[Closed] Wild Camping....

Not cool.

*Stealth camping, not ‘wild camping’ (Although your campers seem to be failing on either definition 🤣)

Pics of the setting needed.

I thought the rule of thumb was pitch at dusk and away by dawn? There's actual laws that I can't fully remember too, where you've to be a certain distance from roads and / or civilisation.

Really though, it's the land owner's problem. If they're minding their own business and cleaning up after themselves then it seems a bit N(quite)IMBY.

Call the council if you have concerns?

Ever been homless? I have and would like to thank all the good people who just ignored me whether in a tent or a vehicle. I'd also like to thank the campsite owner who went a step further and invited me to stay on his campsite for free after seeing me wild camping.

(... assuming you're not in Scotland where it's different.)

Not cool.

(… assuming you’re not in Scotland where it’s different.)

We do have a different law, but Rule No.1 applies even more (legally and morally). We have good Access laws, not free-for-all laws that some think.

Could pop down and say hello, offer them a cup of tea, see what the score is? Be a nice person etc.

I'd say wild camping is cool for a week depending on where it is. What sort of land is it? Woods etc? Do they have good kit, or are we talking homelessness here?

I reckon they are the advance party for setting up an illegal rave. By the weekend you will have 1000 people off their head dancing to rubbish tunes blaring out of massive speakers that are powered from a collection of rusty transits.

Do they have good kit, or are we talking homelessness here?

Nope. Aldi type big tents. Didn't know how to put it up.

They're quiet.

I may be overly assuming, but "a couple of chaps" doesn't immediately suggest homeless to me?

How do you know they don't have permission to camp there from the land owner? As above, go say Hi, ask them how long they are staying, where they are heading etc?

apedoctor
Could pop down and say hello, offer them a cup of tea, see what the score is? Be a nice person etc.

This seems like the most logical thing to do.

Or OP could start blasting some really awful music (Coldplay, Lighthouse Family etc) to scare them off.

There are tents in the local woods around the train line in Cambridge, mainly homeless people.

I may be overly assuming, but “a couple of chaps” doesn’t immediately suggest homeless to me?

Why not?

I guess my question would also be, what's legally allowable if you're homeless and wild camping? It's not a great situation for anyone to be in, so totally sympathise if it is the case.

Had a similarish debate with myself recently. Wee FC carpark in Dunkeld, just above Inver. Used it a month or so ago and the only other "users" were a caravan an awning with full fire pits and obvious long term setup. I thought live and let live but was there again last week and now 6 vans taking up 3/4 of carpark and making it feel less secure. No real harm being done yet but in these days of pressure on parking I wondered if it was worth reporting. There are "No overnight parking" signs.
Edit - located about 500m from FLS offices so they are presumably aware and maybe unable to act?

Pics of the setting needed.

Yes, definitely needs a picture. End of the garden for me is pretty close. A lot further for others!

Sneak down, insert some frozen sausages and let the badges and foxes take care of them. 🤣

Just go talk to them, be nice, see what the crack is. You might make a friend or two.

I'll pop over and offer a drink to the guys and see what's what. At least I'll know what's going on then.

They're not on your property, but whose land are they on? I would speak to the landowner before doing anything else.

I'm in the not cool camping gang with this. I guess photos might help. Your garden might be what there rest of us might call an estate or park or it could be a pocket handkerchief. Distance and visibility from your house would also be a factor in the rule 1 transgression too. I think i can count on one hand the number of times I have ever left a tent up from one night to the next wild camping and those were times when I had it poked out of the way in a hard to find spot and I was off to walk a circular route or I was holed up in a white out. and I don't think I've every wild camped within 500m of a house.

All the above assuming this is holiday camping.

Oh, and are we talking cars too?

I’ll pop over and offer a drink to the guys and see what’s what. At least I’ll know what’s going on then.

Let us know what happens! Couple of pics etc! #nosey

I reckon they are the advance party for setting up an illegal rave. By the weekend you will have 1000 people off their head dancing to rubbish tunes blaring out of massive speakers that are powered from a collection of rusty transits.

Could you let me know where these chaps are camped so I can "avoid the area" if an illegal rave does happen please?

I wouldn't be happy with that, bit of an eyesore etc. I'd at least want the owner of the land to be aware as it can be quite hard to move people on if not dealt with swiftly.

Yes we don't know their circumstances but I'd say it would be respectful of them to assure neighbors that they are allowed to be there, if they are.

Let us know what happens! Couple of pics etc! #nosey

How would you like pics of your mug/stuff plastered over social media? Or are requesting private pics (off-forum) for #personalperusal?

Not cool. If you're wild camping you should be out of the way not at end of someone's garden, and not there for multiple nights unless really in the middle of nowhere*.

*Only really a few places in the UK and not usually vehicle accessible.

I’d say wild camping is cool for a week depending on where it is. What sort of land is it? Woods etc? Do they have good kit, or are we talking homelessness here?

