[Closed] Will I die - old ski content

Surely if they worked before they'll work now?

Not on that new modern snow 😉

Do you ski a lot off piste ?

Most "all mountain" will be about 10mm-12mm wider under foot than those.

That said my Powder skis are 115mm under foot and are a lot of fun off piste (Lne sir Francis Bacons). But if I am bombing around on piste I prefer my K2 Apache Recons which are 78mm under foot (and getting on a bit now)

I've been wrestling with this very thing.

I have some newer skis, but still want to have a go on my old 204cm K2s.

It's the bindings that are the issue. I've decided to take a risk on my 20 yr old Look bindings - mainly because they are supposed to be very safe and reliable, and have been relaunched due to the strong second hand market...

Having said that, I will be testing the release at the beginning of each day I use the old straight skis and will start easy and build up...

... of course - I may just decide that old skis are junk and consign them to the wall.

The width of the ski is not about making them easier off piste but merely a reflection of the how skis changed in order to make them easier to turn. Wider tail and shovel = easier to turn. The actual surface area of the base of the ski is not actually that different to old skis, its just profiled differently.

Powder skis will be wider in the middle, under the foot too, so they do get greater surface area.

All skis work off piste, and in fact you are less reliant on the cut of the ski. Off piste is all about technique, but modern off piste skis allow less technically proficient skiers to ski off piste 🙂

"Having said that, I will be testing the release at the beginning of each day I use the old straight skis and will start easy and build up..."

Why bindings are very simple things, basically just springs on pivots. As long as the driction plates are not too warn you should have no problems, ok the springs may have lost some strength over the years..

Long skis, off-piste - but with some reasonably talented skiers 😉

Skiing starts at about 1:20

ETA - The old VHS player may be getting some use tonight!!!!!

Still on my Atomic GS11s here. Still plenty fast enough on piste. 😀

Why bindings are very simple things

Peace of mind really.

The bindings appear to be in good nick

The sidecut of a new ski is what really kicks the turns off, IMO. As above, the actual surface area isn't much changed, but the shape of the ski is. You'll be fine on your old skis, but everyone will of course point and laugh at you! 😉

You'll be fine on your old skis, but everyone will of course [s]point and laugh at[/s] [i]bow down and worship[/i] you!

TBH, A lot of Brits in the Alps have all the new gear. A lot of the local skiers still seem to ski on old kit

What I don't get is the particularly British fascination with having really, really phattttt pow skis, bro. (I am so street sometimes, I astound even myself).

Some of the really big sellers in the UK are things like Atomic Chetlers. They're as wide as waterskis, FFS! You really don't need anything that phatttttttt unless you're spending all your time balls-deep in Japanese powder every single day.

It's a bit like riding a 6" travel bike everywhere. Oh. Erm. 😳

Question more around BS Marketing - just like bikes, golf, etc, etc.

Given it has been some years since I have skied and I'll focus primarily on nice groomed piste with my daughter then sure all will be fine.

It just struck me that an awful lot of the skis on display extolled 'all mountain', 'off piste' when I'll assume the majority of users would probably stay on piste.

It just struck me that an awful lot of the skis on display extolled 'all mountain', 'off piste' when I'll assume the majority of users would probably stay on piste.

^^This^^

As above, loads of people buy phattt planks, staing "yeah, I spend all of my time in the back country" when what they mean is, "I cruise pistes between bars all day, occasionally venturing in to the slack country*"

*The "off piste" shortcut between pistes. We've all done it!

My big fat powder skis are a lot more fun than skinny skis off piste IMHO. They also make it a lot physically easier as they have so much more float. They are not too shabby on hard pack either. Much better than say Pocket Rockets of old. They are slower edge to edge but they are not like a limp lettuce and have some pop unlike older powder skis.

Edited to add

I only actually got about 4 days on them last season. Hoping to get more when I head out on Friday. Me and some mates have a guide for a few days too so with all this snow should be a lot of fun.

rkk01 - 204 k2's - did you have MSL's as well? ... damn I loved those skiis and used them when I was doing a season.

I threw them out a few years ago when I stopped going skiing so often but looking back on them I should have kept them & showed the kids what I used to ski on

*The "off piste" shortcut between pistes. We've all done it!

😆 This is how I roll

Had more fun on some skinny tiger sharks (not mine unfortunately) than on some Nomad Tis

"They also make it a lot physically easier as they have so much more float."

See my comment about about technique... or lack of it 😮 If you ski right in powder it requires a lot less effort than skiing on piste whether on a pair of old style skis or supper fat modern skis.

On piste 'old' skis actually track alot better than modern skis. I have a pair of Volkl Race Slalom skis that track way way better than an equivalent GS ski today, the side cuts on modern skis are much more difficult to keep going in a straight line.

