[Closed] Vegetarians- tips on making the transition easier?

Do the transition over a long period. Say 80 years or so.

Keep away from the smell of bacon!

Good luck by the way.

There are loads of brilliant recipes for making truly tasty food. A word of caution, do not make your own vegi-burgers and take em to a barbi, the bloody meat eaters take em all and tell you how nice they are while you suck on a lettuce.

Vegetarians- how did you make the transition? How long did it take? Any tips and guides?

Sorry to be flippant - but just go to bed and when you wake up the next day stop eating meat, it's an overnight thing! No fazing required.

I've done it twice. Once about 20 years ago and then after going back to eating meat about 4 years ago again a few months ago. 20 years ago we hardly ate any meat anyway for financial reasons. This time I didn't eat much because my wife remained veggie so I guess it was easy as I was mostly weaned off before making the change. This time the main thing I missed was the full range of the menu when going out and having a steak as a treat.

Only advice would be to stop the temptation to replace meat with cheese - sure way to becoming fatter as you switch. It's so easy now - so much more choice in the supermarkets and when eating out than thee used to be. We still use some of the quorn style 'substitutes' once every couple of weeks but to be honest I think that's just us being lazy.

it takes a while to see food you can eat rather than see food you cannot.

however it was so long ago, and i did it overnight, i cannot offer any practical advice.

Difficult depending on whether or not one has 'food issues'. Otherwise instantaneous, it's super easy to learn basic nutrition either online or a night in with a good wholefood/veggie book, a pad and a pen to write a shopping list.

Eating out has become much less challenging over the last two decades, but small town pubs are still mostly rubbish for veggie food

We cook recipes from amongst others Ottolenghi, Anjum Anund, the Palomar, Carluccio etc. If you use good flavours and have a mix of textures then life will be good all round. For example if you use Bulgar wheat in chilli then the texture is very satisfying.

cokie - Member
I've started my journey to being a vegetarian.

Out of curiosity; practical or ideological reason for such transition?

Cheers!
I.

Vegetarians- how did you make the transition? How long did it take? Any tips and guides? Any must make recipes?

Like above, made the decision and then stopped. However this does depend on how and what you cook, and who else is eating with you. The important thing is to make sure you're still getting what your body needs, and every body is different. Certainly calcium and iron and the two that spring to mind as being plentiful in meat, but it's not too hard to factor in. Depending on your reasons for it, don't beat yourself up either.

Otherwise there's loads of very good recipes out there; it's a damn sight easier than it was!

Edit: This:

We cook recipes from amongst others Ottolenghi, Anjum Anund, the Palomar, Carluccio etc. If you use good flavours and have a mix of textures then life will be good all round. For example if you use Bulgar wheat in chilli then the texture is very satisfying.

Cheers for the advice guys.
I'm finding it easier than I thought. Big thing that I realize is how much processed food I used to eat when out and about.

I love cooking, so vegetarian dishes add a new dimension to it. Plus lots of home made soup.

I think it's just the protein aspect I'm still working on. Rather easy to get fat and carbs in your diet. I've noticed my muscle recovery is suffering a bit.

Struggling with cutting it out full stop because I cook all the time with my better half and she loves meat.

IvanMTB- Ethical and environmental reasons for me.

Pulses, nuts (try toasting them) loads of stuff will give you protein. Don't go carb heavy especially the poor quality pasta and white rice. We use a lot of veg often raw (a mandolin is your friend). Prepare brilliant tastes.

Marry one - then the decision is made for you

the protein aspect I'm still working on

This is a bit of a myth - unless you lift weights at a very high standard- as we do not need that much- and all the recovery stuff i have seen has been veggie

As for protein beans , pulses, cheese , milk, eggs and nuts or soya protein/whey powder or pea protein

Never try to explain your dietary choice to meat eaters - and you'll be asked again and again - just smile and change the subject!

[url= https://theflexitarian.co.uk/the-flexitarian-diet/ ]flexitarianism[/url]

Firstly good luck

Recipes: Curries !! Herbs & spices become more important, fresh produce too. A lot of meat based cooking is lazy just having the meat as the star of the show. So much great Italian too. Visitingg a few fully vegetarian restaurants is useful for ideas.

