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Had a word with a motorist this morning.
Approaching a 3-exit roundabout. Dark, but well lit. Reflective clothing on, back light blinking merrily away. I see in my rear-view mirror there's a car about 30 yards behind me as I get to the roundabout, so I signal strongly that I'm going right (to the third exit), get on the roundabout and start to pull to the right. Next thing I know there's a !bang! as the outside of my handlebar connects with his bodywork as he bullies his way past me to go straight on.
He stops further on. I cycle up behind him and stop. He looks in his mirror and waits. I wait. I raise my arms as if to say "Well?". He gets out. I open calmly with "Are you trying to kill me, or what?" Instead of the apology and enquiry as to my well-being that I was expecting, I get "You didn't signal. You were in the middle of the road. You blah blah blah..." So I raised the volume to 11 and exercised my extensive knowledge of Anglo Saxon, finishing with informing him that he had "the brain of a ****ing wart".
Silence. As there was no damage to my bike and he had at least a scratch and hopefully a dent in the bodywork of his "Entitlement" Porsche, I left it at that...
Breathe in, breathe out.
Had two last night in less than half a mile.
First involved a van. I'm waiting to turn right at a junction. There's a van approaching from the left. I wait for the van to pass then I pull out. The van indicates left, pulls into the side of the road then all of a sudden pulls right and does a u-turn. I slam on the brakes and eyeball the guy as he's pulling the u-turn. Eventually he notices me, his face doesn't register a single emotion and he just drives off.
Less than a minute later, again I'm approaching a junction intending to turn right and I'm positioned towards the right of the give way. A woman in a Mondeo is approaching from the left, indicating to turn right into the street I'm in. She starts to turn but she's cutting the corner massively and heading straight towards where I'm about to be. I slam the brakes on, she sees me and makes an angry face as though it's my fault she can't turn a corner without veering onto the wrong side of the road.
He pays a lot of road tax you know.
Must be that sort of morning, glad your ok.
Why does the brand of car he drives matter?
Every time I read one of these threads I think "maybe I'll wait a bit longer before I start commuting on the bike again". Too many of em. 🙁
CaptainFlashheart -
Why does the brand of car he drives matter?
Because he's (the driver) more than likely a complete pleb.
Why does the brand of car he drives matter?
Normally it wouldn't. But it is a Porsche FFS. Ergo, he is more than likely a cock.
Shit driving on all accounts and a terrible reaction. It is very hard to see signalling arms sometimes, especially if it's dark, but that's not an excuse. Glad your OK.
😆 @ dd
...all of a sudden pulls right and does a u-turn...his face doesn't register a single emotion...she's cutting the corner massively...makes an angry face.
Wolverhampton by any chance?
"She starts to turn but she's cutting the corner massively and heading straight towards where I'm about to be."
I get this frequently on a road close to my house. Luckily I'm usually in the large planet-killing truck & the miscreant has on occasions had to reverse & try again.
She starts to turn but she's cutting the corner massively
You know, there's a lot of this going about at the moment. It's a particular favourite of minicab drivers. I make a point of not being run off the road so they've to rethink, but it's a bit easier to do that in a car.
Why does the brand of car he drives matter?
Why are you picking up on the OP but not the following poster making the same clarification? Is is only an issue if we highlight they're in a Porsche, not a Mondeo or a van?
Normally it wouldn't. But it is a Porsche FFS. Ergo, he is more than likely a cock.
Tend to find the opposite to be honest.
With rare exceptions crap driving is normally from crap cars, vans and taxis
Whats a Porsche Entitlement? Is it a Boxter model or a new 911?
With rare exceptions crap driving is normally from crap cars, vans and taxis
Oh I wasn't commenting on his driving ability - I'm sure what with driving a Porsche that he's more than likely an awesome driver. Possibly triple de-clutches on the roundabout.
But he's driving a Porsche! A PORSCHE FFS! So more than likely a cock. Or Richard Hammond - in which case he's. MASSIVE cock.
