[Closed] Ultra light tents - any experiences?

My (flawed) Alpkit Delta has such light fabrics.

Despite lots of care, I have a taped up tear in the groundsheet from a bit of Heather. I do use a groundsheet protector most of the time, adding another few grammes to it.
Fly is ok, but being Sil-nylon it stretches much more than other nylons in my experience.
All other fittings etc are fine and up to the job imho.

There is no way it's going to last as long as my old Macpac, but thrn nothing would. But it cost £60..,.

We bought a TN Solar Photon 2 (rather cosy and small porch, but fits in frame bag in medium Cotic Soul) and used it for a few nights bikepacking last year. Unfortunately due to injury it hasn't had any further use. It is sub 1kg, and for that, the material is very lightweight. I'd be careful where I'd pitch it, and wouldn't use it without the nylon footprint which takes it to over 1kg packed. However we have other tents for 'regular' use. That tent is very much to serve a purpose. You purchase a super light weight tent for the pack size etc, but think accept you have to treat it with care.

The TN Starlight looks worth a look. Wasn't yet in stock when we needed to purchase something.

My TerraNova Laser Photon will be going up for sale soon, I can't get on with the design-makes me feel claustrophobic! Robust and light though!

I've got an old Akto from before the prices rocketed, it doesn't get as much use as it should but was fine on a very stormy trip around Mid-Wales last September (I did get a bit worried during the night time lightning mind with the metal pole directly above my head)

I bought it over the Terranova for durability over lightness, it's been fine so far over 10ish years, I have a sneaky suspicion I may have bent a pole though, or was it always like that?

Ultralight =/= 2.4Kg

The newer version of my Scarp 1 (you saw it in Glen Feshie) sleeps two, has dual vestibules and comes in under 1.5Kg. There's also a full Scarp 2 that weighs 1.7Kg. Neither really fall into Ultralight category either but they are a good compromise for robustness/durability.

I like the dual vestibule design as it gives options for door opening, storage, cooking shelter and for each to be able to get out of bed without crawling over the other. A lot less claustrophobic and awkward than a tunnel design too.

When you bear in mind that those tents don't include pegs and bags in the weights they don't look that light. Add in a footprint as well and with sensible pegs you are looking at around 2.3kg I'd have thought.

For that weight I'd go with a tent with at least a more robust groundsheet. Hilleborg would be getting my money in your situation.

When you bear in mind that those tents don't include pegs and bags in the weights they don't look that light.

The pegs are tiny carbon twigs and the bags are so thin they weigh almost nothing.

I've stayed in a Laser Photon. Very light, but not that comfy to sleep in. Love it when carrying it, not when pitching it. Probably not suitable for you tbh TJ.

For a true 3 season tent in Scotland I'd say you'd have to be pretty careful with sub 1.5kg tents. A sheltered site is a must, None of the groundsheets will tolerate pointy rocks.

I've used the Alpkit Ordos, Force10 Helium tents, and have just ordered a sub 1kg Nordisk. They'll all keep you dry, but all have their limitations.

Lightwave tents work ok but you do need to pack them with care. My XT flysheet has a small friction hole from rolling it up across some stone in the grass. Fortunately it's in the vestibule end so not a problem.
The inner first pitch can be a problem when it's sheeting down as it's mostly mesh. The vestibule is huge though 2 of us in low camping chairs were comfortable and able to cook as well. Venting is ok for cooking inside too. (They are now the same price as Hilleberg were when I bought mine)

For roomy solo cycle touring I’m erring towards buying the 1.5 version [url= http://www.trekkertent.com/home/home/7-stealth-2.html ]of this[/url] Trekkertent.
Very light.

What I want is a large robust two person tent. The question is are the lighter materials robust enough for us? The tent will get a lot of use and we have on occasion had to sit out long periods of time in it in the rain so it needs to be larger than the laser or else I will be murdered.

Its not a tent as light as possible we need - its a decent sized robust tent that is the lightest possible. Are the tents made of the ultralight fabric like the first of those linked to strong enough?

Scotroutes - My memory of that tent of yours is its a bit small for what we want. wouldn't fancy two weeks in it. Is it made of the thinner material?

