banking this would be a trip to the regulator and not for tea & scones.

I would make sure I was the 1st whistleblower.

Financial reward and immunity in return for throwing your company under the bus if you get there first, OP 😁

Otherwise...😳

Op is a mafia don

My immediate thoughts were it does sound a bit anti-competitive/shady.

Is the supplier also doing direct sales in their territory, or is it actually another reseller and not the true supplier?

What the OP describes at the outset is a cartel. One individual has broken ranks and sounds like he is getting it from both sides for breaking the omerta.

Viewed objectively the 'rogue' is the only one acting in the best interest of the customer. All other parties are getting the hump because it is upsetting their cartel.

If the 'rogue' is selling his company's goods/services at below his employer's minimum price to line his own pockets in some way, he is defrauding his employer, so it is between the employer and the employee.

Separate legal entities are not allowed to influence each others pricing, who they tender with etc.

This is why suppliers who are also retailers (Clarks shoes stocked elsewhere for example) can put a RRP on their invoice, but it is unenforceable because that is price fixing. Clarks could refuse to supply other retailers who might then undercut them, but it is better business for them to simply charge a high cost price.

Suppliers who are also retailers try all sorts of things to stop the other retailers they supply from undercutting them, but they cannot insist. In these cases they will also be wary how much stock they are willing to supply. No point selling 10,000 units to retailer X if retailer X is making a bad buying decision and will stick it all in the Sale. However, if retailer X is of sufficient size, they could try this to destroy the supplier/retailer as a retailer and make them a monopoly supplier and buy them out.

But price fixing and having geographical 'patches' is not something that can be formalised legally between legal entities.

This is where ethics meets profits, so there will always be good and bad behaviour.

Note that anti-competitive behaviour is not always to the detriment of the customer. My mate used to own a ham producing business. Sometimes he (or a competitor) would get a glut or order that they could not process in their own factory. They would help each other out with spare capacity to get the order out. It was done quid pro quo and did not affect the price to the customer. It meant that each company didn't have to put all their eggs in one basket customer-wise. It actually ensured that, in the long term, there were more suppliers available to each customer.

Complex yet simple!

Judging by the fact that you’re clearly in a Cartel then you need to hire some minions to take him out. Also get some pet Hippos and hide money in your walls.

The owner was incredibly apologetic and it hasn’t tarnished the relationship between us, but matey boy has really taken umbridge about it!

Talk to the owner. He’s your longest serving contact. This threatens the relationship between your business and his, so take it to the top.

My mate used to own a ham producing business. Sometimes he (or a competitor) would get a glut or order that they could not process in their own factory. They would help each other out with spare capacity to get the order out. It was done quid pro quo and did not affect the price to the customer. It meant that each company didn’t have to put all their eggs in one basket customer-wise. It actually ensured that, in the long term, there were more suppliers available to each customer.

M N X?

F U N E M?

S. V F M.

F U N E X?

S. V F X.

I'd not be calling the compitions and monopoly people.

I'm sure the guys at the suppliers pissed he is in sales and you cock blocked him. And probably gave him a load of Attitude

F U N E X?

V F N 10 E X.

Exclusive territory based distribution agreements can be legitimate in certain circumstances if very carefully drafted (and the reality matches the contract) but it’s a minefield. If the employee of the company is not following the rules, and you are 100% sure the rules are legit and clear then it will be because they are incentivised to break the rules - so you need to have that conversation with the signatories to the contract.

I’ve got a reseller who is rude, obnoxious, and makes promises we can’t fulfill without consulting then throws me under the bus. We’ve just told her that she’s too hard to work with and we will be avoiding her where possible. She seemed under the mistaken belief that she matters more to us than vice Versa. I’ve no idea how it will end up long term - but I’d be surprised if the loyalty on the other side of your contract is to you rather than their employee who you’ve shouted at!

What if "geography" means "country"? I think it's fairly common for sales agreements to be based on countries? From how I read the OP - it sounds like his company was supposed to be the sole reseller in Ireland - but the supplier/manufacturer (?) seems to have started selling direct there.

IANAL, but a exclusive country-specific sales agreement with a supplier sounds legal (on the basis that these are quite common), and the OP would have legitimate cause for complaint if the supplier rescinded on this.

The obvious answer to the OP is: Why are you arguing with the monkey? Speak to the organ grinder.

(I have just checked whether organ grinder/monkey could be considered racist - I don't think it is, so I'm going to stick with it..... but if I've offended anyone, I apologize)

Has matey got a wheelie bin?

Yes, you can set up exclusive distribution agreements in which you agree not to actively sell direct to customers but it's a bit harder now to define territories effectively. If a customer googles, and finds your product and contacts you, it's legal for you to passively sell to them even if that is in a territory where you have appointed a distributor, they can't stop you. You can't go on a sales tour of the territory and knock on doors to drum up direct business. And what if the purchasing office is in one territory but they want deliveries to several, all with different arrangements.

Depending on the relationship with them, you may choose to tell the googler that you have a distributor and pass details on, would be the way we always ran our business. Some customers didn't want to deal with distributors if they didn't see the worth in it eg: holding local stock for immediate delivery, providing tech support.

Worst I had was in mainland Europe, where we had different distributors in FR and Benelux but customers in French speaking Belgium would prefer to deal with the FR distributor rather than the Benelux (ie Dutch) one. Being the man in the middle manoeuvring between two distributors where both arguments were correct was impossible!!

but if I’ve offended anyone, I apologize)

I’m offended by your spelling of apologise 🙂

but if I’ve offended anyone, I apologize)

I’m offended by your spelling of apologise

It's my stupid American spellchecker. I apologize if you have taken offence

Horses head in the bed will sort it.

it sounds like his company was supposed to be the sole reseller in Ireland

Ireland is in the EU...

I use to work for a concrete company, latest in a long line of fines in this industry:
https://brodies.com/insights/competition-and-antitrust/construction-firms-fined-15m-in-latest-sector-competition-law-breach/

Concrete is susceptible to anti-competitive practices as the product has a short (hour or so) shelflife and it's hard/expensive to move the manufacturing.

Update
Isn't the internet brill, it was this I was involved in (while working in Germany), for one of their competitors, and we also got fined:
https://www.holcim.com/german-competition-authority-fines-cement-companies

I apologize if you have taken offence

That's a non-apology....you're making it his/her fault for being offended by your bastardisation/bastardization of the Queen's English

That’s a non-apology….you’re making it his/her fault for being offended by your bastardisation/bastardization of the Queen’s English

Nobody has called me a racist - so I could care less.

Couldn't care less? This'll bring out the pedants 😂

I can't believe how many pendants on here take a fence ouevre  tiny errs.

Is all 'sales' business as shady as this one sounds?

All you need to know is does this guy have a dog and do you have any sausages...

Is all ‘sales’ business as shady as this one sounds?

For the most part, yes.

does this guy have a dog and do you have any sausages

Lorne?

The 'ise' vs 'ize' thing is bollocks I'm afraid. Both are fine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford_spelling

Thanks for the input folks as always! Haha if it only it was as grubby and as underhand as one or twos imagination has created!

It's only stuff like emea etc...

I think that’s the first time that I’ve done trolling!

We’re in the bazaar business and I can tell you, it’s a crowded marketplace.

er, lol 🙂