[Closed] Where's decent to live in London?

While I'm only a reasonably regular visitor to London Village, I've been out to Greenwich a number of times, and if I had to chose an area to live, it would be there. Very much like a small village on the outskirts of London, lots of green, open spaces, and easy access back to the city proper. Plus it's got the Cutty Sark!
A friend of mine lives at London Bridge, in the shadow of the Shard, and that's a nice little area, with Southwark Cathedral, and a fantastic market, along with some fine pubs. She loves it there. I'd still choose Greenwich, myself; I love it's quiet unhurried feel.
A view from Greenwich:

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A Greenwich attraction:

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Budget?

what do you want from a place to live?

Quiet? Buzzy? Leafy? Easy links within London, or easy to get out of London?

Greenwich is my favourite place in London too and I think I would love to live there. Also depending on where you work, commuting by river could be an option which I like the novelty of.

With this being a mountain biking forum though, I can't help but think you'd be better living somewhere further South for biking purposes. For mountain biking from London you have 2 main options: Surrey Hills in the South, or Swinley Forest in the West. I'm in Wimbledon in the South West which makes both a relatively easy option, and for out-the-back-door riding; Richmond park will at least provide some access to greenery and a bit of mud.

All depends on your work/life balance really, and after that how much of your "life" portion you want to be taken up by mountain biking. If I worked in Central London rather than Surrey, I'd probably be looking at Greenwich too.

Greenwich is nice but pricey. Away from Greenwich its self there are some very cheap areas in the borough but most shit holes (I can say that because I lived in them). Brockley (Lewisham borough I think) is cheaper and close to Greenwich but not a shit hole and still has some worth while pubs and ok transport links and still very close to Greenwich. Very close to cycle to central London too.

It depends entirely on what you want from London

Cheers for the advice so far - definitely sounds like the Greenwich/Lewisham area fits the bill. I've used the river bus service to Greenwich a few times in the past and that does appeal to me as an occasional option - it reminds me of my commute when I lived in Hong Kong!

Ah - should have mentioned budget. Initially I think I'm just going to buy something small, maybe even a studio flat, that will eventually be a buy-to-let so up to £250K for that.

Main place - maybe £500-700K. It'll just be the missus and me so probably looking for an apartment - 2 bedroom as a minimum. We'd like to be close enough into London that it's easy to get into the centre for nights out etc. I'd also like to be able to get out of London reasonably easily for weekends etc, and the east side appeals as it's closer to the Channel Tunnel. I suspect during the week I'll be doing more roadie cycling than mountain biking but it'd definitely be good to find somewhere to get muddy at the weekend!

Greenwich, Blackheath, Beckenham, Bromley, Dulwich... these are the fancy/nice places. All are commutable by the bike... takes me 35 or 40 mins from Beckenham to Tower Bridge

Shad Thames is close-ish (walking distance to London Bridge), reasonable area, quite well-connected.
Canary Wharf is kinda obvious, but there are some relatively nice places there of newish low-rises that aren't too pikey.
Beyond that, consider Clapham (bit overpriced, but then where isn't in London...), Earlsfield, East Dulwich and so on. They're a bit further out, which has advantages (less busy, easier to get out to the countryside) and disadvantages (getting the train into work, or cycling)

If you want easy access out from the S.E head to Mazz hill. Just east of Greenwich, close enough to walk and very easy access to the start of the A2 via the A102. You will be the "right" side of the traffic bottle neck to enter and leave London on the weekend which can make all the difference. A little bit longer to head into central but still a very easy cycle or train. Taxi should not be too bad late at night.

Clapham is overpriced, Balham is nice though. Full of nice pubs and eateries, great fish and chip shop too.

Also look at Blackheath, nice are and good A2 access to get out again for w/e. Consider how important leaving London on a w/e is to you as being one side or the other of the town centre can make a big difference as to ease or getting in and out.

West london along the river Chiswick Richmond Kew etc.. area, M4 to go out, riverbus or Thames towpath to go in.

I'd be a bit careful regarding Greenwich as there are a large amount of new housing developments going on and many more planned. This increase in housing isn't being matched an improvement in transport infrastructure and the area is already jammed morning and evening. IMO.

The river bus is bloody expensive.

Barcelona.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/10/24/london-housing-cheaper-live-barcelona-commute_n_4156587.html
London's crazy expensive and it sucks.

Are you a Russian oligarch?if not then I'd stay where you are. London would be a massive hilarious joke if only it wasn't going to end up bankrupting the entire country with its monumental stupidity. Hey ho.

There's no room for bitterness in London binners. 😉

Having worked very near London Bridge and lived in a fair few places across London I would offer the following advice.

