Winter tyres for cars

I've been doing this for 15+ years. 7 months on summers, 5 on winters. As long as you put them away clean and dry (ish) and don't store them somewhere stupid, they'll be fine.

Look on eBay, there tend to be sets when people sell the cars they are for. Not the best time for buying winter tyres.

The downside is that unless you live in Scotland there is no need to get winter tyres unfortunately in this country

Used to have two sets of wheels (summer & winter), now just run one set of all seasons year round. This is on a STW issue Octavia.

If I had something a bit more sporty/niche, I may have stuck with two sets of wheels.

Tyres should be good for about 5 years. I've been doing it for the last lots of years.

You get very good at changing wheels. I can flip 4 corners in under an hour easy peasy.

I do mine, when i bought them it was cheaper to get the alternate wheel size on 16's (both alloys and tyres) than just but the 18's tyres.
Stupid wheel sizes so i have a spare set of wheels now

The downside is that unless you live in Scotland there is no need to get winter tyres unfortunately in this country

This is true if it's a BMW he's just bought. You park it up in November and get it out again in April.

With a good enough car you can really feel the difference.

One day.

But silly advice aside. Modern all seasons really are quite good unless you really need the three snow flake and mountain for all round UK conditions.....

I agree with the all seasons comment, my wife's car will be getting then come time to replace tyres.
I run winters as i have the spare wheels so it is easy for me.
Both winters and all seasons make a massive difference below 7 degrees.
I can def tell a difference in my mazda between the winters and the pilotsport 4's on the summer wheels.
I also appreciate most don't have the option for a spare set of wheels but having killed 2 cars between us in winter conditions that would have been avoided with season specific tyres it is a cost I'm happy paying

Modern all seasons really are quite good unless you really need the three snow flake and mountain

most all season have 3PMSF

Did you see the carnage on the M25 a few days ago??

Always worth checking for used- not so much at this time of year mind, but they're the sort of thing that people buy for a car then sell separately when they sell the car. Thinking about it, I've not bought a new winter tyre for over a decade.

FunkyDunc
Free Member

The downside is that unless you live in Scotland there is no need to get winter tyres unfortunately in this country

Need? Maybe not, I mean you can just choose not to drive sometimes, and even in bad conditions you can generally get where you're going. But want? Abso-bloody-lutely. It's one of the biggest safety upgrades you can do. It's also a huge peace of mind thing, driving in bad conditions is stressful enough. And as ever, remember they're not "snow tyres", they start to really be useful as soon as it gets down below 6 degrees or thereabouts, more so in the wet.

I bought a used car in Portsmouth the other day, drove it to Edinburgh, and cursed it for having summer tyres. The worst parts of the drive were in England btw, but all the way from the south coast it was cold as balls and if I'd had my winters on, it'd have been much better.

One thing that gets overlooked a little is that yep modern tyres are mostly fantastic... But, they've also grown more situational in some ways. So many tyres now are of the "5 narrow slicks in a row" design, which works really, really well almost all the time- lower noise, long life, excellent wet weather clearing, great dry grip, better fuel economy. And absolutely ****-all grip in snow, mud and ice, especially once they're worn a bit since the cross-tread they do have tends to be very shallow.

I'm also a fan of allseasons mind- they really do well, if I didn't have room for 2 sets of wheels I'd be happy enough on a crossclimate or similar. But 2 sets is still better, and the OP seems to have that option so I'd go that route.

First winter on all-seasons (cross climates), first drive with snow on the roads today. The difference in wet, cold and snow has been night and day. Coming from decent brand tyres too.

The downside is that unless you live in Scotland there is no need to get winter tyres unfortunately in this country

And that’s exactly why the uk grinds to a halt as soon as we get a bit of bad weather.

