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My head is fried – our daughter recently bought a horse after being gifted some money by her grandparents. Over the last few years (when she had a full-loan horse) we would just hire a horsebox as and when she wanted to travel. However, now she has her own and has much more time and flexibility over when she competes, we are considering getting a car capable of towing (someone at the yard has kindly offered us free use of her horse trailer) so we don't need to book boxes months and months in advance and have all the hassle of collecting and dropping them off every time.
So - is there a website that simply lists cars by their towing capacity as it seems such a minefield and there's loads of contradictory information out there. We could just go nuclear and get something capable of towing 3500kg, but I don't want to be lumbered driving around in a huge (and correspondingly expensive to run) vehicle.
I'm afraid you'll have to do some homework - this is the site I normally use...
https://towcar.info/towing.php
My wife tows her horse very well with this - so you are looking at those sorts of figures...
...two small ponies or one horse - for two 16.2hh horses you'd need 3.5t towing capacity.
Probably not an exhaustive list but:
www.towingcapacity.co.uk/weight-limits/3500kg/
*swap the last /3500kg/ for other numbers.
n.b. it's more to do with the weight, gearbox, clutch and drivetrain of the vehicle than it's power. Even old series landorvers are rated for 3.5t, despite having a whopping 52hp. Basically they assumed you'd stick it in low range on the hills and just hold up the rest of the traffic. They also have scary drum brakes. Consider whether you think the car is actually capable of pulling itself and another car's weight behind it up a reasonable hill, especially something FWD if it's raining.
So - is there a website that simply lists cars by their towing capacity as it seems such a minefield and there's loads of contradictory information out there.
Check the actual car you look at as well. Some may or may not be homologated to tow at all if the wrong options were ticked at the factory. Don't just trust a database that says "Ford Kuga 2.0 TDCI - 2500kg", check on the VIN that the Kuga in front of you is actually type approved for that. And it's not always sensible either. The utilitarian version might be homologated, but the sporty one not, despite being exactly the same just with more power, which should make it even better.
as per answer last time this cropped up - early Porsche Cayenne (petrol) or early VW Tourareg (same car underneath but diesel).
Rated at 3.5t, 4wd, low range transfer box with difflock. Sensible priced and nice to run about in daily.
It is late so I won't check all the replies but...
Do not believe the listed tow weights on those websites. They will give you a steer of the maximum possible but some cars listed cannot tow unless they had factory towbar prep as an extra. This isn't a retrofit thing.
The reason I have a diesel Superb and not an IV hybrid one is a very clear example of this. If you look up the Superb hybrid on those online spec sites it's able to tow quite considerable amounts ... But only with factory towbar prep.
I checked 4 with internet listed towing capacities and not one of them was capable of towing when I looked at the VIN plate.
You must always check the VIN plate of the actual car you are buying. This has the weights on. No second weight (dashes or zeroes) no tow. Ever.
The online car supermarkets were all clueless on this. Gave up with two of them with cars we wanted because noone could actually check the VIN plate.
Sorry I scrolled up and spotted immediately someone had already made the same points.
A friend has a VW Toureg as RNP suggested above, seems to tow a very large twin axle trailer with impunity and is liveable the rest of the time.
My mk1 Kuga (diesel, 140 bhp and front wheel drive) copes very well (big clutch, big brakes) but just isn't heavy enough to feel safe when towing near its limit.
You need to check the horse box you're borrowing, can be quite a difference in their weights.
Also, no reason really to need something with a 3.5T towing capacity if you never intend to tow a box and 2 large horses. My OH has never had more than 2.5T towing capacity, consequently she's never attempted to take 2 horses.
Her current horse is a Connemara, between this and her trailer she's barely at 1.5T (her AWD Kia Sportage is rated at 1900kg, while smaller engined and/or 2-wheel drive versions are only 1600kg).
Mate of mine has a VW Amarok to pull his twin axel, big lad caravan. When he looked at swapping the Amarok and Passat they also own for a do it all vehicle the answer he came up with, after much research was BMW X5.
i think 3.5T is overkill. 2.5T will get you most things. I'll point you in the direction of the Mazda CX 60 and 80 -which are both very nice cars to be in and considerably cheaper than Bimmers and Porsches.
i think 3.5T is overkill. 2.5T will get you most things.
Depends what and where you're towing.
