[Closed] this riding on footpath nonsense

I went on some local footpaths at the weekend and got a thorn in my rear tyre......watch out they bite back !!

(been going on the same paths since 91 with no trouble)

If a cyclist isn't confident enough to ride on the road, maybe they should be riding at all.

The most stick I've had by far for this has been from other mountain bikers and particularly STWers 🙂

paddy, bless you, I'm talking about bumpy muddy public footpaths, not pavements/sidewalks etc

When we did this one before, nobody could come up with anybody having been taken to court for it - not even in the places where it's a criminal offence under bye-laws. I've also googled before now - am reasonably convinced nobody has ever got into serious trouble for it.

(why does my google browser thing "googled" is a spelling mistake?)

I once almost went to prison for cycling through a golf course aracer. I was really worried - as you can imagine.

YOu would Ernie. did you smash a loom while you were at it

SFB - you provide people with the ammunition to bitch and make a fuss - same morally as red light jumpers

That story must be worth sharing

I ride footpaths in the hope of meeting SFB 😉

SFB - you provide people with the ammunition to bitch and make a fuss - same morally as red light jumpers

an interesting concept 🙂 The difference being that no one is placed in any danger of physical harm! But as for bitching I'm sure they can do that without any help from me!

I once rode across the 18th hole of Barbon golf course, under the impression I was on a bridleway and those distant golfers were waving at me cheerily :o) The reason being that the actual route of the BW had been allowed to become so overgrown I didn't even see it...

SFB -the red light jumping I do is to improve my safety - but it still causes the cage drivers to bitch.
By riding on footpaths you give the bitches ammunition

By riding on footpaths you give the bitches ammunition

ammunition for gobfarts ? Why would I care ? The point is, it's only an issue in people's heads. IRL no one has the time or inclination to police it and without enforcement (on dubious grounds anyhow) case law is entirely moot, as I weekly demonstrate.

I still think somebody(else) should organise a well publicised, Kinder Scout style mass trespass. On Kinder Scout for added antagonism. (Only if it's still a FP obviously, it'd be a shit demo if it was now a BW!)

I still think somebody(else) should organise a well publicised, Kinder Scout style mass trespass

How about this? (STW Jan ride)
[url= http://www.bogtrotters.org/rides/2010/24jan/DSC_0111_.jp g" target="_blank">http://www.bogtrotters.org/rides/2010/24jan/DSC_0111_.jp g"/> [/img] click pic for bigger[/url]

38 riders in central Lakeland on a Sunday and 40% footpaths...

[url= http://www.bogtrotters.org/rides/2010/24jan/thumb/144p.jp g" target="_blank">http://www.bogtrotters.org/rides/2010/24jan/thumb/144p.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

Paramo clad ramblers waving a leki pole in red faced rage - 0

Fail.

Damn good start though 😉

I regularly ride sections of footpath that connect bridlepaths, on the assumption that back in the sixties people were too stupid to realise that a route that people rode horses on didn't suddenly require them to get of and carry the horse just because the next parish shows a footpath. No matter what Mr Sanctimonious says. It's the hypocracy of Ramblers that gets me; mass [i]trespass[/i] to get their access, but denial of same to others just because of poor ROW mapping by parishes when access law was changed in the sixties.

I heard about the Jan ride, Footpaths on a Sunday afternoon with 36 people - not my preferred method.

Nice evening or small groups being discreet is what I prefer.

In an area such as the lakes where there is already some tension about use of the fells it would be useful for people to at least not head out in big groups in the middle of the day. The last thing we need is someone to have an accident with a rambler who maybe waved his walking stick at a bike then we all have a much bigger issues and it is taken beyond a minor telling off.

The last think I want to see is a bunch of National Trust/NP guys sent out to look out for bikers forcing confruntation

Nice evening or small groups being discreet is what I prefer.

Are you a swinger? 😉

 

38 riders in central Lakeland on a Sunday and 40% footpaths

Sounds like hell on Earth.

Observe [url= http://www.cheekytrails.co.uk/ethics.htm ]"The Rules"[/url] and all will be fine... 🙂

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😉

SFB, that footpath was a nice smooth track, look what all those irresponsible cyclists have done to it!

anyway, footpaths are old hat, corridors are more 2010
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If someone says “bikes are not allowed on here” reply with “yes, I know, silly isn’t it?”

this is a very handy tip... a much better and more purposeful response than the usual guff I manage to summon up.. will be repeating this mantra whilst out and about later on today..

Love that site Crazy legs..

forget footpaths I always fancied a go in an airport.

