[Closed] Universally critically-lauded artists that you just can't stand

On the Billy Joel front, he’s far from genius, and rarely (if ever?) critically lauded, but I think he’s a decent songwriter.

He's the epitome of mediocrity.

Which part of “don’t care” do you not understand.

Sorry I thought we were attempting to have a discussion. As you were, rant away.

Not sure "The Foos" are universally lauded?

We could def have another thread for "hugely successful artists that you just find a bit bland".

We could even allow Coldplay in that one.

Nickc - Are you a student? You seem very righteous about things that don't matter.

“A few good songs…repeated over and over…”

Does this mean the Quo are out?

:O

Just for the sake of argument:

https://theweek.com/articles/827454/strange-death-easy-listening

Must have been mentioned already but Bob Dylan is a very difficult listen for me. I give him grudging respect as a songwriter but his voice is just horrid, and that was in his prime, I gather it's far worse now.

I'm with StuartMaconie that "All right thinking people respect and love the Beatles. Never trust anyone who doesn’t". Good piece on McCartney vs Lennon here Some patchiness but so much material and when it's good its great (discovered his 1998 ambient Techno album released and the Fireman on the back of that piece)

ABBA too.

But Led Zep I've never understood the reverence for. Nor Pink Floyd (though I've had times when I've been into them) and though I had a period of liking The Doors can't stand them now either. It might be the pompousness of them all that does it.

Elton John I've never got understood - some amazing songs but such an unlikely star. Can't quite work out how he ever fitted into a 'scene' and whether he'd have made it in a later era.

More recent stuff - Foo Fighters. So average.

We could even allow Coldplay in that one.

NO! Coldplay should never be allowed anywhere, ever.

Sorry I thought we were attempting to have a discussion.

Saying “what bit of history don’t you understand” is not discussion, if you want to chat, dial back the gain on your terse setting...

Tracey Emin.

Bob Dylan a poor singer! Shock horror. You mean like Tom Waits, Roger Chapman. Joe Cocker (how is Joe these days?) et al?

Some of the most characterful voices are less than musical.

A lot of mine are repeats from above

ABBA make my teeth itch
Never liked Bob Dylan
Paul McCartney should have bowed out gracefully 30 years ago

I crossed “Coldplay” out on the bingo card very early.

That link that Thols posted has a good point made in a load of BS 🙂

It's true that Easy Listening has underrated stuff lumped in there - listen to Dionne Warwick's recordings of Bacharach and David songs, they are brilliant compositions, performances and good recording too. But his premise of 'there's no vinyl of Jimi Hendrix in the shops' is because anyone with them is hanging onto them not getting rid, even if some of the EasyListening albums did outsell by the boatload (Tijuana brass!). Also the beatles are a great example of well recorded pop songs that have distorted guitars so I don't know why he moans about that....
There is also a lot of dross EasyListening - James Last ? Perry Como ? Jim Reeves ? no thanks

Where is everyone on the Bee Gees? While it’s easy to scoff, there are undoubtedly some tracks that you have to be dead to not tap your feet along with and the number of no1 singles and album sales are phenomenal

Saying “what bit of history don’t you understand” is not discussion, if you want to chat, dial back the gain on your terse setting…

Its also not a discussion if you dont read what the other poster wrote and just carry on ranting, but dont you worry kid, crack on.

Some of the most characterful voices are less than musical.

Wayne Coyne being the standout. I mean his singing is *terrible* but The Flaming Lips are an amazing live band. I hated the Smiths until a few years ago - just couldn't get past Morrissey's voice and delivery.

The BeeGees are fantastic (the new doc on Sky Docs is worth a watch). Some stuff does get tired from being overplayed - I can imagine if you were listening to US radio with it's notoriously small playlists at a time when the BeeGees had I think 6 records in the top ten, even more if you were a DJ playing it, it would have started to grate. But just *listen* to Stayin Alive (or even better this remix...

The beat, the baseline, the horns, the strings - just the *groove* of it.

but dont you worry kid, crack on

thanks Grandad 👍

he’s allowed a bank to use Like a rolling stone in an advert. That is not an act of revolution, that is literally selling out to “the man”

By this measure, the beastie boys are more revolutionary than Bob will ever be.

And just exactly what has any of the above have on Bobs songwriting ability? You do realise that there is a metaphorical as well as literal interpretation of revolution, yes? It’s not all dope, guns and ****ing in the streets. Do you think that perhaps the intervening, oh, 50-odd years passage of time might have affected how he feels about things (considering he tried to completely disassociate himself from the whole voice of a generation thing from the off)? Your interpretation comes across as, well, naive to me.