I am not vegetarian but eat meat maybe twice a week. Made the change pretty quicky. Note I do eat fish so maybe easier. Also as an fyi we eat virtually no pre-prepared ready meals.

As well as the usual already mentioned above, there are tons of meat substitue products in the supermarkets. Quorn and Linda Mcartney do a fair bit. Some are awfull whilst others are pretty good. Work your way througb the range and see what you like. Warning: the quorn scotch eggs are extreemly adictive.

the protein aspect I'm still working on

I wonder if this is sometimes also shorthand for 'star of the show'. Depending on how traditionally british you tend to eat people are used to have a slab of high protein 'star' with a bunch of veggies in various stages of process arranged to the side to make up the full plate. Veggie meals don't always quite work like that.

You need to find your own mojo, what works for some might not for others. Cut down over a period of time or go cold tofurky.

I like products like Quorn as it means you still get a protein stick or slab or chucks or whatever in a convenient format just like with the meat alternatives. Bangers and mash, hot dogs, chilli, spag bol, burgers with all the trimmings, etc etc. Part of this is just a mindset thing; you wouldn't turn your nose up at a chicken burger because it's not made of beef, so why should vegetable protein be any different?

OTOH, a friend of mine hates the texture of meat or anything vaguely resembling it he so won't touch the stuff. He's gone the other way (which is arguably healthier), lots of veg and grains and stuff. To my mind that's probably better, but it's a bigger leap from a carnivorous diet than just simple replacement.

Wafer thin ham? 😉

Never try to explain your dietary choice to meat eaters - and you'll be asked again and again - just smile and change the subject!

+1

😆

Oh yeah - Tesco sausages. I wouldn't normally condone shopping from them, but they do have a good 'meat replacement' veggie range and their sausages are my personal favourite.

I woke up one day and couldn't face the idea of being responsible for death anymore and haven't eaten meat again since that day. I recommend fidnign some kind meat alternatives so you don't have to give up your favourite stuff. Some suggestions -

Sausages: Sainsburys Cumberland style and the Quorn one sare good. I quite like the Linda McCartney ones too but not everyone does.
Beige food: Fry's and Quorn do great nuggets, escalopes, breaded fillets etc.
Mince: I reckon soy mince is nicer than Quorn mince but both are good. The Fry's one is gross.
Burgers: Fry's and Quorn are great again. Morrisons do a nice own brand one.
Crispy duck/pulled pork etc: holy shit the veggie versions of these are great.

Past that just cook whatever you used to that wasn't just 'meat + whatever'. Any kind of stew/soup/casserole/baked dish/stirfry/curry etc can be made veggie. You don't have to start from scratch with a whole new set of recipes.

Ethical and environmental reasons for me.

When in uni (12ish years ago now), in the context of geography/demographics studies we were taught that eating meat helps reduce our (detrimental) environmental impact. This was based on a comparison of the square hectares needed to feed an individual if hunter-gatherer or vegetarian or meat-eater.

From an environmental point of view I think eating meat isn't nearly as problematic as how the animals are reared, and how much we over eat and throw away.

Back to the point though - best way to eat veggie: find the sikhs and/or hindus in your area and learn from them. They make vegetarian food so good I could quite easily forego steak and lobster!!!

there are tons of meat substitue products in the supermarkets.
...
Some are awfull whilst others are pretty good

That's a very good point. They do vary quite wildly both between brands and products. Stuff that replaces flavoured meats tends to work particularly well, as you can just replicate the same flavourings. The Tivall hotdogs are indistinguishable from (what I vaguely remember now of) Plumrose 'pork' hotdogs, for instance, and Tesco's own brand aren't far behind. The Quorn hotdogs OTOH, not that great.

Quorn mince is a handy staple to have on hand for stews and chilli and such, to add a bit of protein. The thing to watch though is you can't boil it for a week like you might do with meat, or you end up with slurry. Either flash-fry it first (which is what I'd do for a chilli, along with a few drops of MSG / Marmite / soy sauce maybe) or chuck it in ten minutes before the end of cooking a sauce (eg, spag bol). The larger Quorn chunks don't really suffer from this, it's just the mince that can be a bit disintegratey if you overcook it.