The last 2 or 3 year we have been using a lightwave ionx that I picked up cheap but that has some flaws solved on the newer lightwave tents.

Anyone use trekking pole tents? Seems a good idea as we will be carrying trekking poles anyway and saves weight. those trekkertents look interesting

Have you considered the MSR Hubba Hubba series? We had a look and were impressed, and though not right for our specific needs, looked like a good balance of weight, liveability and durability. Only question would be, being USA based, it's a largely mesh inner on most of them, which might not be so great in damp Scotland?!

I’ve heard from someone I trust that the Trekkertents are strong for their weight. How strong that is I’ll find out this year in the Highlands, but I do tend to be careful with my kit and they are made in the UK so I’m optimistic.

For about £38 you can buy alloy poles from BearBones [url= http://www.bearbonesbikepacking.co.uk/shop/?product=shelter-specific-poles ]here[/url], like I’ll need for cycle touring.

stop pissing about, and get some cash spent you tight gyet...... 😆

http://gb.hilleberg.com/EN/tent/red-label-tents/nallo-2/

The suggestion of MSR above is good - they do seem to offer more space than some others.

I am a fan of Vango, not popular I know, but a couple of thier posher models are spot on weight/room/price balance.

I've also seen a couple of very good lighter Robens as well, that offered twin entrances and good space. (Edit: Raptor model)

To add - I've spent a week in a Nallo and wasn't that impressed. Poorly vented, to shallow a slope at foot end led to wet feet twice. For the money, there is better imho.

Mebbies also have a look at Big Agnes. Downside is they're Yankee designed so inner first and fully tensioned with whippy poles. They are light though, good quality and well designed. Not sure if they do a tunnel/extended porch but you can research them.

I use a Seedhouse SL2 for extended (many, many nights) solo or cosy two's up with SWMBO. Porch isn't huge but that's not an issue for me. Weight is not that much different to a fully specced Laser Comp. They do UL versions as well for more ££/fewer Ozs.

Have you considered the MSR Hubba Hubba series? We had a look and were impressed, and though not right for our specific needs, looked like a good balance of weight, liveability and durability. Only question would be, being USA based, it's a largely mesh inner on most of them, which might not be so great in damp Scotland?!

They aren't, ime, great in UK conditions and the Hubba Hubba NX, at least, has an end design that folds in on itself in strongish winds - the guying points are in the wrong place - which is disconcerting in a 'hello, the roof of my tent just slammed into my face sort of way' and this is just the summer solstice.

The mesh panels make them pretty draughty too. The MSR Access are winter-specced so extend the transverse pole and do away with the mesh, but also weigh more. Nicely designed with decent internal space and two doors though and not outlandishly heavy.

I've used a Nordisk Telemark and that was super-lightweight, but tougher feeling than you'd expect, but ultimately nothing that's very light is also going to be very tough. Nordisk stuff is expensive too, but they do some serious wind tunnel testing on them - see vids on YouTube.

Agree with the venting comments on the Nallo above.

HTH :-/

Another TN Solar Photon here, so far so good! I am careful with it though..

We've a Vango Spirit 200+ which is very similar in design to the Exped Cetus (it's also 3Kg!). It's OK but I wouldn't want to be holed up in it for a couple of days. If the design extends to the ventilation, hard to tell from the images, then in humid weather you'll get condensation pooling in the tent. The door panel only has a mesh section in the upper third and there's just two small "windows" at the foot end. I wouldn't buy it again. The[url= https://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/equipment-c3/tents-shelters-c25/all-tents-c148/f10-xenon-ul-2-tent-p7010 ] Vango F10 Xenon[/url] is probably the newer version of it.

Our other lightweight tent is a Terra Nova LaserComp - I bought it for a mountain marathon and have used it for cycle touring but it's very, very snug and not what you are looking for. It is what I'd class as ultra-light being 900g.

The problem with full or substantially mesh inners is that the air that you heat up gets carried away so you are constantly having to reheat new air meaning you need a better rated sleeping bag and clothing. Ideally you'd be able to cover over the mesh panels. You'd also have the problem of avoiding drips of condensation from the outer falling through the mesh but unless things were very humid you'd be unlikely to get that much condensation.

