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Whinging kids.
Nobody is to blame for your failure but you.
We are heading off on a tangent, but that is simply not true. It is a popular belief within the old and the right wing though. There are lots of reasons for success and failure, some are within your control, some are not.
Wow! some spectacular **** holery in here the last few hours.
Actually i’ve got a Zoom call tomorrow that could see me part of a Covid Vaccine trail
What vaccine to make the trails stay alive?
The boomer generation has repeatedly benefitted from things and then repeatedly denied them to the following generations through their political choices.
Are you seriously suggesting that everyone between the ages of 55 and 75 is personally responsible for these things?
This kind of blame game is absolutely bloody stupid and also very damaging.
Do. Not. Generalise.
Are you seriously suggesting that everyone between the ages of 55 and 75 is personally responsible for these things?
This kind of blame game is absolutely bloody stupid and also very damaging.
Of course not. Many in that generation also got screwed over by their peers but that doesn't change the fact that the young are being asked to sacrifice their futures with what appears to be very little consideration. Much more could be done to help but yet again a political decision has been made to not help them which is hardly surprising given the age profile of Tory voters.
Apologies @Greyspoke - I think we were talking at cross-purposes: when I said it probably made no difference, I meant that in both cases people had to stay relitively local and so, in terms of transmission, hotspots sould not spread into less affected areas easily.
Interesting to note that even last week a lot of Wales was on a slight negative trend ('on the rise' button here: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/20/covid-cases-and-deaths-today-coronavirus-uk-map ) so hopefully this quick intervention will do some good and will allow less restrictive measures post lockdown
Are you seriously suggesting that everyone between the ages of 55 and 75 is personally responsible for these things?
You'd have to be VERY literal-minded to assume the poster was saying that.
Poor.
You’d have to be VERY literal-minded to assume the poster was saying that.
Surely the very definition of an STW argument is to be Very Literal Minded?
What I can’t understand is why they don’t call it cheese on toast like everybody else.
We do, you're thinking of an English term.
Many in that generation also got screwed over by their peers but that doesn’t change the fact that the young are being asked to sacrifice their futures with what appears to be very little consideration
Everyone's making sacrifices (apart from Dominic Cummings), sure some parts of lockdown measures hurt certain demographics more than others but are you saying a student losing a year of education is more impactful than a 50 year's old business failing (without a decent pension as backup)? Not all business owners are yacht-owning multi-millionaires... My barber is shutting down his place next month as even though we're no longer in lockdown it killed his business (and the continued lack of footfall from local office workers is the final nail in the coffin). He's nearly 50 and hoping he can get into HGV driving as a way to support his family.
The youngest Boomers would now be 56 and those most likely to be at risk from covid will be retired, many who retired in their 50's with generous pensions. I believe the support should be going to the working age population (and people who will work in future) rather than retirees who tend to have fairly comfortable lives.
At least Cardiff airport is still open and everyone from England can drive there and go on hols !
Huge list of donts/cants on the wales.gov website going to be like a ghost country next 2 weeks, and talking to an ex police chief inspector today he said most is unenforceable, but a great time for the more officious officers, and lot of people are going to hate the police of theyre stopped.
Result the police cant win what ever they do.
Just coming home tonight with the kids at just gone 6 and the police were setting up on one of the roads into Carmarthen. Definitely wasn't an accident, nothing or no one else anywhere near. 2 police cars both with lights flashing about 100yds apart. They were getting some signs out of their cars too, looked like it's a stop check for people travelling.
At least Cardiff airport is still open and everyone from England can drive there and go on hols !
Travelling into Wales for the purpose of a holiday is not allowed so no, they won't be. As gnusmas has said above they are setting up checkpoints on key roads, there's one on the main road to the airport at Culverhouse Cross that I know of and bound to be one on the eastern side of Cardiff too somewhere. It won't catch everyone, probably very few in all honesty, but a few news reports and social media posts showing that they are out there and you do risk the chance of getting caught if you go out for non-essential reasons will deter some people who otherwise might go out. The more people who obey the restrictions the better the reduction in virus spread will be.
been reported on local media Gloucestershire police are staging road blocks asking drivers where they have come from, also all supermarkets are covering up or removing all non essential stuff,eg clothes electricals mobile phones,homewares and lots more, bike shops still allowed to stay open thankfully.
