WTF Apple

I give you apple and raise you cgi who decides that they'd invent a series of emails accounts never to be used except for registering work iPads. So not only do we not know the password but I don't even know the email address.
Can you see the issue?

No that’s crap.

I have an iPhone. Which mainly i like. In general combined with icloud its worked well despite forgotten passwords and destroying a one

But

I’m in a doom loop on my home PC. The icloud app won’t accept my pass word. It says to use a code on my phone. But that doesn’t come up as an option.

If in sign out it will delete about 50Gb of synced data

I think i have found a better way of getting pictures to my pc. So i think deleting the app is the way to go. But i really shouldn’t be in this position

Sure, the Apple fans will say it’s my fault for forgetting the password but I’m not going to accept that. People forget passwords, it happens. You shouldn’t be locked out for a week.

It's there to stop your machine being hacked or worse. It's inconvenient but the alternative is things like Crowdstrike or all your money heading off to Nigeria, Korea or Russia. If I remember correctly MS locks you out for 4 weeks for an email password reset in Outlook.com or Hotmail.com. Password manager for you, as then you only have one to remember (or a book in a drawer, or a selection of posi-it notes).

there was nothing work could do about it at all

Well, they could replace it as you say. Or you get a few days free holiday.

It’s inconvenient but the alternative is things like Crowdstrike or all your money heading off to Nigeria, Korea or Russia.

I'm not convinced.  Maybe a 24 hour wait period but a week?  Seriously?  I can reset my online banking details immediately with a few shared secrets and that has access to all my money.

However the real issue is that it's a work laptop, owned and operated by my employer, but it's at the mercy of Apple. How did this happen? I'm not exactly sure. When I first started using Mac about er.. 6 or 7 years ago, I didn't want to create an Apple ID but I think I thought I had to to use the App store or something. So then when the next machine arrived I did the same thing. It says that my machine is 'managed' by Apple ID which I think should not be possible. I log into it with work credentials and it's definitely being managed by work.  So somehow it's being managed by two sets of systems at the same time which I think is where the issue occurs.

On Windows you sign in with one Microsoft account and that is the single point of management - your work can offer the account, or Microsoft, Google, Yahoo etc can offer it. But there's only one. If it's work, their techies can go into Active Directory and change or reset the password directly - or at least that's how it used to work.

 Password manager for you

That doesn't store the device password.  The Apple ID was stored on the password manager, but where's the password manager? On the laptop. For some reason it wasn't syncing to the cloud so an older password was all that was available. And since this isn't Star Wars, it did not check out.

However the real issue is that it’s a work laptop, owned and operated by my employer, but it’s at the mercy of Apple. How did this happen? I’m not exactly sure. When I first started using Mac about er.. 6 or 7 years ago, I didn’t want to create an Apple ID but I think I thought I had to to use the App store or something. So then when the next machine arrived I did the same thing. It says that my machine is ‘managed’ by Apple ID which I think should not be possible. I log into it with work credentials and it’s definitely being managed by work.  So somehow it’s being managed by two sets of systems at the same time which I think is where the issue occurs.

Yeah I think you are blaming the wrong people here.  I've locked myself out of lots of apple products and there's some clunky stuff but actually it seems to work surprisingly well for most use cases.  But your work IT people have messed up their device management (Apple don't make me change my passwords so I assume that is some flawed IT security logic of your employer), and then they've not designed around the level of stupidity of their users.

yes, Apple is annoying like that...I spat my dummy out with an Ipad i was gifted for something similar, and handed it back

However

it should have been set up under management via apple business management or such like, its been a while since i dipped my toes in the water there. And your password ideally shouldn't be on a local account, should be the equivalent of a domain account.

So, the IT infrastructure and set up of the Mac is weaksauce, and you've fallen prey to it

Your work clearly don't know how to manage your laptops.

They should be using something like Jamf that would sync with your AD.

They should also have an admin account on the device.

Yeah that's so many levels of fail from your work IT to end up in that situation. WTF indeed.

I give you apple and raise you cgi who decides that they’d invent a series of emails accounts never to be used except for registering work iPads. So not only do we not know the password but I don’t even know the email address.

Can you see the issue?

Stirling Council IT department says 'hold my beer'.

However the real issue is that it’s a work laptop, owned and operated by my employer, but it’s at the mercy of Apple.

I'm not seeing the 'real issue' here, this is a Them problem. "Dear Employer, I cannot access my laptop therefore cannot do any work. Let me know when you've fixed it and/or replaced it, I'm off to watch Bargain Hunt."