As Rich says, site location can be a big factor. I've used car camping style frame tents in a storm without problem but had a full on mountain tent ripped to shreds, the difference being how exposed the site was. Incidentally the one that got destroyed was a Terra Nova but it was our choice of location that was the problem, it had previously stood up to a Scottish winter storm without problem.

To keep the headline weight down, the lightweight tents skimp on the groundsheet meaning that they recommend a footprint which of course pushes the weight back up to what it should have been in the first place 🙄 Weights get quoted without pegs in the same way that bike weights are quoted without pedals as it's up to the end user as to what they prefer or what might be needed for any given trip. For a roomy 2 man tent then somewhere around the 1.5Kg mark is probably as low as you want to go

I too was going to suggest the [url= https://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/equipment-c3/tents-shelters-c25/two-person-tents-c26/hubba-hubba-nx-tent-p2405 ]MSR Hubba Bubba[/url]. Partly mesh inner but two doors and a lot of room. Edit following Badlywireddog's post - the Access does look a good bet as well, quoted as a mere 12g heavier than the Hubba Bubba.

Is there any store near you that does a tent display day/weekend? It would definitely be worth a visit as you'd be able to actually see what the tents are like in terms of room and materials. Alternatively head to a campsite and ask owners of the tents about them

I too was going to suggest the MSR Hubba Bubba. Partly mesh inner but two doors and a lot of room.

As above, the end poles can fold under in strong-ish, but by no means excessive winds, and the thing is quite draughty. If you want MSR with a bit more UK friendliness, look at the Access instead would be my suggestion. You lose a little on venting, but it's warmer and more stable.

To answer your question, the fabric definitely does feel fragile, so it does freak me out a bit and I am super careful with it, but it has lasted (so far!) It's been used a few times over a couple of years...

I use a MSR carbon reflex - it’s v thin and I do carry a cut roll of tarp to pitch it on as the tub will not last. It’s v light though and a decent size. From using both I’d go for the nordisk equivalent though

I've got the MSR Hubba Hubba - it's good for vertical space but only OK for floor space. 2 vestibules is great though.

More generally, I'd echo the thoughts of those above about the new lightweight fabrics necessitating the use of a footprint. The fly seems to stand up to weather brilliantly but the floor can leak if it's really awful. Just make sure you budget that in your weight calculations and you'll be grand.

Not for the OPs needs but for anyone else’s wanting to try ultralight on the cheap.

There’s crazy cheap versions Chinese versions of the Big Agnes Sold under NatureHike brand that are around and under 70 squid and they’re not ultrashite.

(You just have to get the right colour as the materials are different on the colours)

I’ve used the decathlon ultralight in mountain marathons

https://www.decathlon.co.uk/quickhiker-ultralight-2-hiking-tent-2-man-grey-id_8245650.html

Sub 2kg and has stoodup to high winds and rain admirably, not a flashy make but only £120

I've been using a

https://www.approach-outdoor.com/tentes-de-randonnee/6329-taurus-ul-2p.html

for a few years. Big enough for two, warm, tall enough to sit up in, pitches in one go, well made, the siliconed fabric is standing up very well to UV.

The downside is the hight in high winds. Even pitched tail into the wind it's less stable than say a Wild Country dome.

I've got a Ferrino that's even lighter but wouldn't take on a trip to the Alps or Scotland.

Hilleborg would be getting my money in your situation.

They do ask for such a lot of it, though 🙂

[url= http://www.backpackinglight.co.uk/shelters-1/WF130.html ]Does it have to be a Tent?[/url]
Ive used the F4A for just over a year,in some horrific weather and it performed fantastic.
No real weight penalty, but a lot more room

Helsport do some nice tents... something like this?
http://www.helsport.no/fonnfjell-superlight

Also 15% at a local supplier:
http://www.tamarackoutdoors.co.uk/Mobile/MBSCProduct.asp?PdtID=21148119

We have a vaude taurus ultralight which has been absolutely awesome. Is under 2kg for a 2 man but it feels plenty sturdy and robust.

The vaude was one of the only tents that caters for 6'+ people too so a little extra weight was well worth it for us

My advice is, do whoever you are going with a favour, and buy a one man tent.