See my comment about about technique... or lack of it If you ski right in powder it requires a lot less effort than skiing on piste whether on a pair of old style skis or supper fat modern skis.

All I know is I have more fun on the Lines and to me that what matters. I know I am never going to be a great skier, so it does not bother me any more.

I did a season a couple of years back and did over 100days on the mountain. So I know that I am not going to get that much better or I already would have, so will take all the help I can get 🙂

Gee Jay

Still have a pair of the original K2 Extremes...
[img] [/img]
(not mine, but same graphics)

I'm as excited about using them again this year as I am about going skiing 😀
[I am going to be disappointed, aren't I 😥 ]

Also have a pair of Volkl GS skis, but deffo wpouldn't trust the Geze bindings that are on those. The Volkls had the best edge grip of any ski I have ever used.

bazzer, then time moves on, the waistline grows and it becomes very irritating that what would have been easy you now have to think about or put some effort in 🙁

But my stories of what I did 15 years ago get WAY BETTER 🙂

Mine were like these

[img] [/img]

Completely straight if you looked down the edges, no cut at all. They were fast though

See my comment about about technique... or lack of it If you ski right in powder it requires a lot less effort than skiing on piste whether on a pair of old style skis or supper fat modern skis.

Interestingly I can ski virgin really nice light powder effortless on my piste skis. Its later in the season when it wetter and heavier I struggle more. I also find it harder when its cut up.

I ski with a fairly wide stance normally too which I know is not ideal for bumps and powder, but it does work well on ice and hard pack 🙂

I do love it though 🙂

Yeh, my season was '94/95 I think, LDA - happy days 🙂

My liver has almost recovered

Those skis resemble the colours of some of my old ski clothes!!!

I daren't post any pictures of me skiing from that era - family shame etc, etc...

I used to set out to wear "shocking" ski gear - even in the days of flourescent blue / yellow / pink

Those skis resemble the colours of some of my old [s]ski[/s] bike clothes!!!

Bula hats FTW! 🙂

The newer skis need a different style of sking. The old straighter, longer skis were the type that you could 'jump' parallel turn, the newer parabolic type need to stay firmly on the ground, so are edged round, with both skis having contact on the snow. However on the steeps and deeps, I still jump them round slightly.

I had to have lessons to relearn how the ski when I first got my parabolic skis. Someone in a ski shop last season said mine were 'old school', I suppose they're comparable to a slack angled hard tail.

Somewhere around I have pics of me in the late 80's wearing a mid blue, puffy all in one with clouds on it, the misses had the same in a lime green...
Mind you I also have pics of me in the 70's skiing in kagoul top and waterproof over trousers

Claim to fame, I started skiing in '71 (aged 6) in the Lebanon, bet not many have skiied there

Ahh yes, the lovely bright colours of the 1980's, which would fade in bright sunlight, getting duller as the seasson went by.

I had a gorgeous ivory coloured 'all in one' suit with fur trim hood. Very warm but not practical for visiting the loo.

My Dad still has one of those old Nevica jobbies, he wears it into town in UK if it is cold or snowy, its like soooo embarassing

haha I had a powder blue Nevica jacket when I was about 14 🙂

I loved it, it was well cool at the time 🙂

😆

haha I had a powder blue Nevica jacket

its like soooo embarassing

HeHe - like this?
[img] [/img]
Had the smock version 😳
It was actually pretty poor unless you had a lovely bluebird day. Not warm and not waterproof

ETA - The "Jumble" and "old tat" tags are starting look fitting

Dad's is like that, my suit was more like this

[img] [/img]

But in a nice powder blue (no matter how hard I search I can find nothing quite so awful on google images)

Hangs head in shame

Ahh yes, the lovely bright colours of the 1980's, which would fade in bright sunlight, getting duller as the seasson went by.

I've got some great video of an old French woman in a one piece and straight skis a couple of years ago. Weather was shocking, she had her hood on - really showed how faded the rest of the suit was!

Anyone here been one piece licking?

Back to OP; Benz you may not die on old skiis but you probably will if you wear ski clothing of the same era

"The newer skis need a different style of sking. The old straighter, longer skis were the type that you could 'jump' parallel turn, the newer parabolic type need to stay firmly on the ground, so are edged round, with both skis having contact on the snow. However on the steeps and deeps, I still jump them round slightly."

You used to ski very badly then, as it has always been possible to carve skis and you can only do that keeping them on the ground. You are also using the wrong technique off piste today, unless your talking about skiing slopes 50 degrees or so plus...

All that modern skis have done has made it easier for avergae skiers to carve turns, as the ski does most of the work for you. Older skis required you to drive the ski a bit more and think about it.