Even in Scotland where Lightweight Wild Camping is a right (provided you comply with your responsibilities) the access code suggests that the following are not acceptable:
- camping in close proximity to dwellings without seeking the owner's permission
- camping in the same place for more than 2-3 nights
- going to the toilet (in the wild) within 30m of a watercourse, or close to buildings

Only on STW can we jump to the conclusion that someone camping for more than a few nights with low-quality kit is homeless!

It's a pretty rational conclusion if you live somewhere like Northampton or Milton Keynes. Plenty of people living in cheap pop-up type tents around town. I doubt they are there for the scenery.

It’s a pretty rational conclusion if you live somewhere like Northampton or Milton Keynes. Plenty of people living in cheap pop-up type tents around town. I doubt they are there for the scenery.

It's not that out of place in sunny Richmond upon Thames either. They often pick the green bit between the A316 & the train line but I assume the landowner (probably TFL or the council) takes a while to ask them to leave (or, more helpfully, gets them into something other than a tent).

I doubt they are there for the scenery.

It's unlikely. They're in their tents 90% of the time I'm awake.

– camping in close proximity to dwellings without seeking the owner’s permission

YEP.

– camping in the same place for more than 2-3 nights

YEP.

– going to the toilet (in the wild) within 30m of a watercourse, or close to buildings

YEP.

It was more a comment on the town centre tent dwellers around here than your new neighbours @rickon It could be a green and pleasant land wherever you are.

How would you like pics of your mug/stuff plastered over social media? Or are requesting private pics (off-forum) for #personalperusal?

Sorry, I meant just of the area to get an idea of where they are, not intimate portrait shots and in depth product shots so I can gauge the quality...

Sorry, I meant just of the area to get an idea of where they are, not intimate portrait shots and in depth product shots so I can gauge the quality…

Too late.

I do a lot of wild camping but live in Snowdonia so have a lot of places to choose from.

For me wild camping is about pitching late and gone early the next day - I never leave my tent up during the daytime and I wouldn’t pitch anywhere near someones garden, unless desperate, ie very bad weather and I’d be gone as soon as possible.

As said could be homelessness - I know that campsites are full in Snowdonia - so maybe no campsite availability for them so they have chanced it in a field?

Too late.

nice spot...can see why they chose it. hard to see where your land ends tho 😉

Go and have a chat with them. If they are respectful then live and let live, chill and don't be uptight.

Do you live near an Amazon warehouse?

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/amazon-workers-sleep-tents-dunfermline-fife-scotland-a7467657.html

Too late.

OP - is that you sat perving on the bench? What are you doing with your right hand?

you should also warn them about the dangers of inflatables in offshore winds

Too late.

Spat my tea across the desk at that, nice one OP 🙂

I also like your approach of taking them a drink for a chat - a great approach

We have a few long-term wild campers in the area. A couple have been around all through Covid. However, they are camped off the busier tracks and are certainly not visible from any other habitation.

yeah rickon's image is lovely, but same place, different viewpoints and we get a better picture of the OP's place

actually a nine year replica of (of all places!) Middlesborough. Quite cool in a "why?" sort of way.

Is that the campers by the blue door? If so, if say they're too close

Muggles attending the Quidditch World Cup innit. You can’t see the rest of them because magic.

Staying for weeks at a time isn't within the rules. Even in the LRA it says 1 or 2 nights. Anything more and you are outwith the law. I don't think you are allowed to camp next to residential areas either.

@theotherjonv

You need to update that model of the Boro. Need some of those bits of green perforated steel on the windows then you'd convince me it was just off Newport Road where the council keeps promising to redevelop.

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2021/jun/01/michelangelo-of-middlesbrough-hailed-for-27000-hour-model

Mister-P
Free Member
I reckon they are the advance party for setting up an illegal rave. By the weekend you will have 1000 people off their head dancing to rubbish tunes blaring out of massive speakers that are powered from a collection of rusty transits.

Could you let me know where these chaps are camped so I can “avoid the area” if an illegal rave does happen please?

I second what @Mister-P said, I want to "avoid" that area if a rave happens. Certainly wouldn't want to end up dancing to rubbish tunes from massive speakers again..... What is the address (just to be sure)?

Watch the original Rambo film and don't be like the aggressive cop at the start of the film, it didn't turn out great for the polis

In conclusion, the campers have now murdered the OP and are wearing his skin for a suit around his (now their) house.

It's the only way for millennials to get on the property ladder.

We've also stolen his Ssingletrackworld account, and finally have bikes. Our plan to obtain a Shimano XT rear mech has finally come to fruition!!! Mwahhh haaaa haaaaa haaaaa!

Now, do you guys know anyone who knows what kind of wood you need for a log burner?

Now, do you guys know anyone who knows what kind of wood you need for a log burner?

you need to burn the body first..that should keep you warm for a day or two

In yesterday's glorious weather I did a local cheeky rider-built (and very excellent) trail near Caerphilly. There's a section where it crosses a flat area in trees and becomes a bit indistinct for maybe 20m. There were 15 or so teenagers camping out in large stand-up height tents with loads of gear with them including music and beer fridges etc. Sounds great for them (as long as they tidy up) but they were taking the piss a bit. It was some distance from the traditional trails, to be fair, however I did see loads of people walking on the homemade bike trails. Anyone else noticed this as they become more distinct apparently due to the lockdown effect?