I used a [url= https://www.macpac.co.nz/equipment/tents/tramping-hiking-tents/microlight-classic-tramping-tent.html ]Macpac Microlight[/url] for the last KIMM I did. It's really a one man tent you can just fit two people in with no room to move. The inner is all mesh, so doesn't keep any heat in. Weighs about 1.4kg.

We have used our Easton Kilo for a tour of Normandy and the NC500. Its snug 2 person but is nice and light. Not sure what would happen in a big blow. The carbon poles are lovely and it comes with light pegs too.

It pitches inner first. I like it but im sure there are roomier 2 man tents

but im sure there are roomier 2 man tents

Indeed, mine seems just perfect for one!

Not sure what would happen in a big blow

Mine survived a rather big blow on Arran earlier this year 🙂

Terra Nova Zephyros 2XL Lite here.
Pretty roomy, but not great porches. Big enough for two people not in a sexual relationship.
About 1.5kg, material holds up well.
Bought as I thought my (then) wife would come camping with me.
She didn't and a bit big for just me... Now use tarp and bivvy until I find someone to come bike packing with me.

Trekkertent Phreeranger with dual entry and the extended bell? Marc designs his tents for Scottish conditions - ie midges and heavy rain. I am not a fan of inner pitch first tents so rate the outer pitch design when the rain is pouring down. US made superlight stuff is fine in the US but in the UK, no see um inners aren't so good when the temperatures drop and the wind gets up. An added bonus is that you get to support a Scottish company!

My weight weeny friend keeps talking about Tarptent.com

US firm with no UK /EU distributor which may or may not be a problem.

Very light, but porb not ideal for Scottish conditions.

I'm interested, but would only be using it in fairer climes.

My Scarp is a Tarptent product and it works fine in Scottish conditions.

Still, it's irrelevant to the OP as he's not after ultralight tents at all.

Cool, good to know....

Might get the b-in-l brother to bring one back...

I had a TN Laser Photon2, sold at biggish loss on ebay after a few outings, it was ok but I'm tall and the lack of headroom annoyed me. Replaced with a Nordisk, its better but all sub 1kg tents have numerous limitations.

For me anything over 1.5kg all in is too heavy for bikepacking or walking.

Tent is for crappy weather or midge infested zones, other wise I use my tarp, my old one had cover for two, weighed less than a big bag of crisps but was a bit too noisy in high wind so I have replaced with what looks like a copy a of Trail Star tarp that cost next to nothing and passed the basic garden test but has yet to see real action.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DANCHEL-590G-Camping-Tent-Ultralight-1-2-Person-Outdoor-20D-Nylon-Both-Sides-Silicon-Pyramid-shelter/32829305349.html?spm=2114.search0103.3.273.bBsVFt&s=p&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_5_10152_10065_10151_10130_5490020_10068_10192_5560011_10190_5550020_10307_10301_10137_10303_10060_10155_10154_10056_10055_10054_5470020_10059_100031_10099_5460020_10338_10103_10102_440_10052_10053_10107_10050_10142_10051_10324_10325_5380020_10326_10084_10083_10080_10082_10081_10110_10111_10112_10113_10114_10179_143_5570011_10312_10313_10314_10184_10078_10079_10073,searchweb201603_11,ppcSwitch_5&btsid=16f39c13-edf7-4633-bd4c-87abc32cb4d9&algo_expid=ffcb2ef3-4cf9-4ff6-8caa-6b9bca09bc57-31&algo_pvid=ffcb2ef3-4cf9-4ff6-8caa-6b9bca09bc57

Ta folks - some good thoughts a a few names of tent manufacturers that I hadn't thought of

Correct scotroutes - what I am after is a decent sized tent and wondered if the fabrics the ultra light tents are made of are durable enough as some decent sized tents are made of this stuff.

For what we do it has to be robust and big enough for two folk to use for weeks on end

Our latest tents - TN Voyager and TN Solar Photon have both been of the superlite types - the solar photon especially so with what is the thinnest and lightest materials I have seen in a tent. The Voyager has had a very tough time indeed and so far the fabrics have held up - I expect several years service to come despite use outside its brief. The only let downs have been zip failures. We have never used footprints.