🙂
I like the idea it's an expensive car so his stupidity will cost him more to repair 😉
Me too! 😀
I believe there's a diesel spill on the A635 from Stalybridge to Manchester, couple of colleagues have kissed tarmac.
Or Richard Hammond - in which case he's. MASSIVE cock.
but he's a midget... 😆
thanks for scratching my new car...and the reason I didn't say anything was because I was astounded at the way you thought you owned the road !
and next time please wear something less bright as I have a massive hangover and the flashing lights and bright yellow reflective stuff made me feel very nauseas.
portlyone - MemberI believe there's a diesel spill on the A635 from Stalybridge to Manchester, couple of colleagues have kissed tarmac.
You know the Pope?
Okay, I'll bite.
OP, why were you in the middle lane to turn right at a 3 lane roundabout? Or were the lanes arrowed?
You should be in the correct position before entering the roundabout, not shifting whilst on it. The driver probably assumed you were going straight on too?
...so I signal strongly that I'm going right (to the third exit), get on the roundabout and start to pull to the right.
So the car hit you with such force that it scratched and dented it but you stayed upright?
Whats an 'entitlement Porsche', apart from something that makes you sound a touch bitter and jealous?
On a positive note I had a lovely ride home last night. It was hammering down with rain all afternoon but stopped just before I left the office. I got up to the moor and the sky cleared to reveal a lovely moonlit night. I then had an 8 mile ride on the cycle path with my lights off and just a 'be seen light' on. I t was lovely.
I think an Entitlement Porsche is something that marks you out as a bit if a cock. Being jealous of the owner doesn't really make a difference to his cock-coefficient.
But a generous size if a male chicken!but he's a midget...
Gotta love STW... OP gets hit by car, STW turns on OP!!
didn't think OP had stated which lane he was in. Some stupid roundabouts near me the cycle lanes run around the outside where presumable you're supposed to ride around the outside indicating right all the way around 😕OP, why were you in the middle lane to turn right at a 3 lane roundabout?
Tend to find the opposite to be honest.With rare exceptions crap driving is normally from crap cars, vans and taxis
+1 - most expensive sports car drivers are actually quite precious about their cars and tend to drive often very sedately unlike say big saloon or 4x4 drivers and mostly people driving really crap old cars who just dont seem to care at all. I know its a siubjective comment but feels right based on 20 years commuting by bike and as an ex Porsche 911 owner 😉
Glad to hear the car was scratched.
BTW I [b]am[/b] posting to STW the biking forum and not petrolheads?
the porsche I saw halfway down the embankment of the M6 on saturday anecdotally suggests otherwise - but admittedly I don't know the details.most expensive sports car drivers are actually quite precious about their cars and tend to drive often very sedately
hahahahahahahahAHHHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHInstead of the apology and enquiry as to my well-being that I was expecting,
Seriously woppit, you kill me, you really do, and that was before mentioning it was a Porsche.
Why does the brand of car he drives matter?
because there are cars it's wise to give a wide berth to - BMW, Porsche, Volvo (estate), any pretendy 4WD and Honda Jizz being examples.
And anything with a lowered suspension or car mod sticker taking up most of the back window
didn't think OP had stated which lane he was in. Some stupid roundabouts near me the cycle lanes run around the outside where presumable you're supposed to ride around the outside indicating right all the way around
True. But the driver complained about him being in the middle lane and Woppitt stated himself he moved to the right on the roundabout - turning right or switching lanes?
More details required before I get my pitch fork out though 🙂
Seriously woppit, you kill me, you really do
My pleasure old chap. 8)
True. But the driver complained about him being in the middle lane and Woppitt stated himself he moved to the right on the roundabout - turning right or switching lanes?More details required before I get my pitch fork out though
I'd say that passing a cyclist who's been signalling right, on his right, while going round a roundabout is an utterly stupid idea regardless of the lane he's in.
The highway code says you may choose to cycle around the outside of the RAB to go right so the driver should be anticipating that and NOT overtaking, especially as the cyclist had indicated!
