80% of the public are against lifting the cap.
Really? any evidence to back that up?
Aye right. Starmer and Reeves have picked a ridiculous hill to die on.
You've definitely got this the other way round
7 MPs just voted against something in the manifesto they were elected on <3 weeks ago
And yes the 2child cap is ridiculous punishment of the poorest families and I'll bet it's effectively scraped in the budget
Wow, clearly a lot of people in here who don’t quite understand politics.
Thanks for enlightening us with your wisdom.
EDIT. Three line whip yet 40 something Labour abstains....hardly screams party discipline.
Oh, I often forget that everyone not to the left of Jeremy Corbyn is a Nazi
Nah, just a bunch of people who think it's better to scrap something that makes children go hungry, rather than getting all tumescent* over a strong man act.
* You'd know what that meant if you'd been to college.
The Tories didn’t do this and they all lost all authority. It’s basic politics.
If you are going to lecture people on "basic politics" you could at least get the facts vaguely right.
The tories under Johnson actually went full tilt for expelling the unbelievers in the glorious leader and it really didnt help them.
Politics isn’t getting everything you want all the time,
Well **** me sideways with an epileptic hedgehog its so handy that a political genius like you is here to explain the basics to us.
However whilst you are doing so can you start with explaining exactly how Starmer is blocked from choosing to change the policy? Remind me when the next ****ing election is? How exactly would he be punished for this? Bonus marks if you can manage sixth form politics essay standards about how it is easy to make the changes early.
I know its hard defending hard right policies but try for ****s sake rather than simply announcing anyone who disagrees simply isnt up to your level of genius.
80% of the public are against lifting the cap.
That's a very, uhhh, specific number.
Anyone who defies a three line whip to vote against their own government must be suspended
That’s not true. There are a variety of possible outcomes. They didn't have to be suspended or didn't have to be suspended for so long. A 24 hour suspension would have been enough of a spanking for the rebels to make their point without lasting consequences. Now they're going to be determined to be the awkward squad forever.
But in any case - it wouldn't have killed the PLP not to have the vote whipped. Or only lightly whipped. They still would have won and it would have been possible to avoid a confrontation of this scale so early in the life of the parliament.
Newsnight is well worth a watch tonight for the incredible bravery of new Labour MP Natalie Fleet talking about being groomed and raped at 15, and violence against women and girls. She’s detailing what Labour are going to do to support rape victims and prosecute offenders
its really moving to watch
These are exactly the people we need in government
https://Twitter.com/wistfulcass/status/1815869278630854735?s=46&t=1lK7Dw1b6RqGJyvufO-trQ
That’s a very, uhhh, specific number.
Oddly enough the only survey I could find came in at 60% Unless you only count tory and farage plc voters which does hit the 80%.
80% of the public are against lifting the cap.
Really?, are you sure it’s not 79%….could be 8%……..perhaps 32%……..personally I like the sound of 27%.
And yes the 2child cap is ridiculous punishment of the poorest families and I’ll bet it’s effectively scraped in the budget
sop why is it not being scrapped now? Its an easy thing to do, it will cost a small ampunt and it will immediately help raise children out of poverty
so why not do it now?
* You’d know what that meant if you’d been to college.
I do actually have a degree, but it’s for crayoning so probably doesn’t count, right?
I don’t do big words, but then maybe that’s a blessing as I don’t generally feel that would make me somehow superior to everyone else, in a sneering and condescending way
You crack on though. It’s really impressive
*swoons*
If Labour can't show willing on something so simple, so easy and so straight forward then what precedent is it setting?
https://twitter.com/AaronBastani/status/1815832426675068974?t=9yve89oX6bVqkCU2Ha7ksQ&s=19
An embarrassment of a party. But it doesn't surprise me.
https://twitter.com/SaulStaniforth/status/1815464130452877772?t=yGk9fGiVe6Razin7EQzg2A&s=19
Brainless commentary from Jacqui Smith.
Inept. Economically illogical.
Well I wasn’t expecting abuse but seems to be the way of politics on social media.