Agree strongly with Northwind; I'm another who has used two sets for many years, happily the same set of steel rims that I bought for my Passat over ten years ago, also fit the Superb. Heading out this morning on steep, properly snowy roads in GlenIsla, I simply drove around a neighbour's Octavia scout struggling to climb on 4seasons. So, 2 wheel drive on Goodyear Ultra grips trumped 4x4, four season.
To be fair, the conditions were particularly tricky, several inches of packed snow, steep climb and corners but I simply drove up, without stress. We were heading out for some xc skiing on high ground, so being able to get around confidently is great. When I have to take a rental car for work at this time of year, I hate it; that worry that braking and handling are really compromised on, say, a rainy road at 4-5C.

Always used to put winter tyres on but wife has put all seasons on the front of her A3 and all has been fine in S Pennines in recent snow.

We’re not that far off main roads though.

most all season have 3PMSF

Some. Just done a search for all season on one of our tyre sellers website (also looked at cross climate and 4 seasons tyres) and only about 2/3rds of them are classed as proper winter tyres. Though saying that, even non winter rated "cold weather" tyres will be loads better in a UK winter than using summers. Bloody awful over here though.

The downside is that unless you live in Scotland there is no need to get winter tyres unfortunately in this country

TBH a winter type tyre will be better for most of the population when driving in low temperatures, 5-7 degrees ish. So basically a couple of months commuting on the south coast and maybe 5 months in scotland. 😉

Summer tyres with good tread and 2WD are plenty good enough in the SE. Snow tyres are for areas that have a protracted snow season. All season tyres have generally less grip than summer tyres and the typical British winter is a mix of cold snaps but mostly 2 - 7C (and heading up to 12C here next week). I'd rather have the grip and stopping distance of summer tyres during a typical British winter than less grippy all-seasons.

My German RWD auto car came with nice summer tyres that couldn't handle steep wet roads, muddy car parks and wore out in 8000 miles. The CrossClimate+ I replaced then with have done 30,000+ miles, work in the cold and wet and generally feel much more confident 90% of the time. I'd not run a car again with summer tyres.

Well my experiance of using both is at odds with your interpretation of the ratings.

Which funny enough were debunked as a flawed test method in the previous winter thread

The all seasons also excel on the typical British standing water we get during winter time.

I'm keeping going with my winters, that way it is less likely i will be running into the back of someone due to lack of grip.
Plus i don't care about the majority of the time, i want the grip when it really matters. The rest of the time i am not driving anywhere near the limits of the tyres and anyone that is doing that on the roads is a ****

And that’s exactly why the uk grinds to a halt as soon as we get a bit of bad weather.

Not really. Its horses for courses. Since I have the luxury of not driving when its really crap (bar an badly timed trip to Snowdonia several years back) summer tyres are generally the best bet for me. If I was out more often then all seasons would be the better choice. Winters would only be a consideration if I moved somewhere further north + more rural + needed to drive more frequently.

The M25 carnage mentioned above was odd. I was out early on monday (on foot and bike) near potters bar and the main roads were completely clear. I guess there was an accident which got everything stacked up and stopped the gritters getting through and then possibly another one to escalate things.

Some of the comments on this thread seem to be willfully ignorant.

I have switched between winter and summer tyres for well over 10 years. I live on the northern edge of the Central Belt of Scotland. We go skiing when we can, and I have a 20 mile or 11 mile rural commute. Winter tyres make a massive difference. End of.

Anyone who doesn't believe this simply demonstrates that they actually have never used them.

Changing them is a hassle, but I have it down to less than an hour per car.

Whether you think you need them is up to you. Yesterday I really did, and so did the person who had chosen to drive on "summer" tyres, who drifted across the road towards me. I bet they shat themselves. I did, but I was able to brake, steer and take evasive action.

Most of the time it is not that dramatic, they just quietly get on with being your only contact points with the road.

dissonance
Full Member

And that’s exactly why the uk grinds to a halt as soon as we get a bit of bad weather.
Not really. Its horses for courses. Since I have the luxury of not driving when its really crap (bar an badly timed trip to Snowdonia several years back) summer tyres are generally the best bet for me. If I was out more often then all seasons would be the better choice. Winters would only be a consideration if I moved somewhere further north + more rural + needed to drive more frequently.