Sorry to be flippant - but just go to bed and when you wake up the next day stop eating meat, it's an overnight thing! No fazing required.
I've done it twice.

Seems like good advice

20 years ago we hardly ate any meat anyway for financial reasons.
This time I didn't eat much because my wife remained veggie so I guess it was easy as I was mostly weaned off before making the change.

But you've never tried it personally 😉 😆

As an omnivore the only things that allow me to enjoy a vegetarian meal are tangy cheese and spices. And a little more salt than usual on the top.

From an environmental point of view I think eating meat isn't nearly as problematic as how the animals are reared, and how much we over eat and throw away.

Yes. Most studies seem to talk about intensive US style beef. I'd like to know the environmental impact of hill-reared Welsh lamb (since you can't really do much else with the land) compared to flying legumes around the world.

Wafer thin ham?

I'll say one thing for the carnivores, they never cease to come up with original and witty jokes that we've never heard before.

I think the issue for many people (me included) is that simply replacing the meat with beans just isn't satisfying. Maybe some find it easier, maybe that's why some people complain about veggie food and others don't. Perhaps we have different guts and different brains.

Hence why I try to find things that do make it satisfying, as mentioned in my earlier post.

I think the issue for many people (me included) is that simply replacing the meat with beans just isn't satisfying.

Don't do that, then.

I don't, that's what I was talking about.

Ah! Misunderstood your meaning, sorry.

Yes. Most studies seem to talk about intensive US style beef. I'd like to know the environmental impact of hill-reared Welsh lamb (since you can't really do much else with the land) compared to flying legumes around the world.

I went down this route - a meat eater who only ate responsibly and ethically reared meat from locations that made sense environmentally. Or as other people liked to say, a fussy f****er. It was just so much easier to go back to being veggie - took the thinking and rationalising out of it. Especially when I really only ate meat when at friends houses or at a pub/restaurant.

If I every get to own a welsh hill farm (or bit there of, or even next door) I'd go back to eating it then. Ideally it wold have a river with trout and salmon at the bottom of the valley!

Thinking about it.. plain unadorned meat stuck in a hot pan can be one of the most incredibly savoury and amazing experiences. Vegetables just aren't like that.

The only veg ingredients I can think of that are as amazing in their pure form are cheese and spices. I think mushrooms probably could offer such a complex taste experience, but personally not much of a fan.

If I every get to own a welsh hill farm (or bit there of, or even next door) I'd go back to eating it then

Just buy Welsh lamb or free range chicken from Asda, if you want to. Or your local farm shop. Not trying to persuade you, just saying that local more eco-friendly options are available. You can probably get wild meat too.

Just buy Welsh lamb or free range chicken from Asda, if you want to. Or your local farm shop. Not trying to persuade you, just saying that local more eco-friendly options are available. You can probably get wild meat too.

As I said though - I don't eat it at home so only whats available in restaurants etc. Which to be fair is pretty good now. And then friends see you eating meat and then you turn you nose up when at theirs as their meat is 'not good enough'. That's how it's perceived anyway.

Free range chickens - covers a variety of conditions that.

Eating out has become much less challenging over the last two decades

Yep, I went vegetarian about 35 years ago and it was a bit harder to find stuff.
If you want to know what it was like back then just vists middle America.

Agree with the overnight approach though, but all depends why you are vegetarian. If it is moral/ethical enlightenment then why not immediate. If for health/other reasons then I suppose it doesn't really matter.

What is disappointing is that the number of vegetarians doesn't seem to be any higher (in % terms) than it was 40 years ago. Thought a few more people would have cared by now.

Thought a few more people would have cared by now.

Well that's quite a combative statement....

and lo it did come to pass that the thread became about molly

For the last few years I'd give up meat from my birthday in mid-November to Christmas - six weeks. This year I carried on into the new year. Now I don't miss meat at all. Not even bacon butties!

