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An email went round work to all users from the fun police today announcing a blanket ban on nuts/traces of nuts anywhere on the work site, with a blurb about allergies, anaphylactic shock etc.
It's a reasonable size place, open plan offices on 2 floors, warehouse, production line, etc etc, but can they enforce a ban on what people eat?
And yes, there were many, many childish "nuts" jokes, of course 😎
Have you considered there might be someone with a severe nut allergy on site?
Have you considered there might be someone with a severe nut allergy on site?
It'll be the guy wearing this to the canteen
The irony is the OP works for KP
traces of nuts anywhere on the work site
Best of luck to the poor bugger who gets the job of enforcing that!
What do you happen to be producing? Not food is it?
What trees are on site? Have they been warned?
Not sure on the legal technicalities but it's quite possible that they have to do this, if a new employee has a severe nut allergy.
It probably falls under a reasonable accommodation to make for a health condition, and I bet you'd feel like an ass if someone ends up hospitalised because you ignored it.
This place just didn't feel right without that image.
As you were
Yes, I had considered someone may have an allergy; thank you captain obvious.
For the record I'm not planning on hospitalising someone with a Snickers, just wondered if they can technically ban certain foods in a workplace.
For the record I’m not planning on hospitalising someone with a Snickers, just wondered if they can technically ban certain foods in a workplace.
Mostly their site their rules....
I know places that have a complete ban on anything aluminium for very good reasons, Anywhere making food could quite easily go for that, it's much easier than banning from a certain location or area.
If you do have people with a severe allergy then it could also be seen as a resonable step over insisting that nut waste is bagged out and all areas where nuts are consumed have been cleaned, hands washed before using shared computers etc.
Microwaving of fish should also be banned
(not being flippant about nut ban, totally acceptable if someone with allergy works there)
The irony is Houns works in an aquarium
fortunately peanuts are legumes
and almonds are from the stone of a fruit of the peach family
As a food manufacturer we do not allow employees to bring nuts to work.
Common practice in the food industry.
I also think its reasonable if an employee has a nut allergy.
Yes, I had considered someone may have an allergy; thank you captain obvious.
For the record I’m not planning on hospitalising someone with a Snickers, just wondered if they can technically ban certain foods in a workplace.
If you knew anything about what you’re talking about then it would show that you had considered it. As it is, you don’t, and you haven’t.
That Snickers bar would actually kill my son. One bite would send him into full anaphylaxis that would require immediate medical attention.
Banning nuts anywhere isn’t because the “fun police” hate you, it’s because nuts are a major allergen that kills people.
it’s because nuts are a major allergen that kills people.
So is milk
Bensales; I know exactly what I'm talking about, I'm simply asking out of curiosity if a work place can ban certain foods. Also, I'd made an educated guess that it was in reference to a severe allergy that someone suffers from, but thanks for your input. Ironically, if the TV advert is anything to go by, you should eat a Snickers.
My daughter’s school has banned all nuts as one of our pupils has an allergy.
no hardship...much better than something going wrong...
Bensales; I know exactly what I’m talking about, I’m simply asking out of curiosity if a work place can ban certain foods.
By giving very little context... I know places that ban eating and drinking....
That Snickers bar would actually kill my son.
I have a nephew whose face tingles if someone eats nuts in the same room. So yes a complete ban on nuts can be imposed, their gaff, their rules. Failing to enforce the ban will get someone jail time and a huge fine for the company if an employee dies as a result of someone sticking it to the 'fun police'.
Work place banning nuts?
Does that include Brexiteers?
Harsh but fair. They bring me out in a bad rash too.
Considering some of the biggest companies in the UK can sell food with nuts or traces of nuts, without listing it. I'd be surprised if I company could ban nuts, even tiger bread baked in house didn't have to list it contained sesame.
If it were me I'd ask the boss why, if he said Steve from accounts will die if he looks at a walnut I'd follow the rule. If on the other hand Steve from accounts has a mild sesame allergy I'd just not eat my snickers near Steve. Obviously if I was called up on it I'd stop.
They can ban what they want as long as there is a good reason for it. I've banned smelly food at my place of work, got sick of people eating at their desks with stinking food. Either they eat in the kitchen which has ample facilities and seating or go away out for lunch.
if he said Steve from accounts will die if he looks at a walnut I’d follow the rule. If on the other hand Steve from accounts has a mild sesame allergy I’d just not eat my snickers near Steve.