The M25 carnage mentioned above was odd. I was out early on monday (on foot and bike) near potters bar and the main roads were completely clear. I guess there was an accident which got everything stacked up and stopped the gritters getting through and then possibly another one to escalate things.

Doesn’t really explain why the UK grinds to a halt though does it?

The M25 was just one place where there were issues, if even most cars just had all season tyres we wouldn’t get half the problems we get when the snow and ice arrive, as a country we don’t always get snow but generally winter is cold enough as someone above pointed out 2-7c most of the time, below 7 and a winter or all season will stop in a shorter distance than a summer and that’s surely not a bad thing, certainly better than claiming on insurance. We often change our tyres on our bikes for winter so why not our cars as well? Probably cheaper for car tyres than our bikes 🙂

Winters, and certainly all seasons, aren't just for snow tho'. They're better when it's below, 7 or 8. Not equal, better, especially when there's water thrown into the mix.

Snow you get the extra problem that most people don't get much experience driving on it

I’d rather have the grip and stopping distance of summer tyres during a typical British winter than less grippy all-seasons.
Posted 1 hour ago

Summer tyres are more grippy for dry braking. They are worse at wet braking though. We get quite a few wet days in the UK. These tests compare a summer, all seasons, and winter dry and wet braking and snow handling at various temps. Leaving aside the winter the worst braking distance in the tests was the summer in the wet at 2C. 33.6 metres that is 5 metres worse than the all seasons braking distance at any temp.

Seems a good argument for all seasons for a UK winter to me. Obviously if you get snow the all seasons are far better.

https://tiresvote.com/articles/testing-winter-summer-and-all-season-tires-different-temperatures/

Doesn’t really explain why the UK grinds to a halt though does it?

It does. We generally dont need it so dont pay out for it. If the climate changes then we will need to shift resources to handle it. Having been stuck in jams on the M25 though I would be curious how much was due to the weather vs stacking it because they were busy admiring their phone.

if even most cars just had all season tyres

You have pivoted from needing winter tyres to all season here.

but generally winter is cold enough as someone above pointed out 2-7c most of the time

The problem with your winter tyres are good approach is, next week, they arent for me. Its outside the Michelin recommended range during the day so unless you want me to drive at night its a bad choice.
The average temperature here during winter is 7 which is on the switch over point and bearing in mind night vs day chances are when many people are driving its on the higher side.

All seasons would be a good choice so long as you can afford to pay more and handle the compromise. Personally I dont feel the need given my driving habits despite being lucky enough to have the cash to do so.
If my circumstances change then my approach will.

Doesn’t really explain why the UK grinds to a halt though does it?
It does. We generally dont need it so dont pay out for it. If the climate changes then we will need to shift resources to handle it. Having been stuck in jams on the M25 though I would be curious how much was due to the weather vs stacking it because they were busy admiring their phone.

if even most cars just had all season tyres
You have pivoted from needing winter tyres to all season here.

but generally winter is cold enough as someone above pointed out 2-7c most of the time
The problem with your winter tyres are good approach is, next week, they arent for me. Its outside the Michelin recommended range during the day so unless you want me to drive at night its a bad choice.
The average temperature here during winter is 7 which is on the switch over point and bearing in mind night vs day chances are when many people are driving its on the higher side.

All seasons would be a good choice so long as you can afford to pay more and handle the compromise. Personally I dont feel the need given my driving habits despite being lucky enough to have the cash to do so.
If my circumstances change then my approach will.

At no point did I mention “needing” winter tyres, because at the end of the day as long as you have legal tyres on the car that is all that we “need” in the Uk.

You are indeed right next week the temps will go up, coldest months are Jan and Feb so still plenty of time for some cold weather.

As to all seasons I’m was mearly pointing out that they are another option…

Not to be rude but, anyone who talks about snow tyres should generally be ignored. There are a few snow-specific tyres out there, mostly for 4x4s but essentially everything sold for cars in this country is winter, not snow.

