[Closed] What's it like being a secondary school teacher in 2016?

Rewarding, but bloody hard work. Lots of people will moan about it, but at the end of the day, you will not get another job like it. It sounds a cliche, but you do it for the kids. They are bloody brilliant.

Just need to find the right school with a good senior team and you will love it.

Marking is a pain, yes. But if you cannot get it all done, no one is going to die as a result. Ofsted are a nuisance, but I quite relish the chance to show how good you are, and they are not as evil as most make out.

Schools are having a real issue in getting maths teachers and geography teachers- so you will walk in to any job if good enough.

Just think- It's going to be bloody tough, there will be highs, lows and stress sometimes, but the good outweighs the bad.

Good mate loves it. More than anything else he gets pissed off with uncaring parents but genuinely tries to help those in kids in that position. He's a pe teacher then became head of sixth form a few years ago also. Bit of a lad so maybe has a connection with the older pupils. This year started as deputy head at the age of 31 so doing very well.

If you speak to my missus, she'll tell you its far, far, far worse now than it was even a few years ago.

I toyed with the idea of doing it a few years back and I'm glad I didn't. Not even the 6 week holidays in summer could offset the amount of sh*t she has to deal with from parents, kids and other staff.

With maths you can pick and choose. I got teed off with all the Gove nonsense and took early retirement 18 months ago. Recently I was approached about doing a maternity leave in a sixth form college and am absolutely loving it. MrsMC visits around 100 schools regularly and she reports she's never known such a year for staff turnover (at HoD level and above), and that might be an indicator of how it is for many.

Just need to find the right school with a good senior team and you will love it.

If you speak to my missus, she'll tell you its far, far, far worse now than it was even a few years ago.

I think these two have nailed it.

My wife is a science teacher, has now done about 16 years.
She moved at Christmas from a dead end job in a school run by absolute C**ts to a new job with a really strong leadership team.
She is now doing a dual role, science + SENCo and loving it.
However she has been doing 3-4 hours work every evening for the last month.

Cannot stress how great an impact a good SLT will have. I moved from a failing school, where the leadership was rotten. The school now is in an area of high social deprivation, so 'worse' kids, but actually, I love it. Everything we do seems worthwhile. SLT support the work we do, and lead us in the whole, in a really good way. They try and protect us from all the crap from the govt, and thats all they can do really.

As a head of department, I feel supported and I will go the extra mile and work later, as I enjoy being there and having an impact.

Far too many schools have these 'management' types where they think being ruthless is a good way to lead, and get everyone to do as they say by bullying them. These types tend to have no idea about teaching and do the job just to get promoted.

freeagent- It is good to hear that other teachers are enjoying the profession at the moment- All we ever hear is how 'awful' it is!

Thanks very much everyone - I sort of suspected I'd get completely polarised opinions in posting the question, but it's all really helpful nonetheless. I definitely noticed a massive difference in the enthusiasm of teachers on the CPD courses I did based on what they said about their management teams.

I've not read anything that's really put me off. I think I'll try and visit a few schools (if anyone in Sheffield is reading this and could help - consider this a plea 😀 ).

Just need to find the right school with a good senior team and you will love it.

I think this cannot be overstated.

finbar, did you do a PhD to teach in universities? I'm in a very similar position to you at the moment. Just coming to the end of my PhD, I absolutely love teaching, have spent a year in South Korea teaching in a high school there and am acutely aware of the lack of opportunities in higher education at the moment so considering going down the Schools Direct avenue and getting a PGCE.

My mother is a retired teacher (PE, English and towards the end of her career taught special needs) and the main advice she has given me is to find a decent school, with good Ofsted results, and a supportive environment for teacher development.

Like a lot of industries at the moment (including higher ed), teaching has been hit hard by a toxic culture of corporate style micromanagement and bureaucracy which can cause problems if you get landed in a school with a bad management team.

Bad management = unhappy teachers = poor standard of teaching

If you find a good school though, teaching is one of the most rewarding experiences you can do (as you already know) and is much more of a stable career option than flitting between one precarious higher ed position to the other.

Interesting report on R4 this morning about increasing violence in schools - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-35431782

My parents have happily recently retired from teaching, in nice, 'good' schools etc, and yet they still strongly warned me off getting into it.

Interested in this. have done 25 years in big corporate and it's always been my intent to save enough up to sort the mortgage out and then go into something a bit more fulfilling and to <cliche> give something back.

My skill set would be very transferrable to a charity or trade body - but teaching is another route I'd consider.

