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The Tories are not seeming at all popular at present, so this raises the question - what would be needed for there to be e revolution?
I suspect that it would need a radical change away from apathy in the general public.
We'd need to have a real reason for an uprising, but we don't.
If it didn't happen in the early 80's it will never happen.
The misuse of THERE and THEIR could tip me over....
Beeter speeling tort at skool.
A change of tone and content in the media rather than just blithe acceptance and repetition of lies and half truths.
The general population are way to comfortable for there to be a revolution anytime soon. There would need to be a significant change in employment levels, cost and standard of living before then. Either that or an imminent world war which could be avoided by some mass population direct action.
it would affect property prices to much
Ya, Pol Pot started a culling revolution when he tried to change his surrounding into his idealistic "paradise".
Ya, revolution ... do you have guns? No guns no revolution.
You want to turn the place into shite hole?
🙄
You want to turn the place into shite hole?
The place is a shite hole.
High levels of immigration to rural parts of the country, an overbearing bureaucratic european union hell bent on centralization of power in Brussels, high levels of rural unemployment, a perceived distance from a semi-corrupt Westminster body politic, a right wing demagogue and a nationalist, independent, jingoistic political party to bring it all together. Should do the trick provided they're not too incompetent. Oh, wait...
The place is a shite hole.
Quite nice where I live.
What would it take for their to be a revolution in the UK?
A call by United States for regime change.
A ban on all soaps, eg emerdale, eastenders, brokside, hollyoaks, neighbours, casulty, holby city would bring all the women close to riot
And for the men banning audis and Bmws, from the outside lane of motorways, and hondas from the middle lane which they pay extra to drive in at 60mph.
The place is a shite hole.
Care to elaborate?
Quite nice where I live.
+1 Glorious walk around the Surrey Hills this morning - hard to imagine anywhere better!
No TV or cheap beer would send the masses into a frothy Starbucks style protest.
In real life? A huge push into a federal euro zone with power handed over to non elected drones might just do.
If it didn't happen in the early 80's it will never happen.
Agreed. Scargill's best efforts weren't enough. We had the right Prime Minister at the right time.
The place is a shite hole.Care to elaborate?
I think he lives in Scotland.
Are any of the political parties popular?
I don't see any of them getting good press at the minute.
Oh, the never satisfied brigade 😉
Should nip up to East Neuk it's all getting rather exciting there
Voter apathy? Highest voting since 1997
Tories unpopular? Against expectations won a majority
WMK - what next????
The Tories are not seeming at all popular at present, so this raises the question - what would be needed for there to be e revolution?
Haha, seriously?....some people really are still reeling from the election result arent they?!
We have a decent level of free education to A-levels in this country, free Uni stuff would mean more taxes and lots of the electorate dont want to pay more tax.
We have fairly low crime levels and murder rates far lower than countries like the US with their 'freedom' gun laws that supposedly allow the population to rise up ready in 'revolution'....
We have an NHS which can be frustrating at times when waiting for routine stuff but if you smash yourself up in an RTC, suffer a heart attack etc it swings into action and preserves life as well as any other health provider in the world.
We have loads of forestry commission land, national trust, MOD and common land available to walk, ride and run on.
We have a temperate climate with an absence of tornadoes, earthquakes etc...
We arent exactly struggling for food, quite the opposite as despite the media hysteria over food banks we actually have an obesity crisis.
Fuel is relatively cheap....i know this winds up the greenies....but the alternative is you tax the hell out of petrol/diesel and freedom of movement then becomes the preserve of the wealthy....hardly a good way to create a more equal society.
Yes, lots of stuff in this country needs improving but it would take more tax or diverting existing funds from current projects which would upset those areas having funds taken from them to be put elsewhere...
...and as someone else above alluded to, we actually have it quite safe, comfortable and cheap in this country when compared to somewhere else you could be born.
Given that we are a small island with limited natural resources our quality of life is quite remarkable, the general humour, work ethic and resourcefulness of the British never fails to amaze me....we seem to muddle on in a (generally) successful manner no matter which party is in government, i like that....its almost like we govern ourselves, you know like a mature grown up country usually does...no need for revolutions here.
nationalist, independent, jingoistic political party to bring it all together
Yep describes the torys to a t
For people to care about something other than themselves. Humans are selfish, and thus extraordinarily easy to deceive and coerce. Also, people need to stop deferring their conscience to religions, politicians, media and celebrities.
Ya, revolution ... do you have guns? No guns no revolution.
You're confusing social change with military conflict. I suppose another thing we need for revolution is for people like you to keep right out of it. Just watch how the grown-ups do it.
