[Closed] why are SUV's so much more popular than estates ?

"Look at me up here. I'm better than you"

Yes, I am better than you. Deal with it.

andy8442 - Member
Image. Simple as that. "Look at me up here. I'm better than you"

Nah, higher seating is a bonus, no matter what car you drive.

Never had an SUV, as I don't need four wheel drive - but I do have a Doblo:
Almost exactly the same size as a Disco, has the same sterling levels of reliability, same high seating position, but without the stupidly expensive tyres and unnecessary transmission and drivetrain components.
More interior space, cheaper and even uglier than most SUV's too.
🙂

andy8442 - Member
Image. Simple as that. "Look at me up here. I'm better than you"

Nah, higher seating and better visibility is a bonus, no matter what car you drive.

Never had an SUV, as I don't need four wheel drive - but I do have a Doblo:
Almost exactly the same size as a Disco, has the same sterling levels of reliability, same high seating position, but without the stupidly expensive tyres and unnecessary transmission and drivetrain components.
More interior space, cheaper and even uglier than most SUV's too.
🙂

I like my Ford Kuga mk I.
Yes it's taller & wider than the 9-3 SW and the 3 series Touring I've had in the past. But it's no longer.
Yes it's bigger inside. Will get my drum kit, a Marshall 4x12 cab and amp, two or three guitars AND their owner in it. Couldn't manage all that including the 4x12 in a 3 Series Touring.
No, it doesn't use any more fuel than either of them. 42mpg beats both the Saab and the Beemer.
Yes I'm higher in the car so I get a better view of the road ahead.
Yes my aging M-I-L can get in it much easier than she can into a lower car.
And yes it has 4WD on demand, so on the very rare occasion that it does snow, I'll be able to drive in conditions that would put my old BMW out of action.
No, I don't think of it as 'better' than you. It's a Ford, remember

No, it doesn't use any more fuel than either of them.

Uses more fuel than a decent modern estate though. I'd be horrified with 42mpg

Uses more fuel than a decent modern estate though. I'd be horrified with 42mpg

My 1.3 Doblo gets 42mpg round here.
Over 50 anywhere flat though.

Big car, small engine, big hills.

Awful cars for awful people. Britain is full of awful people these days; I mean the Tories are in power FFS.

Liking Larry_Lamb's contributions here. 🙂

Higher seating position.

Insecurity.

People feel more secure in a car than they do out of it. Hence all the road rage, but not person rage. Bigger car makes people (and in particular mums, but plenty of men too) more secure.

Personally I much prefer a lower car with less weight. Better handling and performance. I would consider a suv if I found one that was better (and the same price) than the estate/hatchback version. So far I haven't.

The Kuga is bigger than a 3 series - its based on a Mondeo estate chassis and a Mondeo estate is a bigger car than a 3 series touring. Quite a bit bigger. 3 series touring have tiny boots - not much bigger than your average hatchback.

Cars are like bikes, you don't have to be able to justify them. I no longer look on cars as toys and nice things to have but as practical tools which is why I think these big 4x4 cross type cars are a bit of a nonsense. They do have small interiors relative to their external size - they have to be to fit in all the 4wd stuff (which is redundant dead weight for the vast majority of the owners) - the engine has to be further forward to fit in the gearbox and all the 4x4 drive train. They are heavier again due to the 4x4 gubbins. But if they're big enough for your needs then that's all that matters.

It's just a shame that in this day and age where cars really need to be getting smaller, lighter and more efficient the exact opposite seems to be happening - and in most cases its all to do with vanity, fashion and ego stroking (yes like most cars but just bigger and even more pointless). Still, I think we should enjoy them while we can. In 10 years or so cars will be banned and we'll be swanning around in driverless pods looking back on the days of self drive cars in the same way we look back on TV's before remote controls and outside toilets.

