You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
He's 12.
Goldfinger - "no Mister Bond, I expect you to die" but very dated.
The Spy Who Loved Me - The second best car and Roger's family humour, also dated.
For Your Eyes Only - The first Bond I saw at the cinema so a personal favourite, the 80s, Dated
Dalton was a good Bond but the scripts kind of let things down.
Goldeneye - has the Aceribo telescope and Sean Bean in it, still not this century
Tomorrow Never Dies - I seem to remember this being quite good
Skyfall - Good film but you can't start off with M dying.
Spectre - Haven't seen it but at least it's current.
Dr No and then all of the others in order
Casino royale? First Daniel Craig film and I reckon he’s the best bond
Casino royale? First Daniel Craig film and I reckon he’s the best bond
This ^^. Start with the "reboot".
Most of the Connery films are terribly dated, the CGI is woeful and the attitude incredibly sexist. The scripts in the Craig era were very inconsistent but most of the tech and social attitudes are current.
Do one of each actor in chronological order But choose the best film by each bond.
So
From Russia with love
Ohmmss
Live and let die
Living daylights
Goldeneye
Casino royale
Goldeneye, then dig out the N64 and play the game for a few months before watching another Bond film.
The Craig-era films are easily the best, but if you start on them he'll never make it through any of the old ones. For me Connery films are better than Moore films and both are better than any of the other Bonds, with George Lazenby being the best of the rest.
Casino royale? First Daniel Craig film and I reckon he’s the best bond
Was going to be my answer too.
Still watches as a quality film to a modern eye. The earlier stuff is either dated (and often sexist) or so kitch now it's only really any good in a sentimental nostalgia watch kind of way.
Live and Let Die for me.
1973, and it shows, but it is an entertaining film, without too much violence.
The earlier stuff is either dated (and often sexist) or so kitch
Start with Casino Royale - the Peter Sellers version, then the Bond films chronologically. That way the Bond films will not seem dated or kitch.
Connery era wasn’t just sexist, but some of the ‘force yourself on a women, they really like it’ I find un watchable.
Casino Royale reboot and then do the new ones through to Spectre.
Mine have also seen the Dalton ones.
I'm mid 40s so grew up in the Moore era. It took me years to appreciate the older Connery films. I'd assume modern kids might be the same - they are used to more recent cinema style and special effects so that will appeal more.
And let's be honest some of the early staff now looks a tad misogynistic and a few were not very racially balanced (the "foreigners" and racial minorities were often not kindly scripted and with ghastly stereotypes). I struggle on some (not all) of them to look past that these days.
Goldfinger - Killer bowler hats and lasers.
Thunderball - Sharks and the best battle of the divers.
You Only Live Twice - Little Nellie and best fake volcano battle.
Then just go straight to the Craig ones 🙂
Live and let die
Happy to see I’m not the only one. Bond was part of every Christmas, from when I was a kid to watching it hungover with my dad on Boxing Day afternoon.
Those early installments are now utterly unwatchable thanks to the rapiness of the protagonist and the casual racism, it’s a tradition that’ll not be handed down to my son. No disrespect to the original writers of course, it just belongs in the sea with plenty other stuff of the era.
Personally, I think anything non-Craig might be a bit hard for a 12yr old to appreciate being "of its time" just yet...
Casino Royale is widely regarded as the best modern Bond film, it's a pretty good film in its own right and doesn't require you to have watched any other Bond films to enjoy it. I'd start there. If he likes it, then superb... You can show him Quantum of Solace which obviously has a natural follow on, Skyfall and then Spectre. By the time he's watched these, he'll either be mega keen to watch some of the older films, or he just won't get it!
I'd say that showing a 12yr old Doctor No is probably going to leave him a little cold if he doesn't already have a hunger for the Bond franchise! As for working forward from there... He'll need to be REALLY switched onto it already for that to happen! I'd say that it would be much more difficult for a 12yr old now to get the "of their time" ness of the Connery-Moore era Bonds (and the cheesiness of Piers Brosnan too!) would take a lot more cultural awareness than he might be prepared for. My sister was the biggest Bond fan in the world by the time she was 13, but she's 37 now and has a degree in History from Oxford Universtiy, she is acutely aware just how much context most of the earlier films require to be able to enjoy them!
Moonraker or Live and Let Die. Moonraker has some amazing sets.
My 15yr old bond aficionado (reads the books and has all the movies) for some reason rates Timothy Daltons films. I
Alan knows
rewatching them in chronological order.
Got to the start of diamonds are forever this evening before feeling overdosed after finishing you only live twice and on her majesty’s secret service earlier.