Work machine, settings set up by work. I really think the finger of blame should be pointed at somewhere closer than California. I’ve been using Apple products since the late 90’s, never had a password issue because, guess what, all the passwords and their settings are in my control.

then went to bed and of course I forgot

Did I miss the bit where you wrote down the password that you were clearly likely to forget?

So, your work uses personal deployment for work machines? Good luck…

I had the exact same thing. Had to change password on (yearly) and forgot by the monday

You can actually change password in some circumstances through the terminal

https://support.apple.com/en-gb/102673#assistant

<li style="list-style-type: none;">

From the Utilities menu in the menu bar, choose Terminal.

In the Terminal window, type resetpassword, then press Return to open the Reset Password assistant.

If asked to select an admin user you know the password for, click “Forgotten all passwords?”.

At the Reset Password window, click Deactivate Mac, then click Deactivate to confirm.

If you see an Activation Lock window, enter your Apple Account information, then click Next.

At the Reset Password window, enter your new password information, then click Next. (If this window lists multiple user accounts, click the Set Password button next to each account name, then enter the new password information for each account.)

When the password reset process has been completed, click Exit.

Choose Apple menu  > Restart, then log in with your new password.

My work Macbook Pro made me change the password late Sunday night

Unless you work shifts, why were you on a work device then?

However the real issue is that it’s a work laptop, owned and operated by my employer, but it’s at the mercy of Apple. How did this happen? I’m not exactly sure

My work sent me a recovery key and i managed to enter this by getting into recovery mode

Unless you work shifts, why were you on a work device then?

Wouldn't it be awful to have to work 9-5 every single day?

If you see an Activation Lock window, enter your Apple Account information

That's just it - I didn't have the apple account information.

I bought my first Mac studio this year to run alongside my windows PC - for a change, and see what the fuss was about.

A very similar thing happend to me the first week and had to reinstall the whole system.

Sure I was a rookie on this thing but it's not what I expected.

I don't mind a challenge but hey.

Any business managed machine that requires you to have your own personal account logged in is a complete failure of business device management.

Your employer failed to set the device up properly, it's absolutely a 'them' problem.

Had they set the device up properly, they would also be able to manage the situation for you.

Sure I was a rookie on this thing but it’s not what I expected.

Really? If you could "get around" needing the password without going through the proper account recovery procedure, what's the point in even having one?!

They should be using something like Jamf

That's how we managed Macs. If something like this happened we would simply re-image it.

That’s just it – I didn’t have the apple account information.

Is that for the account you set up but didn't need to?

where’s the password manager? On the laptop.

In diety of choices name why only there? There are password managers that work seamlessly across lots of devices.

I am absolutely shoite with tech, but (following advice on here) I’ve got Bitwarden on my iPhone and laptop. Works well and has saved my bacon more than once.

Had they set the device up properly, they would also be able to manage the situation for you

Yeah this was my frustration. They seemed to offer a range of suggestions which to me says that they aren't (or at least weren't historically) in full control.

Is that for the account you set up but didn’t need to?

Well, yes, perhaps, not entirely clear. It seems that back in the day it was a work supplied device but essentially operating as if it were BYOD. But now it's not, so there may be multiple systems in play.  They seemed to be expecting the recovery key to work but it did not. Not sure why - apparently if you enter your password wrong three times then it invites you to enter the recovery key but according to the internet it will never ask again. And it did not ask me in the recovery mode screen, it's not clear why.

In diety of choices name why only there? 

The password manager has been randomly not syncing and being a bit weird, so this particular password was one of the casualties of that.

Anyway, my new Windows laptop arrived today and (in the spirit of arguing about stuff) it's a bit shit. Lenovo P15, and it is plastic and cheap. Apparently these things have a magnesium frame which sounds great but all it means is that if you drop them the plastic shatters on the corners.  Reviews praised its build quality saying it doesn't flex, but it clearly bloody does flex quite a bit. The trackpad is small and encumbered with unnecessary physical buttons and when you tap it it feels loose rather than solid. But what's much worse is that the stupid thing has a numeric keypad so you're forced to type off to the right which is really shit.  Who the hell needs a numeric keypad these days? I'm not a bloody data entry clerk.  The screen is also a poverty spec FHD one - UHD is available on this model but my employer of course did not spec it.  This is the benefit and also problem with Windows world.  Beautiful laptops are available on a par with Apple, but crappy plastic ones are also available.  The nice thing is that the plastic ones are much cheaper, thereby bringing more computing power to the hands of poorer people, but it also means that employers can cheap out. With Apple, they can't as there are only nice devices available.  That said, the niceness doesn't do it much good when Apple make them obsolete - my previous Mac is still a lovely device in good condition but is worthless and destined for recycling/landfill.