But be honest - I'm late 40's, so to start a teaching career am i able to access the training grants, etc. that a younger person could? Am i 'too old' to make that switch. FWIW, I'm a degree level chemist, working still in that industry, and was an ace at Maths at school (A's in everything, should really have done maths at Uni but chemistry was more interesting and more vocational. Oh, for time again......) - so would need to revise my maths and science knowledge but then could do maths, science and also would get involved in sports.

finbar, did you do a PhD to teach in universities?

Nah, I did a PhD to do fieldwork in South Africa and Sardinia 😉 !

After I finished I loved the teaching I did for a couple of years, but wasn't so hot at devising and applying for research grants, hence my departure from academia. I'm in the Civil Service at the mo.

On my PGCE, we had people such as myself who had just graduated to folk who were nearing retirement and just wanted a change.

Advice would be- phone a local school, say what you are thinking of doing and head in for a few days. They could sort you out shadowing someone etc.

Shadow;schools will let you do it if you are checked. Never known such a squeeze on time and resources,it has changed so much in the 12 years since I started. I am in a rough school with a crack SLT...Love it.

Don't forget how much time it will take out of your life.

Even if you ignore the good / bad experiences - you will still not have any time left for yourself at the end of the day/week.

My brother tried teaching for a while - he had no time to relax or take a break. Massive work load.

A good friend of mine tired teaching for 3 years. We used to ride 2/3 times a week before he was teaching. When he was teaching we saw him once a year.

So even it you find a good school/management etc, it still takes a massive toll. Will you find the money and reward worth that ?

There are other "fulfilling" ways to "give something back". I have worked for 3 charities and they were well paid/organised/rewarding. You could find one that needs your skills.

Thanks. Actually getting (proper) careers advice on this from the RSC (no, not the luvvies, the other one) so will see what they say too, but real life 'wisdom of cyclists' advice is also always worthwhile.

I've worked with and for some right conniving, lying, immoral, bullying bastards in 25 years of bigcorporate and while 2 quick steps and off the train platform has crossed my mind more than once, they haven't driven me to it yet. So while schools would bring their own challenges, hopefully I'd have the mindset to deal with them too.

[edit] @ trimix. Like i said, it's only an option, and charity might well be a preferred one. I have a couple of friends in that sector and am exploring that too.

Other areas that interest me are Trade Body - the quasi-charity sort. Not a variant on the old gentleman's club where all the MD's of the membership just get together 3 times a year in a fancy hotel to 'discuss' the industry and then adjourn for a long lunch, but the sort where they have a strong emphasis on (pure for example eg:) using funds from the membership to provide apprenticeships to attract more young people to the industry.

Or i also do some work with universities / research organisations looking for interesting new technology that could be commercialised in the markets my company works in. In doing so, I've found that many Uni's have people on the other side of the fence looking for companies to work with but (IMHO, and apols to anyone who does this) most of them are from academia and are good at accessign grants from the EC, etc., but have sfa idea of what industry needs to make a product commercialisable and how industry works in general.

Teaching is great but hard not everyone can do it. I have encountered more and more bullshit as I have been promoted. I cant stand it so I am jacking it in. It means I will not rise above 38k a year and I'll be taking a big cut

Have you considered the independent school sector? They like people with PhDs (looks good on their promo materials) and you don't necessarily need a teaching qualification.

Don't forget how much time it will take out of your life.

What are we talking? 45 hours a week? 60 hours a week?

I cant stand it so I am jacking it in. It means I will not rise above 38k a year and I'll be taking a big cut

Do you mean you're going down a rung to be a teacher, rather than a management/teaching role?

Have you considered the independent school sector? They like people with PhDs (looks good on their promo materials) and you don't necessarily need a teaching qualification.

It's on my radar, thanks - I'd still want to do formal training first though, especially if I can get a bursary.

I worked for a year in an independent school. It's long hours, I was probably doing 50 a week, plus you are expected to be involved in lots of extra curricular activities, hence why some schools like the staff to live on site.

Finbar, yes. Meeting next week either workload is slashed or I just be a teacher. I would prefer the later.
Hours well I work 7.30 till 5 most days. Sometimes leave at 4.30 sometimes much later and about 3 hours at weekends. Those hours are pretty hectic though. Currently on a free period and not using my time wisely!

The hours are not really the issue but its the intensity of the hours. Teaching is draining in a way you cant see till you try it

Haha, get back to marking! I have taught full time for a year already (just not in the UK, with all its associated BS...), and lectured for two, so I'm confident I at least vaguely know what I'm letting myself in for.

