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My son's an apprentice electrician and seems to be chasing and chiseling a lot of walls. Disposable face masks leave him with a nose full if dust so aren't cutting it.
I've had a Google but it's a huge rabbit hole to disappear into, so any shortcuts on advice welcome.
Brick / floor dust is a must, likely loft spaces too, asbestos a bonus as not anticipated but you never know. No chemicals.
Prefer a decent brand like 3M etc.
Knowledgeable insight and links to mask & filters and how to correctly size a mask online appreciated.
Cheers.
My disposable masks are FFP2 and my mask with filter cartriges is rated P2
The rating is about the type of contaminant as well as filtration %
FFP2/P2 filters 94% of contaminants. The higher level 3 is 99.5%, but I find them uncomfortable and level 1 is meant for low dust levels. Go to a proper shop and get some advice
The other thing is that there's no point wearing a mask if you're going to get home covered in dust. Change of clothes or overalls is good to protect him and his family
Your son should get some asbestos training, ideally from his employer, because asbestos can be in everything from floor tiles to artex on the ceiling. The really bad stuff is generally hidden away and if suspected must be surveyed first.
To replace a paper mask any will probably be fine. Availability of replacement filters is important so get it from a shop that supplies those too.
For dealing with poisonous dusts, especially asbestos, you need to be clean shaven (shave again mid shift if working 12 hours) and have a mask fitted. Different brands suit different faces. It is a common thing to do. If he goes to college can they do the face fitting for him there? I makes a huge difference.
For diy I have an Ellipse one from Toolstation. Stays put better and more comfortable than a paper one. I haven't had it face fitted properly but mainly use it for sanding and rockwool handling.
Edit: I find the half mask more comfortable than paper (everyone is different) bit for asbestos training is a must. Generally for an electrician suspect asbestos, client gets it tested, if there it gets removed then electrics. Don't try to work with it!
I use two Elipse masks depending on what I'm doing.
Can't comment on asbestos but I use them for dust, mdf dust inclusive and spray painting Water-borne paints.
The one on the left is A1P3 which is vapour and dust
The one on the right, P3 is dust only.
Some info on mask choice HERE
Both comfortable and judging by the reviews on Screwfix, seem to fit a variety of faces.
Following as I need a new one for spraying weed killers etc. Any recommendations?
Following as I need a new one for spraying weed killers etc. Any recommendations?
https://www.progreen.co.uk/equipment/safety-clothing-ppe/respirators-filters/
My son’s an apprentice electrician and seems to be chasing and chiseling a lot of walls. Disposable face masks leave him with a nose full if dust so aren’t cutting it.
Dusts the HSE's new most favourite topic with spot checks and surprise visits. I'm getting bulletins pretty much weekly about it His employers need to get their act together - their job to make sure the risk is assessed and theres something functional in place and their responsibility to provide it. It goes beyond a mask which is the last line of defence - a bit of thought needs to go into capturing the dust at source and keeping the site clean while you work.
Thanks Timba.
Hmm I’m exposed to a lot of dust during dry weather as a groundsperson. I’ll have a look at the HSE link to see if there’s anything about us
@qwerty - it's not for you or your son to be sourcing PPE/RPE it should be his employer. Whether it's needed should be down to risk assessments/method statements that whoever is managing the job should be issuing, your lad should also be aware of any issues that the RAMS haven't picked up and should be doing dynamic risk assessments( we have a small pocket sized book that stops us in our tracks whilst we fill it in when a job goes off piste slightly)
Asbestos awareness courses should be a given for a sparks.
But regardless - P3 filters on a facefitted 3M or Sunstrom mask from Arco.
* I've lost two friends to asbestos in the last few years - both were tradesmen.
We use two types at work, either 3M or Sundstrom depending on face shape, I'm a Sundstrom. I think it was £50 for a face-fit test and then.another £50 for the mask itself. The cartridges are interchangeable and you can get different ones depending on what hazards you're expecting to face. I rate them over the disposable 'pack of 5' types you can pick up in B&Q.
But yeah as above your son's employer should be picking up the tab for this.
Trend ones are very good but face fit is needed ideally.
Ffp2 is useless in industry for continued work (my opinion)p3 was my minimum I would let anyone use.