I suspect it's like fags. Once you nail 6 weeks the attachment is purely psychological. Maybe meat is just a bad habit too...

For sure. "We've always done it this way" is a poor but very compelling reason for doing things.

I had it for a while with alcohol. I got into the habit of having a drink whilst making tea. It got to a point where I didn't think about it, didn't necessarily want it, it was just my routine; stick my headphones on, pour a drink, start cooking. I've knocked it on the head now, but breaking that habit was surprisingly difficult - not because I was an addict per se but because it was just part of the routine then all of a sudden when I stop I'm denying myself of something. I suppose smoking is the same; if you always have a cigarette after a meal say then you've got this "x then y" mentality and that's hard to break.

Rather than viewing it as depriving yourself of something, look at is an opportunity to try lots of new things. I was never a big meat eater in the first place so it wasn't a massive change for me, but my diet is immeasurably better since I went veggie. It took a lot of the trauma out of eating (in hindsight I've always had an issue with eating meat), I'm a lot more experimental in the kitchen and am making and eating things I wouldn't have dreamed of in my 20s.

Fajitas for tea tonight.

For a long time I was essentially a veggie, kind of without realising, as I just didn't eat meat from one month to the next.

Currently it's only really convention that has me eating meat. As someone said earlier, the "star of the show" mentality.

I don't think I would miss it if I put some more effort into cooking though, rather than the "lazy" traditional options.

(I don't really like bacon sarnies, so hurdle #1 sorted)

When in uni (12ish years ago now), in the context of geography/demographics studies we were taught that eating meat helps reduce our (detrimental) environmental impact. This was based on a comparison of the square hectares needed to feed an individual if hunter-gatherer or vegetarian or meat-eater

Either you went to a really shit uni or you didnt understand what they were telling you that day!!!

Good recipe books help tremendously. Plus an open mind when it comes to trying things.

[tedious]1 reply before someone said bacon[/tedious]

🙄

cokie - Member
IvanMTB- Ethical and environmental reasons for me.

Thanks mate. Always interested in people's motives.

It is extremely interesting sociological subject.

CHeers!
I.

Add MSG to all your veg to make them taste good. 😛

The secret to good vegetarian food is MSG ... try it ... that's what they use in the far east. 😛

Recipes: Curries !! Herbs & spices become more important, fresh produce too. A lot of meat based cooking is lazy just having the meat as the star of the show. So much great Italian too.

I would echo what Jambalaya says above. Rather than trying to find substitutes which will mimic the flavour and taste of meat, focus on cooking and eating really good food which just happens not to have any meat in it.

It's no accident that Italian and Indian cuisines have really good tasting vegetarian food. Meat was/is expensive and most great cuisines are based on peasant cooking, which has always made the very best of what is both available, e.g. in season, and cheap.

As Jamabalya also says, good quality fresh produce is even more important when you strip out meat and are often relying on fewer ingredients to provide the flavours and taste sensations. For example, buy the best quality tomatoes, especially if they are the main part of a dish, and use fresh herbs rather than dried (except for oregano).

[tedious]1 reply before someone said bacon 🙄 [/tedious]

Yes I'm aware of that thanks.

I included it at end of what I wrote, because that's what literally everyone used to say to me for the seven years or so that I didn't eat meat (hardly)

🙄

most great cuisines are based on peasant cooking, which has always made the very best of what is both available, e.g. in season, and cheap.

And some great stuff is based on the exact opposite.

Old/bad wine, stale cheese and stale bread.

Mix it up and have a traditional Tyrolean fondue, delicious ! 🙂

I'm a part-time veggie. When I am at home it is easy, Mrs BGL is committed. When I am travelling for work it is harder, if pushed I tend to go for fish but sometimes there really isn't much choice if you want to eat a decent meal.

Since its only every once in a while I don't worry about it. The main benefit is I very rarely (like once every 6 months) eat cheap processed meat.

I don't miss bacon at all; a decent fish dish is what I will cave in for.

The two books by Anna Jones are brilliant. Never had a disappointing meal from them.

Interesting discussion and also some great advice, cheers all!
Must explore with more spices. Veggie curry sounds nice.

