[Closed] UK bouldering grades

UK bouldering outdoors using font grades usually. These are different to sport and trad tech grades but use similar numbering but there isn't really a read across

Edit sorry wrong chart

Not Font grades?
No idea, but I always preferred Font grades. I can't see how a single move Uk tech grade can be used for a boulder problem....unless it is one move long.

Fairly sure that it'll be Font grades.

Ive seen that page before and it seems to date from 2011.

At that time, i would refer to every n wales problem with a V grade.

Now however, it seemed like everything was described purely as a '6c' or similar grade. In the same way as a trad toute would list the hardest technical difficulty.

Have i misunderstood? Is the book pushing someines personal agenda?

Ian

V-grades are still dominant as far as I'm aware. The only area they are lacking is at the easy end of the scale, I think VB to V0 covers a huge range of grades.

Would be an interesting choice to go back to trad technical grades unless there are a lot of 4b/4c/5a boulders.

(and as others have said, Font grades would be a better choice in those circumstances.)

Ok, so we have moved away from the V grades of the US and adopted Font grades?

My previous post seemed to cross with lots of others...sorry

The 6c is a font grade. As I said similar numbering format to sport or trad tech grades but different scales which do not read across. Also UK trad tech and (french) sport grades do not read across either.

@martinhutch thats what i thought, but i seem to have slept my way to a new world of tech descriptions

My incredibly limited experience is that V grades are still used at quite a lot of indoor centres, whilst outdoors most guidebooks use Font grades.

@old dog thanks.

I think i have it now!

Ian

The rockfax sheets are useful for comparison.

Most bouldering gyms do use V grades just to add to the general confusion!

There is/was also the Peak 'B' grade too. That seemed unnecessary and I thought was soft-touch on any kind of comparison with Font or V grades.

Because climbing doesnt have the same opportunity to come up with new gear standards has to make do with new grades.

I also have my own grading system which tops out at ohyouabsolutebastard11 🙂

Because climbing doesnt have the same opportunity to come up with new gear standards has to make do with new grades

We do obsess about shoes though - especially in bouldering

Ok, so we have moved away from the V grades of the US and adopted Font grades?

Still some local variation but Font grades seem to be gaining the ascendency.

Whereas the alternatives are going downhill fast?

V grades all day in and out for me. Just look at how much Font grade 6 covers

For a nation that came up with the metric system, Font grades are a confusing mess. Just remember to deduct 2 V grades from your ability when moving from indoor to outdoor.

Thanks all. Its obvious now.

So i need to get back outside and obsess about some new shoes, whilst enjoying my new guide book

Ian

I was climbing V4 at my previous local and nowadays I'm a middle of the road yellow climber at climbing works (pic above). If that helps as a conversion reference.

edit - that said I'm a believer in just climbing what looks fun and forget the grade!

@ cougar. That needed great appreciation!

The Font grades are correctly (but not always) written with a capital letter eg 6A whereas UK tech are small letters 6a.

that V grades are still misused at quite a lot of indoor centres

FTFY.
To be honest, V grades seem to be really badly understood in the UK in general at the lower end of the scale.
Brits tend to vastly overstate the V grade of easy problems if they've never actually been bouldering in the states.

I can on sight 7a sport, climb 6b English Tech and 6b Font grades.

But over various trips to Utah & California I have never climbed harder than V2. Loads of the V1s in Little Cottonwood, Joe's and Big Bend are absolute nails.

The idea that the problems I climb at The Depot are V5 or V6 is laughable.

There is/was also the Peak ‘B’ grade too. That seemed unnecessary

It was meant to deal with the issue I outlined above, but quite rightly got little traction as the last thing we needed was another slightly wrong bouldering grade.

that said I’m a believer in just climbing what looks fun and forget the grade!

You should pop down the new Climbing Hanger, they don't have grades at all but then you just end up grading them yourself... Oh a Hanger purple is about a Depot black, around an Awesome walls pink or just above a Works Pinkle but not quite a yellow, what? The Works have swapped black and yellow round? Yes because they set some really hard yellows and some easy blacks so just swapped... Just say it's a flipping V4 and don't get me started on when the Foundry set light brown next to dark orange.

Locally we don't use V grades at all , so they have no context for me. Font grades only.

I'd agree with the generalist that at the bottom end, where I usually operate, bouldering grades can be absolutely nails in established areas. 6A = english technical 6a...

I helped write the first OTE Yorkshire bouldering guide with Steve Rhodes back in the day. And unhelpfully we used technical grades from memory as V grades and don’t grades weren’t commonplace. But that was also before bouldering mats, the best we had was a bit of carpet and a beer towel.

"I can on sight 7a sport, climb 6b English Tech and 6b Font grades.

But over various trips to Utah & California I have never climbed harder than V2. Loads of the V1s in Little Cottonwood, Joe’s and Big Bend are absolute nails.

The idea that the problems I climb at The Depot are V5 or V6 is laughable."

So glad to see this. I might have done a V3 once (according to Uk climbing)

The tip I remember is that 2 grades up front a font grade is the sport grade

So a 6a Font is something like 6c sport

But as all my climbing was really before either system I can't confirm

Update technical master gets V4!!!

file://fileservc/home$/JMC/downloads/guidebook_sample_BMC_millstone.pdf

You should pop down the new Climbing Hanger

Went last week for the first time. Big fan. The setting I thought was very different to the rest of the city, lots of lateral movement. Can see it becoming my favourite boulder place (foundry is hard to beat as overall favourite though).