Not letting me edit my post so I can clarify it was “only” 60%. Please accept my humble apologies for not fully agreeing with you all. But 80/60, still the same outcome.
I shan’t read any further comments as I don’t put up with being mocked, so enjoy the rest of your time here.
The lifting of the 2 child cap when finances permitted was the manifesto pledge. Labour are just following this. I am pretty convinced it will be lifted as soon as it can be. Ironic tho' that Braverman (lols), the Corbynites and SNP are united in opposition to this. Just needs Reform to join to be the full set of opportunists.
I agree with the 6th form analogy for the 7 that have been suspended. 2 weeks ago they were campaigning on that manifesto.
This is why I’m not a Labour voter or supporter anymore. The feel good start period is definitely over.
After 2 weeks?? Right OK...... Labour Achievements under Starmer after 2 weeks....
Appoint Richard Timpson as prisons minister, Richard Hermer as Attorney General (Soz Ems), Patrick Valance as Minister of Science. People who genuinely understand their field.
End the Rwanda scheme, Close the Bibby Stockholm prison ship
Announce an ambitious house building programme
Announce the formation of GB Green Energy
End the ban on on-shore windfarms
Promise an extra 40,000 appointments and operations a week in England
Open new negotiations with Junior Doctors
Start recruitment of a new leader for the new Border Security Command (BSC) (lols)
Reset the relationship with European partners
Call for an immediate ceasefire in Gaza (Meet with both Palestinian and Israeli leaders)
Announce the appointment of a Covid corruption commissioner
Prevent MPs taking on second jobs that dont benefit their consituants (eg lobbying jobs)
Labour Achievements under Corbyn (and MacDonald, Long Bailey, Burgon and the rest of the cwazy gang) in 5 years;
.
.
.
.
.
(moral victory)
As for todays back slapping SNP & Stephen Flynn. The GE result was just the start. Until the SNP sort out their governance and move on from 2014 and try and appeal to all the no voters they will continue to decline, and get slaughtered in the MSP elections.
@rone I'm fairly convinced that I know your politics and nature fairly well, so a word of caution on Bastani..... he's gone flirting with fascism on some of the stuff he's putting out there these days. Of course not that post that you've shared, but there's some very bad stuff on immigration etc.
@j4mie you charge headlong into the thread saying that most posters know nothing about politics. Then cry when people push back. Well, cheers again for your enlightening contributions.
So if the 2 child cap is unaffordable now what makes you think it will suddenly become affordable in the budget which is 8 months away? Or do you mean the spending review at some point before that? Given the pledges made so far its not going to be affordable then either
Well I wasn’t expecting abuse but seems to be the way of politics on social media.
I would suggest if you dont want abuse then you shouldnt start by hurling abuse at others.
Read what you wrote about others "don’t quite understand politics." and "ranting on social media" and so on and it might explain why you got the response you did. Its frankly binneresque.
I’m fairly convinced that I know your politics and nature fairly well, so a word of caution on Bastani….. he’s gone flirting with fascism on some of the stuff he’s putting out there these days. Of course not that post that you’ve shared, but there’s some very bad stuff on immigration etc.
I've followed many commentators over the years including Bastani. I don't agree with everything he says at all.
I've seen little evidence of what you are suggesting with all due respect.
Well I wasn’t expecting abuse but seems to be the way of politics on social media
You get used to it. There’s a little pack of lefty hyenas on here who get together and pile on to anyone who disagrees with them.
They clearly have righteousness on their side - something bestowed on them through their sanctimonious idealogical purity or something
They come on here to competitively virtue signal to each other. Apparently it’s a thing. Kids nowadays eh?
Ironic tho’ that Braverman (lols), the Corbynites and SNP are united in opposition to this
And yet it is the supporters of the glorious leader Starmer who are getting into bed with a hard right tory policy. So crack ****ing on.
The lifting of the 2 child cap when finances permitted was the manifesto pledge. Labour are just following this. I am pretty convinced it will be lifted as soon as it can be.