So far on her majesty’s secret service (Lazenby & Rigg) is the best one.
Dr No and from Russia with love were very constrained and surprisingly weak compared to how I remembered them.
edit. I’ll be skipping quantum of solace as it is dreadful.
Craig era in order, maybe the Dalton films as well (almost current, non sexist and getting into good explosions and sfx).
As much as I watch all the others when they are on the box, I wouldn't use them as a yardstick for classic cinema.
If you really want your lad to watch that stuff, I'd crak out Austin Powers films instead, at least its tongue in cheek enough to still be funny now!
Golden Eye.
Casino Royale is a great film but I reckon a complicated plot for both a kid and a first Bond film.
Golden Eye is very self explanatory, even if Brosnan is sleazy.
My 15yr old bond aficionado (reads the books and has all the movies) for some reason rates Timothy Daltons films
He's the closest to the Bond that Fleming created.
He’s the closest to the Bond that Fleming created.
I'm not sure that's a complement. Have you read any of them in the last 20 years? I did and it came as a bit of a surprise. Thin (physically and conceptually), sexist and pretty massively racist. I think I might have been able to excuse the 'old fashioned' racist language (can't remember which one but he described one of Bond's soon to be triumphs as a 'smouldering negress') but the attitude throughout was pretty shocking, especially as they were only written in the late 50's/early 60's.
The further they can move both Bond and the films from Fleming the better imo.
but the attitude throughout was pretty shocking, especially as they were only written in the late 50’s/early 60’s.
50s and 60s I'd not be shocked at all given the standards of the day, look at the state of the 70s/80s and casual racism in society, mainstream TV and "comedy" even then. We've a way to go yet.
The older films are not without their stronger female characters but they are certainly not the majority.
As an adult I still find the Connery-era stuff pretty watchable, but in context. Is said 12 year old mature enough to realise that some of the attitudes are a bit... of their time?
The Moore era seems a bit ott and camp now, though I enjoyed them when I was that kind of age so who knows.
So far on her majesty’s secret service (Lazenby & Rigg) is the best one.
Agreed
Did those worrying that casual sexism etc in the films might corrupt a young person find it had that effect on themselves?
I’d say it was online pornography you want to worry about there.
Ultimately, whether or not your son enjoys the early films depends on his specific personality and on prior exposure to more modern all-action films.
My son watched very little telly at all after Postman Pat and then devoured all the Bond films at 12 or 13, but doesn’t rate Bourne.
You can’t go wrong with the Moore era I would say, especially Live and Let Die, because there are some truly funny scenes (double decker bus) and characters (sheriff) and amazing stunts (speedboat chase) that kids love.
And the stunts were real.
The further they can move both Bond and the films from Fleming the better imo.
In which case why bother calling him Bond if you've completely altered the character?
I absolutely loved the books and wrote my dissertation on Bond. I haven't however read them again in 20 odd years so I wonder what I'd think this time around.
I'd start on Goldeneye and see what happens. No particular era is perfect, Skyfall was as bad as any Moore excess or even that Brosnan CGI scene.
I’d say that showing a 12yr old Doctor No is probably going to leave him a little cold
Oh, I'm not so sure....
Trouble is if you avoid 'problematic bond' you're missing out on John Barry era scoring. Like this incredible piece of music:
And even mid period bond has issues didn't Dalton get chummy with the Mujahedeen/Taliban in the living daylights? 🙂
50s and 60s I’d not be shocked at all given the standards of the day, look at the state of the 70s/80s and casual racism in society, mainstream TV and “comedy” even then. We’ve a way to go yet.
I guess it depends what you use as your frame of reference. If you look to low brow 'popular culture' on TV of that era you have a point. However that's setting your bar pretty low; if you read some Len Deighton who started writing his books just 3 years after Fleming the attitudes (and sophistication of the writing too - but that's a separate debate) are in totally different leagues.
In which case why bother calling him Bond if you’ve completely altered the character?
I'd argue Bond, the film star, has moved on from the Fleming books to the extent they have a life of their own.
Did those worrying that casual sexism etc in the films might corrupt a young person find it had that effect on themselves?
I’d say it was online pornography you want to worry about there.
I'd say we are children of our times yes. My generation (late 40s) left our childhoods with attitudes that have needed reseting. Consciously or subconsciously. I don't think we need a repeat loop for the next generation too if we can help it.
The porn thing is a complete red herring too. Unless the dad sits his son down to some grot together and points out all the good stuff porn watching is covert and a non approved activity. Watching an old Bond film that you have recommended unconditionally sort of implies (to an unsophisticated 12 year old mind) that you are good with everything going on too. You re putting it and the attitudes within on the approved list with your recommendation.