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(They do look like c0cks though)

I had a Police caution when a kid, from riding on the pavement, I'd have probably got off with a telling off if I'd not been cocky:

PC - Son, here
Me - What?
PC - You are riding on the pavement
Me - Not really (technically yes, but I was 'trackstanding' with a friend as he walked on an empty pavement home from school)
PC - Whats' your name?
Me - John Smith (name changed)
PC - And whats' your dads' name (small town)
Me - MR SMITH

So he took my details, and a few weeks later my folks received a letter that I had to meet with the Chief Constable for a Police caution.

My mum (no nonesense Yorkshire lady) took me, and let the copper read what he had to do, and then berrated him for a good 5 minutes on how he ought have his guys out dealing with real-crime. He couldn't get a word in edgeways, and at the end apologised for all the inconveniance.

As we left, I said sorry to her - and she said don't be daft, and don't worry about riding on pavements - he won't have us in there again.

What's the "legal" difference between a footpath and a pavement then?

(just to open up another can of worms) 😉

it would be useful for people to at least not head out in big groups

I demur. I don't agree with the appeasement line and welcome confrontation - except it never happens - most of the time there's nobody there to notice or care and the sooner the self-policing meme is eradicted from riders, the happier they'll be

Yes going out in big groups is more likely to annoy others into complaining but I think you are on shakey ground saying big groups on FPs is irresponsible cos it may mean trouble for your future fp riding mikewsmith.

While I don't agree with SFB on much I do like his open attitude about footpaths ie he doesn't sneak around doing it. Oh and the stw lakes trip was fine, no problems with walkers, very quiet day rambler-wise actually.

I too am more of a stealth trail poacher myself tho.

Spent most of my youth (11-18+) riding footpaths and never once got questioned until I went out onto more popular paths such as those around Rivington, where the odd rambler got over-excited about my lack of bell, or subsequenty about my use of a bell. If you're careful and courteous around other path users I find you get nothing but a nice smile and a "Hi".

[i]What's the "legal" difference between a footpath and a pavement then?[/i]

Pavements are next to roads, and AFAIK it is illegal to cycle on them. Footpaths are not next to roads and AFAIK it is legal to cycle on them, but the landowner can object.

Others may disagree with the second statement.

if you are polite and considerate to other users then why not?

to get to all the out of bounds stuff in the Peak you have to use footpaths.

To be honest when you get into the stuff out you will only find like minded people (on two legs or on bikes)

Despite me finding sfb to be an argumentative, disturbingly pervy, intellectually arrogant, perniciously corrosive presence on this forum, I find myself agreeing with him on this particular point. 😕

I abandoned my principles in this area a number of years ago, originally to take the load off some badly eroded BW areas. I found that there was no other bugger using most of the footpaths in my area and realised my riding was substantially enriched with the increased variety and options for route building. Its also clear that s has been stated above, the definitive map process of the 60's was hardly undertaken thoroughly.

I now ride where I will, irrespective of ROW and only mindful of sensitive or contentious areas.

Despite me finding sfb to be an argumentative, disturbingly pervy, intellectually arrogant, perniciously corrosive

I'll accept all those but "perniciously corrosive" - how so ?

I abandoned my principles

interestingly, I'd describe it the opposite way - for years I reluctantly toed the club's line on sticking to recognised rights of way until I abandoned this craven stance...

Sorry, but bollocks to the law.

I have ridden fp's since I was a kid and will continue to do so. I simply dont care what other people think. In 23 yrs of riding, I have been moaned at twice. I tend to find a cheery preemptive "hello" does the trick with even the most militant of walkers.

Lots of farmers get pissed off with people riding on footpaths.What needs to happen is all outdoor users mtbers horse riders even the ramblers work together for better sensible access to the country side.One local nature reserve is out of bounds as a natural unspoiled place despite the steps and the gravel paths that have been put in .You get a right bollocking for riding round it but the wardens land rover is always in there.It's not us country lovers who will wreck it but all the townies who need gravel tracks steps and signs so they can access the countryside

What's the "legal" difference between a footpath and a pavement then?

A pavement is a strip of land by the side of a highway set aside for pedestrians, on which it was made illegal to drive a carriage in the 19th century. At some point, someone decided that a bike is a carriage. It is therefore a criminal offence to ride a bike on a pavement, but the advice to the police from the Home Office is only to issue a fixed penalty notice for the offence if the cyclist is riding irresponsibly.

A public footpath is a route over which pedestrians have a legal right of way. This right does not mean that you can't ride a bike on the same place; indeed there may be other legal rights of way for bikes along the same route. If there is no other right of way, the landowner or their agent may ask you to leave the land and they could start civil proceedings to recoup the damage you have done by riding on their land, just as they could if you rode anywhere on their land without permission.

For those not in the know..

if there is a footpath local to you and you know the land owner - go and speak to them - with their permission you can then ride on the said footpath - much to the chgrin of the red sock brigade.