Nobody is to blame for your failure but you.
Fortunately for you, you can just blame your mum and dad.
rather than retirees who tend to have fairly comfortable lives.
Er yeah not all retirees are sitting on fat private pensions, you know.
Much more could be done to help but yet again a political decision has been made to not help them which is hardly surprising given the age profile of Tory voters.
It's because we have a Tory government, and Tories are about small government and self reliance. So they don't help. This is basic politics.
Result the police cant win what ever they do.
Nor can the WG. No lockdown = you have failed to control the pandemic; lockdown = you're being unreasonable and killing the economy.
Do bike shops have to cover up non-essential items? 🙂
If they do, what’s non-essential and what should they be covering up?
Carbon bikes?
FS bikes?
TT Bars?
Castelli bibs?
Give us your non-essential bike bits!
Common sense
also all supermarkets are covering up or removing all non essential stuff,eg clothes electricals mobile phones,homewares and lots more
Including stuff like duvets / microwaves / kettles etc. Officious, petty, and unhelpful.
If I needed a new kettle under lockdown I wouldn't boil water in a pan for fortnight and then go to a local shop, I'd order it from Amazon.
So, is the pathology Prof in the video above talking sense? His arguments seem valid, so is it just a different opinion, or has he got things wrong?
If I needed a new kettle under lockdown I wouldn’t boil water in a pan for fortnight and then go to a local shop, I’d order it from Amazon.
It’s a fairness issue.
Curry’s, Argos, Or whatever are closed. It would be unfair for the supermarkets to be able to sell you a kettle when these others can’t.
Obviously everyone just goes online, but this is more of a problem for things like clothes.
Not defending the idea, just explaining it.
Otherwise we’ll be back to March where people were whining about others buying ‘non essential’ foods thinking we should all be just eating pasta and vegetables; without giving any thought to where 65 million peoples worth of calories is going to come from.
people were whining about others buying ‘non essential’ foods
Seriously?
My Brother is a middle manager in Morrison’s.
As far has he knows they were informed about the non essential sales as 1pm yesterday, 5 hours before the legislation came into effect. The Supermarkets are PISSED OFF, they’ve got millions of pounds of Halloween, Guy Fawkes and other assorted seasonal crap on the shelves and store rooms of stores in Wales that they’re frantically trying to shift to stores in England.
I’m not usually bothered with ‘whataboutery’ but its all a bit stupid. My wife’s colleague has been taken to hospital with a wound, her husband is making a 3 hour around trip Home to get her clothes because he can’t buy any in the shop down the road. On the other side of town a Elderly lady who lives on microwaved meals delivered to her has had hers pack in at the worst possible time, but that’s okay because whilst you can’t buy a microwave in Sainsbury’s in Thornhill Cardiff, you can buy one from the Argos store located in the store... they’re exempt from closure because they’re located in a supermarket, but also exempt from a ban on non essential sales because they’re not a super market.
Also because it was dropped in their laps at the last moment, there’s no clear cut off on essential v non-essential so different shops are selling different things.
It was said the rules are the same as the previous lockdown so the shops should already have a list of what they can and cannot sell. Don't fully understand why it's proving so controversial and shops are struggling to get it right.
all argos stores in wales are closed even the ones in sainsburys supermarkets
https://www.argos.co.uk/features/service-disruptions?tag=ar:propbar:covid19
not sure about home bargains or B M stores or Wilkos who all sell similar stuff
all argos stores in wales are closed even the ones in sainsburys supermarkets
The one in Cardiff is open and staffed, I was there today.
It was said the rules are the same as the previous lockdown so the shops should already have a list of what they can and cannot sell. Don’t fully understand why it’s proving so controversial and shops are struggling to get it right.
AFAIK they were able to sell whatever they stocked back in Spring, we’ll once they got their heads around how to make the stores SD compliant etc. I certainly bought a shirt in Tesco in early April.
WAG Government have just announced they’re going to review it this weekend to ensure it’s a “common sense” approach.