Not sure what the beasties were dragged into it for, but they both coexist in my world, I’m a big fan of both.

PJ Harvey

yep. Ticks every box: Original Peel Darling (OPD) critically acclaimed Jules Holland Regular (JHR), frequently praised in the Guardian (PIG). Just a bit draggy and tedious. Like Nick Cave.

ABBA? I've a memory I'm trying to repress of a karaoke rendition of Dancing Queen in an East London pub. Thank god, repressed it again. Obv great melodies, three in every song, and great straight ahead pop music, but they do plod somewhat.

There is also a lot of dross EasyListening – James Last ? Perry Como ? Jim Reeves ? no thanks

The sort of stuff you would hear on the Light Programme before The Beatles changed everything.

Dylan?

Great piece from Bill Drummond: https://www.theguardian.com/music/2007/oct/02/folk

But in 2000, I still suffered from a persistent belief that those three Dylan albums were not only the greatest albums ever made, but in 200 years' time they would be considered the high-water mark of rock'n'roll as an art form. There is nothing worse than a middle-aged man thinking the music of his youth is somehow vastly superior to what is being made and played today. I did the only honourable thing: I took the albums to Oxfam.

Bob and Woody were revolutionary for a select group of rebellious middle class white people in the 60s (the Boomers) who had spare cash to buy their records. that’s absolutely as far as they go music wise. I’d say given the current state of popular music, Grandmaster Flash has had more influence than Bob has ever had.

the Beastie Boys got dragged in as they have a ban on their music being used commercially. So in that respect as least they have the backbone that Bob doesn’t, eh...

The following fill me with rage

Lady Gaga (Turn it off she writes songs by getting a dictionary and picking words at random)
Robbie Williams (Cant stand the bloke)
Abba (Cheesy irritating nonsense)
Michael Bublee (just covers other songs and does nothing original)

Overrated

Foo fighters - (All their songs sound the same)
The Doors - (I don't get what makes them so good?)

.
There is also a lot of dross EasyListening – James Last ? Perry Como ? Jim Reeves ? no thanks

Good prompt, just been listening to a bit of Gentleman Jim Reeves (probably have him more as country than easy listening tbh)

+1 on Robbie Williams and the doors - proper turn the radio off music.

Bob and Woody were revolutionary for a select group of rebellious middle class white people in the 60s (the Boomers) who had spare cash to buy their records.

That is a highly reductive interpretation that shows your prejudices.

So in that respect as least they have the backbone that Bob doesn’t, eh…

Eh (as in?), indeed!

That is a highly reductive interpretation that shows your prejudices.

given this is a thread about critically lauded musical acts you can’t stand, I would hate to be unclear...

Eh (as in?), indeed

Bob (the revolutionary) has sold out, the Beastie Boys have not

I love how so many people are vehemently trying to justify why they don't like certain artists/bands. There is loads of music I can't stand but it is all personal.... nothing to do with quality. I hate Amy Winehouse personally just because I do. Same reason I hate blueberries... just doesn't work for my tastes

Same reason I hate blueberries… just doesn’t work for my tastes

A dislike of blueberries is so deeply foolish, I don't know where to start..

Same reason I hate blueberries

heathen

“Grandad”

There’s another one crossed off. I’m going to get a line soon.

are you going to get a hooker to go with it?

Is “the Beatles changed everything” not on your bingo card DD?

No, too obvious.

There is nothing worse than a middle-aged man thinking the music of his youth is somehow vastly superior to what is being made and played today.

Agree with this, but a middle-aged man forcing himself to abandon the music he loved in his youth (and for years afterwards) because he feels it is no longer 'cool' is sadder still.

Bob (the revolutionary) has sold out, the Beastie Boys have not

Bob never was a revolutionary. He never claimed (or wanted) to be. It was his songwriting that was. He can’t fit your punk rock ideals 10-20 years before they existed. He was an activist for a while though (before it all got a bit mental).

The beastie boys were dicks. Fortunately they realised this (and apologised). One of the reasons I like them. But they ain’t no CRASS, Minor Threat (or Fugazi)... ****ing corporate sell out whores... 🤪

I'm not sure that Gen X-ers tend to be as boorish and blinkered about the music of their youth being "best" in the way that baby boomers often are.

In my late teenage years/early 20s I was mad about My Bloody Valentine and similar acts - as well as some amazing dance music being produced and played out in the clubs I went to.