It could be lifted tomorrow. it should have already gone by now. so its not going to be lifted "as soon as it can be" because they have made a political decision not to do so If its unaffordable now then what is going to change to make it affordable at any point in the future?
But in any case – it wouldn’t have killed the PLP not to have the vote whipped. Or only lightly whipped. They still would have won and it would have been possible to avoid a confrontation of this scale so early in the life of the parliament.
The kings speech is the programme for government, they voted against the manifesto they were elected on just 3 weeks ago....
If they didn't support the manifesto why campaign on it?
Until the SNP sort out their governance and move on from 2014 and try and appeal to all the no voters they will continue to decline, and get slaughtered in the MSP elections.
I'm not sure about that. By the time they roll around, Scottish voters might think the General Election was enough of a punishment for the SNP, and Labour isn't quite as shiny in (UK) government as it was in (UK) opposition. And at the risk of being repetitive - Anas Sarwar can't pull off the Upright and Rigorous routine that Kier Starmer could.
But anyway, all of that is off topic for this thread...
Not the out of context ideological purity argument, again. Sigh.
Meaningless.
Back in the real world
So if the 2 child cap is unaffordable now what makes you think it will suddenly become affordable in the budget which is 8 months away?
Well exactly -because Labour are making stuff up about the economy and how it functions.
The government doesn't wait for money, can you imagine a system like that?
Did they wait for money for COVID or just spend it? Lmfao.
Ultimately doesn't matter because when their planning reforms basically do nothing (other than move money to developers) and their lack of spending under performs for growth - then we can all talk about magic growth fairy in pragmatic terms.
Aye right. Starmer and Reeves have picked a ridiculous hill to die on.
So 3 weeks in they have defended an abhorrent tory policy, faced a significant rebellion ( 40 abstentions make it so) Peed off everyone who worked in child poverty. Ignored the actual evidence and lost a lot of goodwill. why? It just makes no sense.
None of you can defend retaining this piece of performative cruelty
And yet it is the supporters of the glorious leader Starmer who are getting into bed with a hard right tory policy. So crack **** on.
Yes - bet we could go through posts and see them screaming with anger when the Tories put it out there.
Rage filled posts about poverty and how disgusting the Tories are.
Now it's ideological purity apparently .
And yet it is the supporters of the glorious leader Starmer who are getting into bed with a hard right tory policy. So crack **** on.
But thats not the manifesto pledge is it? And it was introduced in 2017, so if Corbyn hadnt been such a dick and un-electable, there might have been a labour gov't in power (they had two chances and even lost to the known liar Johnson!) to reverse it before the financial crash caused by covid, the Truss budget, and the cost of living thing. But if you need to tanty please do crack on & write off Starmer 2 weeks in.
Not the out of context ideological purity argument, again. Sigh.
Yup with bonus points for whining about people being nasty to him despite him hurling abuse at others. Its not surprising that he leapt to the defence of someone who showed the same gammon like tendencies of wanting to hand out insults but not take it.
It is odd how his arguments so closely match the gammons given his seeming hatred of them.
Well I wasn’t expecting abuse but seems to be the way of politics on social media
You get used to it. There’s a little pack of lefty hyenas on here who get together and pile on to anyone who disagrees with them.
They clearly have righteousness on their side – something bestowed on them through their sanctimonious idealogical purity or something
They come on here to competitively virtue signal to each other. Apparently it’s a thing. Kids nowadays eh?
I mean the gaslighting is just off the charts here!
to reverse it before the financial crash caused by covid, the Truss budget, and the cost of living thing
There is no technical reason why they can't afford it. None. Zip.
It's just a choice. It's also peanuts in the grand scheme of the economy. And they want growth well this sort of things feeds into growth. Just like money into the NHS.
Doesn't matter, Labour are heading towards a big fat fail of a party unless something comes out of the hat.
Still time for them to stop with this nonsense.
a word of caution on Bastani….. he’s gone flirting with fascism
Really? Where?