The big issue for me is UV degradation which is unavoidable long term. It's lessened by a) only using in scotland 😀 and b) not using superlite tents as basecamps in the alps, for example. An earlier Voyager I owned years ago changed colour dramatically after a sunny fortnight basecamping in Austria, and went very crispy. Nowadays I either suspend a tarp over the tent for shade or use a cheap decathlon type tent in those circumstances

In general I have a number of what used to thought of as unthinkably light and thin shelters and garments, and they have all lasted extremely well and beyond any expectations I had of them. This is especially true of superlite waterproofs but the same applies to tents. Personally I would be more concerned with the quality of manufacture and the warranty/customer service reputation of the manufacturer than with the materials per se

Thing I found is that a 2 man lightweight tent is really a 1.5 man tent.

I had a nallo but that was a four season tent and needed good ventilation.

How about a hilleberg anjan, a three season tent with better ventilation than a nallo? Expensive and not ultralight though.

I personally wouldnt trust an ultralight tent in poor conditions. I once had a terra nova voyager superlight, very lightweight tent but very flimsy ad well. Id prefer the extra weight for better piece of mind.

For roomy solo cycle touring I’m erring towards buying the 1.5 version of this Trekkertent.
Very light.

I've got one and thus far it has been superb. A little fiddly to pitch well to begin with but you soon get the hang of it. I haven't been out in any totally grim weather yet but it feels remarkably stable provided it is pitched sensibly and all the guy points including the additional ones are used.

I chose to get the heavier fabric and the rear zip for venting and with pegs and homemade alloy poles it comes in at bang on 1kg. It's roomy for one and I've used it for 2 at a mountain marathon and a 4 day Tour du Mont Blanc.

dyls - Member

Thing I found is that a 2 man lightweight tent is really a 1.5 man tent.

Yup - thats the issue. Its not for one night hit and run raids - its for two of us to live in for weeks on end hence needs to be bigger than the ultralite tents and has to be robust as at times we will be a days walk from alternative shelter

Its the ultralight materials and their longevity I am interested in.

Its all part of our retirement planning when we intend to walk many hundreds of miles over months

But as I said - thanks for the input - I have a few more to look at and we are in no hurry!

I have worked out I can save almost over 2 kilos from our kit going for the lightest options of waterproofs, tents and warm layers. the cost will be a couple of thousand tho to do this.

Very light waterproofs - again any experiences? Even normal weight waterproofs regularly fail due to the use we put them thru. Last "summer" we walked for 14 hours one day in heavy rain - every piece of waterproof clothing - all decent brands and relatively new and well treated - failed after 10 hours of continuous heavy rain - the breathable materials just soaked thru

My current waterproofs are 300g for the trousers and 600g for the jacket - this can be halved but would this be at the expense of durability? I am considering a small poncho for these conditions to add another waterproof layer - I can do this for around 75 grammes.

I wish someone made decent non breathable waterproofs that actually remain waterproof unlike every breathable jacket I have had that simply cannot cope with long exposure to cold rain

TJ - I think you're trying to get too much from a light tent. 2 to 2.4kg's gets you a much more spacious, robust tent that's better suited. For weeks out, I would want either an extended porch or light tarp depending if you're below the treeline. There's a good few models of (proper) two man tunnels /semi geodesic with extended porches.

IME uber light = compromise in durability and function, for everything.

I've also learned to bail out of really grim weather when I can these days....it's retirement man, enjoy it!

Point taken. Bailing out isn't always possible tho if you are a days walk from the nearest shelter! That 14 hr day tho we did walk past a shelter at 6 hrs and should have stopped then with hindsight

I have seen spacious extended porch tents ( which I love) made of the ultralight materials. I don't quite have the bottle to buy this tho which seems to be strong / light and eye wateringly expensive

http://www.lightwave.uk.com/products/tents/vapor?product=product1

Hogan XT ultralight

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vaude-Hogan-SUL-XT-2-3P-Tent-Lightweight-Adventure-Mountaineering-Tent-/332361709261?_trksid=p2385738.m4383.l4275.c10

F10 Xenon XT

https://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/equipment-c3/tents-shelters-c25/all-tents-c148/f10-xenon-ul-2-tent-p7010

Realistically, walking for 12 hours in very heavy rain, you are going to get wet to some point. When you walk you compress the fabrics round the arms, legs, under rucksack straps etc. So after time, along with the sweating inside (even if it's cool) you are going to get damp. IMO that's the time to adapt your plans and take some shelter (tent etc) before you then have to spend two days trying to dry out and get warm.