Time for my annual link 🙂

Can't believe it's 11 years. And still amazed by how those tyres transformed the Beemer into a very capable car in wintery conditions.

snip...but essentially everything sold for cars in this country is winter, not snow

The manufacturers seem to prefer all-seasons, summer and winter. They sub-divide under EU labelling into either snow or ice, which changed last year
From May 2021 on, the three-peak mountain with a snowflake symbol inside (3PMSF) is a snow tyre. The ice tyre symbol is a triangle with a four-peak stalgmite inside. The standards for 3PMSF have been agreed across cars, vans and lorries, the standard for ice tyres has only been agreed for cars so far
There are a raft of exceptions of course, space-saver spares and designated off-road are possibly the most common examples
The CrossClimate2 is a snow tyre, more specific Michelin winter tyres are their Alpin and Nordic ranges
To check for older stock (still legal to sell), new labels have five categories, A-E, rather than seven, A-G

The tiresvote article ^^ is out of date, e.g. the CrossClimate has been replaced by the CC+ and the CC2

This is true if it’s a BMW he’s just bought. You park it up in November and get it out again in April.

I’ve driven BMW’s on ‘normal’ tyres for 10 yrs or so in hilly Yorkshire and south. Probably 3 times in that period I put snow socks on the ‘normal’ tyres.

I only remember one year in that time when snow stayed on a road for 1 day + and then people had sledges on the main roads not cars

We've been changing our wheels in winter for years now. Had steel wheels and winter tyres for the subaru and now have a spare wheel set and winter tyres for the Ateca. No one drove up the hill we live on last Monday and 2 cars had been abandoned at the bottom of it on Monday morning,

We keep an eye on the temperature and make a decision which weekend in December to change them. As with others, we have got better and better at making the change. They are cleaned up, treads checked and stored in the garage in between. Currently have dunlop winter sports and if that is overkill living in Essex then I will add that we drive to the French Alps every year for skiing.

It does seem a faff until there is bad weather then you realise just what a game changer they are.
The tyres stored in the garage seem to have no issues other than perhaps a slight loss of tyre pressure, no problems with the tyre perishing

Back to my case, yes I live in the south (cotswolds) but where I and the SO work are high and exposed, nature of her work means she doesn't really have a choice about working from home, every year I have been in situations on summers I'd rather not be in. Yes I have been able to keep going but wheel spinning up a climb isn't relaxing. Think the videos cars crashing on Leckhampton hill that are floating around, I'd been that way a couple of hours previously and decided to return a different way because I'd suspected that would be the situation.

As the car is brand new I could take the c500mile tyres off and swap to all seasons and sell the originals on eBay. but that doesn't seem to make a huge amount of sense. As the car is only a Polo google tells me a new set of wheels and tyres should be around £500, which in the scheme of things isn't that much if it can make winters a little more relaxing.

It seems 4wd, winter tyres and an electric car is what you need if you want to drag race in winter!

The problem with your winter tyres are good approach is, next week, they arent for me. Its outside the Michelin recommended range during the day so unless you want me to drive at night its a bad choice.
The average temperature here during winter is 7 which is on the switch over point and bearing in mind night vs day chances are when many people are driving its on the higher side.

Have you ever driven on winter tyres?

By the way all season are (or were) an option when ordering a new Skoda. From memory £150. Worth checking if ordering new.

The problem with your winter tyres are good approach is, next week, they arent for me. Its outside the Michelin recommended range during the day

How long are your summer tyres out of their recommended temperature change (and significantly compromised) Vs t slight compromise of running winters in warm weather?

All seasons would be a good choice so long as you can afford to pay more and handle the compromise

And there is proof that you've not spent much time living with all-seasons! Unless you are a driving enthusiast (who by default would be more interested in optimum tyres and likely to have two sets of wheels) you really don't notice the difference in summer unless the all-seasons are particularly aggressive and winter orientated.

-

-

I have some snow socks for small cars for those who don't want to store a spare set of wheels
Or don't have £600 knocking about behond the sofa cushions.
Good for 14in to 16in wheels and some 17 with low profile skinny tyres.
£15 posted

https://www.admiral.com/magazine/guides/motor/winter-tyres-heres-what-you-need-to-know

“Will they affect my insurance?
Your insurance doesn’t change if you change to winter tyres. If you do decide to get your tyres changed, you don’t need to contact your insurance provider as long as it’s only the tyres that have been changed. If the entire wheel has been replaced, you will need to contact your insurance provider.”

https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=102232

“Apparently they’ll let me fit winters tyres to my existing alloys but changing the wheels counts as a modification and requires me to play them for the privilage.”