You used to ski very badly then, as it has always been possible to carve skis and you can only do that keeping them on the ground. You are also using the wrong technique off piste today, unless your talking about skiing slopes 50 degrees or so plus...

You do have a way with words FD 🙂

But you are right basically these days if you put a modern ski on its edge and stand on it, it will turn. You don't really need to drive the ski so hard into reverse camber to make the ski form an arc, the sidecut provides the arc.

Edited to add

But this is a good thing as more people can have fun 🙂

[i]All that modern skis have done has made it easier for avergae skiers to carve turns, as the ski does most of the work for you. Older skis required you to drive the ski a bit more and think about it.[/i]

Certainly agree with this bit, took me ages to learn to carve properly with old skiis, now everybody can do it... Oh well back to good I used to be 🙂

Way back in the day we had the had the attitude that skis were penis extensions- the longer the better, even if you couldn't use them properly.

I've still got a set of 207cm Volkl P10 RS's with Derbyflex plates up in the loft, reminder of good times, but I reckon I'd be broken in a day if I had to ski them now.

No, no, no.....the Volkl's I have are parabolics...just quite old (2004-ish) and not in the current slightly wider flavour.

However not as old at the 80's flouo Renntiger R's with S747 Equipe bindings which also nestle in the garage loft.....

The yellow Nevica one piece with pink and purple panels I believe is still in my parents loft. No wonder my mates called me 'Banana Man'...which was being very charitable.

"You do have a way with words FD"

Only offering some critical coaching advice 🙂 . Apparently I am a very good ski instructor in the real world 😯

Ok here goes a nicey nicey 'correct' technique explantion for off piste.

If its nice snow all you do is start by putting the skis on an edge turn almost like you do on piste, no leaning back, no leaning forward excessively just neutral, no heavy pressure etc.

After a couples of turns and a bit of momentum, you will naturaly start to bend the ski in to reverse camber through the turn and as you come out of the turn as you un weight naturally the ski will naturally return to the natural inverse camber. All this releases stored energy in the ski and you and unweights you making it easy to transfer your weight in to the next turn.

People watching this think that the person is 'jumping' up, they are not they are just using the energy in the ski. When you jump you have to exert pressure downwards and in powder all that does is push you deeper in the snow, uses more energy, and makes it difficult to switch from edge to edge...

🙂

FD the rebound from the ski is how I feel when I ski on piste. The ski almost tells me its loaded up and its time to turn. I love that feeling of being popped into the next turn with the energy in the ski.

I find it harder to get that feeling off piste, it does come sometimes.

Are you teaching anywhere this year ?

Edited to ask what sort of width stance would you suggest when off piste ?

On piste I tend to be hip width, rather than old school ankles welded together. I have been trying to narrow my stance off piste is this correct ?

Way back in the day we had the had the attitude that skis were penis extensions- the longer the better

Yup - use to stand my 205's on the toe of our boots in the cablecars to look badass!

It's funny - I ski a 179cm, 90mm underfoot. Riding the cable car up the Grand Montet it felt short and skinny - weeks later in Zermat they felt massive as everyone was on little piste twiddlers.

I have been trying to narrow my stance off piste is this correct?

I'd go hip width or wider, you've got more chance of tripping over yourself in deep powder, go for the planted approach more like below (face optional)

[img] [/img]

"On piste I tend to be hip width, rather than old school ankles welded together."

Old school was never ankles welded together, that was just an intermediates idea of what looked good. Hip width (what feels comfortable) is about right for on or off piste. Too close makes it difficult to distribute weight evenly and balance, too far apart and you will not be able to control the tips.

The biggest mistake a lot of people make skiing off piste is trying too hard. Try not to think about it too much and before you know it you are doing it naturally.

ankles welded together

Still love seeing les vieux Francais rocking that look as they barrel along in a faded onesy!

Only just swapped the bindings from my Salomon Force9 3s (1998 vintage) onto my new Scott Aztec Pro's. TBH if it's icy, or in the bumps, I think they would be hard to beat and I still miss my dear departed Force9 2s (bloody baggage handlers) which were fantastic everywhere.

I've also got a pair of Head S75 which I keep for Scotland and Weardale and they are nowhere near as stable at speed as the old planks. They are much easier to use though,

I've got some Salomon Axendo 9s in my past (and cellar).

They haven't been used in anger since 2002 but on a well-groomed piste they are [b]fast as stink[/b].

You used to ski very badly then,

Have had many, many lessons, so hopefully improved over the years.
Yes was talking about steep off piste for the jump turns. As CFH says ^^ I still see skiers with ankles glued together the French way.