If there are those who genuinely think the UK is a shite hole need to get out and spend time in other countries - and I don't just mean on their tourist beaches and idylls. I wonder what other country they think is better than the UK on the balance of everything? They all have their pro's and con's - mostly con's relative to the UK. It's not perfect, but nowhere will ever be. Get over it and get a bit more 'glass is half full' instead of 'glass is half empty'.
We have an NHS which can be frustrating at times when waiting for routine stuff but if you smash yourself up in an RTC, suffer a heart attack etc it swings into action and preserves life as well as any other health provider in the world.
Make the most of that while you can.
Take a look through history and look at the conditions that were in place last time we had a revolution...
If there are those who genuinely think the UK is a shite hole need to get out and spend time in other countries
well said....
are all those desperate folk at Calais trying to get here to start the revolution because the place is so bad?
The place is a shite hole
If you really want to see shite, start a revolution.
Switch off SKY?
Bang on. It's brilliant going abroad on holiday for a couple of weeks, but if you had to live there all the time you'd still be paying taxes, dealing with local healthcare, transport and all the other shit that pisses you off in the UK, just in a sunnier location.If there are those who genuinely think the UK is a shite hole need to get out and spend time in other countries - and I don't just mean on their tourist beaches and idylls. I wonder what other country they think is better than the UK on the balance of everything?
It would require internet keyboard warriors to put down their hazelnut macchiatos and get off their arses.
I'm not buying shares in guillotines any time soon.....
Humans are selfish, and thus extraordinarily easy to deceive and coerce.
Actually humans aren't selfish. It's one of the principle reasons why humans have been successful. You would struggle to find another species of mammals as selfless as humans.
Actually humans aren't selfish. It's one of the principle reasons why humans have been successful.
Humans are never selfish?
The thought of a revolution in this country is utterly hilarious.
We will bend over and take pretty much anything that's dished out. On the whole we are a passionless lot with very little fire in our bellies.
On the whole we are a passionless lot with very little fire in our bellies.
Unless you spill my pint 👿
Living standards are way too high for a revolution. You'd need real hunger / repression on a mass scale for a revolution.
I think he lives in Scotland.
Dunno which part, the bit I'm in is a really nice place to live. Plenty of really interesting and rewarding jobs going in my industry sector too. Even with my limited experience!!
Was having a really good blether with some Angus locals near Carnoustie on the coastal path today. They also really like where they live. Come to think of it, I don't know many people (in real life) in Scotland who don't actually think it's a nice place to live.
Three_Fish - Member
Ya, revolution ... do you have guns? No guns no revolution.You're confusing social change with military conflict. I suppose another thing we need for revolution is for people like you to keep right out of it. Just watch how the grown-ups do it.
Ya, unfortunately my understanding of the word "revolution" is always associated with guns like Pol Pot. Ya, I doubt I will join in unless the street is full of ZMs trying to harm me that forces me to find something to defend myself.
However, I always wonder why people don't use poo/turd/human excrement as weapons by throwing at ZM bureaucrats? ... I mean by getting the message to them by telling they stink to high heaven with their policy. Put it this way by throwing poo at those ZM you might create good for people as someone will have to clean the shite out out of their clothing.
How about throwing bags of poo at the riot police instead of confronting them head on? Throw the poo then run like hell. Nobody get hurts but the whole place will stink to high heaven ... 😆 Just remember not to get the poo on yourself.
Personally, I would like to throw poo at those unelected ZMs ... imagine their clothing are dripping with running poo ... yaaccckkk ... 😆
The slogan should be:
"Poo for change!"
"Poo for revolution!"
edit: try bagging poo ... not as easy as you thought. I used to dog walk for my friend and everytime I picked up the poo it was like warm-ish ... hmmm ...
edit edit: seriously, try using poo instead ... that will definitely attract attention. It will be big news!
The place is a shite hole.
chain broke ?
I have a strong suspicion that throwing poo counts as assault, so throwing it at the police or a politician ay not be a good idea.
The best way to effect change is by voting. if none of the parties represents what you want, form your own party and try and convince as many people as possible to vote for you. If enough people like you get in, you can effect really change.
Chewkw... You really do need to lay off the hallucinogens for a while.
The best way to effect change is by voting. if none of the parties represents what you want, form your own party and try and convince as many people as possible to vote for you. If enough people like you get in, you can effect really change.