My Hillman Imp on Romanian remoulds was great in the snow. Never had so much fun at 20mph.

“Apparently they’ll let me fit winters tyres to my existing alloys but changing the wheels counts as a modification and requires me to play them for the privilage.”

I tell my insurer each time I change the wheels and tyres. They do not class changing the wheels as a modification provided the wheels are OEM and are listed as appropriate for the vehicle. They do not charge for this
So my Golf winter wheels are Mk.7 Gti ‘Austin’ wheels which cost £400 for four second hand compared to about £1000 each new. It is always a risk getting second hand wheels but as long as you inspect them carefully…
I would have bought steel wheels if they were available in the correct size, but I could not find any in the UK

What would be the go to All Season tyre? We live in Edinburgh and have all season tyres on one of our cars, an aging Renault Scenic (which are running until it's no longer viable, I worry this might be soon).
Our main car is a VW Touran which is used mainly for getting the kids about, holidays etc. I'd like to get some All Season tyres on this.

Our main issue is getting in and out of the estate we live on. It gets minimal gritting and we're at the top of a hill. Also the kids' nursery is down a private road (although they are good at clearing it).

Don't really have space to do a winter/summer set. Plus if we did I think the tyres would expire due to age instead of being worn down due to how few miles we do!

See what is available in your size. Then if perfomance on snow getting up and down the hill is important choose one of the tyres with good snow performance.

Though any good all season has far better snow grip than summers. Going all season is the important factor, the brand less so. IMO

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/product-group-tests/92863/best-all-season-tyres-2022-tyre-brands-reviewed-and-uk-prices-compared/verdict-results-category

My German RWD auto car came with nice summer tyres that couldn’t handle steep wet roads, muddy car parks and wore out in 8000 miles. The CrossClimate+ I replaced then with have done 30,000+ miles, work in the cold and wet and generally feel much more confident 90% of the time. I’d not run a car again with summer tyres.

+1

https://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/in-praise-of-proper-tyres/

Over the last snowy week I’ve completed a total of 350 slip-free miles and a set of conti all seasons. In my BMW.

I have swopped the OEM tyres on my last 2 Audi’s out to CrossClimates, A6 Avant Quattro and currently Q5 and have found them like night and day. We live in a high area of south Lanarkshire and get a fair amount of ice and snow.

Have just today ordered a set of 4 for wife’s Q2 which has been struggling on our local roads this past week.

The tyres that come on new cars are always terrible even if they have the same name from the same brand as the aftermarket tyres.

As others have mentioned, winter tyres in the UK are NOT snow tyres. They may be snow rated but they are just winter oriented. Soft compound, more grooves, different construction. Better for ANY condition that it cooler. Not just wet.

It should be standard that UK cars have all seasons fitted from factory.

Also those saying next week is warming up. Max 12 is still likely to be close to freezing at commuting times at tarmac level. Pretty sure the drop is about 4-5 Deg between air and ground level.

The tyres that come on new cars are always terrible even if they have the same name from the same brand as the aftermarket tyres.

Codswallop. The cars fitted to most remotely sporty cars will be optimised for handling, those on electric/eco cars are highly optimised for rolling resistance, so they won group tests. They might not be optimised for winter conditions, but they're rarely bad tyres

I have an EV coming next summer on a lease deal, through work. Standard EV optimised tyres are included as are wear and tear replacement with same. Gonna miss my CrossClimates 😞

Can you not choose to fit different tyres as long as the car goes back how they expect?

Not sure, as the arrangement is it goes to KwifFit for routine tyre wear and tear replacements and the cost is included in the lease deal.