- Clapham (South - Zone 2) - Lived here for a few years.

Very nice with a bit of greenery and somewhat village like - exceptionally dull social scene however and the worst most frustrating transport infrastructure I have ever experienced. Commuting daily from Clapham Common/North to the city was like navigating my way through the seven circles of hell on a daily basis! I left primarily because of the nightmare Northern and Victoria lines. Can be quite expensive also and any further out; Balham, Tooting etc gets a bit shitty quickly frankly and adds significant journey time to your commute etc.

- Algate (East - Zone 1) - Lived here for a while also.

Was in the centre of the city (CBD really) and it was quite lively but brilliant if you have an active social life. Excellent for work - less than 10 mins walking to London Bridge. Downside was no greenery obviously. Overall fun but can be expensive and you need to like city-centre living.

- Angel (North - Zone 1) - Aiming to move back here in the next few months myself.

Can be quite expensive but is probably my favourite area of London. Good social scene, bit of greenery, excellent services and you tend not to need to travel too far to go out when you live here as it has an excellent selection of bars, pubs, restaurants and shops etc. You are still on the Northern Line but heading south ergo transport is a lot better. Honestly I really loved this area; have a visit and you will see it has an awesome vibe about it.

- Canary Wharf/Docklands/Canada Water etc - Know the area well.

This would be an obvious choice as it would convienient for the job and there are some very nice flats etc about however I had quite a few friends based here and the place can be quite soulless at the weekend when it becomes a ghost town. Honestly it was just very dull and uninteresting with quite a lot of pikey shitholes only a tube stop or so away. Social scene is somewhat dire here IMO. As for Greenwich it is very nice but like Clapham is too far out if you want to easily avail yourself of any of the social activities in the city. Greenwich can be quite pikey in many areas to be fair also.

Frankly I would tend to recommend North London above most other areas and will never again live south of the river as it tends to be a bit shit or simply just a nightmare to get to anywhere else in london.

NB: For your budget and flat hunting you may want to look at areas around Mile End and the like in east london as it is a very good rental spot and on budget. Good luck!

Main place - maybe £500-700K. It'll just be the missus and me so probably looking for an apartment - 2 bedroom as a minimum.

London really is a different world innit. 😕

You could buy a proper country mansion with land for that round here. FWIW I was in Greenwich recently and it seemed quite nice (for London).

[i]There's no room for bitterness in London binners.[/i]

Which is odd because every time I go there everyone looks monumentally pissed off.

As a regular visitor though, Greenwich seems nice enough and Blackheath (I think), you know, for London. If you've lived in Edinburgh though you'll feel trapped and restricted and will flap your pretty wings ineffectually against the brick and steel walls of your prison until you die of loneliness on the steps of your flat in Hackney with cardboard biscuits still in your mouth.

This is the fate of all London dwellers.

Which is odd because every time I go there everyone looks monumentally pissed off.

I told them you were coming.

Trains from Greenwich aren't very good, much better from Blackheath.
I'd almost suggest somewhere around New Cross - at the top of the hill. It's less than 10 minutes by bike from Greenwich or London Bridge. It has lots of transport links. There's Goldsmiths. There's pie and mash. It might be more urban than you're after though.

If you want road cycling then somewhere on the overground/underground line for getting into the city and to not be too far from crystal palace, it's where a lot of the road rides leave from as there's an area of green that extends inside the m25 and some good roads/countryside.
Although anywhere in an arc from Greenwich round to Wimbledon would do (apart from the crime/filth/estate bits) would probably suit.

Me I would go fro dulwich/herne hill way

Personally I'd take Blackheath any day over Greenwich.
I know both places pretty well, and Blackheath is nicer in everyway, however it is only short walk down the hill into Greenwich, so I reckon you'd get the best of both worlds.

Blackheath Station is 2/3 stops from London Bridge.

I live in Orpington, which is another 15 mins out of London on the train, however if I worked in London i'd probably move a bit further in.

As for biking - on the road either head toward Crystal palace and out, or out through Bromley into Sevenoaks/North kent.
For MTB, there is a tiny bit of Urban MTB around Oxleas woods, or head out toward Biggin hill/Sevenoaks and fill your boots.

[i]I told them you were coming. [/i]

you'd think they'd be a lot more chipper then, what with my upbeat and positive personality.

I can't comment on Greenwich as a place to live but I have visited a few times & it is nice. The commuter boat is good but expensive.

Re pricing London really is a series of local housing markets. I have investment properties in Kingston (always in demand due to access to London, university, shops & hospital) & prices in the last year have probably risen 10%, maybe a bit more. A decent central 1 bed flat is now 250k, 2 bedder 300k.