If you cant be bovvered with all that palava you could always volunteer for some arduous volunteer work in some real poverty stricken part of the world, work hard do good things and learn what real shiteholes are really like, then you can come back here all sanctimonious and tell us how lucky we are 😀
[s]chewkw[/s] Pookw
Major house price crash, or a proper national bankruptcy... maybe a small change.
But,
+1 Glorious walk around the Surrey Hills this morning - hard to imagine anywhere better!
Failure of a class of people to identify and help with the circumstances of others for a start. If this country continues to slowly creep backwards, A revolution maybe on the cards in a few decades.
We are too spineless to deal with it sooner.
tpbiker - Member
If there are those who genuinely think the UK is a shite hole need to get out and spend time in other countries
well said
That's not a great argument is it?
Things don't need to change because other countries are worse? That attitude could be the reason there'll never be a revolution in this country.
The best way to effect change is by voting. if none of the parties represents what you want, form your own party and try and convince as many people as possible to vote for you. If enough people like you get in, you can effect really change.
I think the EU might have something to say about "real change".
If you want real change, revolutionary change, as the OP suggests and which is apparently the subject matter of this thread, then you will have to go further than changing parliamentary representation.
Otherwise just be satisfied with the status quo beyond not much more than a bit of tinkering.
110/148mm spacing seems enough for some people.
willard - Member
I have a strong suspicion that throwing poo counts as assault, so throwing it at the police or a politician ay not be a good idea.
Ya, poo throwing becomes an assault. You do know that if you touch them (i.e. other people) it becomes an assault too? So why not make the best out of it by using poo? When you are charged at the police station everyone gets a big laugh at being poo thrown.
Imagine thousand of people throwing poo then it gets into big news then it becomes the norm of protest and no longer a "proper" assault. It then becomes the laughing stock of the world and the politicians would be taken the mickey out of them, when they gather they would greet each other with "How's your poo nowadays? Get any? You need to get them to change their diet you know.".
The moral of the story if you want to be a ZM then you should be able to handle poo ... 😆
edit:[b] oh ya if you want your poo to stink to high heaven then eat plenty of red meat ...[/b]
we dont need a revolution we need young people to vote, and baby boomers to die off.
The papers all seem to be terrified for a lefty Labour party leader, so maybe that will do it.
The papers all seem to be terrified for a lefty Labour party leader
They claim not to be.
There won't be a revolution because most of us love it here. I'm very interested in the practical, deliverable suggestions the OP has for the country post revolution or is this just a general purpose whine?
We need winter because it says here
There won't be a revolution because most of us love it here.
I think the suggestion here is a political revolution rather than a cultural revolution. There is some evidence of widespread public dissatisfaction with politics and politicians. Although none to suggest that it has reach the point of revolutionary fervour.
Like the recent fairly convincing victory for the Tories you mean? A nation gets the government it votes for. There were options and that was the result, shitty options I'll grant you.
Like the recent fairly convincing victory for the Tories you mean? A nation gets the government it votes for. There were options and that was the result, shitty options I'll grant you.
Shitty options indeed 🙁
Like the recent fairly convincing victory for the Tories you mean?
I think it's stretching it a bit to call it a "fairly convincing victory". I don't think there's ever been a ruling party in government in the UK that has won so little support from the electorate as this present government did.
There have been rare examples of parties winning slightly less percentage of the vote but on a much bigger turnout.
The Tories actually got only 25% of the total possible electoral vote in May, correct me if I'm wrong but no other party imo has ever won a general election with so few votes.
And don't forget they only have a working majority of 12.
So not a convincing victory for the Tories imo.
Humans are very selfish and will only work together if they can see its better for them individually or their family. We are not ants.
The idea of working for the common good is a selfish act as its seen by those that do it (a lot of us) as better for them and their family, which is a selfish attitude. The problem we have if we want a revolution is persuading enough people that it is better for them in the medium to long term.
Humans are very selfish and will only work together if they can see its better for them individually or their family. We are not ants.
Humans really aren't that selfish. We form families and tribes, and will quite easily sacrifice ourselves for others.
Surprised no-one's quoted Trotsky: 3 square meals, absence of.
Mogrim +1
The problem we have if we want a revolution is persuading enough people that it is better for them in the medium to long term.
This is totally totalitarian man 😆
Asking a bunch of mainly middle class, middle aged men who can afford an expensive hobby about revolution maybe asking the wrong crowd?
What would labours % been? In fact, add up labour, the lib dems and the SNP, what % would they have got?
Of those that cared sufficiently to vote the Tories got 37 odd %. uKIP got 12%, so nearly half between them.
To say that the left has been hard done by and is somehow the most popular view in the UK just isn't true. People are lamenting that blair and co were too right wing, but they actually won elections.