Does Steve not have a right to privacy? I know he's only an accountant but even they have feelings.
If you ban foods in a work place because someone might have an allergy to something, you'd be banning almost all food.
Unless there's a risk due to being a food production place, it would surely be specific to an individual with an allergy working there.
As for kids and schools, that's another matter as kids do stupid things or don't think. Risk is greater.
For the record I’m not planning on hospitalising someone with a Snickers, just wondered if they can technically ban certain foods in a workplace.
Yes.
This makes more sense
http://www.hse.gov.uk/myth/myth-busting/2014/case281-junior-school-bans-snack-fruit-rice-cakes.htm
Perfectly reasonable imo.
Nuts and a couple of other things banned at my kids' school.
Given the amount of peanut butter spread on eldest ones toast this morning he was probably a peanut hazard at about 20feet.
(Edit hands, face and teeth cleaned before dispatch to school obviously)
I have a nephew whose face tingles if someone eats nuts in the same room.
Really? Since when have nuts of any type given off fumes or vapour under normal atmospheric conditions?
Coming into direct contact I can understand, but just being in the same room? I say that’s psychosomatic. How does said person react when near a tree that produces nuts? Or goes into a shop where there are nuts on sale, or there are products containing nuts? The atmosphere itself must therefore carry those allergens, so how does that person manage to live a reasonable life if the general environment carries tiny traces of something that might kill him?
I know places that have a complete ban on anything aluminium
So no mobile phones, laptops, printers, or other office equipment that contains aluminium?
Really? Since when have nuts of any type given off fumes or vapour under normal atmospheric conditions
IIRC it’s in part an enzyme that is one the nuts as opposed nut themselves. This allows it to be airborne which those who are extremely sensitive are vulnerable to.
As for those near a tree with nuts on. Well that’s simple, it’s not all nuts the most common being peanuts. Not only do peanuts not grow in the uk they don’t grow on trees.
Those with a hypersensitivity will avoid areas such as shops to not expose themselves. I know someone who had a latex allergy sensitive that if a balloon had been in a room a day or two before they’d have an attack. They had that many attacks that the adrenaline for treat damaged their heart, basically told an attack or the treatment would be the final one sooner than later.
HTH.
Really? Since when have nuts of any type given off fumes or vapour under normal atmospheric conditions?
Yes, really. Everything emits something, just because you and I can't smell it or react to it doesn't mean it isn't there. He is full anaphylaxis allergic to them and has at least one epi-pen ready when he goes out.
You can't ban everything that has traces of nuts in. How ridiculous. Turn up to work smothered in peanut butter and wearing a t-shirt that says "no, I didn't get the email"
You can’t ban everything that has traces of nuts in. How ridiculous. Turn up to work smothered in peanut butter and wearing a t-shirt that says “no, I didn’t get the email”
And get a hauled in for a disciplinary.
@Hols2 sorry was just being as vague as the OP, mobile exposed Alu Metal so foil, cans etc. if it's part of something it's fine but simply banning stuff like kit kats and coke cans is a much simpler process than saying you can have it in x but not y and make sure it's not in your pocket.
Are the severity of these kind of allergies getting worse? I never recall hearing of cases of 'airborne anaphylaxis' in previous decades (in which era no-one would countenance banning nuts from schools/workplaces etc).
Could just be a lack of reporting, obviously.
We are a nut free school. It's a bloomin nightmare to police. Read an article the other day that suggested that schools with nut free policies are doing those with allergies no favours as the kids that suffer are learning complacency when they should be learning self reliance in a world full of nuts. Would be a brave head that took this up however. Also, with the significant rise in teenagers and young adults taking on vegan diets you are treading somewhat of a delicate balancing act between the nut eating nutritional benefits for a small minority vs significant harm to a tiny minority. If it wasn't for those with allergies it could be argued that kids in general should be being educated to increased their consumption of nuts (and reduce meat consumption) for both health and environmental reasons.
Beyond schools and outside of food manufacturers I think I'd be in favour of temporary bans which are enforced when a nut allergy sufferer is employed and lifted when they leave and not just a blanket permanent thing in a H&S gone made kind of way.
Semi serious question - have the number of people born with allergies gone up or did we just kill a lot of them off early back in the day? Seems a significantly larger issue now than in the past.