I've had similar, indicate right, move out into the 'straight on' lane, then , as I join the roundabout someone will overtake me on my right only to cut across and take the first (left) exit! People see a bike and overtake without any thought.
Highway code rule 167:
167
DO NOT overtake where you might come into conflict with other road users. For example
-approaching or at a road junction on either side of the road
-when you would force another road user to swerve or slow down
-when a road user is indicating right, even if you believe the signal should have been cancelled. Do not take a risk; wait for the signal to be cancelled
[quote=bails ]I'd say that passing a cyclist who's been signalling right, on his right, while going round a roundabout is an utterly stupid idea regardless of the lane he's in.
It is, but if you're signalling right on a roundabout as a cyclist then with only a very few exceptions* you should be positioned so that a driver can't pass on your right. Which is what is being questioned.
* where for example there are two lanes marked to turn right - though even in that case I'd be inclined to take the right hand lane on a bike to make sure I don't get cut up.
Yes, but if there are two lanes to turn right then you wouldn't expect the 'right-most' lane would ALSO be for straight on, otherwise you could have a car/bus/lorry in lane 2 (for example) going right and a car to their right (in lane 3 of the RAB) wanting to go straight. So if you get cut up it's because the driver has used the wrong lane to overtake a right signalling vehicle through a roundabout. Once you're at that level of pigheaded stupidity it's hard to say "Oh, you should have ridden in the middle of the [i]other[/i] lane, that would have definitely stopped him from dangerously and illegally passing you".
Coudl the OP have ridden in a different way to discourage the driver? Possibly or probably.
Was the driver breaking the highway code and probably the law by overtaking a right-signalling vulnerable road user through a junction, cutting them up and hitting them in the process? Yes.
I'm glad people think "How could the cyclist avoid that" because it likely means that they're aware of their own safety and how to stop pr&cks in cars killing them, but it makes some of these threads seem like they're dishing out blame to the victim rather than advice.
FreddyG driver reportedly said road not lane
when said by driver to a cyclist "middle of the road" is anywhere other than 1" from the kerb."You didn't signal. You were in the middle of the road. You blah blah blah..."
Care to elaborate woppit?
[quote=bails ]I'm glad people think "How could the cyclist avoid that" because it likely means that they're aware of their own safety and how to stop pr&cks in cars killing them, but it makes some of these threads seem like they're dishing out blame to the victim rather than advice.
In case it wasn't clear (and it should be from my posting history) I wasn't blaming the cyclist at all in this case, simply suggesting that it is possible to try and prevent such incidents which aren't your fault. I totally agree with you.
We have a roundabout near here where two lanes are marked to turn right, but it catches out a lot of people as there are only two lanes entering the roundabout (left turn is on a separate filter avoiding the rounabout)! I could imagine getting a car passing on my right to go straight on if I used the left lane on a bike - I might be correct and the driver might be wrong, but it still hurts as much when I get hit, so I'd probably choose to use the right lane there even though I'd use the left lane when driving. Anecdotally, last time I did use left lane in a car I got cut up by somebody in the right lane who hadn't expected me to turn right.
when said by driver to a cyclist "middle of the road" is anywhere other than 1" from the kerb.
Fair point. But he could also have been factually correct. E.g. The middle of the road (split into 3 lanes) could be the middle lane.
Anybody know how I paste an image from Google maps streetview on here?
Click the share link and you'll get a URL you can share. Otherwise, take a screenshot and upload it to photobucket/flickr etc
Aracer: No, it wasn't aimed at you, just a general observation. Like I said, it's sensible given that we all want to avoid being squashed, so the conversation will always be: "the driver might be 100% wrong, but you could have done X to avoid it".
Fair point. But he could also have been factually correct. E.g. The middle of the road (split into 3 lanes) could be the middle lane.
So what? the driver would STILL have been overtaking a right-signalling cyclist through a roundabout! So he could have been factually correct in his statement, but his driving was STILL illegal!