I'll probably pop along to the local pay'n'play and ask a few of these SUV drivers what they're like, I'm sure there'll be plenty of them there. 😛

My TV doesn't have an outside toilet.
I feel like I'm missing out now.
😐

MkI Kuga was based on the Focus Iirc. Not as long as a Mondeo and definitely no longer than my old 3 series tourer - fits in the drive even with all the damn wheelie bins

MkII Kuga may well be based on a Mondeo and I know it has a bigger boot than the MkI. Blander though

My TV doesn't have an outside toilet.

My car has TV for the back seats. No toilet, though.

You all have to sit in the back of the car to watch Happy Valley?

You lot are weird.

So, if I've got a TV in the outside toilet, am I posh?

My car has TV for the back seats.

So, if I've got a TV in the outside toilet, am I posh?

You have a TV in your hedge? That's not posh that's weird.

on our 2nd yeti so I'm a double twunt.
initially got one because wanted something different and they were getting great reviews, plus the fact the passat had got stuck on (or couldnt get up) the hill outside the motherinlaws 2 year on the trot.

Thanks to me getting a yeti we havent had any real snow in Manchester for 3 years now. 🙂

Anyway....nowt intimidating about a yetio, great little cars.

I can categorically state the kuga is based on a focus. mk1 and mk2. 100% ten foot of concrete guaranteed. The evoke is off the old mondeo platform.

Oh the engine is in the same place too.

Is a Yeti an SUV though, really? Is dissapointed. I always it more as Skoda's answer to the Peugeot Partner/Tipi/Doblo type things. They look a lot more sensibly proportioned than the Tiguan/Kuga/Mokka/q3/GLS type jelly mold samey thingies.

They do have small interiors relative to their external size - they have to be to fit in all the 4wd stuff (which is redundant dead weight for the vast majority of the owners) - the engine has to be further forward to fit in the gearbox and all the 4x4 drive train.

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I think this post has convinced me to go with nice 4x4 estate 😀

Iainc. - go for a scooby 🙂

The yeti isn't an SUV. Too subtle and sensible. Looks like postman pat's van really....

Perhaps Fiat had the right idea with the Multipla? 😉

So explain this, then...

The picture of the Fiat was taken in spring, whereas the one of the skoda was winter time.

All this chitter-chatter about SUVs makes me wonder why these aren't more popular.

I quite like it..

[img] [/img]

Am I the only one thinking this is a bit pointless...? Getting wound up by the type of car that someone else drives won't change a thing.

Live and let live is sometimes a good maxim.

Live and let live is [s]sometimes[/s] [b]always[/b] a good maxim

FTFY

Quite ironic that in the non predjudiced, liberal, do-good, holier than thou world of STW, people are described as insecure, self-important, selfish, vile human beings for driving their car of choice.

^^^^^ possibly, but the thread title and initial post is simply examining why they are so popular and what the benefits are over an estate car.

^^^^^ possibly, but the thread title and initial post is simply examining why they are so popular and what the benefits are over an estate car.

I've no problem with the threads intentions, just the following judgemental drivel

It's a willy thing. Can't see a 'supermini versus a small hatch' debate generating the same views 🙂

Live and let live is sometimes a good maxim.

Except when some people's choices adversely affect everyone else. Like, for instance, trying to park and drive something the size of a bus in a built-up area.

Of course, if we are being sensible, we'll forget SUVs and estate cars.

There is a solution which gives a high driving position, and can swallow a large family and all their bicycles. It's highly manoeuvrable, adequate speed and handling, and fits in a normal carpark.

Ford Transit Tourneo.

Being unsuccessfully trying to convince the missus it would better than a Volvo for years now. 🙂

But everyone's choices always affect everyone else, so I'm not really getting you here.

The same argument can be applied to driving an Mondeo estate (which is massive!) rather than a fiat panda.

Oh and a Mondeo is longer and wider than my Touareg - selfish bastards driving those massive cars....

more profit

Development costs for small car vs extended platform:

SUV, generally are modded small platforms, no real heavy-duty components] are much the same, however the selling price is hugely higher. The difference in profits is HUGE, with many supermini's making 1-5% profit only!