As others have mentioned, winter tyres in the UK are NOT snow tyres

"Snow tyre" has morphed into the current umbrella term "winter tyre" and is used by manufacturers and individual countries. Countries specify snow chains, tread depth, and "winter" rather than snow tyres, e.g. this from Finland Today...
"Winter tires can best be identified by the 3PMSF markings on the tires (three-peak mountain snowflake symbol)" https://finlandtoday.fi/new-traffic-law-requires-winter-tires-to-be-used-from-november-1-if-the-weather-so-requires/
A CC2 with 5mm tread is fine in Finland as a tyre used on snow

What would be the go to All Season tyre

I've got Michelin Crossclimates on my Caddy van and they've been excellent. Just spent 2 days in the far North West driving in all sorts of snow.

Important thing to remember about the CrossClimate is that Michelin originally didn't designate it an all-season tyre (which are usually designed by starting with a winter tyre and working backwards) - they designed it as a summer tyre that just so happens to have the 3PMSF approval.

Pretty much the perfect tyre for most of the UK tbh, and what we have on the Jeep (and the Tiguan before that).

Despite joining and enjoying the adjacent thread mocking this one and all the other tyre threads, I run Michelin cross climates and love them for the reasons given in the last couple of posts above (and others). I live on the south coast, semi-rural, so snow is rarely a concern but rain always is and frost was a big issue recently. Previous Summer tyres just spin up in my FWD turbo diesel golf in the merest hint of rain when the turbo kicks in. I’m not even talking about “making progress”, I mean getting safely and smoothly out of junctions. And that behaviour tells me not to expect much in braking or cornering. Cross climates, on the other hand are reliable in these conditions year round, inspiring confidence in emergency braking situations. Idiot dog brain above is spot on.

@timba I appreciate the technical designation from the industry as snow = winter. But Finnish winter tyres have a much different set of requirements than UK variants. Also, most tyre fitters in the UK would not use the term snow tyres with Joe public. Hence the resistance to call them snow tyres here as it gives people the wrong idea that they are only for snow.

But Finnish winter tyres have a much different set of requirements than UK variants

Not so different
The 3PMSF standard is EU-wide and is the same one as is used here. The only difference that I can see is that they want a 3mm minimum tread depth against our 1.6mm
Granted, to use the 5mm recommendation for any length of time you'd want something with a lot more tread depth from new but that isn't the discussion here

Agree on the Cross Climates, I put a set on 2 years ago and they have been very, very good. I also have a set of Cooper full winters in storage that I thought I might use if we had another 'Beast from the East', but can't see me using them.

Another option for storage is a garage if you are friendly with them. Mine are sat on a rack if I ever need them - you do need to pay a small amount to have them swapped over + balanced though, tenner a wheel from memory.

dissonance
Full Member

The problem with your winter tyres are good approach is, next week, they arent for me. Its outside the Michelin recommended range during the day so unless you want me to drive at night its a bad choice.

They don't turn into a pumpkin at 7 degrees. The recommended range is only where they work better. There's then a wide band where they're perfectly good but just not outright better. But of course, that doesn't make them bad, or a bad choice.

The big thing is that when winter tyres are better, they're much better, at the exact time when you most want it. Much safer, much more likely to get you to your destination. Whereas when they're worse, they're a bit noisy and wear faster, and have less good handling on a warm summer afternoon where you absolutely least need it. Nobody ever got stuck in a sunbank.

The 3PMSF standard is EU-wide and is the same one as is used here.

I was more talking about the public image of tyre types rather than standards. Interesting to know the above though.
Don't scandinavian countries have another level (or 2) above our winter spec of full blown ice tyres. Studs etc.

I used to have a set of steel wheels and winter tyres for my car and my wife's car. That's 8 steel wheels that came out the loft and down to the driveway for swapping every October and March and 8 summer wheels that went the other way. Yes they were terrific but jeez, my poor back! I then sold the winter wheels and fitted Cross Climates for year round use to my car. I've also recently fitted those Hankook all seasons that won the Auto-Express group test (mentioned above) to my wife's 4x4. Having now driven on all season tyres, in all seasons, including the recent cold snap, they really are a no-brainer for year round use on Scottish roads. Nearly as good as a summer tyre in summer but far, far better in poor conditions when grip is normally lacking. They aren't as competent in deep snow as a full on winter tyre but they generally work just as well on cold wet roads and aren't as compromised in mild weather. About to fit another set to my daughter's car and won't ever go back to summer tyres. I don't understand why summer tyres, designed to cope with a Greek heatwave, are default fitment for new cars sold in Scotland.

