[Closed] VW T versus Ford Transit

Lot of it most likely goes back to the air cooled stuff.
A splitty or a bay are achingly 'cool' both in the vw scene and increasingly to none 'scene' people.
Popularity and age lead to some stupid prices.
Stupid prices and the fact (said as an ex bay owner) that they aren't the best vehicles to use for actual camping as opposed to show off type stuff or the odd weekend at a vw show when compared to a newer camper van, mean that the
later water cooled stuff, t25 & T4 got concentrated on by poorer vw people. Move that on to the T5 too in latter years.
Also beetle/golf fans getting older & having kids, still wanting to be part of the scene so sticking with VW but in more modern, safer and bigger vehicles. 2 adults, 2 kids and all required camping kit into a bug?

As usual many 'niche' trendy things move into the mainstream and it becomes the favoured camper of most simply because they are so associated with each other, VW & campervan become synonymous.

There are a good number of people IMHO who only drive a T5 because tee isn't an Audi or BMW van...

As for trades buying Transits over VW, probably price,and dealer experience help Ford there. Plus the Sportline has recently been discounted so if you want a poncey one it's spending big cash up speccing a 'lower' model...

Theres one big reason for trade/ commercial users to choose a transit over a VW - 8'x4' sheets of material. They fit perfectly into Transits, you could maybe jam one or two awkwardly into the VW. Transporters are a Transit-sized van, with any of the costs and inconveniences that brings, that doesn't [i]quite [/i]take a Transit-sized load. 'Transit-sized' is pretty much a unit of measure and lots of goods are designed or packaged to fit into one, meaning they don't fit well into a '97% Transit Sized' van

That has two effects -
One is very few people buy them new as a result of that. So you see far fewer of them on the road.

There are lots of non-trade second users of vans chasing a very small stock of second hand vehicles.

Those second users are looking for a van thats not a 'van'. They want to distinguish themselves from 'van-drivers'. Its often said that for a van Transporters are very car-like to drive. The reality is pretty much all vans have been car-like to drive for the last 20 years, but the T4 was car-like first. That seems to have made VWs the defacto non-van-drivers van.

I suspect it's mainly down to price, that and availability of after market conversion parts available for the VW.

I run a VW T5 as a Camper, was the best van out there at the time for the duty, I bought it before the 'Scene' went mental.

I run a Peugeot Expert for work though, because I could pick up a 1 year old one with 35k miles on it for £8.5k. It's not a patch on the VW in anyway though, but it gets all my junk from A-B and doesn't cost the earth to run. Having said that, when I sell it at 10 years old with 100k on the clock, it'll be all bar worthless. A 10 year old VW with 100k on it still seems to be 'worth' £6+K so maybe it's worth paying up front and driving a nicer van?

I'd seriously look at the new Transits if I needed another work Vehicle, but I still prefer the looks of the VW as a camper.

Having looked into this recently, it seems that the majority of converters focus on VW as they know they can make money doing that. People are less inclined to spend £15k converting a Transit or Vivaro etc even if it is a better base vehicle
Another thing is that in the long term, a converted VW will depreciate less

ot long ago scrapped a 10 year old Mk1 Vito, with 60K on the clock. Engine was brilliant, but trhe rust was terminal! My T5 camper is a 'van for life' and I dont expect it'll succumb to terminal rust in a decade! When I bought a Polo from new a few years ago, I was asking about the 10 year anti corrosion warranty, and if it applied across the whole VW range. The salesman said it did, apart from the Sharan, which used a Ford Galaxy chassis!

compare a 10yr T4 and a 10yr Transit.

thats why...

*sighs*

These are the new 29er threads aren't they?

I had the pleasure of driving a new Transit Luton at the end of last year covering a good few thousand miles and despite me not looking forward to it it was by far the best van I've driven. Far better than our VW or any of the Mercs I've driven. The vw has been popular as it's a bit smaller than the transit and for day today use more practical. I believe the latest transit range includes a smaller version than the traditional transit which may prove popular for conversions.

VW snobbery and herd instinct. "Hey Dude, check out my new T5! Yeah, I'm an individual..."

The Transit Custom is more comparable to a VW T5, and VW should be (if they aren't already) franticly reaching for their drawing boards to see how they will respond.

There is a new full size Transit on the way this year too, which will be a little bit bigger than the current one, and more suitable for meaningful conversion into dayvan/camper/motorhome.

These are the new 29er threads aren't they?

I'm not sure these are as fatal to kittens as the wheel size threads...

The Transit Custom is more comparable to a VW T5, and VW should be (if they aren't already) franticly reaching for their drawing boards to see how they will respond.

[i]But[/i] the T5 won the group test in STW, not the Transit.

transits are for pikeys and ya can get a 8x4 sheet in peice of cake :)P

compare a 10yr T4 and a 10yr Transit.

Real workers use transits, and accordingly they get wrecked, while people "playing" at trades use VW's.

But the T5 won the group test in STW, not the Transit.

What were the criteria for the judging? what gave it the edge over the others

But the T5 won the group test in STW, not the Transit.