It's also an arms race, better visibility.....until every other car is equally huge and tall.

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It's funny how one person mentions looks over an estate car. I think the opposite, much prefer a an estate car aesthetically. SUV look like a 4x4 want to be, a pretender. That is the thing with aesthetics, very personal.

I generally prefer the look of a estate car over it's saloon version. And there is another thing - what the hell is the point of a saloon car these days? Just why would anyone buy a saloon - they must have taken leave of their senses. I'm so outraged i'm going to start another thread!

I think it's a perception thing. For a family or a person who needs to carry a bit of stuff then logically an estate car is the best choice. If you enjoy driving rather than just getting from A to B then there are many estate cars these days that are as fast as proper sports cars with handling to match.

SUV's by comparison are normally heavier, less fuel efficient, less practical, worse handling etc, etc. Often they are not real 4x4's, just styled to look like them. They're not sports cars but often have shouty extra fake exhausts etc. They block visibility on the road for anyone following them. So not really a good choice then - but then people seem to love them - go figure?

Guessing that the glitzy marketing and blingy accessories offered by SUV manufacturers kind of appeals to a certain kind of person. The higher up driving position creates a fake sense of safety and superiority. The people who buy them are probably generally the sort of people who don't enjoy driving for drivings sake, don't really know much about cars or driving, but the opportunity to cruise round in the latest crass bluetooth chariot (on lease or PCP of course) kind of appeals? Guessing it's probably the same type of person who follows fashion and who changes their iPhone to the latest model every 6 months.

Don't get it myself, give me a well sorted estate car any day.

For a family or a person who needs to carry a bit of stuff then logically an estate car is the best choice.

Yet so many manage with just a family hatch.

It's all about personal choice nothing more but people get sucked into thinking that they need bigger. I like an SUV but neve bought one as they're more expensive to run with no real benefit.

I think it's a perception thing.

Its a belonging thing. A form of conformity.

A friend of mine moved to the cirencester area a few years back, and he could be best described as a pinko commie compared to the locals. He now owns a range rover to take his offspring to school, got a gun licence for his shotguns, and I learned recently that his wife who does baking for dinner parties etc, that its is frowned upon to buy your pastry already made from a supermarket, you have to make it yourself.

I love the way people can "frown upon" certain things, when in reality they are being back stabbing bar stewards when you are not around. Middle england is full of snipers.

I wouldn't last five minutes there without extending my middle finger at everyone and everything.

Its about whatever class or social circle you want to belong to. Its about fitting in, its sameism and its a little bit shallow.

Yet so many manage with just a family hatch.

I've just carried 20 scaffold boards home in my Smart ForFour 😀

The few SUVs I've been in, I've been surprised at how cramped for space they are.

[quote=bencooper ]
I've just carried 20 scaffold boards home in my Smart ForFour

building site next door

[img] [/img]

hmmm

I've just carried 20 scaffold boards home in my Smart ForFour

I've just carried 20 scaffold boards home in my Smart ForFour

Is that the Skoda skip joke of the 80's brought up to date?

building site next door

😀

All legally bought from Glasgow Wood Recycling. And they're only 4ft ones, so all went inside the car, no problems.

[URL= http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o42/Citroenxsara/597ADA7B-B13E-44BE-A535-C7F817D62913.jp g" target="_blank">http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o42/Citroenxsara/597ADA7B-B13E-44BE-A535-C7F817D62913.jp g"/> [/IMG][/URL]

New reason discovered, so I can keep my fingers by not having to try and fold this lethal contraption, it goes in whole.

Ah, SUVs are for carrying SUV-buggies 😀

My sister in law bought an SUV because their buggy didn't fit in their car. Should've thought of that when you bought the buggy...

tail wags dog

Ah, SUVs are for carrying SUV-buggies

😆

Yeti owner here. Bought 6 months ago. Might have gone for something more practical I suppose, but seats come out, it swallows bikes, drives well, I like the high position, and I like the look of it (in black). Is all of this somehow "wrong"?