From the argos website
Following guidelines, our stores in Wales will close from Friday 23 October at 6pm, until Monday 9 November. Argos stores within Sainsbury's supermarkets are also closed, but pre-paid online orders can be collected as part of your essential food shop, or you can order online for home delivery.
Argos stores and Argos stores within Sainsbury’s supermarkets are still open across England, Scotland and Northern Ireland, where you can pay in-store. To keep your visit as short and safe as possible, we recommend you purchase your items online, for collection or home delivery.
Argos doing exactly as previous lockdown order online collect in store.
I’d just not yet again help boomers to the detriment of the younger generations. They always seem to want the government/society to take care of them/their problems but don’t want to contribute.
The boomer generation has repeatedly benefitted from things and then repeatedly denied them to the following generations through their political choices.
As one of the last Boomers I reject those gross generalisations, many of us have seen how this disadvantages the younger generations and don't agree with it at all. I will argue this with sufficient vigour that people have had a 'fit of the vapours' when on the receiving end.
Your experience may differ but we're not an amorphous generic mass to be all lumped together (a courtesy I try to extend to everyone).
Anyone else been out and noticed how many people are driving to local beauty spots and meeting with their friends? Did my usual lockdown loop earlier (home to Tongwynlais, past Castell Coch, onto the ridgeway through the golf course then dropping down to Cefn Onn Park to home) and all the car parks were rammed with people meeting others and generally acting like nothing has changed. Another rider was talking to someone as I winched up the hill to Fforest Fawr car park and there had just been a heated discussion between a local walking their dog and two families parking up to go for a walk together. The roads are a lot busier than I was expecting too, even saw people trying to go into shops that were obviously closed!
If lots of people are ignoring the rules during this firebreak it will all have been pointless.
Haven't ventured out at all yet but the roads where I am a few minutes outside of Carmarthen are pretty quiet. I'm trying to find out if the multi storey is closed again so I can take the kids cycling over there like we did last lockdown, it was brilliant.
Just did a monster Cardiff circuit - no more than a few miles from the city at all times but managed to rack up a pretty tough 80km. Roads still had plenty of traffic. Maybe half as much as I'd expect on a normal wet Sunday afternoon.
Not much traffic around Newport this morning but the car park at Tredegar House was half full and the road on the Duffryn side was rammed as usual with those too tight to pay a quid to park so some people obviously can't follow the very simple "don't drive to exercise" rule.
The Health Protection (Coronavirus Restrictions) (No. 3) (Wales) Regulations 2020 has no provisions that stops supermarkets from selling so called non essential items.
@superdez I think the bit on "mixed businesses" covers it.
Greyspoke No it doesn't that relates to a business that are listed in Parts 1&2 of Schedule 1 when they are within a business that is listed in Part 3. The regulations make no reference to what goods business that are listed in Part 3 are allowed the sell or not.
Not much traffic around Newport this morning but the car park at Tredegar House was half full and the road on the Duffryn side was rammed as usual with those too tight to pay a quid to park so some people obviously can’t follow the very simple “don’t drive to exercise” rule.
Yeah compliance seems a lot lower this time.
@superdez the Regs don't say what goods or services a business has to offer in order to fall within one of the types of business listed in Schedule 1 Part 1 either. It prohibits (or allows) the opening to the public of premises at which different types of business are carried on. What goods or services on offer cause a business to fall into one of those listed types requires an interpretation of ordinary everyday words such as "pharmacy" or "bicycle shop". If goods outside the scope of any business listed in Part 3 are offered alongside goods within one, then that will amount to carrying on a different (non-Part 3) business. S. 16 makes it clear that unless that activity ceases there will be non-compliance with (eg) s. 11(1) notwithstanding the opening to the public of premises carrying on a permitted business that is permitted under s. 16.