I can't stand his work, and his recent-ish piece on George Galloway (Bastani wouldn't vote for him, but only because he discovered his intolerant views on LGBTQ+ issues. Really? Not the decades of grifting or apologetics for awful people or dodgy practices around "charities"?) was very eyeroll-worthy. But I haven't seen any signs of fascist sympathies.
Wow, clearly a lot of people in here who don’t quite understand politics.
I'm sorry... My irony meter is going crazy right now! You're going to have to clarify your position of authority for me so that I can understand your position here...
I shan’t read any further comments as I don’t put up with being mocked, so enjoy the rest of your time here.
Or maybe, and quite predictably... NOT!
Starmer will probably get shut of it next week now the vote has served its purpose… getting rid of the last of magic grandads disciples.
They can join him in backbench, placard-waving irrelevance.
Their spiritual home
Also willing to bet that it wouldn't take @cougar or any other forum mods very long to unearth historic evidence of your undying loyalty to said placard waving irrelevants either...
FWIW, I really don't have strong views either way about this 2 child cap... That certainly puts me in a minority here, but there are arguments both for and against that have relevance, and I don't think lifting it will have the desired effect of lifting hundreds of thousands of children out of poverty in the way that its undying supporters think it would... But I have a real issue with Starmer's Johnson-esque heavy hand regarding dissenting voices, and believe that it will come back to bite him in the arse much sooner than later!
It might only be the likes of Long-Bailey, Burgon and Zultana right now, but when it's far more prominent Labour MP's who have already swallowed more of Starmer's highly questionable right wing authoritarianism than they should have ever had to, start rebelling too...? There's a great many Labour MP's that are far more closely aligned with the current Green Party than they are with Starmer's version of Labour, and they won't stay silent forever!
You get used to it. There’s a little pack of lefty hyenas on here who get together and pile on to anyone who disagrees with them.
You've got a predictably short memory... I can certainly remember not that long ago (certainly, eBikes were already quite a thing, and 26" wheels were long dead on new bikes) that you were the self appointed chief "lefty hyena" on this forum...
I do actually have a degree
Binners if it's any consolation I have never been taken in by your pasty-eating proper working-class geezer STW persona, TBH I doubt many people have.
I think you were probably set a trap which you walked into. "Binners proclaims he has a degree shocker"
I'll somewhat retract my post about Bastani....I've got a conversation on my phone with a pal talking about a couple of GB News vids that we'd thought were far right in tone and content. I cannot for the life of me now find them. Apologies.
mboy - for me its partly the symbology of it and partly the fact that while it would not solve child poverty it would give poor families with 3 or more kids an immediate cash boost that would be significant.
its also quite funny watching those who will not criticize Starmer squirm as the retention of this policy is indefensible
its also quite funny watching those who will not criticize Starmer squirm as the retention of this policy is indefensible
This.
Centrism is not really about solutions and comes undone very quickly. It wants to attack conservatism and support it at the exact same time which leads to things like this.
Blimey, it's all got a little heated tonight!
I'll check back in tomorrow, well today now.
its also quite funny watching those who will not criticize Starmer squirm as the retention of this policy is indefensible
Squirming? What squirming? I don't see any squirming.
The centrists seem to be very comfortable pushing the official Labour line on the issue.....They hate the child benefit cap, of course they do, who wouldn't hate such an unfair Tory policy? Unfortunately the Tories have left the economy in such a state that Labour can't do anything about it right now. But don't worry, as soon as they can scrap it they definitely will.
The heat is for good reasons though.
A few of us want to see some change.
This would have been a decent place to start.
I admit despite even with all my public finance discussion - that Labour will have a battle on when it comes to spending. They will get slammed about it.
But they need to fight this. The evidence is strong enough to argue the mechanics.
It's the same with the Democrats - they seem to want to make excuses for their decisions - whereas the Republicans and Tories just do what they want.
If only Starmer used his authority for the good stuff.
Squirming? What squirming? I don’t see any squirming.