I read that and wasn't convinced by the arguments. But I am biased - one of these on the way 😀

[img] [/img]

Well I love my transit. I'd never swap it for a small, overpriced T5.

Pah. None T5 owners are just jealous that they either can't afford or are too wet to splash loads of cash on what is obviously the superior vehicle. 😉

Plenty of 'proper' trades I know use T5s. People but stuff because it's what they want.
If you care that much what other people think of your choice of vehicle I feel sorry for you.

Lots of new Transits around my way now, was beginning to think they were extinct!!

Hmm proper tradie work done here out of a T4 no problem. Now using a Transit Connect still no problem. Would I buy a T5? No. Can't afford it. Happy with T4 at sensible price 6 years ago, very. Seen more VW's out as worky vans today than transits.

I believe the latest transit range includes a smaller version than the traditional transit

Not quite - the new transit custom is the same size as the smallest of the old transit range. What they've done is distinguished that van stylistically (and in branding terms) from the larger/heavier payload models. They're aping VW and merc in that respect - a 2.6t panel van (T5 or Vito) then a more variably specced 3.5t range (Crafters and Sprinters)

With the old range of transits they were using the same few front panels and badge on a massive range of different vans - 2.6t to 3.5t, some with independent suspension, some FWD, some RWD, some chassis cabs with leaf-sprung beam axels - there were about 100 different out-of-the-factory combinations but they called them all a 'Transit'.

So the new Custom is aimed at T5/Vito market but its still properly transit sized, but by not sharing bodywork with the bigger vans it doesn't look as big as the older models

I just use whatever cheap 3.5t van which carries at least 1500kgs and is about 12 feet long inside .It needs to carry an IBC full of water and 2 metre bus shelter panels .That wony fit in a t5 ,and they cost way to much

VW T versus Ford Transit

In Schermamy almost all trades use VW's.... Either T4 or T5s. In fact I've just bought a T5.
Strangely very few Transits compared to the UK.

I have the (dis)pleasure of driving Citroen Jumpers around the alps in summer. Neither of them are a touch on the 400,000km T4.

I unbelievably got 4500 quid for my 07 transit just before Christmas on a part chop deal. That was against a 11500 12 plate. It would seem if they don't look like shit and have low mileage they hold their money reasonably well.

Agree wrightyson

Pa got 5k on his 08 85ps swb low roof with 185k on clock....

Im looking to buy atm. 22k for new custom , 13k for a 3yo mk 7 with c. 30k or 6k for something 5years old and 100k on clock.

Compared to my normal french vans they hold value well enough.

I've had my custom since Feb. brilliant van. Can't really fault it and I've had all the usual suspects except T5. I've had two T4's. Very good but dated now. Custom is the new standard and all the others will respond with new models in the near future. VW said a new one was coming but didn't know when.

This is an immaculate 125 t260 trend so plenty quick enough reasonable payload and a few nice extras but the key was only 13k on the clock. Always find electric mirrors a must tho as I rarely have a passenger in to check for traffic on a particularly oblique junction I use regularly. Thought it was very good value with that part chop price.

mtbmatt - Member
Well I love my transit. I'd never swap it for a small, overpriced T5.

I agree, but seeing as my beloved Transit is MoT failed for rust, maybe a non-rusting vehicle would be a smarter choice.

Ah yes but vw rust too epi. What age and milage was your transit - how long had it spent as a tradies wagon on the road daily not getting washed etc.

Most vws i see seem to live. Show pony lifestyle.

There is a new transit out now, it looks like a custom at the front and has got all new interior.
It is bigger than my mid top transit with a 3.5m load bay,

I was seriously considering a transit, but two things put me off. The size I wanted was a mwb lr transit which are relatively rare, making second hand choice very limited. The swb transit just not long enough load bay once second row seats fitted. The other draw back was the low towing capacity on the smaller lighter transits, T5's can tow 2500kg. I ended up with a lwb T5 2.5 kombi. Another plus is that as its classed an M1 passenger vehicle its not restricted to commercial speed limits. Although it does cost a few extra quid on the ved for the privilege.

I would like a transporter, but the ones with air con are a fortune. We drove to Spain last year and I wouldn't want to do it without Aircon. I liked the look of the vivaro, but the gearbox issues have put me off. It's looking like a vito

Another plus is that as its classed an M1 passenger vehicle its not restricted to commercial speed limits. Although it does cost a few extra quid on the ved for the privilege.

Is that because it's a Kombi? Does that mean I could do the same with my Transit Custom DCIV (ie 6 seats)?

AFAIK vehicle category can't be changed. You can have the number of seats changed on the V5 but the vehicle category will remain the same. The T5 kombi / shuttle / window vans come from the factory as M1. Apparently they use a modified body shell with addional strengthening / stiffening of the side panels for seat belts etc to meet M1 type approval. However it seems it may have been a bit of a grey area as the T5.1 GP kombis are now classed as N1 (commercial).