Hip-hop was coming of age at the same time, with Public Enemy, NWA and the aforementioned Beasties.

That was longer ago from now than the Beatles were from then (if that makes sense), but maybe because that was the start of a subculture that's still going strong - it feels much less remote and the music of my youth doesn't feel so distinct from current stuff.

Or am I just being smug about "my music" being so influential?

That was longer ago from now than the Beatles were from then (if that makes sense), but maybe because that was the start of a subculture that’s still going strong – it feels much less remote and the music of my youth doesn’t feel so distinct from current stuff.

This never ceases to knock me sideways.

This never ceases to knock me sideways.

Haha, but did the 60s stuff just feel so old-fashioned because I was so young?

Are there any 20-year-olds in who could comment on whether Slam's Positive Energy or Hardfloor - Acperience sound really dated to them now?

Agree with this, but a middle-aged man forcing himself to abandon the music he loved in his youth (and for years afterwards) because he feels it is no longer ‘cool’ is sadder still.

Bill Drummond's words not mine. He relapsed and bought Dylan's greatest hits (found it in his hand getting back in the car at a motorway services) and had to chuck it out of the car window. My reading is he did this because he liked it too much, it's now comfort zone stuff and no longer challenging, and he likes a challenge. Me, I like Dylan. What can you do?

(And Dylan was challenging in its day. I must rewatch Coen brothers' inside llewyn davis. Fantastic film with a great performance from Justin Timberlake...)

He never claimed (or wanted) to be

if you handily skip over the Evangelical Christian phase, when he absolutely did, but hey, who hasn’t declared themselves a Prophet of the Lord every now and again. I guess that’ll be the “mental” bit, right?

I’ll give you this, Bob Dylan absolutely pioneered the faux intellectual arrogant “misunderstood artist” trope that so many have followed. If anything; that’s his legacy

I'm really struggling to see the point of people trying to tell others they are wrong about the artists they don't like, but hey, this is STW.

Chakaping I know some folk in their early 20s who love stuff like Hardfloor and Slam.

Are there any 20-year-olds in who could comment on whether Slam’s Positive Energy or Hardfloor – Acperience sound really dated to them now?

I think not nearly so much. There hasn't been a 'musical revolution' in the way that Acid/House/Techno/Jungle were in the years since.

Releases from artists like Bicep, Four Tet wouldn't have sounded out of place back then and are big now. We've got an 19 year old godson and we share a surprising amount of music in common.

I’m really struggling to see the point of people trying to tell others they are wrong about the artists they don’t like

As I said at the top of page 3: It's pointless. Seems to have become the theme of this thread though.

I'm enjoying myself though, so that counts for something, right?

I’m enjoying myself though,

I'd rather people didn't.

"I was born like this I had no choice, I was born with the gift of a golden voice" - The Late, great Leonard Cohen, not taking himself so seriously ....

if you handily skip over the Evangelical Christian phase, when he absolutely did, but hey, who hasn’t declared themselves a Prophet of the Lord every now and again.

I’m happy to to be honest. Especially as you’re conveniently moving the goal post as there is nothing particularly ‘revolutionary’ about a Jew declaring themselves a prophet (there’s a 6,000 year tradition, in fact there’s a whole book about it if you care for some research...).

I really find your obvious intense hatred of the man weird and wonder at just what flames this.

You keep forgetting to acknowledge his nobel prize for some reason, surely that’s a legacy less bitter people are going to go with?

Can't believe Genensis haven't been mentioned yet and only a meagre votes for Phil Collins.

Also on my 'can't stand list' are Blur, KISS, Smiths / Morrissey, Leonard Cohen, The Who

There hasn’t been a ‘musical revolution’ in the way that Acid/House/Techno/Jungle were in the years since.

I suppose that's true if you ignore grunge, R&B, brit pop and the rest of it. My dad said something similar about the music I liked 🙂

I can't think of any critically-lauded artists I really can't stand. Apart from Pink Floyd, they're shite.

I really find your obvious intense hatred of the man weird and wonder at just what flames this.

Story: He once refused to go into a restaurant as the maitre'D didn't instantly recognise him....

You keep forgetting to acknowledge his nobel prize for some reason, surely that’s a legacy less bitter people are going to go with?

Ah the Nobel, sorry, yes, Refused to go as there would be a live audience...(that weren't there just to see him),  so went in private, Wouldn't give a speech, (which you have to do to get the prize money) but did write an essay just before the deadline, so that they had to give him the money in the end. Speaks volumes about the man dontcha' think?...what did Irvine Walsh say...[checks notes] ah yes; "this is an ill conceived nostalgia award wrenched from the rancid prostates of senile, gibbering hippies" although he does declare himself a fan, so y'know, praise indeed....