No offence but when is 7.30 till 5 deemed long hours? When I kick off my next project (imminent)
I'll be doing easily that and checking weekends if I have lads who want to do extra on a weekend?

Dunno, that's why I asked - I tend to do 8am - 6pm more often than not in my current job...

Shadowing a teacher for a few days is a real eye-opener, it put me off teaching for good.

But, it's a personal thing, Mrs Natrix enjoys teaching, so try shadowing and see what you think.

Train qualify get out.

A phd plus pgce plus maths makes the world your oyster - UWCSEA Singapore, British School of New York etc etc.

I work closely with teachers. Good and bad ones but they all complain a lot. I have worked in Industry for 30 years for some challenging companies and in occasionally pressured environments. Nobody complains as much as teachers.
It can be a very challenging job from waht I can see and probably not one I could do and other than senior ones the pay is not fantastic.
The pension is excellent and of course the holidays. In my experience they all complain they work long hours etc but I spend a lot of time in a large school and I am always first in and last out. They all claim they work long hours at home etc but I dont believe most of them.

The pension is excellent and of course the holidays. In my experience they all complain they work long hours etc but I spend a lot of time in a large school and I am always first in and last out. They all claim they work long hours at home etc but I dont believe most of them.

Are you the care-taker?

Are you the care-taker?

🙂

My wife is retraining as a German teacher via Teach Direct and it's very very hard work in the first year. The school my wife is working in is excellent with a really good SLT BUT they have very high expectations so coupled with the workload at school, marking, course work and the seemingly unending pile of self-assesssed paperwork that needs doing it's not any easy choice.

I work a 50 - 70 hour week (including being on call) with a good salary so picking up the additional 'stuff; around the house and extra childcare commitments has been tough so depending on your circumstances it can have a big impact.

Also the money is frankly rubbish if you look at a true hourly rate!

My wife is however loving the teaching bit so hopefully after the course is done it'll settle down into a busy but fulfilling role which is more than be said of her previous role at our local county council!

Also the money is frankly rubbish if you look at a true hourly rate!

This. I'm sure it's rewarding, but the pay is truly shite.

The hours are not really the issue but its the intensity of the hours. Teaching is draining in a way you cant see till you try it

No offence but when is 7.30 till 5 deemed long hours? When I kick off my next project (imminent)

As an ex-teacher (10 years ago) now Project Manager running a big team with several multi-£m projects I can say that AA comments above are bang on the money. My job now is more stressful and I work longer hours than when I was teaching, but it's not as intense.

No offence but when is 7.30 till 5 deemed long hours?

Dont think it is really, but when you have 25-30 unruly 15 yearolds sucking the ife force from you its quite tough. The attrition rate tells the story.

What is it with British psyche where we like to brag about the long hours we work? With the advent of new technology, improved communications, more efficient plant and machinery, greater automation we should all be working a 30 hour week.
Just saying.

I consider 40 hours a week to be too long and normally work about 35.

brag about the long hours we work?

I don't get this at all. If you've done your allocated work and the jobs are all done why hang about? Our psyche is bloody bizarre.

I hate it.....only do 1 day a week as supply, the rest of the time I'm a guitar teacher (which I love) doubtful I'll be sticking it until the end of the academic year. It's just full of bullshit

Not all teachers complain. Some do.
Not all teachers find the job stressful. Some do.
Not all teachers love the job. Most do.
Not all teachers work stupid long hours. Some do.

Teachers are people, just replace "teachers" above with your profession of choice.

Nearly 20 years in and I still find it a great job. Still find time to ride at least twice a week (often three times), don't feel stressed too often, and do get 13 weeks pretty much to myself each year.

As said, if you get in the right school with the right team and survive the first three years or so unscathed then you'll be set.

Been teaching for 5 years now and still like it. It is knackering and some colleagues have unrealistic workload expectations but on the whole it's good fun and most of the challenges are interesting.

As above, the right management makes all the difference.

Every job has its crap to deal with, it is just how you deal with it.

I play the game, when I have to, but I work hard and enjoy its rewards. I also have realistic expectations of what I will get done, but I also have realistic expectations of my department. I pile on the pressure when I have to, but also protect them from some of the crap SLT give us.

Just give it a go- teaching is still a good job.

My wife is a head of department in an independent school. The money isn't too bad and the holidays are great but he does work very hard, with lots of extra-curricular stuff and lots of marking and lesson prep etc. at home. I suspect if she had a similar role in an comprehensive it'd be less work but also less rewarding.