I remember growing up we used to tow ~18ft trailer sailers which were probably up to ~1200kg behind fairly average TD estate cars with ~2000kg towing capacity. It's probably fine until you get to a bit of grass, or a too smooth slipway, or any incline big enough to have the word "hill" in it's name. There was a lot of going uphill in 1st and getting out to push it across grass, dragging it up slipways with rope, etc.
If it was just going up and down the motorway occasionally I'd not worry about it. But horses implies farms, fields, hills, rural roads etc all of which will be made easier with something with a bit more grunt (and big brakes, and 4x4).
Leftfield suggestion, 80's Discovery with a V8? It'll absolutely drink petrol. But will be tax exempt and classic insurance so there's very low running costs apart from that. Which means that aside form the capital required to buy it and having to park it there's no need to use it as your everyday car so you can still have something small and economical the other 90% of the time.
early Porsche Cayenne (petrol) or early VW Tourareg (same car underneath but diesel).
Rated at 3.5t, 4wd, low range transfer box with difflock. Sensible priced and nice to run about in daily.
But I really don't want to be running around daily in a huge Tourareg – when it's not on horse duties, it is a family runaround and I don't want something that will barely hit 20mpg in town if I can help it.
FWIW, the trailer we can borrow is 1400kg and the horse (young and going to get a bit heavier) is around 550kg so my 'sweet spot' would be something rated at 2500kg. The owner tows it with two smaller ponies in her Kuga but I really don't think that's a great idea.
FWIW, the trailer we can borrow is 1400kg
That's a weighty trailer (is it an Equitrek?) - especially + horse + all the other gubbins chucked in a trailer.
I think realistically you are into the 3.5t towing capacity.
From the research I've done you've either to vehicles in the 2t category or they jump to 3.5t category. I can't think on many inbetween.
That's a weighty trailer (is it an Equitrek?) - especially + horse + all the other gubbins chucked in a trailer.
I think realistically you are into the 3.5t towing capacity.
Yeah, I am very surprised they tow it with a Kuga (he is a lorry driver though, so a pretty experienced driver)
(is it an Equitrek?)
I *think* it is an Ifor Willams
I have spent a bit of time looking at this issue too - maybe needing to tow in the future and not wanting to drive a massive truck on a daily basis. It made my head hurt! Newer vehicles, especially hybrid has surprisingly low towing capacities. Something like a new Hyundai SantaFe (in my eyes a big truck) can only tow about 750kg from memory!
Our current thinking is to borrow / rent a small horse lorry as needed. But following this with interest.
What model? My wife's Ifor Williams 505 is a smidge over 900kg. Even their posh ones are not more than 1000kg unladen weight
Wife's is like this...
i think 3.5T is overkill. 2.5T will get you most things.
Depends what and where you're towing.
I remember growing up we used to tow ~18ft trailer sailers which were probably up to ~1200kg behind fairly average TD estate cars with ~2000kg towing capacity. It's probably fine until you get to a bit of grass, or a too smooth slipway, or any incline big enough to have the word "hill" in it's name. There was a lot of going uphill in 1st and getting out to push it across grass, dragging it up slipways with rope, etc.
If it was just going up and down the motorway occasionally I'd not worry about it. But horses implies farms, fields, hills, rural roads etc all of which will be made easier with something with a bit more grunt (and big brakes, and 4x4).
Leftfield suggestion, 80's Discovery with a V8? It'll absolutely drink petrol. But will be tax exempt and classic insurance so there's very low running costs apart from that. Which means that aside form the capital required to buy it and having to park it there's no need to use it as your everyday car so you can still have something small and economical the other 90% of the time.
You'd be looking at a Range Rover rather than a Discovery if you wanted an 80s tax exempt vehicle. The latest year for Tax exempt vehicles is 1984 at the moment and Discoveries weren't introduced until 1989.
@the-muffin-man – that looks very similar (if not identical). The person didn't know the weight of it but I just took a pic of this (and assumed the 1400kg was the unladen weight)...
Our current thinking is to borrow / rent a small horse lorry as needed. But following this with interest.
The only issue with that approach is the availability (they get booked up months and months in advance especially in the summer) and the lack of flexibility/added time aspect. For example, if we wanted to go to an event 30 miles away and it ran from 11am-5pm, we would have to be up at 7am to drive to somewhere to collect the horsebox, do the paperwork, drive to the stables to get the horse then potentially go back on ourselves to get to the event. At 5pm on the dot we'd have to be rushing to load the horse, drive back to the stables, unload and sort the horse, clean the box out (as it is usually expected) then drive it back and hope we manage to get there for 7pm (which, in our experience, is when they are normally required back). It's not fun and adds lots of stress to the day.