But realistically neither of these might happen - with luck said 12yr old is sufficiently mature that when he sits down to watch these films dad has banged on and on about the worst that'll happen is he'll question your taste/sanity!
Did those worrying that casual sexism etc in the films might corrupt a young person find it had that effect on themselves?
Do you actually think like this, or are you trying to cultivate your online image in a troll-like direction?
Dr No is a terrible film. The script is bad, the sexism, the racism (the English actors in eye make-up pretending to be Chinese for example) I did write "the plot" as well, but this is Bond, they're all pretty unbelievable really...Having saud that The later Moore ones are camp enough to be "charming" and from Dalton on-wards they're OK-ish films...
The thing I find really variable is the source material, some of them are really really bad; the depiction of the black gangsters in Live and Let Die is just flat our racist (and despite chrispo's comments above, was called out for it at the time) but in most of the books; the "love interests" are actual people, rather than the T&A depictions of the movies, and both rescue Bond and he's often not the emotionless womaniser he's depicted as, and while none of them are literature, I'd say From Russia with Love and Moonraker* ares still worthy of a read hands down the best two. The others are probably bin-worthy.
*Weirdly the actual plot of Moonraker (set in the UK with Bond on a military base for a lot of it) would actually make a pretty good movie.
I'd wager that a good percentage of the hand wringing anti-misogynists in all walks of life watch as much porn as the next man
didn’t Dalton get chummy with the Mujahedeen/Taliban in the living daylights? 🙂
One of the Rambo films was dedicated to those plucky freedom fighters too.
Alliances change. Might be overly complex bit of background reading for a 12yearold though.
Watch the brosnan ones in order. The tech is still futurey enough to not be a complete joke, it’s not quite as rapey.
You have to admire the woke attitudes of today.
If it means we no longer need to put up with outdated casual racism and sexism then yes, you do.
Poor attempt at a troll.
Oh, and OP - for a kid just stick to the DC films I reckon.
If he’s 12 he’ll still appreciate Home Alone so I’d go with that one, Skyfall?
Don’t pussy around as if there is a member’s consensus. Just put him straight on the hard stuff:
*edit gah bindun
didn’t Dalton get chummy with the Mujahedeen/Taliban in the living daylights?
Who didn’t?
There is a chap did a 15 minute YouTube video explaining how, if you accept that all Bonds are the same individual, they can all fit in a logical storyline.
I love an old bond movie, but I have to agree it's a bit out of date nowadays. Likewise indiana jones and the temple of doom. I loved that film back in the day, but some of the attitudes on display are a bit dated.
Still enjoy it though.
For a kid id start with the dc movies, then maybe after that the Dalton ones. Connery films are a bit too dated to be enjoyable for a kid I reckon, Moore similar but still preferable over brosman efforts.
My suggestion - Man with the Golden Gun, obviously. Corkscrew car stunt, Island lair and extra nipples. Generally silly and fun.
Or the greatest Bond opening ever!
finished The Man With The Golden Gun yesterday. Might get to The Spy Who Loved Me today. I’m tending to side with folks who suggest ignoring Bond altogether or go for more recent ones.
So far these have not been even good cinema and I’m now fairly glad that my children refused to sit and watch any of the old ones when they were younger: ‘it looks old and boring’. I should’ve listened. So many better movies out there. Still, ploughing on through the rest.
Those early installments are now utterly unwatchable thanks to the rapiness of the protagonist and the casual racism, it’s a tradition that’ll not be handed down to my son. No disrespect to the original writers of course, it just belongs in the sea with plenty other stuff of the era.
Can’t disagree.
I’m tending to side with folks who suggest ignoring Bond altogether
Internet high five for you sir. Other than good stunts, jaws and bowler hat man the old ones are rubbish and haven’t aged well at all. I never really understood the appeal of the character if I’m being honest and he’s a really shitty spy. Skyfall and Casino Royale are pretty good though
Got to start at the beginning with Dr No then in chronological order, its the only way
didn’t Dalton get chummy with the Mujahedeen/Taliban in the living daylights?
The CIA spent decades funding them when they were fighting the Russians. I think it's important to understand that today's enemy was probably yesterday's friend etc and the world isn't simple black and white, but just endless shades of grey, which change over the years.
Same with the racism / sexism, it's as important to realise / know how bad it was / where we've come from as it is to understand what is considered acceptable today (which probably won't be acceptable in 10 years time).