I was in a Canadian government building recently, the wearing of any scents was banned. No perfume, after shave, deodorant etc.
I have never seen or heard of that before.
Banning nuts anywhere isn’t because the “fun police” hate you, it’s because nuts are a major allergen that kills people.
But for the vast majority of people they are a harmless food stuff.
I can’t see how this ban would be practical. Someone could go out on their dinner time and eat something nutty, not wash their hands (I don’t after I eat everything) and unknowingly shake hands with someone they hadn’t met in the company yet and inadvertently kill them.
Would it not be better that the person who has the problem be identified so that people who work around them can take appropriate measures? It could be used to promote some learning of allergies and everyone would benefit and the person affected would probably be safer than banning all nuts and not knowing why or for whom.
Could that person also work from home? In reality you aren’t going to make a huge workplace safe no matter how hard you try unless you ban all food from the building and people have to shower and wear matching protective suits.
Semi serious question – have the number of people born with allergies gone up or did we just kill a lot of them off early back in the day? Seems a significantly larger issue now than in the past.
A quick google suggests they have even in a short term of 7 years. I will leave you to read the search results...
I can’t see how this ban would be practical. Someone could go out on their dinner time and eat something nutty, not wash their hands (I don’t after I eat everything) and unknowingly shake hands with someone they hadn’t met in the company yet and inadvertently kill them.
Well for all we know the OP works in food manufacturing.....
But you can ask for basic hygiene principles to be applied. There are medical privacy issues with identifying somebody and basic HR issues
Could that person also work from home?
Such as pressures and influences that could be seen that they are the problem and ultimately be a constructive dismissal case.
I guess the OP could have just emailed the Fun Police at his work for some more details and let us know what the reasoning and thinking was behind that. Easier than expecting STW to know the full details of what is going on.
It also sums up how many people work in very relaxed places, spending time in big industry, around big magnets, in food and bev plants and medical/pharma places you just read the rules on the way in and moderate what you are doing accordingly. Just one of those things about work places.
I can’t see how this ban would be practical.
I doubt that it's meant to be. It's meant to be a legal protection for the company so that if anyone dies, the company lawyers can pretend that the company did everything within their power to protect their employees.
It's simply an arse covering exercise so when someone does bring in a nut and someone else has a reaction they can show they've done everything they could reasonably be expected to do to mitigate the risk.
Damn you Hols2
In reality you aren’t going to make a huge workplace safe no matter how hard you try unless you ban all food from the building and people have to shower and wear matching protective suits.
Of course it's not fool proof it's about minimal exposure risk.
It’s simply an arse covering exercise so when someone does bring in a nut and someone else has a reaction they can show they’ve done everything they could reasonably be expected to do to mitigate the risk.
It's not a very good arse covering exercise then because if they have highlighted it as a significant enough risk to ban nuts, then not having effective control measures in place to prevent someone bringing in a nut and causing another to have a reaction is a bit of an open goal.
I agree it’s no good for arse covering - if anything it does the opposite - if someone dies then as noted they could be liable for not enforcing properly - they’d be better saying sorry but there may be nuts here so you have to take your own precautions...if arse covering is the objective that is...
As for those near a tree with nuts on. Well that’s simple, it’s not all nuts the most common being peanuts. Not only do peanuts not grow in the uk they don’t grow on trees.
Of course, peanuts aren't actually nuts. So with regards to the OP it would appear that peanuts would be allowed on the premises.
First they came for the peanuts, then they came for the bananas...
Of course, peanuts aren’t actually nuts. So with regards to the OP it would appear that peanuts would be allowed on the premises.
That took a lot longer than I thought it would.
😉
That took a lot longer than I thought it would.
Try halfway down the first page, 19hours ago.
Yes, that's before I posted.
It's risk management... I'd imagine there is a new employee who has a severe allergy..
It's not unreasonable in that scenario.
No they can't guarantee a bit of nut dust won't float in through the window but they can mitigate the risk a lot.
It's a bit like why they don't give out complimentary nuts on planes any more.. And I've been in planes recently where they have announced a passenger with a nut allergy and instructed no one to open any nuts that they may have brought on board.
It's not a big deal really, considering the consequences.
It’s not a big deal really, considering the consequences.
You're right. Goodbye evolution.