House prices continually defy gravity as there really is no other investment which performs in the same way for so little risk. Over the last 10 years they have probably doubled in price whilst currently yielding 5%.

Good luck in the search, you should find something nice with that sort of budget.

OP - tremendously hard question to answer.

I would start with your workplace and look at the various commute options and how far you are prepared to travel and/or whether you would ride to work.
Then I would look at where you want to get to at weekends, for visiting family, for riding and leisure etc. Access to airport for holidays etc
Then the big question if price and what you can afford and how much space you want.
Also the thorny issue of parking, whether you want/need off street parking (and secure or not)

You need to start looking around yourself and weighing up the various issues really. Basically it's all a compromise, I always chose to live out in Guildford and have a 75 min commute. This makes sense f you have kids but its mad for two people to commute into London every day.

My daughter lives in Greenwich which is nice, ditto Blackheath.

At the moment I'm thinking Greenwich as I like it from visits as a tourist and it's under 10 minutes on the train from there to London Bridge. What other areas should I be considering?

Anywhere else! Greenwich is one of the most expensive places in Britain for property. Beacuse it's a lovely area, and very convenient for Canary Wharf and central London.

Ah - should have mentioned budget. Initially I think I'm just going to buy something small, maybe even a studio flat, that will eventually be a buy-to-let so up to £250K for that.

For that amount, you'll be looking at the bottom end of the market, near enough. You might get a fairly decent small ex-local authority flat for that, or else it's shitty 1-bed townhouse conversions. I can't believe such properties will continue to hold much value, even in Greenwich. A friend took over a year to sell his nice refurbished Georgian flat in Blackheath (garden, nice area, good schools etc) because no-one wanted to pay the asking price. He ended up with bugger all real return for it.

Main place - maybe £500-700K. It'll just be the missus and me so probably looking for an apartment - 2 bedroom as a minimum.

That might get you a fairly nice 'warehouse conversion' type place, or a hideously expensive new build. You might get a nice view. What you won't get, will be much living space, a garden, or any real 'character'. And you're still only looking at flats, not houses!

Are you a Russian oligarch?

He's got a point there. Greenwich is super expensive for anything 'nice'. It's insane. If you're prepared to lower your sights, and aren't snobbish, there's far better value for money in Deptford, Woolwich and New Cross, although you might have to live amongst the plebs. 😉

I'd put a bit more thought and research into it if I were you. Far better value for money to be had elsewhere in London. You might have to commute a bit further, but you won't have to live in a shoebox.

My office is in More London by City Hall; there's a (one) direct train from Guildford via Leatherhead where I am in the morning and evening, if miss that the have to go get the train to Waterloo East and then to home which isn't that bad. So this way I live outside London close to great riding, have a better house for my money and just have to put up with the commute and cost - £3k/year maybe.

If too long commute Epsom would be a great compromise.

That money would buy you a very nice house outside London, why not commute in? You could live outside with loads of biking and rural surroundings, and still only be 25/30 minutes from work via a fast train. You'd have a bigger house, London close at hand and rural relaxation on tap.

Just a thought.

South of the river...never

NORTH London is so much nicer and has far less oinks !

I'm in the deep greeny suburbs of North London prob a bit far to travel...but so much a nicer place

1 - Shoebox in a lovely part of central London, and short commute by bike
2 - Larger box in OKish part of outer London, and a longer commute by bike
3 - Big old house village house with a garden, space etc, commute by Brompton and train

I'd always plump for either 1 or 3, myself. Once you get towards 'outer' London, you may as well get properly 'out' of London. Commute times/costs are essentially the same!

NORTH London is so much nicer and has far less oinks !

While I fully agree with you that one must be North of the Moat, one should also ensure that one is not North of the Parks. Anywhere North of Marble Arch is basically bandit country. 🙂

IMO widen your search. I'd live within zone two circumference and rent somewhere first on a 6month contract.

I lived in NW London- West Hampstead and loved many areas north of the river. South of the river has its charms too and you have a mostly excellent tube system.

Enjoy 😀

Although If I was moving down from Edinburgh I'd probably leave a part of my heart behind.

I passed this not long ago and thought it looked good value for money. It's within budget.

[url= http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-27174675.html ]Linky[/url]

Falls slightly outside of your desired area though 🙁

NORTH London is so much nicer and has far less oinks !

While I fully agree with you that one must be North of the Moat, one should also ensure that one is not North of the Parks. Anywhere North of Marble Arch is basically bandit country.

Bandit country...oh dear I think you'll find the gentry has moved out and not in...perhaps you should start reading Ham & High ! Obviously a common oink I speak of...