I used to do this as a 15 year old living at my mum and dads where there was no BWs just alot of FPs..

mostly the FPs were in and around Farms and Farmland.. and the Farmers had no issues as long as I stuck to them. (which walkers often wouldnt)

I no longer worry about this as I now live in Scotland..
Where any track, trail or path on the ground - you can walk, cycle or horse ride along. However Pavements are covered by the highways act and not the Land Reform act - therefore not permissable for use by cycles.

back in 1988 i wrote to Lord Stafford asking for permission to ride my 'specially adapted bicycle' on some of his land. he wrote back, said no problem, enjoy your cycling. Hence, in Hanchurch at least, it seems the landowner is on your side no matter what the FC say.

Agree with above we wandered off a bridleway and saw the farmer in the field so we went to say sorry and he didn't mind at all just said keep hold of the dogs (which we were) and leave the gates as they are

Where any track, trail or path on the ground - you can walk, cycle or horse ride along.

If I'm not wrong, it doesnt even have to be a path or a trail, you can walk/cycle/horse ride wherever you like providing you're not being irresponsible.

What needs to happen is all outdoor users mtbers horse riders even the ramblers work together for better sensible access to the country side.

hahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahah

what needs to happen is that people need to get a grip and stop bothering others who aren't bothering them,

The ramblers association is a Vogon disguise, have you heard their bureaucratic poetry? there's nothing worse!

what needs to happen is that people need to get a grip and stop bothering others who aren't bothering them,

Obviously it is bothering them, or they wouldn't bother others 😀

I am not a rambler fan either but in an ideal world one large body of people trying to improve things may have more clout than smaller groups

the ramblers view of what might 'improve things' is probably a countryside entirely without horses, bikes, trail bikes and 4WDs.

Agree on the trailbike 4x4 bit unless it's policed properly they really rip sensitive areas apart

I regularly ride along a footpath in Bewdley on my commute.
It's through a park, so for most of its length, there is plenty of room on one side or the other to do a wide loop round any pedestrians I might meet.
Riding home one day last week, the two oncoming pedestrians were wearing police uniforms. 😕
A wide sweep to the right while maintaining the same pace and I was gone before they had time to think about Rights of Way. 😀

Please can someone post a link to this thread on the Ramblers forum?! 😉

the two oncoming pedestrians were wearing police uniforms.

beneath which they had only frilly suspenders...

In my defence, it is a proposed Sustrans route.
North out of Bewdley on the West bank, or heading upstream with the river on your right, if you prefer.
It's a far safer route from Bewdley in to the Wyre Forest than the official Route 45 up Welch Gate, but I think the Sustrans argument is that a long ride up a steep narrow hill between houses in a 30mph limit is safer than crossing a road with a 60mph limit. It isn't.

[i]and welcome confrontation - except it never happens - most of the time there's nobody there to notice or care and the sooner the self-policing meme is eradicted from riders, the happier they'll be [/i]

The confrontation may not happen there and then, instead we get people building traps and obstacles on trails after the "group ride" that affects other riders.

Is a bit of common sense really too much to ask for?

The confrontation may not happen there and then, instead we get people building traps and obstacles on trails after the "group ride" that affects other riders.

not anywhere I've ever been

Is a bit of common sense really too much to ask for?

it's common sense not to build mantraps as it's both illegal and dangerous. It's common sense that it's our country.

SFB enjoys the confrontation a bit too much but I don't think you can lay the blame of "traps" at the feet of cheeky group rides, that rests clearly with the unhinged minds of the individuals building the traps. Just as a mototorist seeing an RLJer doesn't give them carteblanche to run down cyclists, seeing trail poachers doesn't give them reason to build traps, they are just sadistic gits.

I'll admit to not having read every post on this, so apologies if this has already been said.

Like many of us I have done plenty of cheeky riding, but as someone who also likes to go for a peaceful walk with my little 'uns, it is nice to know I can get on a footpath and be fairly confident I don't have to worry about bikes hurtling towards me from both directions. Using the same reasoning, I like riding at trail centres because - generally - I'm not going to find endless walkers around every corner spoiling my fun.