When she's working she probably works similar hours to myself but gets something like 13 weeks of holiday compared to the 5 weeks I get, so that's an upside. On the other hand the most junior of my consultants only gets paid slightly less than my wife does.

johnnystorm - Member
As above, the right management makes all the difference.

Most people don't know how to manage ... 😮

Great thread on teaching, nothing to add.

As for hours, my Brother regularly worked till he was so knackered he just went to bed too tired for anything else.

My mate worked too late to ever meet us for our regular night rides in over 3 years.

For the pay both were overworked / overstressed and undervalued.

Life is bloody short, dont waste it.

As an aside, did anyone just hear Any Questions where there were two successive questions:

1) what would you do to improve oecd numeracy and literacy ranking? Unanimous answer: let teachers teach without interference

2) should that headteacher have told parents to come to school properly dressed? Unanimous answer: noooo,there are more important things, she shouldn't have...

Gaaah, well, which is it, you bastards? Either we let teachers use their latitude and initiative to do what they judge their schools and kids need, or we don't! Very annoying.

Im now halfway through my NQT year and it's very tough. I love my job, but the money is pretty lousy at this stage. It's unbelievably rewarding though, and you'll never learn as much as you do when you have to teach something.

Word of warning though - teaching is NOTHING like lecturing. Cross lecturing with babysitting, social work, motivational speaker and actor and you'll get close...

Word of warning though - teaching is NOTHING like lecturing. Cross lecturing with babysitting, social work, motivational speaker and actor and you'll get close...

No offence but when is 7.30 till 5 deemed long hours?
Dont think it is really, but when you have 25-30 unruly 15 yearolds sucking the ife force from you its quite tough. The attrition rate tells the story.

Its not uncommon for my wife (teacher obviously) to only have a 10min lunch without a single break throughout the day. She comes back shell shocked often, but still loves her job. This is the difference between a long day at the office and a long day at school.

It's not uncommon for me to only have a 10min lunch without a single break throughout the day. I come back shell shocked, still have stuff to do in the evening and the worries often stop me sleeping at night. At the end of the day if I've done a good job, a millionaire is an even bigger millionaire than when he started. At least your wife has something really worthwhile to show for it!

I suspect that's why she still loves her job and I'm looking for a change.....

It's not uncommon for me to only have a 10min lunch without a single break throughout the day. I come back shell shocked, still have stuff to do in the evening and the worries often stop me sleeping at night.

I'd change jobs, sounds very unhealthy.

but you do it for the kids. They are bloody brilliant.

Kids are just like the rest of society, some are brilliant, some are eedjits and most are somewhere in the middle.

I mainly do it for the money. And holidays.

Too many teachers are martyrs to the cause. They do ridiculous hours often when not necessary then complain about it. This has a number of negative effects: 1. People lose sympathy for the profession. 2. It creates a culture whereby working massively over your contracted hours is not only acceptable but expected.

I teach in Scotland where things are a little different but my advice to new teachers is to look at your practice, talk to the old hands, decide what has heehaw impact and stop doing it. Then have a right good talk to yourself about not feeling guilty, after all if the powers that be really valued that stuff they'd give you time to do it.

I have been teaching for 19 years (blimey that has flown by!) and recently went back to being a HOD in a secondary school after being in GFE for a couple of years!
Is it stressful, yes it can be.
Is any day the same, not a chance 😀
Would I want to do anything else, not on your life 😀
Workload expectations can be huge, but for some reason even though I only take home occasionaly and it is one set of work to mark at home max, and I have never worked until 10pm, all of my students do well and my departments do well! I think there are a few too many martyrs in teaching who love to tell the rest of the staffroom how long they are working to make themselves feel a bit better!

My working day tends to be at my desk by about 7:15am (I am an early riser and work better in the morning), I don't take breaks or lunch by choice then I leave usually by about 4:30-5pm. However on Fridays I aim to be off by 3:10pm. I reckon that that working day means I don't need to take much home, and I like to keep the two as separate as possible

Thanks for all the continued insight everyone. Teach Direct were supposed to call me yesterday afternoon and didn't, but I shan't let that put me off just yet 😉

As Edukator said, this is a great thread that puts both sides across for the OP.

Yes money is crap per hour. Yes, the holidays are awesome. Yes, teachers complain about the hours too much I think. Yes, its savage/draining as a 10 min break from 8-4.30 is normal. Yes, it's very rewarding and I couldn't imagine doing anything else.

I don't have much more to add other than I followed a similar route (PhD to maths teacher via lecturing) so if you want to contact me direct you're welcome to (email in profile)