Well, that's our resident vagrants back. Disappeared for a week, and then arrived back on Friday.

Police don't care, council haven't got back to me.

It's very disturbing having two men camping outside your back garden.

They don't appear to be around during the day, so not really sure what's going on.

I feel this caveat related to the land reform act now applies:

"Informal camping or shelter to which access rights generally do not apply: 7. Camping for non-recreational purposes (eg political protest, residence).... Other non-compliant purposes may include when informal camping extends beyond a few days into weeks, so its purpose may shift to having a residential function."

And... I'm going with this one from the Land Reform Act: (point 1.a.ii and 1.b.iv)

6. Land over which access rights not exercisable
(1)The land in respect of which access rights are not exercisable is land—
(a)to the extent that there is on it—
(i)a building or other structure or works, plant or fixed machinery;
(ii)a caravan, tent or other place affording a person privacy or shelter;
(b)which—
(i)forms the curtilage of a building which is not a house or of a group of buildings none of which is a house;
(ii)forms a compound or other enclosure containing any such structure, works, plant or fixed machinery as is referred to in paragraph (a)(i) above;
(iii)consists of land contiguous to and used for the purposes of a school; or
(iv)comprises, in relation to a house or any of the places mentioned in paragraph (a)(ii) above, sufficient adjacent land to enable persons living there to have reasonable measures of privacy in that house or place and to ensure that their enjoyment of that house or place is not unreasonably disturbed;

Breaking the Land Reform act.... does this mean it's the Local Authorities responsibility to enforce the legislation?

not really sure what’s going on.

Did you ask them?

rickon
Full Member
Well, that’s our resident vagrants back. Disappeared for a week, and then arrived back on Friday.

Working locally & trying to save having to pay for a B&B?

Working locally & trying to save having to pay for a B&B?

Are they the Welsh or Scottish football teams?

I've got nothing to add other than wanting to know why they are there....

Your extract from the LRA would apply if they were camping IN your garden, but not next to it. They are certainly outside the guidance for wild camping, but whether they are actually committing an offence I don't know. If they are, it's a police matter, not the LA.

Have you spoken to the owner of the land they are on?

not really sure what’s going on.

None of them recieved a hero's welcome.

You said weeks ago that you were going to speak to them. Did you?

Talk of land reform act, quoting sections and subsections, whispered words to the landowner, possibly organizing a torch and pitchfork rally to drive them off ?

And from the same crowd who reckon digging up someone elses woods to create somewhere to ride a bike scenario is okeydokey.

dear dear.

Managed to speak to them. Just here for 'nostalgia'. Staying until the weekend, and then back again at the end of summer - so that'll be 6/7 weeks in total.

To be honest, it's just weird. It's a nice place where we live, but they're camped by a road and a car bridge. There's nothing local nearby to do, no pubs.

The other issue here is that the next valley over has started to have a massive problem with people camping in droves, and leaving a total mess. It was in the paper recently, where a group of lads left a couple of gazebos, loads of bbqs, and just a mess. They were found on social media, made to clear it up - and they then dumped it all at a local farmers yard!

Anyway, encouraging roadside camping is very different to Wild Camping. Stay a day or a couple of days, leave no trace, don't camp near someone else's home. Camp at the roadside for weeks, by someone's house - not cool. It's that behaviour that the Land Reform act discourages to ensure we all get to use the outdoors responsibly.

@rickon - so are you actually in Scotland then with you quoting the LR(S)A?

Breaking the Land Reform act…. does this mean it’s the Local Authorities responsibility to enforce the legislation?

Your understanding is flawed. The Act grants rights to people in certain circumstances, but it doesn't mean that if you do something you don't have a right to do you are breaking the law, you just might not have an explicit right to do it. If someone is doing something which falls outside the scope of the LRA then the landowner will have the option to do something about it.

(FWIW, your 6(1)a(ii) argument is flawed - that says that once they've put a tent on the ground I no longer have a right of access over that specific bit of ground - i.e. I can't walk through/over their tent; your 6(1)b(iv) argument may have substance if by exercising their access rights immediately behind your property they ruin your reasonable expectation of privacy).

If it's a "regular thing" then they may actually need planning permission! I seem to recall they were permitted 28 days per annum for camping without planning, but Scottish gov was encouraging LA's to be lenient at the moment, to better manage the increased demand for campsites.

If it’s a “regular thing” then they may actually need planning permission! I seem to recall they were permitted 28 days per annum for camping without planning

Yep, that's right, I think if it goes up to 90 days then you need a tenting licence.

Don't get me wrong, I've no problem with a few nights wild camping. But weeks on end is not on.

As poly says, the LRA gives rights to use land; if someone uses land outside those rights, they are trespassing (the legal term in Scotland may not be exactly that) and it's for the landowner to ask them to leave, or indeed to allow them to stay. As a neighbour you have no rights in that. If they have the landowner's permission then the only relevant laws would be creating a nuisance or using the land as a campsite for longer than the permitted number of days.