Mildly amusingly, in London I saw one behind a black cab. Not entirely different in look.

Someone I know bought a range rover sport because he had just totalled his Jag XK by aquaplaning over a huge puddle on the motorway at 80mph+ and bouncing both ends off the crash barrier.

"It's much safer, its' a 4x4" he said.

I didn't have the heart to tell him that it would have aquaplaned just as well as his Jag in the same situation but at approaching 3 tonnes it would just have made a bigger dent in the crash barrier.

'It's much better in the snow" he said.

I didn't have the heart to tell him he may well have better traction in the snow on summer tyres, but as soon as he braked in ice or snow it would just be a nearly 3 tonne brick and hit whatever it was going to harder.

Oh., and it hasn't snowed since he bought it

However he is happy, so I keep quiet

Like, for instance, trying to park and drive something the size of a bus in a built-up area.

Apparently the only people who think SUVs are large status symbols are the ones who hate them!

We have an SUV thing, Kia Sportage, as the wife's company car (she works for Kia). It's also Kia's best selling model. I love the driving position and genetally prefer driving them to Estates. Economy is worse than an estate, but we don't do enough personal miles to really care about that. Next company car will also be a Sportage, the 2016 model (new company car every 4 months).

Konabunny, have you looked at an Audi Q7 recently?

You may be correct about things like Q3, Yeti, BMW X1 but Range Rovers, said Q7, Volvo XC 90 etc, the ones that actually have 7 seats etc are very wide and it is the width as much as anything that causes space issues on our narrow roads. I have a large estate but it is 160 mm narrower than a range rover and 80mm narrower than an X3

"Most SUVs"

Apparently the only people who think SUVs are large status symbols are the ones who hate them!

[url= http://www.macanownersclub.co.uk/forum/white-diesel-collected_topic490_page1.html ]Yes clearly that must be the case ;)[/url]

Ah, SUVs are for carrying SUV-buggies

And my offspring which are more important than anyone else's so need more space.

You're getting it now.

I like them personally. Makes it much easier to spot the fannies on the road

Wife just got a Peugeot 3008, her choice, she's happy so i'm happy.

Personally, i lean towards fast estates, Octavia VRS, S4 that kind of thing. I think now if you want to stand out, don't buy an SUV

If someone made a big estate that was as wide as an sub across the back they would sell loads. I was looking for a big 4x4 estate and was really struggling to find something that will swallow 3 child's seats across the back row. I don't like Audi or bmw (nor can I afford one), Subaru levorgand outback is too narrow, Honda don't make the accord anymore (not 4x4 I know), Skoda suburb is OK loads of legroom but not very wide. I can't stand people carrier type things, so I ended up leasing a. 7 seat X trail. I don't like it, but if meets my needs for the next couple of years until the eldest is out of his car seat and I can go back to normal estates.

In summary I blame car seats.

It's simple, they are way easier to load stuff in & out of..

After years of driving low slung estate cars I switched to an SUV about 5 years ago - probably never go back to a normal car, they are so much easier to use.

I don't get that hate, perhaps its just inverse snobbery & jealousy...

Yep, ease of use ain't it. We got our kuga when my lad was a couple of months old. We tested plenty of cars and picked the one that was easy to lug the child seat/cot in and out of. Decent boot with a flat floor and no lip, my wife feels safe in it and likes the raised seating, it's very comfortable on long journeys and being 4x4 is great in the snow which is helpful as the council can't be bothered gritting as far as our house. Not a great load of fun to drive but certainly not bad. Neutral would be a good description.

I fancy an estate when we change but it'll have to go some to be as practical.

I have a 3 series [s]estate[/s] touring, and my wife has a Freelander. The Freelander is bit more serious and capable than your average 'Softroader' but its not a million miles different. Whilst I love the 3 series and would always choose an estate over an SUV personally, the Freelander is a different beast and I can see why people like them. It feels different to drive, the driving position is more upright, it's easier to get in and out. I like it 🙂

So whilst I personally agree with the OP, I can understand why some people have a different opinion.

