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Are some of you saying that a skilled turner or miller, for instance, shouldn’t be allowed to call themselves an engineer? Why does a degree make you an engineer when a ‘proper’ 5 year apprenticeship doesn’t?
Good question.
It would probably depend where the extent of their skills lay, for example marine engineers are responsible for the daily operations and maintenance as well as the legal side (safety and environmental). They are trained to use machines but I'd struggle to describe them as machinists or fitters, they may be good at certain tasks but it's not their primary vocation and a dedicated fitter will be able to work all the machines as well as the welding gear and such.
With time served in an appropriate manner your skilled craftsmen would probably be able to call themselves Engineer Technicians (EngTech). I appreciate where you are coming from but I'd say it's as bad to deny a craftsman his proper title as it is to falsely claim one with no qualification to do so. The full guidance is published in the UK-SPEC 3rd Edition [url= https://www.engc.org.uk/EngCDocuments/Internet/Website/UK-SPEC%20third%20edition%20(1).pdf ]here[/url].
Are some of you saying that a skilled turner or miller, for instance, shouldn’t be allowed to call themselves an engineer? Why does a degree make you an engineer when a ‘proper’ 5 year apprenticeship doesn’t?
An Engineer should be someone who can design something to a specification and able to ensure that it meets all necessary regulations for safety etc. The item could be a fridge, boiler, ship engine, TV, mobile phone, power supply, microwave etc.
The skilled craftsmen / technicians who then make the item to the specification aren't (Design) Engineers, that's not to denigrate their importance or skill, it's just a different skillset to (Design) Engineering.
There is a difference in being able to turn metal on a lathe to a given tolerance and understanding why the choice of material, dimensions and tolerances are important.
Don't forget the "thing" being designed could also be a process, system or service, something a craftsman may well have more than enough competence to accomplish (ignore experience at your peril).
There is a difference in being able to turn metal on a lathe to a given tolerance and understanding why the choice of material, dimensions and tolerances are important.
Machinist, no?
Here lies the problem. Engeering is a vast field on persons engineer is not another's. Some of the best engineers I have felt with have limited official engineering education (this doesn't mean no education or no mathematics education) so it all depends on the field.