I've also got scars on both arms from a bit of bailing twine strung across a bridleway. Thankfully there are no accompanying scars on my neck. I'm still wondering if this is relevant to the post 😕

don't think that most ramblers or horseriders are anti-mtb but there is potential for conflict where people ride bikes like c0cks and one or two bad experiences colours peoples opinions

got stopped by a peak park ranger riding one of those odd routes where in the 50's south yorks council made an old route a bridleway whilst derby cc decided that it would only be a footpath on their side of the border - it was pointed out that i was breaking a national park byelaw and i pointed out that the national trust that owned the land had a policy of encouraging cycling (true its in their annual report but you'd never realise it) we chatted about the view and he asked me not to do it again i said i'd fought for access for climbers and walkers and was happy to do the same for cyclists - and went on my way
as an experience compares pretty favourably with the pre crow run ins with gamekeepers and waterboard employees and their dogs and guns when out running on forbidden moorland

personally i think should be campaigning for free access for bike access to all crow land and if in exchange we need third party insurance i'd consider it a good deal (runs and hides) and if some places need a voluntary agreement to reduce conflict no big deal

I'm a live and let live rider, I always say hello and am very aware of how quick a bike can close on someone from behind and scare the bejeesuz out of them, so I exercise caution AMAP. That being said you do get some pedestrians who like to give you as much hassle as possible and bar your way. I like think they are off duty teachers and just thank them for their advice whilst sailing past.

8)

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I ride where I want when I want, and I've had confrontation maybe once or twice asa result of it. As with SFB, mostly this is a problem in [b]our[/b] heads. Most folk don't know the rules anyway, and don't venture (on the whole) more than a couple of hundred yards from which ever car park they've driven to for a nice "day out in the countryside" They mostly assume we know what we can do, and if they do know we shouldn't be there, they'll do the English thing, and mutter to themselves about it.

The last confrontation I had with a bunch of ramblers was on a Bridleway, when one decided that I was was responsible for all the erosion (tyre tracks through a puddle) I couldn't be arsed with an argument, so just ignored the silly man. That was a couple of years ago now.

True they don't. For example there are sections of 'trail' that have never been any form of ROW, however over the years bikers have made these little trails and now walkers use them. So it makes me chuckle when I see a walker getting ready to spout 'you shouldn't be on here' and I reply 'nor should you' But at least I've paid my permit money and tidy the trails up two or three time a year.

I just wave my permit and tell them it entitles me to ride anywhere I want, which isn't exactly true 😆

I try to stick to singletrack (aka footpaths) as much as possible, after all, this is the website for "Singletrack" magazine. However I'm always polite to walkers and am happy to slow down/stop if needed. 99% of the time you get a friendly "Hello", quite often followed by words of encouragement and/or a "You're mad!" type jokey comment. Occasionally you get some miserable git but I still give them the same polite treatment and just carry on riding.

I think I made my feeling clear on the other ROW post.
I'll stop riding on paths when, they take down the mobile mast in the woods, dig up the car park and road to it and return it to woodland, bulldoze the café remove all the litter it makes, get rid of all the reflective signs, make dog walkers pick up the plastic bags and remove all the bins and make people take litter home.

I'll stop riding on paths when, they take down the mobile mast in the woods, dig up the car park ...

AKA "never" :o)

I just wave my permit and tell them it entitles me to ride anywhere I want,

Day release permit?

Any farmers on here to give their views on people using their land?

Any farmers on here to give their views on people using their land?

how much time do you spend on farming forums ?

Two weeks ago, I was stopped whilst riding with my two children on a footpath (consisting of a mile long tarmac road approx 9ft wide). I was told politely that it was a footpath and that, next time, we should get off our bikes and push. He then drove off in his car along the "footpath" aka "road" leaving me scratching my head at the irony of the situation. (Car - yes, bike - no). Ok it was probably his land but it seemed ridiculous all the same. Being new to mountain biking, I posted a query on [url= http://www.mtb-wales.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=XForum&file=viewthread&tid=23962 ]this forum[/url] and received some helpful replies from others. The Scots have the right idea though!

2nd BoardinBob

I emigrated

a forestry commission guy who didn't know the law

That bloody Ashdown Forest needs sorting out with a bit of mass SFB treatment.

That bloody Ashdown Forest needs sorting out with a bit of mass SFB treatment.

be sensible, isn't one of me way more than enough ?

For those of you extolling the scottish set up remember it is not an absolute right - its qualified by the need to be reasonable and some of what you can do on bridleways such as mass rides in wet conditions would not always be reasonable. Similarly there is no duty on the part of the council to maintain tracks.

TandemJeremy - Member
For those of you extolling the scottish set up remember it is not an absolute right - its qualified by the need to be reasonable and some of what you can do on bridleways such as mass rides in wet conditions would not always be reasonable. Similarly there is no duty on the part of the council to maintain tracks.

But that's the great thing - the being reasonable - because most of the trail users on foot, bike, or horse know this, so unless you are behaving like a prat, you're likely to get a cheery hello as you go past.

I like that the council is not required to maintain tracks. No incentive for them to try to bring in restrictions to reduce costs 🙂

How can you tell a rambler from a walker ?

[url= http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-10245508-93.html ]Google builds Street View trikes to map U.K. footpaths[/url]

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So it must be ok or did google fail to google 'riding footpaths'

I wouldn't be very happy having to pedal that lot either 🙁