For the record I don't have an intense hatred of the man, but honestly never has there been an artist who believes his own hype quite as much as Bob... but you seem to be intent on trying (as others have have said) to persuade me that I'm wrong...so you know, I'm just throwing brick bats...You're the one trying to head them into your own net.

Nickc none of your criticisms seem to be based on his song writing ability which is what he is "critically lauded" for, certainly aint his singing ability. You seem keen to play the man not the music.

Thanks A_A i was literally just about to type pretty much exactly your post... play the ball, not the man.

For someone who professes indifference you know more about the ****er than I do, you seem obsessed with him.

And, yes, he’s a dick. I believe there’s phrases such as feet of clay and never meet your heroes would cover most of it. And?

Irrespective of his reaction to it, he’s the only songwriter to be given one, maybes try addressing that (after all it was you who was after some ‘proof’).

I used to have a live version of Blowin’ in the wind that was the best comedy record I’ve ever owned. He sounded like somebody doing an impression of Kermit the Frog doing an intentionally bad impression of Bob Dylan. It was amazing in its terribleness.

Blood on the tracks is a phenomenal album though. The man was a great lyricist then the 80’s happened. Not just to him, to nearly everyone.

Not sure it merits the levels of debate in here considering the thread title. New thread anyone? To be fair a lot of critics are full of shit (film industry is the same).I like reading reviews on Pitchfork purely for laughs. The best by far is either when somebody dies and suddenly receives acclaim that they never had in life, or when an album is reappraised years later (most likely after someone dies).

never has there been an artist who believes his own hype quite as much as Bob…

His book Chronicles is a good read and doesn't convey that to me, more someone trying to stay sane as the world goes mad around him.

I used to have a live version of Blowin’ in the wind that was the best comedy record I’ve ever owned.

There's somethin' happening here and you don't know what it is,
Do you, Mr Funkmasterp? 🙂

(Sorry - line used in 50% of fan responses to critical critics each time Dylan releases another album of honking dirges. Always wanted an excuse and thought I'd get in before someone else. Also, the Nobel committee obviously never saw Hearts of Fire. Or any of his film oevre...)

I suppose that’s true if you ignore grunge, R&B, brit pop and the rest of it. My dad said something similar about the music I liked

Well, Grunge predated rave so ignored that and R&B/Britpop felt less of a change than a addition/continuation. I think genre's stopped fading out at that point in the way they maybe had before.

Bill Drummond’s words not mine. He relapsed and bought Dylan’s greatest hits (found it in his hand getting back in the car at a motorway services) and had to chuck it out of the car window. My reading is he did this because he liked it too much, it’s now comfort zone stuff and no longer challenging, and he likes a challenge.

No, I understood that. It seems odd that he couldn't find room for the challenge and the familiar.

Here’s a good one for another thread: great bands where the lead singer can’t actually sing. I’ll start with
Flaming Lips
Stone Roses
The Fall
Idles
Stiff Little Fingers
Ramones

I think not nearly so much. There hasn’t been a ‘musical revolution’ in the way that Acid/House/Techno/Jungle were in the years since.

Releases from artists like Bicep, Four Tet wouldn’t have sounded out of place back then and are big now.

Yeah, I kind-of thought the same.

Interestingly I remember seeing Mr Four Tet play a small Krautrock club in London 20 years ago, in one of his previous incarnations.

He's probably a similar age to me, which I mention because artists can clearly do some of their best work much later in their careers than in the past, when bands peaked in their 20s and broke up or went rubbish. Especially in the arena of faceless electronic noise.

PS. Britpop was just indie guitar music, but more blatantly derivative of the 1960s. Grunge was just indie guitar music, but less subtle and with more flannel shirts.

Well, Grunge predated rave so ignored that and R&B/Britpop felt less of a change than a addition/continuation. I think genre’s stopped fading out at that point in the way they maybe had before.

Nirvana broke through in 1991, the Second Summer of Love was 1988. And if you think "genre" died out around then you really need to open your eyes, grandad. With Spotify and Youtube and the rest the whole thing's fractured in a way you dad never imagined: http://everynoise.com/

Here’s a good one for another thread: great bands where the lead singer can’t actually sing. I’ll start with
Flaming Lips
Stone Roses
The Fall
Idles
Stiff Little Fingers
Ramones

Pogues

I just wonder how many times IHN has said to himself, “ah lads, I said universally lauded...” 😀

Nickc none of your criticisms seem to be based on his song writing ability

Metalheart's the one who keeps bringing up the Nobel...Songwriting...what d'you want me to say? Copied Guthrie, stumbled into electrified music 20 years too late, wrote songs that were too long, can't sing, plays rudimentary guitar, hasn't developed musically since, well ever really...probably can't now. Somewhere in the 80's became a Bob Dylan tribute act with added "baby Jesus"...