There's been a lot of jumping through hoops to defend it when they know in their hearts it's not a good thing. And mechanically I challenge any of them to cite finances as a reason when Starmer is promising money for Ukraine - at a very basic level that is a contradiction. (3bn a year as long as it takes )
If we could zoom back to 2017 on this forum would there be support for it in the anti-Tory threads?
Another thread goes down the shitter.
The members who post prolifically to political (and other) threads are sometimes referred to as 'big hitters' and, typically, add nothing to any subject.
In my business experience, a big hitter is someone who delivers - usually in adverse circumstances; somewhat different to STW's 'big hitters'.
In reality, on STW, they are individuals like needy kids in a classroom who always want to have the last word and their contributions, despite their invariable length, add nothing to the debate.
Quoting chunks of others original works is naked plagiarism.
Time to cancel my (print & digital) membership; I'm sure one of the many voluble free loaders will now become a full member to maintain STW's revenue stream.
Ha!
In reality, on STW, they are individuals like needy kids in a classroom who always want to have the last word and their contributions, despite their invariable length, add nothing to the debate.
No we don't!
Ian Dunt on the benefit cap 2018.
https://twitter.com/IanDunt/status/1012352859583668227?t=4fTuarsO8grFCC555jR9Ig&s=19
Ian Dunt last month on the benefit cap.
https://twitter.com/IanDunt/status/1798968773161930983?t=IOXo-gTeSD1gsBf8apLmJQ&s=19
Ian Dunt today on the vote.
https://twitter.com/IanDunt/status/1815842752610947433?t=08E6MV-rpTswmbGvZO9ZgQ&s=19
You see the issue with Centrism?
Time to cancel my (print & digital) membership; I’m sure one of the many voluble free loaders will now become a full member to maintain STW’s revenue stream.
If we score flounces that has to be a 10/10. Don't take it so seriously, I am sure most of us are just passing time/taking a break when at work and just enjoy the sometimes pointless arguments. It is after all an MTB forum not a high brow political debating forum.
Be interesting to see the post numbers by days and hours within the day as I am sure most will be around 9-5 Monday to Friday.
walks in, sees the remnants of the tables and chairs from last night's bar fight, shakes head, walks off again.
Well done chaps, you trashed the pub and like Frank I'm not sure I want to drink in it any longer.
You gotta laugh at the amateur dramatics on display
Did anyone really think the Labour government thread was going to be a consensus ?
The members who post prolifically to political (and other) threads are sometimes referred to as ‘big hitters’ and, typically, add nothing to any subject.
As well as drowning the forum in their noise.
I always thought the term big hitters was used ironically.
You gotta laugh at the amateur dramatics on display
Yep, wonder what happens when things that actually matter occur?
Did anyone really think the Labour government thread was going to be a consensus ?
No idea, I certainly didn't, but I did expect it to turn into a very limited number of posters saying the same thing over and over again driving away an unknown number of alternative contributors and viewpoints.
Relax folks. A loose coterie of 'big hitters' got on a roll with a positive feedback loop of borderline bullying and the result was a bit nasty.
New day, same old problems out there in the real world. And no amount of fantasy economics can sort it.
<shrugs>
Rabble: a large, noisy, uncontrolled group of people; people of low social position.
Elected on a 33% vote share and 60% turnout.
I do actually have a degree, but it’s for crayoning so probably doesn’t count, right?
Binbins, absolutely no-one is taken in by your act.
Some people might think that’s worth it – but in any case it’s more complicated than “UK should turn off the tap”.
It was Liz Kendall's interview by Mishal Husain that resurrected that and it was a point made in the context of a "UK Government Thread", rather than the Gaza thread
Why isn't it possible for UK Government politicians to treat the electorate as intelligent and answer in (appropriate) depth, rather than sound as if nothing is being done now when they've had since (October) to think about the problem? "Not that simple...International treaties...Ongoing trade deals...Massively reduced volume since...blah, blah"
You can think many things about grimep, but his/her timing is pretty impeccable.
Thanks! But please don't imply I'm one of the fu#k1#9 pronoun people.