Cheers for the info mark90. I fancy a day/camper type van (T5 too expensive) but would like 2-3 rear seats and car legal speeds. Do the factory crew cab type vans such as a vivaro come as M1. How do you know which models to look for other than looking at the vehicles reg docs. Versions with seats on rails or folding look the best for flexibilty but i guess these are classed as regular vans.

Is there much difference between M1 passenger vehicle v's motorhome, same van/engine as far as insurance goes for a daily driver and 12k a year?

AFAIK vehicle category can't be changed.

You can change it to a motor-caravan, if you meet the requirements.

Re-registered my transit as a motorhome with dvla. Fill out correct paperwork and lots of photos.

I think that the VW vans are galvanized. So they really don't rust in the same way. Or did I make that up

Presumably if your spending thousands on a van conversion you want to know that the body will go on and on while you replace the mechanicals as there wear out.

Reclassification to motor caravan on the V5 changes the body type and gives you car speed limits, but the vehicle category on the V5 will stay as N1 (commercial vehicle) and the taxation class will also be unchanged, plc. I want through this with my iveco camper. I believe this is the only way to get car speed limits on a vehicle that starts life as an N1 van.

The T5 kombis that are M1 are taxed as diesel car, so pays higher rate based on CO2 emmision than if plg.

I don't know if the Vivaro double cabs are M1, a quick look at a V5 would tell you. I only picked up on the T5 thing from the forums, there are more active forums for T5 due to the 'scene' thing.

Another thought, I wonder what the 8/9 seated 'minibuses' are classed as, Eg Transit Tourneo

My 7 seat Caravelle is M1 / MPV.

most trades round my way use vivaro/trafic not transit. Transit's rust in a couple of years (not so sure about the new ones yet).

mark90 - picking up a trafic crew (double cab) lwb on Sat. tax is 220 per year and insurance is the same as the car it replaces.

Think £220 is the plg rate, so likely classed as N1 commercial vehicle.

Only time ive seen newer transits rust is when tradies havnt had the site damage repaired.

We ran a p reg smiley to 120k over 12 years and it was rusty only on the back door where a bad repair had been done and on the piller that got stoved in in the same incident

Our last transit was 5 years old when we got rid, no rust damage. 180k on the clock- my dad is fastidious about keeping his vehicles clean though- once every two weeks they get. A hand wash

In the process of repairing a sill on a mates transit its 15 years old with 180k on the clock and the sill has only just holed through! Above the cab could do with a good rub and spray mind you but its not as bad as folks make out. Ive seen my share of rusty transporters as well - t4s. How ever lets use the 00 merc vans as a base line for badly rusty vans 🙂

If you have an iPhone you are more likely to purchase a transporter. Fact. 😉

Ha ha I'm on pay as you go hence an old T4.

I think the T5 and T4 break down far more often than other vans as they have huge forums advising of how to repair them. The Transit etc don't seem to need this backup.

I just got stung with my trafic crew, assumed it was M1 (not got V5c doc yet) but got a speeding ticket for doing 60 in a 60 limit, but class in N1, so my limit is only 50.
Any idea if it is possible to get class changed to M1?

Got V5C today and it says number of seats is 2, when it is really 6.

Well I've had my 2008 t5 for three weeks now and am more than happy. 132bhp, over 1000km on one tank (approx <10€/100km), 38mpg average with lots of alpine driving and a bit of motorway. Pulls nicely making overtaking of caravans and motorhomes a breeze. LWB means there's enough room behind the 2nd row for me and the GF to sleep.
Driving position is comfy and cruise control a great plus. Oh, and it'll sit at 150mpg without any problems... Admittedly the mpg dives, but I'm in Germany so it has to be done occasionally. 🙂

Currently dicing with death as I'm driving a Jumper around that keeps cutting out when you accelerate. Oh, the seating position is crap and my foot keeps going numb.

Ive had a MK7 57 plate Transit for 4 years, ive done 60k miles, its needed a set of tyres and a fee bulbs. Passed every MOT without a warning.

Totsl cost of ownership has been incredibly small, and its almost worth what I paid for it 4 years ago. The last garage that MOT'd offered to buy it off me.

Cheaper than a VW,bonkers reliable, more space and pretty nippy at 140bhp.

This thread needs some pictures!

chriswilk, was that a ticket from someone with a gun, or from a static camera? Wasn't sure if the fixed ones check plates to determine speed limit?

While I'm not in the market, I just had a look at Transit Customs, and I like the look of this: http://www.whatvan.co.uk/test-drives/first-drive/first-drive-ford-transit-custom-sport
http://cars.aol.co.uk/2014/01/05/road-test-ford-transit-custom-sport-van/
With 155bhp on tap it should be fairly nippy.

I'm in the market for a new van, and considering both of these. But what about vitos? Yes the older ons are known for bing rot boxes, but the newer ones?

We've got a Vito Sport X at work with about 200BHP plus at work, leather seats etc. Also a T5 Synchro (4 x 4)in a fairly basic spec. They both feel like and drive like, vans. The Merc is fast, nice auto box, but noisy. The VW is pretty grim, IMHO.

spooky b329 - it was a mobile camera unit.
I'd made sure I was doing 60, 'cos I thought that was my limit.