Don’t scandinavian countries have another level (or 2) above our winter spec of full blown ice tyres. Studs etc

Tyres meeting the 3PMSF standard will have different levels of technical ability. A top-class tyre will exceed the standard and perform adequately on ice without studs.
A studded tyre will improve grip on ice, but studs have obvious problems with noise levels and damage to roads and, in any case, they're not subject to 3PMSF testing
Winter tyres meant for cars are disappointing in that they don't look like a Mad Max prop because they need to fit inside a wheelarch, but the magic is in the tread compound and pattern
Nokian is a Finnish company, I haven't got time to trawl for prices and reviews just now, but their Hakkapeliitta R5 is worth a look, depending where you drive https://www.nokiantyres.com/tyres/passenger-car/winter-tires/
EDIT: It's worth mentioning that the Finns rely on their winter tyres, you'll find standard, extra-load and run-flat versions as a result

don’t understand why summer tyres, designed to cope with a Greek heatwave, are default fitment for new cars sold in Scotland.

This.

Pretty much applies across the UK.

Many folk struggled to move their cars safely even down here Gloucester way, see that there Leckhampton etc.

Converted all season user here.

I tell my insurer each time I change the wheels and tyres.

DO you? Never have, they're both BMW supplied wheels (18" and 19") with appropriate winter & summer tyres fitted.

I don’t understand why summer tyres, designed to cope with a Greek heatwave, are default fitment for new cars sold in Scotland.

This.

My previous 4 Series came with 20" wheels and Pirelli's - they were a bit 'nervous' in the cold and on searching I discovered that in North America they are not recommended for use below 7c...

I live in NE Scotland and ran winter tyres during the winter from 2010 to 2021. The last few years have seen such long prolonged warm spells during the winter, I've not bothered getting a set for our new car. I'd rather crawl around at a snails pace on the few wintry days than drive at normal speeds on dry roads on winter tyres at 15C when it feels like the tyres are rolling of the rims.

I’d rather crawl around at a snails pace on the few wintry days

Ah yes there were a number of you guys on the bypass last week. 15 mph just generally being a nuisance.

I live in NE Scotland and ran winter tyres during the winter from 2010 to 2021. The last few years have seen such long prolonged warm spells during the winter, I’ve not bothered getting a set for our new car. I’d rather crawl around at a snails pace on the few wintry days than drive at normal speeds on dry roads on winter tyres at 15C when it feels like the tyres are rolling of the rims.

Must've been crap tyres as no way would anyone except a 'professional' driver feel that with the winters I use.

I can feel a difference with the winters in warm temps.
Driving into work this morning they felt a bit wandery, but nothing that i would call scary or unsafe and def not at the point of ending up in places i didn't want to be.
But yes i could feel a difference

Lot of posturing on this thread (echoes of Surfmatt). I agree all-seasons should be fitted as standard for most parts of the UK and if you’re that good / informed / on the edge you can upgrade to your seasonal or terrain specific preference. Clue.

I can feel a difference with the winters in warm temps.
Driving into work this morning they felt a bit wandery, but nothing that i would call scary or unsafe and def not at the point of ending up in places i didn’t want to be.
But yes i could feel a difference

Which isn't really a surprise. Fwiw, I drove briefly with a set of winters on in the summer at a temperature of around 25˚C and speeds up to 70mph. They felt a little vague compared to my - admittedly lower profile summer tyres - and I took it easy, but nothing terrible happened, there was no melting of rubber, I didn't slam into the car in front every time I applied the brakes, or slide off the road on bends and the compound didn't disintegrate. I did not turn into a pumpkin and neither did my car and that was in full-on summer heat. Even winter tyres, as opposed to all season ones, can cope with short spells of use in mild conditions without terrible things happening. I'm sure it's not optimal, but it's not catastrophic either ime.