Edit: thinking about it, I would guess (yes, just an unsubstantiated guess!) that the driver thought the only reason he hit the cyclist was because the cyclist was too far to the right, i.e. "in the middle of the road". The driver thinks that the cyclist should have been on the far left, he thinks that if the cyclist had have been there, depsite wanting to go right, he would have had room to overtake.
"You were in the middle of the road" rarely means:
"You were in the middle of the road, but you should have been further over to the right, to reinforce your right arm signal". It pretty much always means "You were in my way, you should be against the kerb, that's where cyclists are supposed to be."
I've never tried embedded an image but I have posted links, go to streetview find what you want then on the left pane there should be 4 buttons, get directions, my places, printer icon and chain icon. Click the chain icon and a little popout appears with 2 text boxes, top one has a URL bottom has html, copy the URL and use the link button on stw, paste the url in there.
[url= https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=LEATHERHEAD&hl=en&ll=51.31165,-0.333753&spn=0.021568,0.038581&sll=47.73855,12.508827&sspn=47.630389,79.013672&hnear=Leatherhead,+Surrey,+United+Kingdom&t=m&z=15&layer=c&cbll=51.31174,-0.333771&panoid=pTdt91hIPTPgDxpusstNTg&cbp=12,346.69,,0,3.2 ]Scene of the crime.[/url]
So did you enter the roundabout where that white astra is, whilst indicating right? Or were you in the right hand lane?
So did you enter the roundabout where that white astra is, whilst indicating right?
Yes. He clipped me about where the right hand rear light of that red car is on the roundabout itself...
hmm, now I know some are going to say you should have been in the right hand lane as per this [url= 
]pic[/url] but to those people I'd say try that on some roundabouts near me and someone from the road at the 12 o'clock position will see and empty bit of road infront/left of you and use it to turn left which will put a downer on your morning.
on first viewing I'd probably try the text book (middle of the) right hand lane, hug the island then exit, but as a local you will know more about that junction and how drivers normally behave on it than me.
Oh yeah and presumably if he was going straight on he shouldn't have been in the right hand lane so he's in the wrong there before consideration of dodgy overtakes on the roundabout.
The road in the roundabout is not marked into lanes. I was in fact ALMOST on what would have been the central line, aiming at the third exit...
Ah. So you were in the left lane wanting to turn right?
As it's a two lane entrance to the roundabout (not 3 as I thought), then the driver could quite reasonably pass you to go straight on - assuming he really did not see you as he stated. If he saw you and chanced a quick overtake, he is a nobber and you had a lucky escape.
In the future, if I were you, I'd make sure I was planted in the middle of the right lane when turning right - leaving no room for a car to squeeze through.
Glad no-one got hurt.
The road in the roundabout is not marked into lanes. I was in fact ALMOST on what would have been the central line...
Correct. But the entrance to the roundabout is split into two lanes. Given your road position one would assume you were either turning left or going straight on if no arm signal/indication was spotted.
I'd have been in the middle of the right hand lane there tbh.
Although he should have seen your signal, and the highway code does say cyclists can stick to the left hand lane all the way around the RAB if they want to.
RABs like that are not the place to be overtaking though.
I'd have been in the middle of the right hand lane there tbh.
That's my plan moving forward (which, fortunately, I can still do)... 😉
Mind you, I've then got to signal quickly to get off at the third exit with traffic maybe coming behind from the first exit in a really short space.
Hmmm. Tricky.
Think maybe I'll just get off and walk across. 😐
[quote=bails ]the highway code does say cyclists can stick to the left hand lane all the way around the RAB if they want to.
To protest from the CTC who wanted that bit removed entirely. It's certainly not recommended practice, and by far the most dangerous thing to do IMHO.
far the most dangerous thing to do IMHO
But do they have any actual evidence for that? Oh, wait...
https://www.gov.uk/rules-for-cyclists-59-to-82/roundabouts-76-to-78
sticking to the left certainly doesn't appear to be recommended
Couldn't continue past this as I felt physically sick...
I see in my [b]rear-view mirror[/b]