Personally I gave up on super light waterproofs, I wore through them too quickly. This was 10 years ago so things might have changed (also I put my kit through testing conditions on field work).

Madam and I have been using Hagloff LiM3 jackets for the last 5 years and they have been exceptional and lasted. Trousers berghaus paclites. Our walks don't sound dissimilar to what you are thinking - our longest was a 2500km continuous walk over three and a half months in Autumn and winter across the alps. I fully expected to throw the jackets away at the end but they are still going strong. We used superlite kit and bar our shoes and thermals everything survived, including our (already old) TN Voyager mentioned above. We rough camped most nights IIRC. No footprint!

A poncho is a good idea for very heavy continuous rain and I was on the verge of buying one when I was given an umbrella by a strange man in a village in italy. It was the best thing for November rains and was only traded in when the rain turned to snow and i swapped it for a fleece blanket to boost the sleeping bags. What I realised was that it is mad to try and cover all eventualities but in europe especially it is possible to collect, borrow and swap kit along the way, even if it isn't from 'Tiso's'

As I pointed in my original post on the Vaudé it's made of siliconed fabric which is lighter than any other tent outer I've owned and is so far holding up better than other fabrics I've owned. There's no doubt feedback on other specialist sites so check it out, TJ, whatever the brand of tent.

As for waterproofs I've got a selection from 350 to 800gms. The lightest is PU coated thing from Lidl and it's as waterproof as a plastic bag. - I use it for Compostelle type walks where weight is everything, often draped over my shoulders and pack like a poncho. Slightly heavier are some North Face Gortex jackets that now all leak on the shoulders (znd elsewhere)from carrying a pack, they are used for ski-mountaineering. When I'm going to be out in really horrible cold and wet weather in the mountains the 800gm Shöffel ski jacket which is a thick gortex type fabric (but more waterproof) with a drop liner gets used, it's older than the North Face Gortex lightweights and still waterproof everywhere.

The plan so far is to warm up by walking Edinburgh - Cape wrath and maybe back, the main event being the patagonia trail or something similar - a thousand miles in southern south america

ahsat - Member

Realistically, walking for 12 hours in very heavy rain, you are going to get wet to some point.

this annoys me. When is a waterproof not waterproof - when you are in rain for 12 hours a £250 waterproof jacket should be waterproof not soak thu after 10 hours. Old skool non breathable fabrics don't do this.

this annoys me

I am inclined to agree with you, but all fabrics reach a saturation point, particularly when the fabric is being compressed by movement. If you stayed very still/floated/didn't carry a pack, it might work.

I'd be very happy to find a jacket that lasted for 12 hours of rain after 1-2 years of semi regular use. Have to say my current Goretex Pro is two years old, and kept me dry in some decent Lakeland rain over the New Year, but with current knee injury, I can only walk for an hour or two, so not the same test.

Does sound like some great adventures. Enjoy. Think there is always that age old balance of weight, durability, cost etc etc.

Ive just browsed some - that F10 Xenon looks great. Reasonable room (not huge), light enough, big porch, slightly more robust groundsheet. If I had the money....

Interesting projects, TJ. You are right to be going ultralight. On long walks I take stuff that I know is compromised just because it's the lightest. Decathlon overtrousers are sweaty horrible things but 190gm. The Ferrino tent is 1600gm and barely adequate, the luxurious Vaudé is 1790gm and left in the loft at home because I'm not prepared to carry the weight for the odd night I'd appreciate the better performance.

We've found walking 8 hours a day is all we can do for long periods; 29days and 840km is the most we've done walking every day. And walking more than couple of hours in rain to be avoided. Your feet will get wet, and when they get wet you'll get blisters and if you get blisters you'll lose days of walking. We watched people walk on in the rain when we stopped and passed them a day or two later suffering with blisters from the rainy day.