Tend to ignore meat substitutes. I do like humus and falafels though and other Moroccon style food.

Curries are great fun. And can be extraordinarily tasty and varied. My current favourite is cauli and coconut curry served with a killer rice dish (premium basmati, caraway seeds, crispy caramelised onion, cinnamon stick, clove, saffron and cardamom)

On the subject of 'satisfying' veggie food - I've been bugging Mrs MR to furnish me with a recipe for her esteemed puy/dark-green lentil and mushroom casserole/bolognaise-y thing. It gets used in a number of subsequent recipes, ie topped with mustard/horseradish mashed taters as a pie, or with spaghetti, etc.

Disclaimer - I eat meat, fish, cheese. She's veg(g)an.

Saying that, I must eat on average 70-90% vegan food these last few years and enjoy it massively. Love food, love cooking. Have learned a lot. Us Brits often have a weird thing against veg/wholefoods. I was raised on soggy tasteless veg, everything boiled. Meat was the only tasty thing on the plate. Took me a long time to learn that you have to love cooking veg, buy (or better still grow) good stuff where available, not rubbish, value it and prepare with care to combine bring the flavours out, just as with good meat dishes.

She still won't come up with That Lentil Thing recipe though - stating it was 'different every time'. I know one thing - it tastes plate-licking good, and hearty. I will make a supreme effort to get it and post it up here next week. There's also a vegan 'parmesan' on the agenda, made from processed cashews and some other stuff.

When someone asks 'what does she eat?' - you can more or less guarantee the enquirer probably eats variations of just few different meats, potatoes, cheese, supermarket bread etc with some obligatory peas or carrots for a bit of colour at the side of the plate.. I understand that irony as was raised on just that. Everything was grey and beige. When a diet/cooking repertoire is already so narrow you may of course imagine that a veggie/vegan's repertoire must naturally be limited to the same tiny range of foodstuffs - yet minus meat! 'Who can survive on peas and carrots'? Lettuce even?

Don't all leaves/shoots/fungi/beans/roots/grains/fruits/nuts/brassicas/bean-curds/vegetable/oils/seeds/etc etc etc all taste the same? Well - no they don't. And they also taste differently when cooked in differing ways. Does coconut taste like chestnut? Does pearl barley taste like rice? Does walnut oil taste like sunflower oil? Do sprouting beans taste like beansprouts? Yams taste like new potatoes? Bombay potatoes taste like cauliflower bhaji? Does roasted purple carrot and fennel taste like (frozen) boiled orange carrots and peas? No.

OP - once you start combining selections of the thousands of foodstuffs and spices available to a veggie- you can access more different recipes than you could cook in a lifetime! We have some older veggie friends who cook mostly old-school seasonal veg wholefood recipes, majority of imgredients British/locally sourced. And it is good. Simple and hearty. They taught me how nut-roasts from a supermarkets are deservedly scorned . It's like a kind of Paxo stuffing! The real home-made nut-roasts can be addictively tasty and filling with excellent texture and moisture. A staple. A bit like haggis if I had to describe it.

Today was lazy and gobbed a Morrisons 'The Best' cheese and onion pasty and a Subway salad bowl

Mmmm food.

*Edit*. Gulp, sorry for the essay 😳

I was starting typing a lengthy reply to that but really, it's just *applause* from beginning to end.

Marry one - then the decision is made for you

Ha, I did. Not an idealogical veggie though, I'm still omnivore, I just eat meat out rather than cooking it at home. Have gone for weeks/months as veggie though, usually a January or lent thing.

Indian food is key, a huge proportion of India is pure veg and there's a massive variety across the country. It's not all spicy curries. Look for Middle Eastern recipies too, lots of good veg ones that work well.

What was good for us at the time was the wife signing up for Gousto meal box things, we got two new veg recipies a week with the ingredients, so no faffing about or remembering to get that special thing needed in the weekly shop. We stopped after about 6 months as the veg ones were getting samey but we have a dozen great recipies that we cook regularly now.

Marry one - then the decision is made for you

About to marry one..