On the plus side this Lenovo has a decent spec, it also has Windows Hello which is great.  And it bad as the built in screen is, Windows 11 looks lovely on the big monitor.  And I'm looking forward to being able to run work software directly on it and not needing a cloud VM.

One final rant - it's 15" and does not fit in my nice laptop bag despite me asking for 14 🙁

hopefully they can find a home for the MBP with someone with a bit of savvy who can appreciate it! 🙂

Whaddya mean a bit of savvy?  Everyone forgets passwords. The lack of savvy was on my employer's part, not mine. They didn't sort themselves out properly.

I would definitely be raising the screen issue - at our work we fell out with HP over them providing us a batch of laptops with low spec screens.
We now use Dell devices, which despite my initial reservations are absolutely solid - we've had no warranty calls on them in 18 months & 500+ devices

i found it amusing that you suggest you were working on a mac but having to use a VM to do certain things? then they just hand you a windows laptop.

We don't even offer Mac here as an option simply because the sheer amount of work to integrate it, would be a massive time sink, hard enough to keep all of our windows devices in line, let alone making a change to apply to two different OS's (3 of us, looking after approx 300 staff, trying to cut down the number of devices they all use)

Whaddya mean a bit of savvy?  Everyone forgets passwords. The lack of savvy was on my employer’s part, not mine. They didn’t sort themselves out properly.

yes, I agree they should've idiot-proofed it for you. ?

i found it amusing that you suggest you were working on a mac but having to use a VM to do certain things? then they just hand you a windows laptop

Well, we do a lot of stuff.  Many employees, perhaps the majority, don't need to install the software, but some do. I guess that's why we still offer both. The original Mac I had was Intel so there was no issue because I could use containers. However the next Mac was M1 and although it's meant to be able to emulate Intel, it doesn't always work. And for some reason Podman absolutely refused to work on my Mac and no-one knew why, not even on the internet. Hence the cloud VM.

yes, I agree they should’ve idiot-proofed it for you. ?

Absoutely yes.  Anyone who provides front line IT service knows that everything has to be idiot proof, it's most of their job.  But anyway - idiot or not, everyone forgets passwords occasionally.

Anyway - on the plus side, despite being off-centre the keyboard is lovely on this new device. Even though the Mac was the revised keyboard it's not as nice as this.  However, Windows 11 didn't seem to want to use LDAC with my headphones, I had to spend £7 on a driver.

The lack of savvy was on my employer’s part, not mine. They didn’t sort themselves out properly.

You probably want to request the mods change the title of the thread to "WTF my employers IT team".

You probably want to request the mods change the title of the thread to “WTF my employers IT team”.

Apple are the ones who are taking a week to reset a password when it's a work PC so.. why did it ever prompt me to sign in with an apple ID I didn't have and had to create for my personal one?  That makes no sense and would not have happened on a Windows PC.

Don't Microsoft also push you towards logging in with a personal account on a new machine if your IT organisation can't be bothered deploying devices properly?

I'm not sure Microsoft push you towards that. You can log in with a local account, but MS encourage to you have a MS account of some kind.  If your org doesn't supply you with one they want shooting.  But point is that once you've logged in with that, you don't then need to create another to use the app store or One Drive or whatever.

https://business.apple.com

I've been using Apple products for 20+ years and I don't recall ever being told to change my password, I'm not even sure there is a password enforcement policy option for standard Mac users. My current Mac is apparently managed by our IT team (of one person) and it all just seems to work, they've installed some MDM software, there is an admin account which they can use to access the device and push updates to it.

I do have a local user configured for login but I'd rather that than have to rely on internet connectivity to authenticate, what if I'm on a plane and want to work? Once I'm logged in my iCloud account takes care of all of my personal stuff, but all of our work tools are using Microsoft (Azure) SSO so I don't need to log into anything repeatedly. It probably helps that I'm in the Apple ecosystem so actively maintain that side of things for my personal life, but there's no reason that iCloud and MS can't co-exist on a work machine.

Sounds to me like your IT team don't know how to manage Macs, and since you're not that familiar with iCloud you don't know how to use the two toolsets together.

Contact Apple support?

I locked myself out and they managed to unlock it for me.