Labour can shift to the left, and probably should, we need a choice but don't blame them if the spend years in opposition as a result (and of course, they won't stand a chance if they don't get the scottish vote back).
The Tories actually got only 25% of the total possible electoral vote in May, correct me if I'm wrong but no other party imo has ever won a general election with so few votes.
Correct me if I'm wrong but Labour won the 2005 election according to wikipaedia with 35.2% of a 61.4% turnout. My maths makes that 21.6% of the total possible electoral vote. Makes the current govt look for more legit despite the smaller majority. Time we had that boundary review I think.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom_general_election,_2005
and STV or some other form of PR. No party has had real mandate for many many years
House prices halving and old people having their benefits cut would probably do it.
The reason why their has yet to be a revolution is that the legal avenues for voicing political opinion have yet to be exhausted, people still think they can make a difference by voting. Once people feel that their lives are no longer under their own control and they have no way of venting those feelings and changing the direction of their lives legally, they resort to reactionary behaviour. You also have to believe that your life could be better but that there are external constraints stopping it from being better - the issue with the British is that we have stopped believing that our lives could be better - we are a country stuck in post-colonial negativism - we believe things are only going to get worse.
Actually humans aren't selfish. It's one of the principle reasons why humans have been successful. You would struggle to find another species of mammals as selfless as humans.
Selflessness is an evolutionary form of selfishness. As you said it yourself, we are successful because we cooperate - don't let that deceive you into thinking that humans won't **** over their fellow man if doing so benefits them more than cooperation.
We form families and tribes...
Why do 'we' do that?
tou're confusing social change with military conflict. I suppose another thing we need for revolution is for people like you to keep right out of it. Just watch how the grown-ups do it.
I'm with Chewkw, as Che put it.....what's a revolution without guns? Almost all true revolutions involve violent conflict, peaceful revolution is an exception to the norm. The social and institutional constructs that limit the political avenues of the masses almost always necessitate armed conflict, as those holding power are almost always violently opposed to threats to their power. Otherwise the elites would give the masses avenues of political outlet. The greatest trick played by the western elite, has been to understand this concept.
We form tribes because its better for us individually and our family (stability, food supply, security), its actually a selfish act of survival. We can appear to being selfless but it's done for reasons other than the collective. Like those that are truly selfish and would step on anyone to get things their way, we make a cost benefit analysis on what's best for us and those we consider family. Fortunately for a good portion of people many decide that not shitting on everyone around them is not best for themselves.
Want a revolution in the UK? Get as many people as possible to see that things would be better if your ideas would be better for them. Simple really.
Like the recent fairly convincing victory for the Tories you mean? A nation gets the government it votes for.
The nation in which I live has one government with limited powers which it voted for and one UK wide government which it rejected massively. Despite there only being 1 our of 59 MPs a Tory, and 56 out of 59 being SNP we end up with a government that my nation did not vote for.
If this country is a shitehole, why are half of Africa, the Middle East and the Asian subcontinent desperate to get in here?
People who say stupid things like that against the country that feeds, shelters and cures them get right up my nose. They need to go and spend a few weeks in a proper shithole like Lagos or Cairo or Kinshasa to understand just how damned lucky they are to live here. It has its faults but it's one of the best countries in the world in the balance it offers.
Want a revolution in the UK? Get as many people as possible to see that things would be better if your ideas would be better for them. Simple really.
Not simple, you don't convince people with ideas and you don't convince them over night. You manipulate their feelings over decades and slowly bring to boil emotional issues. People do not think rationally, you have to make them FEEL like they have no other choice than to riot.
People who say stupid things like that against the country that feeds, shelters and cures them get right up my nose.
I feed, shelter and cure myself. What is your point exactly?
If this country is a shitehole, why are half of Africa, the Middle East and the Asian subcontinent desperate to get in here?
It's a worse shithold over there? Just because it could be worse doesn't mean the UK couldn't be a lot better than it is now.
Arguably the UK is less of a hole because we do complain, whinge and whine about things. The Philippines is a dump because the people are ridiculously happy, believe in god a bit too much and just let their politicians get on with being corrupt jerks.
Saying that you have no right to complain smacks of sneering tory elitism.
I feed, shelter and cure myself. What is your point exactly?
What? Grow all your own food, built your own house, and don't use the NHS. Respect!
Any revolution in Britain won't come from within.
Mark my words, & I'm not Enoch Powell.
What? Grow all your own food, built your own house, and don't use the NHS. Respect!
That's a nonsense interpretation.