I've been vegetarian (well pescatarian as I convinced her to eat fish) for about 4 years now. Had a couple of slip ups from not reading the ingredients on a few things which caught me off guard (gelatin in store bought cake!?!).

Highly recommend Ella's cook books/website for "special" meals, the ingredients come across as a bit pompous/expensive BUT they're used across the book as base ingredients : https://deliciouslyella.com/

Favourite ones are:
[url= http://www.lakeland.co.uk/r80971/Deliciously-Ell a's-Black-Bean-Burgers]Black Bean Burgers[/url]
[url= https://deliciouslyella.com/sweet-potato-and-chickpea-stew/ ]Sweet potato & chickpea curry stew[/url]

Being vegetarian is easier now than it's ever been with supermarkets producing their own brand vegetarian stuff (burgers/sausages etc) plus quorn & Linda McCartney have really upped their game over the last year or so. For instance Linda McCartney do a pulled pork burger, hard to distinguish between it and what I remember from my meat eating days.

When in uni (12ish years ago now), in the context of geography/demographics studies we were taught that eating meat helps reduce our (detrimental) environmental impact. This was based on a comparison of the square hectares needed to feed an individual if hunter-gatherer or vegetarian or meat-eater

Either you went to a really shit uni or you didnt understand what they were telling you that day!!!

Or he forgot what they actually said.....

(well pescatarian as I convinced her to eat fish)

Why? Out of interest

Get into cooking Indian food, there are loads of brilliant ways to not eat meat that way. Veggie samosas, chana gobi, tarka dahl... om nom nom.

Lentils are a really good way to thicken a sauce and make it satisfying too, sometimes purely veg-based stuff can taste a little bit 'thin' so I'm starving again in half an hour! 😆

Marry one - then the decision is made for you

Definitely easier if the whole household is doing the same thing. I was veggie for years before getting together with Mrs B, she was omnivore. Lasted about a year before I went back to omnivorism. A few years later she went veggie and is now vegan. I'm now veggie again and going vegan (there was an awful lot of dairy in my diet so that's needed a fair bit of thought.)

Get some good cook books and do some research. It's a great opportunity to think a bit more about the stuff you shovel down. There's a whole new world of different ingredients that you've probably never even heard of to explore which likely far outweighs the stuff you now don't eat.

Find it amusing when people question whether I'm getting enough protein/calcium/whatever yet have not a clue as to the nutritional content of their own diets 🙂

Vegetarians- how did you make the transition? How long did it take? Any tips and guides?

Do your research. Plan your meals. Just stop buying stuff that isn't veggie/vegan. It's so much easier with the choices available these days than it was 20 years ago!

It's no accident that Italian and Indian cuisines have really good tasting vegetarian food. Meat was/is expensive and most great cuisines are based on peasant cooking, which has always made the very best of what is both available, e.g. in season, and cheap.

+1

And Malvern Rider's post is bang on the money.

I should add, after reading the pescatarian comments, that I eat fish too (although that may soon stop). I stopped eating meat for ethical reasons, but worked around the Med and in European mountains for a few years; getting non-meat food was pretty difficult if eating out. Even now we only eat fish once or twice a week, but I do appreciate the irony or still eating it, especially with certain breeds being over-fished.

When in uni (12ish years ago now), in the context of geography/demographics studies we were taught that eating meat helps reduce our (detrimental) environmental impact. This was based on a comparison of the square hectares needed to feed an individual if hunter-gatherer or vegetarian or meat-eater

Either you went to a really shit uni or you didnt understand what they were telling you that day!!!

The uni I went to is well respected. Perhaps I did misunderstand.

I've had my morning coffee so am happy for you enlighten me.

I've had my morning coffee so am happy for you enlighten me.

At the most simplistic level of thinking of course the vegetarian diet is the most calorifically efficient (what has the greatest calorific value - the 18 month old beef cow or the food it ate over it's lifetime) but obviously it's a bit more complicated than that as what we choose to eat instead of meat does not have the same environmental impact to be grown and delivered as the food fed to the animals. Apparently there has been some research in the states recently that claims a vegetarian diet has more impact than the average American meat eaters diet but it's been widely criticised by others.