More importantly, at the point in winter when the rubber compound of a summer tyre feels more like a block of rigid Lego-brick plastic, winter tyres are soft enough to actually grip properly. You can feel the difference every time you drive in low temperatures and particularly in the wet. If I were buying now, it'd be all seasons, but as I already had two sets of wheels and space to store them, a set of winter tyres on my spare wheels, a few years back, made sense.

I don't unbderstand why people get so worked up about this. Winter-rated tyres make such a ridiculously obvious difference in cold and wet conditions that once you've tried them, you don't really want to go back. I suspect a lot of those who seem evangelically opposed to winter and/or all season tyres simply haven't used them.

Totally agree bwd.
I'm happy with a little wandery when it gets warmer occasionally in the winter, too then have the levels of grip i had in the snow and ice last week. Well worth a trade off

I suspect a lot of those who seem evangelically opposed to winter and/or all season tyres simply haven’t used them.

I'm not against them at all. I won't be getting any though. My car feels pretty much exactly the same to drive in the middle of summer as it does now.

I currently do the two sets of wheels/tyres thing. Michelin Energy Savers in the summer as were OEM on the car. Efficient, but useless in the wet, more than hopeless in the snow. Then a set of Conti Winter Contacts on another set of wheels for the winter. Like above, bought a trolley jack and down to less than an hour to change all 4. TBH, they normally go on in November and are rarely off before Easter. I'm in NE Scotland, but even at 10 degrees plus in the wet, they are miles better than the summers despite the <7*C recommendation.

Interestingly, if you read the Autoblid or Autoexpress tyre tests, often the 'reference winter' usually scores in the top few for wet braking and wet handling in the summer tyre tests. So if you live somewhere wet, you'll still be better off with winters than summers, even in normal temps.

Now I've got the van as well, I'm tempted to just go Cross Climates on both and risk having to use snowsocks occasionally though for simplicity, rather than having 2 sets per vehicle.

DO you? Never have,

Yes, I always inform them on the phone, twice a year. Not ever been a problem. As stated above it makes sure the company is aware of the change which the small print suggests is necessary.

Another total agree with what @badlywireddog says.

I’m happy with a little wandery when it gets warmer occasionally in the winter, too then have the levels of grip i had in the snow and ice last week. Well worth a trade off

Yep. For where I live* winters are less compromised in summer than summers are in winter. I've had separate winter/summer wheels/tyres for the past 15 years or so and they were worth it, but all-seasons strike a good compromise for me now: no longer live at altitude and far less actual driving in snow.

* That's the key bit.

All-season tyres were a £500 option when I factory-ordered our current van 5+ years ago, i.e. for £500 extra Ford would fit all-seasons in place of the standard van tyres. Not exactly an incentive that many folk are going to take up. It should be a no-cost option. Instead, it cost me ~£100ish (and the hassle) to remove the standard tyres within 100 miles of new, Gumtree them, and fit my choice of all-seasons in their place.

Which isn’t really a surprise. Fwiw, I drove briefly with a set of winters on in the summer at a temperature of around 25˚C and speeds up to 70mph. They felt a little vague compared to my – admittedly lower profile summer tyres – and I took it easy, but nothing terrible happened, there was no melting of rubber, I didn’t slam into the car in front every time I applied the brakes, or slide off the road on bends and the compound didn’t disintegrate. I did not turn into a pumpkin and neither did my car and that was in full-on summer heat. Even winter tyres, as opposed to all season ones, can cope with short spells of use in mild conditions without terrible things happening. I’m sure it’s not optimal, but it’s not catastrophic either ime.

Again, are you comparing equivalent tyres and same (approximate) widths/profiles?

My Pirelli winters are rated to the same speeds as my Bridgestone summers and as an ex-racer (motorcycles) I find that they deliver the same performance for any driving you'd want to do on a public road - but then I'm not a 'Surfmat' 🙂