So a bicycle shop can sell the type of clothing normally sold in bicycle shops but not incontinence underwear, a pharmacy can (I guess) sell incontinence underwear but not cycle shorts. Who would have thought there was such nuance in padded underwear? You can probably have yer chamois cream both ways (oo er missus).
greyspoke Regulation 16 applies to a business which has other business operating within the same retail space for example a mobile phone shop in a supermarket, a gym attached to a cycling shop or an Argos outlet in a Sainsbury's, supermarkets are one business and are, as per schedule 1 part 3 allowed to open. The regulations are specific in that they refer to businesses not goods, if as is normal for supermarkets to sell goods other than groceries then they can continue to sell those products because they form part of the same business, they are not business A and business B. The WAG has used the explicit term 'essential goods' there is no reference at all to what goods can or can't be sold in the regulations only what type of businesses can operate during the lockdown period.
If citing your example of a cycling shop it was normal to sell ladies underwear they could continue to do so because it is the same business and the regulations with regard to mixed business would not apply, if however it was normal for cycling shops to operate a separate business within the same premises that sold ladies underwear then I would agree that that business could not operate under the regulations.
@superdez you assert "supermarkets are one business". The word "business" has to be construed in accordance with the way the law goes about it, which is to say, in context and bearing in mind the overall objectives of the piece of legislation in question and its intended effect. The wording of s. 16 clearly allows for a single legal person to operate several "businesses" from a single premises. (This is also a common way the word is used, for example business commentators note most years how Marks and Spencer's food business is doing better than its fashion business.) So that leaves us with the problem of interpreting how any operations should be split up into separate "businesses" for the purpose of applying the Regulation. The Schedules help here as they list things that are considered "businesses". In Sch. 1 Part 3 "food retailers" are listed as a business and in Part 1 "homeware stores" are also listed as one. "supermarkets" are only mentioned as an example of a food retailer, not as a separate category of permitted business. To interpret a "supermaket" as a separate permitted category would be perverse and contrary to the obvious intent of the legislation. You can of course run the argument, but in my view you would not succeed.
Less traffic this morning, but that could easily be just because it's half-term.
Despite being told I'd have the office to myself today as the appointed on-site guy, two of my colleagues have shown up, and one of the guys who sublets a bit of our office is in too. We've all got private offices so it's no biggie covid wise, they couldn't face WFH with the kids home.
I've been trying to put in our ERF grant since 08:30 this morning, I don't even know if they're taking applications yet, their website can confirm we're eligible, but not how to apply.
Rode the woods around Castle Coch at the weekend, I almost never go there outside of summer, it's usually a horrible muddy bog... this weekend was no exception, I can't stand conditions like that.. I gave up after a couple of hours and headed home, non-stop rain forecast all week, this is going to be a long slog till Spring.
Genuine question. If we walk to the beach (which we can from our house) are we allowed to go for a swim at the moment? I have an 8yr old desperate to try out his new wetsuit! I don't think it contravenes rule 1.
@benjamins11 personally, I would think that's fine. No driving and daily exercise are the rules laid out which fits what you say.
I've found out our multi storey in Carmarthen is closed so will be utilising that again for bike riding with the kids. It's a 5 min walk from where we live so no driving required here either. They loved it last time.
P-Jay - yes we went out for a stroll round Roath Park this morning, traffic down from recently but not as low as during the initial lockdown. Less of the COVID dance going on with other pedestrians as well, but that probably does fit in with what we now know about transmission.
To me, some of the descents in Castell Coch/ the Ganol are a hoot in the wet, but I would agree some of the off-road climbs that aren't fire-road are to be avoided.
To me, some of the descents in Castell Coch/ the Ganol are a hoot in the wet, but I would agree some of the off-road climbs that aren’t fire-road are to be avoided.
Can't stand any of them in the wet.
I got to the top of the Ganol to a descent I love in the dry, got about 100m, trying to pedal like mad to keep half the speed I'd be rolling at in the dry and failing, and just couldn't be bothered anymore, I wasn't nervous of sliding out of being taken out by a root sniper, I just couldn't be bothered with it, and the idea of riding just made me miserable. Enjoyed a tirade from a over-entitled Horse Rider about how I'd personally cause an accident one day for doing something or other. Tried the Fawr side and it was if anything worse, at least the people in the woods were nicer.
One surprising upside of the new regs is the removal of the county borders. I think I'm going to try that Mountain View Bikepark next weekend in search of some hardpack, failing that I think I'll just continually slam my nuts in my freezer door for a few hours every weekend until either Spring arrives or I can legally drive to Afan or whatever.