Face fit is needed if he is and should using eye protection as it helps with less condensation.
I use a Draeger X-Plore. It gets sweaty but keeps me and my snot clean. Beats the shit out of any disposable.
Key thing would be getting a face fit test for whichever mask is chosen. You can have the best mask in the world, but if it doesn't fit right...
Also, as mentioned - it's the employer's responsibility to get this sorted, not you / your son's
Suggestion: Get an appropriately sized tupperware box to keep it in and some wet wipes. If you chuck it in your bag with the rest of you stuff, you just end up with a mask full of dust.
Best give it a wipe down and box it up after use.
Anyone who could foreeably come into contact with asbestos needs to have been put through the asbestos awareness course. https://www.hse.gov.uk/asbestos/training.htm
and i think should have a proper mask face fit.
That doesnt meant an employer has to buy a fancy mask, but they have to have checked that the one they use works for the employee. Then you can just keep buying the same size and model.
Ive always had 3M ones. We tend to use disposable ones for some reason,
https://www.3m.co.uk/3M/en_GB/p/d/v101068070/
with the full Chemical protection, but they adsorb chemicals from the air so can just "go off" even if you dont use it.
I use a Draeger X-Plore. It gets sweaty but keeps me and my snot clean. Beats the shit out of any disposable.
I have one of these (3300 series half-mask); I bought it to respray a bike frame. Works well, even with nasty fumey stuff like Acetone and Evo contact adhesive.
Ive used sundstrom and 3m. The type I use are for liquid vapours so probably overkill.
The main thing compared to a dust mask is that the rubber is easier to get a good face fit.
They are unpleasant though. Hot and heavy.
Dust masks work if you find one that fits. Is he self employed or employed by a company. If the latter they should be providing PPE and as part of that a face fit. I know this is optimistic for some places and hard to push as a junior staff member.
I imagine there are places that will help you with PPE, including face fit testing. Might be cheaper and nicer in the long run. Last time I bought some 3m masks they were £30 and considered disposable. The ones with replaceable cartridges are more expensive.
I've got that Trend one linked above, I should have gone up a size but it still works.
...
Cheers all, your gems if information.
I've found a lot of info on the HSE website. He was using a cutting tool with no extraction.
We'll buy a mask and filters to ensure he has one asap whilst he talks with his employer. Prior to that discussion he's going to ask his tutor at college for advice and guidance as he can then take this info back to his employer so it's coming from the college, not my son.
Face fitting: I've found 14 pages of HSE advice around this, but WHERE do you get this done?
Cheers RNP, but they're not local, but I've found this place which is https://www.erminplant.co.uk/we-do-face-fit/
JSP do a a Press-to-test range with P3 dust filters. Although this doesn't negate the need to do a Fit Test for COSHH Regulations, it gives a better indication that the mask fits properly. I've used this mask for a lot of dusty work during home renovations and it protects well. Remember, clean shaven skin is also required to get a good face fit. Screwfix sell the JSP mask.
https://www.screwfix.com/p/jsp-force-8-mask-respirator-with-press-to-check-filters-p3/1863f#_=p
For what it's worth HSE are purging sites for just this thing no dust suppression on cutting tooling of any kind.
HSE is pretty thin on the ground thou. I can post you a few different shape and make of disposable ones if you want anything to help a young trade
He was using a cutting tool with no extraction.
Who organises the apprenticeship? If it's the college then they should be reviewing the use of that company.
You can get basic M-class extraction for under £200
JSP do a a Press-to-test range with P3 dust filters.
Thats something that I was sure I'd read about but then when I searched couldn't find - I was really beginning to think I'd dreamed of their existence 🙂
I've a couple of 3M 7500 series masks. I've got some ffp3 filters and vapour filters with dust filter attachments.
I rate it (until you sneeze in it)
@timba if I remember correctly it's the other way around, through his own due diligence of organising his own work experience during Covid (schools cancelled all work experience) he got his foot in the door with a small local electrical company you then apply for the college course and submit your employer.
Bottomine is I want him to work safely but am aware of the reality of him being 8 weeks into an apprenticeship with a small town employer and rocking the boat.
I'm hoping the way forward is to raise it at college with the tutor and then politely pass the college info on to his employer in a solution based way.
* or for the college to go direct to the employer, which may be best all round.