Something like a new Hyundai SantaFe (in my eyes a big truck) can only tow about 750kg from memory!
That would be the limit for an unbraked trailer surely? Horse trailers are all braked.
From memory the mk2 Kuga was actually a very good towing vehicle and won caravan nerd awards for it? Seem to remember Top Gear mag having one on long term test and them commenting on it's ability?
I remember this stuff because we had one at the time although didn't use it for towing.
That could be the max loads for the towing hitch not the trailer. Many get replaced over the years as they fail (my wife's has), so it may not be original.
Knott seem to be a maker of those!...
https://www.knott-trailer.co.uk/auflaufeinrichtung.html
Just looked on Ifor Williams parts list too and this the the coupling unit they use - rated from 1400kg to 2700kg. So that's it's operating range not the unladen weight of the trailer...
...but as above, our Kuga is great - 4WD, 180bhp - no trouble at all with one horse and that Ifor Williams trailer.
We had a MkII Freelander before this and that was spot-on too.
That's what i would have thought, but having now checked the specs, it's 750 unbraked and only 1100 braked! Hyundai SANTA FE | Technical specifications | April 2024 The sales guy in the showroom mumbled something about it being the hybrid system that was the issue, and there are no longer diesel versions available.Something like a new Hyundai SantaFe (in my eyes a big truck) can only tow about 750kg from memory!
That would be the limit for an unbraked trailer surely? Horse trailers are all braked.
It set me off down a rabbit hole of looking at lots of other vehicles, and the pattern is similar on hybrids from other manufacturers.
The odd exception seems be volvo estates, where even a V60 can pull 2000kg!
I checked - 750 unbraked, 1100 braked! Hyundai SANTA FE | Technical specifications | April 2024Something like a new Hyundai SantaFe (in my eyes a big truck) can only tow about 750kg from memory!
That would be the limit for an unbraked trailer surely? Horse trailers are all braked.
The salesman suggested it was something to do with the hybrid system. The Tucson also had similarly low ability.
I just checked - yes 750 is unbraked, but only 1100kg braked. THe salesman suggested its something to do with the hybrid system not being up to it.Something like a new Hyundai SantaFe (in my eyes a big truck) can only tow about 750kg from memory!
That would be the limit for an unbraked trailer surely? Horse trailers are all braked.
Seems to be a common thing now on lots of these SUVs with hybrid engines - the towing capacity is much lower than expected. He also mentioned that older diesels were now commanding a premium and suggested i look at a Land Rover. I really dont want to buy a Land Rover.
Apologies for my multiple posts - when i post a reply it seems to vanish!
as per answer last time this cropped up - early Porsche Cayenne (petrol) or early VW Tourareg (same car underneath but diesel).
Rated at 3.5t, 4wd, low range transfer box with difflock. Sensible priced and nice to run about in daily.
The vehicle of choice for all illegal car transporters 🙂
For anything that will cope it's going to be a heavier AWD or RWD car, large saloon or SUV.
The other choice is to run an additional vehicle, if you pick the right models some (bike) vans will tow over 2500. The Transit 330 and 350 models should have a decent tow weight (most are light duty 260/280 models)
The downside with a van is reversing on your blind side which takes practise (unless you have a window in the sliding door)
In the freezing cold car park around me there is a 2018 Sportage, a new Sportage, an Alfa SUV, a Shogun and a Range Rover
So - time for an update. I am pretty sure it is the same trailer as @the-Muffin-man posted above (Ifor Williams HR505) so, at 905kg, and with a 16.2 horse, it looks pretty much ideal. I have now done a load of research and the Kuga gets some very good reviews as a towing car and, more importantly, as I drive it as the 'second car', it is meant to be quite fun to drive anyway. So we are now looking at circa. £6k examples.
Why did we ever give that five-year-old pony lessons? 🤣
The photo is the hitch plate. There should be another one with maximum weight and axle weights. Ifor Williams normally put it on the draw bar
There are too many options for kerb weight so it's rarely stamped and you'll only know by putting it on a weighbridge but can make a close guess from the catalogue.