You’re right. Goodbye evolution.
Goodbye horses surely, to hide all traces of nuts.
Semi serious question – have the number of people born with allergies gone up or did we just kill a lot of them off early back in the day? Seems a significantly larger issue now than in the past.
Seemingly down to the increasingly hermetically sealed lifestyle we lead where people have lovely insulated homes with no draughts or air exchange meaning toxins cannot get out. Leads to an increase in allergies, athsma etc.
Are the severity of these kind of allergies getting worse? I never recall hearing of cases of ‘airborne anaphylaxis’ in previous decades (in which era no-one would countenance banning nuts from schools/workplaces etc).
Could just be a lack of reporting, obviously.
I have a nut allergy and discovered the airborne reaction thing.
Took a while to work out that every time I went to my parents at Christmas I’d have sneezing fits and itchy throat etc. Turned out they’re been cracking walnuts.
I don’t think it’s more common I have a mate close to his 60’s with the same allergy, I just think people give it more attention.
I know someone who was refused service in a restaurant because the manager couldn’t ensure they’d be no nut contamination, despite it only being a tree nut allergy.
Worst thing is I really like them and was absolutely fine until I ate and reacted badly to a Brazil nut.
As said before I can eat Peanuts they’re not the same thing, I just don’t like them.
Seemingly down to the increasingly hermetically sealed lifestyle we lead where people have lovely insulated homes with no draughts or air exchange meaning toxins cannot get out. Leads to an increase in allergies, athsma etc.
Thats bollocks.
You can't develop an allergy unless you're exposed to the allergen, people aren't born allergic to bees for example.
Worst thing is I really like them and was absolutely fine until I ate and reacted badly to a Brazil nut.
/Waits for Psling.
After the Brazil nut reaction, the reaction to other nuts started and worsened in severity.
Memory is a bit hazy on it as it was the early eighties.
After the Brazil nut reaction, the reaction to other nuts started and worsened in severity.
Yup, the attacks get worse each time it's a nasty condition to have.
Thats bollocks.
Cool. Got a source for your claim?
Here's one for the ventilation part of mine:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK224478/ (I will concede this is athsma based as opposed to allergens in general)
And here's some for the hygene hypothesis:
https://theconversation.com/what-are-allergies-and-why-are-we-getting-more-of-them-40318
https://www.allergychoices.com/why-are-allergies-increasing/
I do think there's a lot of of problems with bringing children or animals up in clinical environments.
They don't get exposed to nature.
I do think there’s a lot of of problems with bringing children or animals up in clinical environments.
So where are these clinical environments? I see plenty through work but very few in the real world
Exactly Mike which is why it’s bollocks. I also think squirrel is confusing asthma causes with severe allergies.
Sowing the seed for me there, Drac.
The anaphylactic shock thing seems to be more likely with a peanut allergy. I'm in my 60s and have suffered a nut allergy since I was about 5 or 6 but this is what might be called a tree nut allergy (although I can also react to coconut). Back in the sixties people would remark "how unusual" when my parents advised of my allergy. I do not suffer anaphylactic shock; I get a wetting and tingling in my mouth and, if I ingest, I usually vomit almost immediately. I avoid peanuts and don't actually know how I would react to them (though I have kissed girls that have eaten peanuts and I haven't died yet...).
I also have to avoid marzipan and almond based mixes which I can react to, though not so violently.
Of course it's arse covering (call it reasonable precaution if you want). They're not checking bags on entry are they, as that wouldn't be deemed by a court to be a reasonable adjustment to accomodate the new employee. Schools ban nuts in packed lunches but there is an implicit acceptance by the parents of nut allergic kids that that is all they can do.
I never recall hearing of cases of ‘airborne anaphylaxis’ in previous decades (in which era no-one would countenance banning nuts from schools/workplaces etc).
How far back do you want to go? 20 years ago at uni I had a friend who would start getting swollen lips and throat if someone in the same pub started eating nuts. It was unusual, but not unheard of.
Just about everyone (including medical professionals and academics) will agree that allergies are on the rise. Nobody, to my knowledge, has proven a cause (not a correlation, not a hypothesis, but a p<0.05 cause). Declining breast feeding rates are another correlating factor nobody has mentioned yet.
Would it not be better that the person who has the problem be identified
This thought just popped into my head....