[quote="cokie"]I think it's just the protein aspect I'm still working on. Rather easy to get fat and carbs in your diet. I've noticed my muscle recovery is suffering a bit.Massive red herring, unless you are training [i]hard[/i] for 10-12 or more hours a week you'll get all you need in your diet. And if you are doing that sort of training, I'd hope that diet was on your list of "things to think about".

It's more likely the change in your diet rather than a lack of available protein. One bonus of changing to veggie, is you will look at your food more carefully and eat less shit.

[quote="kerley"]Thought a few more people would have cared by now.Whut? Care enough to get free range meat, eggs, bacon, fish and so on. Eat a fair bit of veggie food anyway (probably half our weekly meals are veggie).

what has the greatest calorific value - the 18 month old beef cow or the food it ate over it's lifetime

Ah yes, but - cows and sheep can eat grass, which we can't - and that grows happily on its own.

Which goes back to the question of how the beef is raised in the first place. Comparing intensive corn fed US beef is one thing - hill raised Welsh lamb is another.

Not all land is the same and can produce the same stuff.

[quote=convert ]At the most simplistic level of thinking of course the vegetarian diet is the most calorifically efficient (what has the greatest calorific value - the 18 month old beef cow or the food it ate over it's lifetime) but obviously it's a bit more complicated than that as what we choose to eat instead of meat does not have the same environmental impact to be grown and delivered as the food fed to the animals.

More to the point, you'd have to eat an awful lot of grass in order to get the same calories as in that steak (probably a lot more than the cow processed in order to make it). Less the case for cows as you could grow things other than grass on the land they normally live on, but plenty of lambs grazing on land which isn't good for much else.

Back to the OP - have you told everybody you're a vegetarian yet? I understand that is a vital part of the transition 😉

nickc
(well pescatarian as I convinced her to eat fish)
Why? Out of interest

No real reason to be honest 😆

Ah yes,

And most cows that we eat are the waste product from the diary industry. Its what happens to all the calves that are either not required for milk or are male so no use to the diary industry.

So for veggies who still eat dairy what would you do with all the cows produced by the diary industry?

 

Less the case for cows as you could grow things other than grass on the land they normally live on

Less the case for cows as you could grow things other than grass on the land they normally live on

Which is why I've always been slightly conflicted and on the fence.

Less the case for cows as you could grow things other than grass on the land they normally live on

Like what? Not sure large scale lentil and bean production is viable in this country? Or is it? Genuinely not sure.. don't seem to see much of that being grown but is that simply becauese meat is more profitable?

So for veggies who still eat dairy what would you do with all the cows produced by the diary industry?

Suspect a lot of veggies would be vegan if they knew how the dairy industry operated...

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/mar/30/dairy-scary-public-farming-calves-pens-alternatives

Ashamed to say that despite being veggie for many years, I'd never given dairy much thought and was largely ignorant of how the industry worked.

Yes, there's an argument that vegetarianism whilst eating dairy doesn't make a lot of sense.

ethically it makes zero sense. It's cruel to eat chickens, but not to throw them live into a macerator https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ee6_1391310852

I woke up one day and couldn't face the idea of being responsible for death anymore and haven't eaten meat again since that day.

Probs best not to think about all the animals that die and the habitats that are destroyed in vegetable production then.

Personally I think veganism is totally admirable - can't help thinking vegetarianism is a bit of a halfway house that's an easy way of feeling more virtuous without having to really think too much. That's not meaning to sound trolly though I can see how its going to be perceived as such.

I watched this with a class last year, well worth a look

And most cows that we eat are the waste product from the diary industry. Its what happens to all the calves that are either not required for milk or are male so no use to the diary industry.

Is this true? I don't think it is.

Is this true? I don't think it is.

It isn't true.

the diary industry

Seems legit.

It isn't true.

No? What happens to all the bulls then?

No? What happens to all the bulls then?

http://www.thedrum.com/news/2012/05/31/channel-4-receives-58-complaints-over-graphic-calve-killing

"The practice is common in the industry, 90,000 male calves shot dead each year because there is no market for them "