Genuine question. If we walk to the beach (which we can from our house) are we allowed to go for a swim at the moment? I have an 8yr old desperate to try out his new wetsuit! I don’t think it contravenes rule 1.
while swimming in the sea isn't illegal, you're asked not to - from Gov.Wales site:
As one of the purposes of the restrictions is to reduce pressure on the Welsh NHS, we also ask people to avoid activities that involve a significant degree of risk (for example swimming or other exercise at sea, or in lakes, rivers or other waterways).
Rode the woods around Castle Coch at the weekend, I almost never go there outside of summer, it’s usually a horrible muddy bog
I find it holds up quite well. Not the new stuff, but I go up the rocky road from the gate, then to the back car park, along the fence line, right down the rocky gulley, up the long gravelly Taff Trail one above Taff's Well, then from there you have a few choices, you can go all the way down the main fire-road and cut down on that trail that comes out by the tea room or there's another less muddy singlerack one that used to have some zig zags built into it.
It sounds like you need some new trails - drop me a line after the lockdown, if you like - I can show you around some of the more weatherproof places I go when it's muddy.
I think I’m going to try that Mountain View Bikepark next weekend in search of some hardpack
Is it open?
Here in Ceredigion we managed to welcome the usual hoards of disease-ridden holidaymakers all summer long without any spread of Covid. So the rationale for a circuit break here is...?
Ceredigion here too. Loads of walkers about that I don't recognise - the filthy swine - but not many cars, wonderful!
Bit gutted I can't (shouldn't) drive to Brechfa/Nant Yr arian, but what's 17 days in a lifetime!?
Is it open?
Sadly not.
Bit gutted I can’t (shouldn’t) drive to Brechfa/Nant Yr arian, but what’s 17 days in a lifetime!?
I'd agree if it wasn't for the slightly worrying tag line of "new regulations" post firebreak, I like Drakeford, but he's still a Politician, there's nothing stopping him imposing new regulations on the 9th that are remarkably close to what we have now.
Bit gutted I can’t (shouldn’t) drive to Brechfa/Nant Yr arian, but what’s 17 days in a lifetime
Brechfa's closed...has been since before original lockdown
Off work for 2 weeks kids at home this week, went out for a ride on the bikes from home today. Bike/footpath were very busy with people walking and riding, but weather forecast better for today than rest of the week so everyone had the same idea probably, most will have been straight from their houses on the route we took but there was still a few cars parked in the usual spot.
I don't even understand why most people I see drive to that spot live within a mile of it yet drive there to walk their dog...
So the rationale for a circuit break here is
Whilst you have low numbers, you want to keep low numbers. You also have fewer facilities remember.
And if your facilities aren't overwhelmed, you might need to take patients from places that are.
Was up round Castell Coch and a few other places playing in the mud today, enjoyed it apart from when I forgot I still have a heavily worn Aggressor on the rear at one point and did a lovely 180 while sliding backwards into a bush! New tyres need to be fitted before the next ride.
Still loads of people driving to the car parks in the woods, usually with a dog and meeting others there. Van Road was very busy with kids on the dirt jumps, probably 30 or so with no social distancing to be seen. Doesn't feel like a lockdown at all if I'm honest.
Given the number of people visible surfing in the webcams, the ‘we would rather you didn’t do water sports’ is being ignored this time. Personally I don’t understand why WG single out water sports, statistically much less risky than many other sports and this time of year the lifeguard excuse doesn’t really work as post half term there wouldn’t be any normally. Agree with the above poster, I do not believe for a second this will be just for two weeks, they are already suggesting it will be more in full lockdown.
Plenty of people driving by me.
Personally I don’t understand why WG single out water sports
They haven't. They didn't say 'don't do water sports' they said 'don't do anything risky'.
Personally I don’t understand why WG single out water sports, statistically much less risky than many other sports
+1
Brechfa’s closed…has been since before original lockdown
I thought Abergorlech trail was open?
I thought Abergorlech trail was open?