Also check a vehicles GTW, common with pick ups that they can tow 3.5t, but then only leaves a couple hundred kg after driver for passengers and kit
You'd be looking at a Range Rover rather than a Discovery if you wanted an 80s tax exempt vehicle. The latest year for Tax exempt vehicles is 1984 at the moment and Discoveries weren't introduced until 1989.
I was thinking Defender but typed Disco for some reason. There's plenty of defenders with V8 conversions out there as V8's are cheap and plentiful compared to donor 300tdi's. A 110 would also fit the bill but I'd want one with disk brakes which is unlikely at that budget.
An RR is probably a better shout though if you could find a non-rusty one. Less likely to have been abused off-road (or will be obvious if it has) but sounds like the OP actually needs to drive it regularly so would need to consider how that thirsty engine offsets against any savings in tax.
TBH I think the only 'good' LR you'd get at that sort of price is a 2.5NA army one. Which may be a bit ponderous as a daily driver and would need to make full use of the low range towing anything up a hill!
I have now done a load of research and the Kuga gets some very good reviews as a towing car and, more importantly, as I drive it as the 'second car', it is meant to be quite fun to drive anyway. So we are now looking at circa. £6k examples.
TBH I think the only 'good' LR you'd get at that sort of price is a 2.5NA army one. Which may be a bit ponderous as a daily driver and would need to make full use of the low range towing anything up a hill!
Having part-owned an ex-army Landy, there is zero chance of my buying one to use for towing a very expensive horse around and using it as a daily. 🤣
I have no experience with horses but all my knowledge comes from caravanning and the community, for what that's worth.
The rated towing capacity of a car is done by testing how much it can move up a certain slope, IIRC. This is not necessarily what's practical or safe to tow in real life. There are a number of other things to consider.
- The max gross train weight which is also on the car's plate - this may not add up the way you think.
- The rule of thumb for caravans was always not to tow more than 85% of the car's kerb weight athough we are told you can push that to 100% these days with modern cars. If you exceed that then the police and/or your insurance company might consider you to be dangerously loaded despite being under the official limit - although I am not sure where that assertion comes from.
- The max weight supported by the towbar (nose weight) is a bigger issue. For stability you want 5-7% of the weight of the van on the towbar. If you are towing 2,000kg that requires a nose weight of 100kg and that is in the domain of proper SUVs or trucks (or perhaps vans, not sure). This may be different for horse boxes.
THe salesman suggested its something to do with the hybrid system not being up to it.
More likely the brakes or the total weight of the vehicle + max trailer hitting some threshold (either legal or physics).
Like all the T5 program LandRovers (RRS and Disco 3) i worked on were capable and tested to tow about 6 tonnes. But legally plated to do 3.5 for tax/licencing/classification/marketing reasons.
The photo is the hitch plate. There should be another one with maximum weight and axle weights. Ifor Williams normally put it on the draw bar
I had three different stamps on my caravan, the one for the hitch (similar to the one shown up there, i think the weight range is what the brake circuit is suitable for, but might be wrong!), the one for the axle/base/chassis (heaviest assembly the chassis is rated for) and the "plated weight", which is (by far) the lowest at 1140 kg. Think my trailer has two, chassis and plated.
The only legal ones are the plated weight.
Regarding the Knott trailer plate up there. The 1400 & 2700 kg fields most likely denote maximum tow weights on that particular hitch if fitted to a single or a dual axle trailer. My 2 pence worth (as someone who spends half his life towing), if it is hilly, muddy, or heavy (1.5 tonnes or more), then you really need a proper 4x4 with a low ratio transfer box. If not so hilly then look for a good heavy AWD vehicle with a slush box, something along lines of a Volvo/BMW estate. If you live somewhere flat and won't ever tow more that 1.5 tonne then your options are much more open.
FWIW I have a 1983 Landrover 110 plated to tow 4 tonnes (tax exempt), but cannot use that for business towing unless I tax it again. I would also need to refit the vacuum brake assist system to tow more than 3.5 tonnes anyway! But my day to day tow vehicle is a 2010 VW T5 with 4motion AWD. Has a rated towing limit of 2.5 tonnes and tows easily as well as the Landrover (with more power and the same weight). However, it easily reaches its limit when needing to do a hill start with a trailer full of lambs. Plenty of grip, but the clutch just won't take it for long!
It can be an expensive option but buy a horse lorry. We have a 4.5t based one that will take 2 horses. They retain their value incredibly well and when daughter leaves (uni?) flog it and get most of your money back. Also so much less hassle / issues than towing a box. You also keep your existing car.