Is this bandit country money

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-40963985.html

I'd only ever live either Kingston, Esher or Surbiton way, or outside M25. The wife has brought this up recently as she is thinking about being close to her family who live SE London and beckenham/Bromley. I hate most of it, and having two young girls the schools worry me looking at the kids who populate them and by and large aren't from that area. Can't afford private school so that's where the discussion stopped.

Bandit country...oh dear I think you'll find the gentry has moved out and not in...perhaps you should start reading Ham & High ! Obviously a common oink I speak of...

Is this bandit country money

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-40963985.html

Lol, define bandit?
They all have security 24/7, & I'm not sure who the people who buy on that avenue would consider the bandits within their own country of origin, oil is quite a dirty business 😉

All depends on your work/life balance really, and after that how much of your "life" portion you want to be taken up by

If I was just coming to London for a couple of years I think I'd probably try to live as close to the centre as possible. You could do something like this - http://www.themodernhouse.net/sales-list/barbican-london-ec2y/description-817/

Greenwich is nice enough but the reason you've seen it on tourist trips is partly because it's full of tourists.

If you're planning on leaving London much (esp if by car) the area makes a big difference. North London suburbs are, unsurprisingly, great if you're heading North but not a lot of help for riding in Surrey (and vice versa). That said, train from London Bridge will take you out to Dorking.

@unfitgeezer - a 1-bed for £850 ! for £750 you can get a nice 2 bed with underground parking in Clerkenwell.

@unfitgeezer - a 1-bed for £850 ! for £750 you can get a nice 2 bed with underground parking in Clerkenwell.

£850 where ?

Lol, define bandit?

Not my words ask CaptainFlashheart his words 😉

oohf. I'd not looked at the floor plan - assumed that had a few bedrooms. Would be a great place to live though.

£850,000 for a tiny 1-bed flat? 😯

You could get a 4/5-bed townhouse with garden in somewhere like Crouch End for that money. And even that's insanely expensive.

Is this bandit country money

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-40963985.html

Nice little London pied-a-terre, that. 😆

Difficult one. IMO it is a bit of a fallacy to think there is a good option for London living - if you have to travel into London to work, you either pay through the teeth for centrally located property, or suffer a long and expensive commute. Have done both, not sure which one is really the best option, but if I were only in London for a short time I would be tempted to stay in the centre, if I had the cash (which I don't).

Have lived in Docklands (Canada Water/Surrey Quays). Easy access to London, but soulless and next to some pikey areas. At least Grennwich has some charm, the river and a few good pubs. Blackheath also on the list of nicer spots in East London.

I now live miles out (Haslemere) and the price of our 3 bed home would not even get us a two bed flat in London, even in the semi-crap areas. Commute does take 1hr 30 to 1 hr 45, depending where you are headed. I am lucky that I only go into London infrequently, where as when my mrs goes back to work, she will need to do that 3 days a week.

I liked Edinburgh when I visited, thought it had a nice atmosphere compared to London and lots of greenery you can actually see. Was thinking about moving to Bristol area, but my wife can't get an easy move with her job and we both need to work. Maybe go 'trendy', grow a beard and live in Shoreditch?

Thanks for the advice folks - plenty to think about there. I'm not intending to abandon Edinburgh completely as I'm going to keep a flat here. For London I really don't want to do the hour+ commute thing - I'd reckon if I did the last thing I'd then want to do is come into London at the weekends, and I'd really like to makee use of what's there.

The commute thing is key really -

Zone 1, property expensive/small - walk to work. Minimal commute times.

Zone 2/3, can have living style ranging from gritty and urban (Brixton? East End?) to distinctly leafy and suburban (Dulwich? Blackheath?) to soulless new town (Docklands). Commute of 30-60 minutes by bike or public transport

Zone 4+ out to commuter belt - more space, easy access to country, commute of 45-90 minutes or more.

Middle one works for me - I ride a bike almost every day and rarely use public transport. Getting out of town takes time but I'm only doing it once a week. Having hills on my doorstep but spending c15 hours + each week on commuter trains really doesn't appeal.

Thanks for all the advice. I've decided to rent for the first 6-months or so until I get a better feel for the options. We're headed down to take a look at some places next weekend, focusing on two main areas - Blackheath and nearer the office at St. Katherines Dock.

West gets you out to Surrey easily at weekends.

Hardest part is snapping up a place before someone on the phone to a housing agent, who hasn't even seen the property gets in before you.

If you can cope with a 40 mins commute you could live in Berhamstead, which is a great town and has a thriving MTB club.

How about north of the river..........About 200 miles north! Nice people, value for money, not London basically.