We don’t even offer Mac here as an option simply because the sheer amount of work to integrate it, would be a massive time sink, hard enough to keep all of our windows devices in line, let alone making a change to apply to two different OS’s (3 of us, looking after approx 300 staff, trying to cut down the number of devices they all use)

I work at a web/tech/design agency where you are offered a mac or windows machine (back end devs prefer windows machines) think we have about 700 odd staff after a recent merger. I'd say thew majority are on mac's but there are also  iphones + android and windows machines to manage

They are recently rolling out intune to manage changes

You forgot your password and everyone else to blame? Thats funny. This is 100% your fault as its solely your responsibility to remember your own password.  Your employer should be having a word at the very least because you can't even manage one password.

has the OP taken the laptop apart to try and fix it yet?

You forgot your password and everyone else to blame? Thats funny. This is 100% your fault

Don't be bloody ridiculous.  Passwords WILL be forgotten. That is absolutely inevitable. If you don't have a decent system for handling it that's on you.  I don't consider 'wait for a week' to be a decent solution on Apple's part.

I suspect I've fallen through the gaps in terms of work management since their process did not work on my machine, but that's a different issue for my employer.

IT standpoint

yes it's annoying that password has been forgotten

but it should also be under management of the IT department, in no business should a corporate PC be under control of the end user to that degree, even as a a top admin here, my pc is not even under the control of my own, user account. Everything is under a separate admin account (to put it simply)

I don’t consider ‘wait for a week’ to be a decent solution on Apple’s part.

What’s it got to do with Apple?

What’s it got to do with Apple?

Apple have locked it remotely.  Not my work.

Then they login with the main business account and unlock your machine. If it’s set up as a personal machine, then that’s a whole other problem…

I don’t consider ‘wait for a week’ to be a decent solution on Apple’s part.

FYI - It’s been a part of Apple’s security policy and has been for years; every time an attempt is made to unlock an iPhone that fails, the time until the next attempt can be made increases incrementally. The onus is on the owner to make sure they are up to date with their device passwords. If it’s a work phone, then work IT are responsible.

If the phone is lost, or stolen, then just how easy do you want it to be for someone to unlock it? There’s been chatter in the online tech news about a whole bunch of iPhones in the possession of various American police and law enforcement agencies have all spontaneously turned themselves off and rebooted - this makes it even more difficult to get into an iPhone. Turns out it’s a new security feature buried in iOS18 that automatically reboots a phone that hasn’t moved or been unlocked for four days, to increase security for owners.
This is Apple looking after device owners, because there are people who are developing ever more sophisticated ways to hack into phones - do you actually want it to be easy for someone to open your phone, in the event of it being stolen or lost?
Suck it up buttercup, the fault lies with IT fannying around and not being proactive in sorting out passwords.

A more detailed explanation of the process:

https://in.mashable.com/tech/84996/ios-181s-new-inactivity-reboot-locks-your-iphone-for-better-protection-check-out-this-feature?utm_source=flipboard&utm_content=topic/technology

Just had to pay for a computer shop to get us back into the emails etc on family members ancient Apple Mac Mini.  He is a little slow and multiple family members had gotten involved so passwords were all over the place.

Anyhow, after a few hours of trying i got all the passwords aligned but the computer was in a never-ending circle of asking for new password but then not recognising it.  I started questioning my sanity until i managed to get into the emails on another desktop.  Even the computer guy had trouble with it sending email upon email asking my wife to relay number codes to him (I think her email was the recovery address).  I think the end result was something to do with it being an ancient version of the OS which didnt support 2 stage verification.  Or whatever it meant.

Sorted now and £80 light.

Well if it makes you feel any better work sent me a new phone and it's an iPhone. I'm a Windows and Android person, have been since forever.

Trying to use the iPhone I now know how my 70 something year old dad feels using any technology ?

Oh it gets better. I remembered I had an old apple account from when I tried Apple Movies or whatever it is, for a trial a few years back. Anyway I found the details and though I'd use that to setup the phone. After sending me an email for two step authentication, it then asks me to confirm the CVC number on the card that is setup against that account.

Which would be fine but that card expired a while ago and I no longer have it. Logging onto my apple account on my laptop via the website, has the exact same issue.

After the gnashing of teeth and some Google sleuthing, someone on Reddit had the same issue. Turns out if you login to iTunes, via the website, with the exact same account, it doesn't ask you to validate the card and allows you to remove it.

So now I can log back into my apple account and continue setting the phone up.

And breath 🙂