“I can on sight 7a sport, climb 6b English Tech and 6b Font grades.

But over various trips to Utah & California I have never climbed harder than V2. Loads of the V1s in Little Cottonwood, Joe’s and Big Bend are absolute nails.

Surely that just means the UK fixed a system that was unfit for purpose? By what you're saying, a V0 could be either a beginner route or something a seasoned climber would struggle on. Imagine travelling an hour to find it's all way beyond you capability!

bouldering...

routes...

and for a short discussion of the grade of 3 pebble slab and agreement on everything else grade related there's ukclimbing.com forums...

@spin has developed the best grading system ever. There are only two levels.

Piece of piss - I can do.

Quite hard actually - I can’t.

Cheers

Sanny

The tip I remember is that 2 grades up front a font grade is the sport grade

So a 6a Font is something like 6c sport

I think that's probably one of those rules of thumb that has as many exceptions as routes that conform. The short answer is that the two aren't really comparable a lot of the time.

Grades probably matter less for bouldering than any other type of climbing and for bouldering there's a lot to be said for the old adage that there's only 2 grades, those you can do and those you can't.

I agree with those saying V grades aren't well understood in the UK but actually it doesn't matter too much provided they are broadly consistent across the country. It's a bit unrealistic to expect them to match V grades in the US as there aren't that many people climbing regularly in both places and the styles are often different.

When I was responsible for setting at a wall we used V grades because they seemed simpler but that gradually made less and less sense as Font grades became the norm outside in the area.

I definitely still think about problems with a UK tech grade but that's not going to help newer climbers or non trad climbers!

spin has developed the best grading system ever. There are only two levels.

Ha ha, pretty much said as much in the post above but I can't take credit for that! Can't remember who said it off the top of my head, maybe John Long or someone like that?

Probably worth pointing out too that grades are massively style and rock dependent. When I was climbing well (a long time ago) I’d climb steep, crimpy limestone stuff really easily, largely down to training on a steep crimpy board.

I remember coming to the Peak and trying nadgery grit slopey problems well within my Yorkshire grade ability and finding them grim.

My two local walls use the V grading system - they seem to have invented + and - grades at the lower end of the scale, which I can't see the point of - a v0+ or a v0- is just a v0

They recently moved away from a grade range (so everything was v0-v2, v1-v3 etc.) Prefer the new system aside from the + - nonsense

@rls1 I can't quite decide if I like the Hanger or not, I'm used to climbing a coloured circuit in one go & their setting schedule doesn't really sit well with that.

@turboflard I totally get this, especially indoors, why do they buy the entire V4 set in fake Limestone and the V5 in fake slate? Means I can climb 5 better than 4.

As for V grades being misunderstood, considering people have climbed V10 I think the new V meaning makes more sense than the original V meaning.

There was a very well know Dundonian climber (now resident in Bermuda) who had a staring system for routes that went either "****ing magic" or "pure shite".

Ha ha, pretty much said as much in the post above but I can’t take credit for that! Can’t remember who said it off the top of my head, maybe John Long or someone like that?

You're thinking of John Gill.

 

The idea that the problems I climb at The Depot are V5 or V6 is laughable.

Shush! My ego can't take all this downgrading!

Trying to stick to v-grades accurately would be a nightmare for any wall. The first four sets at the Depot (Green/White/Blue/most of Black) would all be VB or V0.

Brought up on font grades for last 7yrs at Eden Rock.

Of course they are all pointless as bouldering isn't big enough to need a grade. You look at at, try to climb it and succeed or fail.

Of course they are all pointless as bouldering isn’t big enough to need a grade. You look at at, try to climb it and succeed or fail.

I think we all know it's all about the grade. As a friend of mine put it 'subtle changes in brain chemistry soon fade but a grade is forever'. 🙂

John Gill

That rings a bell, the two grades were something like NBD (no big deal) and PDH (pretty darn hard).

There were other grades - I rememver YDFS as well (You die for sure) - they're pinched from some spoof aid grades from an article in the 80's. John Gill used 3 grades I think based on how many tries he needed.

But you can either do it or not isn't a joke for grading boulders, especially stuff that's a bit nacky. I remember a friend who onsites sport 7a occasionally getting more and more annoyed as he couldn't figure out the trick on a local 4+

Onsight sport whatever rarely counts for much on grit or font bouldering though. It's all about time on that rock. But I do remember one sport crag exception from BITD - Lehn at Interlaken. Like Fontainbleau gone crag sized. On-sight 7a there, excepting the crimpy routes, was a tough exercise in full body movement on slopers. You could go from a week there back to Fontainbleau and you would be on it from day one.

Just look at how much Font grade 6 covers

Well yeah, but as long as you have benchmark problems at each grade then you are good to go.

So for starters, 6a = Mary Rose, Bas Cuvier

By what you’re saying, a V0 could be either a beginner route or something a seasoned climber would struggle on. Imagine travelling an hour to find it’s all way beyond you capability!

Well yes, quite agree.

Surely that just means the UK fixed a system that was unfit for purpose?

Not really. They created the Peak B grade or whatever it was which just confused matters more for a few years and then disappeared.