Marketing. Create a new car category and market it heavily until everyone realises they need it. Now you have created the new normal.

If you take a step back, it makes no sense to create bigger, heavier, less efficient cars for the modern UK urban environment (I know a few people have a pressing need to plough through snow drifts and drive across muddy fields in the country, but most of us simply don't need to do that).

Less efficient? CO2 emissions on Ben's Smart Forfour are 16% to 45% higher than those on the 1.5l diesel Renault Kadjar, a classic ****y softroader suv.

I've literally never seen or heard of one of those Renaults. Guessing you cherry-picked it as a particularly fuel-efficient example. Bulkier, heavier vehicles are in general less fuel-efficient - amazingly. SUVs tend to be bulkier and heavier than non-SUVs.

Never mind the fact that roads/parking spaces etc in most bits of the U.K. Just aren't big enough to accommodate them well.

Car choice is more about status and desired image than most things we buy. SUVs and the like are British-Keeping-Up-With-The-Jones on stilts...

When they first came through in the 90's there was a lot of resistance as on crowded and narrow UK roads and car parks they were clearly excessive and anti-social from their sheer size and physical presence. The dislike of them isn't jealousy or anything new - it's a pretty reasonable assessment IMO given the detrimental impact they have on the community, and at a time when we're poisoning our air (9,000 early deaths from pollution in London each year from traffic) and generally killing the planet... they're a pretty good sign that you don't think much about the impact of your behaviour on other people...

I'd like to see a study about the psychological effect of isolating yourself from the outside world in such a well-protected vehicle and the impact on empathy and concern for others... their sheer size makes it much easier to feel detached, invincible and likely to bring out the bully in most people

It's hard to think you're superior to everyone else in a Renault Twingo!

I'd like to see a study about the psychological effect of isolating yourself from the outside world in such a well-protected vehicle and the impact on empathy and concern for others... their sheer size makes it much easier to feel detached, invincible and likely to bring out the bully in most people

I'd say that there is some truth to this yes. More frequently than coincidental on road rides round here then the people we have trouble with are driving some form of flashy SUV or 4x4. Often it's as simple as an inappropriately close pass, on a couple of occasions it's been abuse hurled and deliberate blocking of the road, intimidation from behind or a cutting up.

That's not to say we're perfect cyclists - we're not. I'd like to think that the close passing is just a size thing, the fact that SUV's are generally wider/higher than some other cars. Sadly I thing it's more down to the type of people who drive these things who seem to fall into one of two camps:

It's either the 'look at me' and full of self importance and status brigade. Funnily enough these are usually not people of high status but often school mums competing to get one over on each other or frustrated short, small, older men with an angry temper. Or it's the people who are just bad drivers, they feel unsafe so they buy a big SUV because it makes them feel more protected on the busy road.

The practicality excuse is bobbins. Most family hatchbacks have more room inside than your average 'fashion' SUV. We brought our kid up during her early years in a 3 door VW Lupo. No problem getting her in and out of the car even with no rear doors and I'm so glad we didn't waste £30k on an SUV just to make this task a little easier!

I've literally never seen or heard of one of those Renaults. Guessing you cherry-picked it as a particularly fuel-efficient example.

The Kadjar is an X trail underneath, same engines and transmissions.

Being tall, I find it easier to put the kids in their seats in an SUV rather than bending down to put them into an estate type car. I like being higher up. I don't think it handles badly, it accelerates and does the speeds allowed on the roads I drive on. It's easy to load stuff into the boot (again, I don't need to bend down too much). Works for me.

Off roaders notwithstanding, for most uses an estate would be fine, of more likely a hatchback would work just as well. Either of which would be more economical. Choosing an SUV shows that you really couldn't care less about the world's problems, and you think slight convenience for you is more important.

^^^ hahahah this guy

Having owned and driven both SUV and estates, I prefer the lower sill of the estate for loading and unloading heavier stuff. Primary requisite being the boot floor is level with the sill.

There are of course other ways to say it...