Thanks! But please don’t imply I’m one of the fu#k1#9 pronoun people.
I was treating you as someone whose gender I do not know. No need to flap.
Attempting to move things on...
BBC News - We don't know how many people are having babies - and that's a headache for schools - BBC News
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ced3e219lxzo
This is an interesting article which, as well as the immediate challenges for schools, also has a large bearing on our economy. We've known for some time that we have a low birth rate and an aging population. The risks to our economy of less economically active people is known, the last Govt attempted to solve it by making people work for longer. But that won't account for all that is needed. This, to me, is where the rhetoric of the populist nonsense about immigration needs a significant challenge. Otherwise we'll find ourselves in a bigger hole than we are now.
This, to me, is where the rhetoric of the populist nonsense about immigration needs a significant challenge.
The problem here is that you'll need to do it in three words or less - that can fit on the side of a bus.
When the ancient Greeks came up with 'demokratia', they insisted that it had to be paired at the hip with education to prevent the people falling prey to easy populism. Unfortunately, I think the UK is past the tipping point on this issue.
Well I guess diverting the thread to go completely off topic and threaten flounces is one way for centrists to deal with the awkwardness of having to defend an indefensible Tory policy which was the subject of a Labour three line whip.
But back on the "UK government" topic. There appears to be a widely held view that Starmer and his advisors are playing a dangerous game with their extremely low tolerance of dissent.
New Labour and Tony Blair was notorious for its "control freakery" and yet despite that Blair was hugely relaxed about Parliamentary rebellions and took them in his stride.
Blair knew his huge majority, similar to Starmer's, meant that he could afford to and that a bit of Parliamentary dissent is actually not a bad look. Especially when you are trying to shake off the image of having a Stalinist grip on the party.
Starmer, or more likely Morgan McSweeney, seems to take the opposite view. Unfortunately he is likely to be storing up future problems for himself as the cracks start to appear even among his centrists. As this excellent piece in the Times today by Rosie Duffield suggests
Unfortunately, I think the UK is past the tipping point on this issue.
As are a lot of countries. Populist leaders know what they are doing and taking advantage of people who are not going to suddenly get educated.
One way of dealing with it is to be stricter on the nonsense parties come out with but that only goes so far as people like Farage were not working pretty much as an individual but has done a lot of damage.
When the ancient Greeks came up with ‘demokratia’, they insisted that it had to be paired at the hip with education to prevent the people falling prey to easy populism
I am not sure thats a completely accurate take on it. Although they were keen on restricting it to the right type of people there wasnt really a requirement for education unless you look at the arguments put forward by some of the philosophical schools which wasnt a city state level requirement.
Even there the approach to democracy was variable eg Plato wasnt the greatest fan although in fairness "democracy" had bumped his teacher off.
centrists to deal with the awkwardness of having to defend an indefensible Tory policy which was the subject of a Labour three line whip.
As a much hated centrist, I'm disappointed that the indefensible Tory policy is still in place and Statmer resorted to a 3 line whip, despite it being an easy win with most voters.
I also understand that if you hang your hat on costing/funding things to get elected, you have to be shown to have done that or the right wing press will make your job harder. It may be that it's part of a wider budget package around child poverty that isn't finalised yet, and announcing parts of it piecemeal won't work politically for some reason I don't understand.
Unlike some patronising know it alls on here, I at least recognise that there are many things I'm not an expert on.
awkwardness of having to defend an indefensible Tory policy which was the subject of a Labour three line whip.
What, faced with trying to force workers who can't afford to start a family to pay for the large families of benefit dependents, while realising the dire state of the economy cannot afford such waste and largesse, the Labour government took the only possible choice? It would be completely immoral to do anything else, a rare glimpse of sanity from the commies.
But back on the “UK government” topic. There appears to be a widely held view that Starmer and his advisors are playing a dangerous game with their extremely low tolerance of dissent
This is where I think it is a very calculated risk. Essentially this cohort were always going to be the thorn in his side. But his centrist position has further marginalised the far left in the Party. He's given them a chance to follow the manifesto, they've swerved it and he has said fine, I don't need you.