Never get blisters even with wet feet unless I haven't had the callouses taken off by a podiatrist before I set off when I get the odd blister in the thick pads under the balls of my feet from sheer forces and then I just continue walking anyway as I have the right medical kit to sort them out. Yes we would only usually walk 8 hrs a day - that 14 hr day was because we ended up heading for a bothy as we couldn't find a sheltered spot to pitch up in the high passes we had climbed up into

We cannot have compromises on robustness due to the areas we want to head for.

Yep it's really disappointing int it? You spend huge amounts on the very top end kit and still get wet after more than a few hours in the rain. I've tried every iteration of GoreTex plus eVent, HyVent and a few others and still get wet. For multi day, I pack a dry set of ultra light clothes THAT MUST NOT GET WET. Everything else is sacrificial.

As for losing robustness with lighter weight, it's inevitable especially with clothing if you're carrying loaded packs. Obviously the effects can be minimised by going superlight with all the stuff you carry as well as the stuff you wear but there's still abrasion and this takes its toll over time.

I've a couple of superlight (~200g IIRC, one eVent the other Pacshite) mountain smocks and they're effectively disposable despite their high cost. They also keep me dry for about the same duration as my top specced GoreTex XCR or Pro jackets.

Have you guys tried Paramo (or Cioch)?
They're not superlite but do keep you dry and the recent designs are less fat, bird watcher bin-bag in style and are much more fitted.

@elshalimo - I've a Velez top and salopettes (can't remember the model) from Paramo. Great stuff but for me it's for close to zero and below as it's just too warm.

The other downside is that they don't pack down particularly well.

Have you guys tried Paramo (or Cioch)?

If I had time and money, I would be tempted to try the newer wind shirt + thin fleece things, but then Paramo are open in saying they're not as weather proof as the 1-piece jackets.

For multi day, I pack a dry set of ultra light clothes THAT MUST NOT GET WET. Everything else is sacrificial.

Yup - after that 14 hr day and getting to the bothy a set of dry clothes was almost literally a life saver - I was on the edge of hypothermia and t'missus was already hypothermic

One interesting thing from that day - my rucksac is a lightwave one - it remained totally dry inside although MrsTJ similar rucksac was slightly damp

@tjagain - we always keep clothes in Exped dry bags when we're backpacking/bothying/hut-to-hut etc.
Basically if it [u]must[/u] stay dry, it goes in a dry bag

Yup - I learned a cold and wet lesson on that one a few years ago with soaked kit after another long day in the rain. essential stuff is kept two waterproof layers from the outside world - in a dry bag in a waterproof rucsac

When bikepacking I'll have my sleeping bag/quilt inside a Schnozzle* inflator bag which is inside an Alpkit Hunka bivy bag which is inside an Exped dry bag which is mounted on the handlebar harness. If something pointy and sharp punctures these then I've a problem but in practice unless you actually ride in to a tree or barbed wire fence that's unlikely to happen. I'll also have a set of dry clothes to wear at night stored in the dry bag mounted in the saddle harness.

*Exped inflatable mats can be inflated using a dry bag with a nozzle that fits onto the mat's valve. Prevents moisture from your breath getting inside the mat (important if you've one of the down versions). The material is a lighter version of that used for their main dry bags. Plus Schnozzle is just a great name for a product! 😛

If you're looking for 'week long' waterproofs, give Columbia outdry a whirl. Fit is a bit clunky, and the material is rubbery/crinkly, but doesn't seem to wet out like regular goretex etc

In the usual STW recommend what you own style, i have a North Face Tadpole 2:

https://www.thenorthface.co.uk/shop/tadpole-2

I would ask yourself whether weight is everything, there are some super lightweight tents out there, but no good if every time the wind gets up you are worrying about longevity, plus if you split the poles and pegs for one person and tent itself with the other, them you are carrying less than a kilo each.

Had mine nearly 20 years, i used it for 7 months straight on a Trans-Africa trip (mostly inner only) and still use it now.

I would ask yourself whether weight is everything, there are some super lightweight tents out there, but no good if every time the wind gets up you are worrying about longevity,

Thats why I asked on here for experiences 😉 - to answer exactly that question

@trademark, I replied to your PM but not sure that works?

I had a Tadpole, it's a bit old hat now and pretty heavy at well over 2kg for not much space. The flysheet taping let go on mine though TNF warrantied it without hassle. I'd already bought a replacement as I discovered the issue mid tour...