As I said, for a certain age demographic this stuff is groundbreaking (white middle class baby boomers, like y'know...Bob himself) , for the next generation it becomes the MOR mum/dad crap that you push against. give me a choice between Bob or...well just about anyone else...it's never going to be Bob. It just doesn't float my boat. There's a genre of male musicians for whom songs appear only in the Key of D minor, and are very serious...Bob is the genesis of that,. Same as Van Morrison, boring middle aged men singing about how hard their lives are while they roll about in millions... mleh, give me a break

Here’s a good one for another thread: great bands where the lead singer can’t actually sing. I’ll start with
Flaming Lips
Stone Roses
The Fall
Idles
Stiff Little Fingers
Ramones

Pogues

The Dead Kennedies

There’s somethin’ happening here

But what it is ain't exactly clear
There's a man with a gun over there
Telling me I got to beware…

Jello Biafra was a brilliant singer to my mind. Nothing else quite like him. His tone suited the ****ed up surf punk sound. Then again it was probably the front man aspect similar to Idles. Don’t need a technically good voice if you’ve got the swagger. Best punk band by far for me with songs that still resonate today. Police Truck could’ve been the soundtrack to the American summer of 2020.

great bands where the lead singer can’t actually sing

Thing is with these "non singer" singers, mostly they are better at conveying emotion than the technically proficient types... which is why their bands are great.
Sean Ryder, perfect example. I'd listen to him over Celine Dion any day (stating the obvious there 🙂 )
(Here, you'll never guess what I've got on the headphone right now! 😛 )

great bands where the lead singer can’t actually sing

Don't forget Clap Your Hands Say Yeah

Here, you’ll never guess what I’ve got on the headphone right now!

I’m guessing from your music related posts over the years that it’s Bryan Adams or Wet Wet Wet?

Not today.. it was related to the subject I was gabblin on about. It was PiL, see.

I just wonder how many times IHN has said to himself, “ah lads, I said universally lauded…”

I've given up.

Although, Nickc does remind me of one of those militant aethists who won't stop banging on about God.

Same as Van Morrison, boring middle aged men singing about how hard their lives are while they roll about in millions… mleh, give me a break

I’ve got a reasonable amount of VM and don’t really recognise the woe is me accusation.

I could actually kill Mark Ronson.

I think you'll find there's a queue, take a ticket and wait to be called.

Copied Guthrie, stumbled into electrified music 20 years too late, wrote songs that were too long, can’t sing, plays rudimentary guitar, hasn’t developed musically since, well ever really…probably can’t now.

Drugs are bad, mmmkay!

Jello Biafra was a brilliant singer to my mind. Nothing else quite like him. His tone suited the **** up surf punk sound. Then again it was probably the front man aspect similar to Idles. Don’t need a technically good voice if you’ve got the swagger. Best punk band by far for me with songs that still resonate today. Police Truck could’ve been the soundtrack to the American summer of 2020.

I think DezB actually nailed this one. Jello isn't really so much a musician as, well I dunno. But whatever he is I agree he pulls it off well.

Great time to admit to being a Van Morrison fan
https://variety.com/2020/music/news/van-morrison-eric-clapton-covid-19-1234843728/

lolz

Wayne Coyne has never pretended to be able to sing, in fact he’s often mentioned how terrible a singer he is. Flaming Lips live was still I’d say in my top 5 best ever gigs - just a great show full of theatre, fun and good vibes. Latest stuff has gone downhill though...
Pogues can’t say the same, S McG could barely stand up when I saw them, it was like going to a really bad stand up comedy gig where you feel like going up on stage and ushering them off to avoid further shame...

don’t really recognise the woe is me accusation.

Have you never listened, I mean really listened, to Bright Side of the Road? Bleak stuff.

You can actually hear his soul in torment in Jackie Wilson Said..

Steps. It’s Steps I hate. And Alright Said Fred. So effing over-rated - Tight Fit were never the same afterwards.

Alright Said Fred

Are they a Right Said Fred tribute band?

I just wonder how many times IHN has said to himself, “ah lads, I said universally lauded…”