If they had abstained, like a few did, this wouldn't have happened. They would have been warned and he's followed through with any warning.
I think the policy is rubbish, but the approach is sensible. He's shown that he is keen to stick to the manifesto and do things appropriately. The optics of just relying on the magic money tree would look bad, despite there likely being a multiplier effect of reversing the policy. Let's judge after a year, not after a few weeks.
At least no one can call him indecisive anymore.
But his centrist position has further marginalised the far left in the Party.
I posted a link to an opinion piece by Rosie Duffield written in today's Times.....he is also marginalising centrists!
The deputy prime minister's CV:
Rayner was born and raised in Stockport, where she attended the comprehensive Avondale School. She left school aged 16 whilst pregnant and without any qualifications. She later trained in social care at Stockport College and worked for the local council as a care worker. She eventually became a trade union representative within Unison, during which time she joined the Labour Party.
Hmm. That's the second highest ranking minister. Oh well.. socialism.
What, faced with trying to force workers who can’t afford to start a family to pay for the large families of benefit dependents
A lot of those "benefit dependents" are workers? Its just we are subsidising their employers to not pay a living wage.
In addition circumstances change. If you get laid off and can only find a low paying job then what are you supposed to do with that third kid?
I also understand that if you hang your hat on costing/funding things to get elected, you have to be shown to have done that or the right wing press will make your job harder
The King's Speech contained significant financial commitments which have been made ahead of spending reviews. I guess they were judged to be more important than the benefit cap.
Keir Stoma's government say they'll build 1,500,000 new homes over the next 5 years.
That's 822 a day.
They've been in a few weeks now, how's that panning out for them?
If those in the common room will allow discussion of any other subjects than endlessly banging on about their hobby horse de jour…
Its Starmers first PMQ’s today. That should be an interesting dynamic.
i doubt the Ridhi’s good grace of last week will last and it’ll be a return to the peevish head boy but apparently one of the Reform lot have got a question. I presume that’ll be about Starmer ‘flooding the country with immigrants’ or some similar guff.
I normally stick it on the radio while I’m working, but I think I’ll watch this one today, if only to see how the little fella deals with the reality of his demotion to the opposition benches. I really can’t see him sticking it out until November, with California calling over the summer
"whether they need to be called out"
Say what you like. If that CV landed on your desk would you hire them for anything more complex than unskilled labour?
And in her case, appalling bad on paper, appallingly bad in reality. So there's no calling out to be done. Crayons is appalling bad. It's a fact.
Hmm. That’s the second highest ranking minister. Oh well.. socialism.
Yes we should all doff our caps for the Eton educated millionaires that did such a spiffing job of running things for the last decade plus, your hero deadbeat dad Johnson fathered how many illegitimate kids and abandoned them?
Could you be more sexist or snobbish grimep?
That rayner was a care worker, one of the hardest jobs in the country, learnt to sign, studied part time at college to get her nvq whilst raising a child on her own and then rising up to become the most senior union rep, for the whole of the north West, before being elected an MP despite relentlessly snobbery from the rw press ...says that she's got more determination and capability than most.
Anyway revelatory interview on R4 today firmer head of counter terrorism
Discussing the last governments disastrous border policy he noted that the system has been a shambles for the last decade and that the £700m spaffed on Rwanda is 10x the counter terrorism budget!!
Labour's plan to unify the policy currently shared by 5 different departments /ministries with dedicated funding is long over due, a huge task but finally being tackled sensibly
He’s shown that he is keen to stick to the manifesto and do things appropriately.
Although before the election the manifesto was meant to be just minimise he "right wing attacks" and stuff not in the manifesto was going to be done anyway. Now all the shouty centrists have flipped to manifesto zealotry as an excuse to shout down anyone who disagrees with the path they are indicating.
@brokenbanjo interesting article that. Agreed re the problems of a more nuanced debate on the need for migration.