It wasn't last time I checked the website
Given the number of people visible surfing in the webcams, the ‘we would rather you didn’t do water sports’ is being ignored this time
Yes I agree...also ignoring the "you must not drive to exercise" rule
@molgrips - but why single that out rather than something riskier such as climbing, off-road cycling, horse-riding etc? It just seems strange to single out a relatively safe minority branch of sports
Because it was the first thing that came into the copy writers head? Because it's a major cause of callouts? Doesn't seem like a big deal to me, when you focus on the actual message which is "keep risk to a minimum". Or 'No Gnar' if you like.
In the minority here, I actually think the full lockdown is a good idea. It can kill off a lot of infected areas and if strictly observed, has the potential to drastically reduce transmission.
Remember, after a few days, the virus will have decayed on most surfaces. What we need to do is then follow that up with targeted elimination of known cases. It goes without saying, there can be NO movement in or out at all.
See New Zealand for more details.
I'm all for the short lockdown, it could buy us enough headroom in hospitals to allow us to have some semblance of a christmas. The big issue as I see it is the majority seem to be ignoring a lot of the rules. There's 3 families with their kids in one of the gardens near me right now, seen plenty of people driving across Cardiff to go walk in the woods despite every area of Cardiff having a decent park and plenty of groups who have obviously arranged to meet.
I thought Abergorlech trail was open?
Abergorlech car park is and 3/4 of the Gorlech trail is available according to the Ranger's facebook. It does say it's for local use only as travelling to the car park is forbidden. Seems busy going by Strava though.
WG haven't 'singled out' water sports. They have just used it as an example of an activity that involves a significant degree of risk.
I agree with @finephilly. The lockdown is about reducing transmission and avoiding overloading the NHS. However, there are still so many covidiots out there that I worry it will have only a marginal effect.
Personally I don’t understand why WG single out water sports, statistically much less risky than many other sports
Tell that to the surfer who was helicoptered off Langland beach yesterday with neck injury
Yes that was unlucky (experienced local surfer) and from the aspect of lockdown bad timing, but it was a freak accident and statistically surfing is very safe. Personally I’ve needed medical attention once in 30 years of surfing compared to several from cycling for example.
@molgrips @dove1 the point is they have singled it out. I live walking distance from the beach but won’t surf because you get vigilantees shouting at you or putting it on community Facebook pages. I didn’t surf last lockdown and am unlikely too this time, but it is frustrating given the benefit it has to my well-being.
I’m happy we are having this lockdown but as above, it’s useless unless we shut our borders until the second wave has passed next spring
Some details emerging from WAG today about the new, new normal post Firebreak.
Shops and Gyms will reopen, as will places of Worship. Perhaps slightly cryptically Bars and Restaurants "will serve customers", I'm sure they mean "open", but I suppose that gives them some scope to say they can offer take away services, which will probably kill them off in their dozens a week.
Half-term will have passed, so I'm hoping they'll allow inter-county travel again.
I live walking distance from the beach but won’t surf
same. didn't last time, won't this time, tho I do feel I'm in a minority this time
I heard from a mate that there was well over 30 people out today at a certain sheltered right that everyone would have had to drive too.... including people who had taken holiday to surf. No pretence to hide it either as I see plenty of photos on social media.
If it was sunny, light northerlies and a long period sw swell I might think differently but I can pass up crowded windy dross quite happily...
I have to say I'm starting to question whether I'm going to stick to the "no driving to exercise" rule, looking at the windsurfing forecast for the weekend - no-one else seems to be 🙁
No, and it’s not like you can just say it’s only irresponsible young surfers breaking rules. I had to do some essential travel this morning and drove by a few car-parks on the way back.
Plenty of cars in all of them with people getting kitted out for a blustery walk.
Disregarding the social media forthing about busy car parks, I severely doubt driving to exercise would have any measureable impact on the spread of the virus.
Only thing is, if that's the only thing people are allowed to do - then EVERYONE does it at the same time and there's traffic gridlock at all the beauty spots.
@chakaping - I completely agree. I do not for a second believe it makes any difference to transmission. Equally, given the weather, beauty spots aren’t going to get overcrowded. For both these reasons I think it’s a silly rule.. but it is the rule.
I don’t have an issue with people breaking it either (minor FOMO aside), just it’s quite interesting the stark difference from last lockdown in terms of compliance