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We're thinking about getting a new car/van as a replacement for our Rifter.
Looking for something around the same size/slightly bigger.
Will either be new or ex demo/almost new.
Options we are currently considering are a Caddy or an ID Buzz.
I know there's a long thread on electric cars but i'm not trawling all the way through that to see if there's any mention of the Buzz.
So anyone care to share their thought on comparing the two vehicles?
For further info it's main purpose will be transporting round two bikes and two people.
Most journeys are around 20 miles each way or less. With the exception of maybe one trip to the Alps every year.
Only doing around 7000 miles a year.
There are so many variables that you need to consider, initial outlay, monthly pcp or lease, home charging or not. The electric car thread at 120 pages would be an hour of good reading to assist your decision making process.
We would be buying it with no finance and home charging it.
I'll dip into the other thread and see what i can pick up from it.
Anyone with a Buzz feel free to reply, I'd love to know your thoughts.
There are quite a few mentions of the Buzz in that thread I recall, from costs and range through bike loading and capacity etc.
How many times woudl you need to charge it on the way to Les Alps?
could you stomach the cost of hiring a Diesel touring car for a week once a year, which would eliminate that one stumbling block (from the info youve given)
We'd probably just go back to flying for the Alps trip.
How many times woudl you need to charge it on the way to Les Alps?
long drives and charging are usually fine if you can plug it in every time you stop for a break/food/toilet etc. 20 minute top ups every few hours usually work well.
I don’t have a buzz but I did do ~2000 miles (total) to the dordogne and back this summer in an EV and didn’t have any real issues. Saw at least one English registered buzz while out there. I wouldn’t discount the feasibility of travelling to the alps in one.
Every time I've gone to the Alps I've stopped 3 or 4 times a quick look on the ionity tool id be looking at 15 stops 20/30 mins each.
Starts to make the train look attractive
Reality is like stu flying makes sense . Little point keeping a diesel car for that single trip.
https://abetterrouteplanner.com/ Will give you an idea of what charging you'd need to do on a trip to the Alps.
Train to Bourg St Maurice, cross the platform to the Les Arcs funiculaire and you're in the resort.
How many people in the car to the Alps? If four people fly then the CO2 from that flight alone will be something around half the emissions saved in 7000 miles minus an Alps trip unless you charge at home with your own solar leccy.
I'm surprised you'd need 15 stops, Trailrat. 15 in about 900 miles says you're only getting a usable range between charges of 60 miles. I get to Berlin (about 1900km) on 10-12 stops with a 395km WLTP car which isn't so different to a Buzz.
That math only really works if you significantly round down the distance from the actual 1350miles to 900 miles.
That site it cool. Tested out our normal route to skiing in Austria and was surprised how little charging there was. Given it didn't account for the normal overnight we do on the way it looks painless. 5 charges, all short, 1:15 charging time. Not in a buzz though.
Will go run the same trip on that other site above.... It wouldn't work on work laptop.
You might want to change the vehicle to the Buzz that the OP is talking about rather than the woeful eRifter which can barley get the length of a charging cable before it needs plugged in again.
Slightly Shorter route at 1200 miles same number of charges half an hour less total charge time.
I'm sure stu is capable of putting in his own numbers for his trip as I did for my trip in my proposed vehicle. - the facelift with the longer range.....
Either way it doesn't detract that from Scotland it's a **** load of charges even if the range ends up being 100% further than "the woeful rifter"
I cannot compare to a caddy, but to 10yrs of T5 and T6 Caravelle ownership. Had a buzz for 18months now, inc '24 and '25 2500mile alps trips (Scotland-Hull-Rotterdam-PdS) and a summer tour of the Outer Hebrides.
The EV conversation is somewhat independent of the Buzz, so the EV thread is a good one for that. Suffice to say, normal cars really are a bit shit compared to an EV, can't see us going back.
As place to be a driver or passenger the Buzz is an upgrade on a caravelle, except for space. Much more comfortable, so much quieter, faster, smoother, great stereo, great to drive, same high driving position but with about double the legroom for the driver, which for me is a massive boon. Also a simple and very comfortable place for the occasional #vanlife camping overnighter 🙂
Caravelle wins on space behind the front seats (height, width, length), and seating flexibility.
Downsides of Buzz - depreciation is a little more precipitous than I expected esp compared to our last T6 that went up in value (over covid), eats front tires which are not cheap to replace, I've got an intermittent rattle in the rear driver side C-pilar which is doing my nut in.
Either way it doesn't detract that from Scotland it's a **** load of charges even if the range ends up being 100% further than "the woeful rifter"
Sure, but how many more charges than stops you would've made anyway? And if it adds an hour or two to your journey how important is that to you?
Every time I've gone to the Alps I've stopped 3 or 4 times a quick look on the ionity tool id be looking at 15 stops 20/30 mins each.
Don't be daft. It's 1000 miles from the middle of Scotland to the Alps, even at 180 miles between stops you're only looking at 6 stops. ABRP is very pessimistic in my experience. Not tried Ionity. Did you have it set to fastest journey time where it's optimising the charge window or something?
I just did a test plan, and looking at one of the legs on ABRP, it thinks the ID.Buzz would do 111 miles on 74% of charge which would be a real world range of 150 miles full charge. The WTLP is 250 miles. I can't see that the real range is that bad compared to WTLP.
I put Edinburgh to Chamonix in Google so it wasn't an attempt at distorting things, honest, trailrat. JOG to Menton will be a bit more.
There are other criteria on these apps such as what you charge up to 80/90/95/100% and how low you're prepared to go. I'm happy to go to 98% on the Zoe if it means fewer charges as charge rate doesn't slow much and there's inevitably a bit of faff time to each charge.
I have previously owned 3 Caddy's, 2 diesel then a petrol DSG and last month moved to a Buzz Cargo. The Caddy's were all great vans with the petrol DSG (23 plate) being really refined and car like but the Buzz is head and shoulders better. Even my low rent version is really well kitted out, it's genuinely rapid (sub 7 to 60) and so easy and relaxing to drive. Range is realistically 250-300 depending on how you drive and the load. If you are going pre registered, make sure and get a 25 model, they have more efficient powerful motors and the crap infotainment system was revamped to an excellent version.
Love ours. I started a thread about their bike carrying abilities here (scroll down for actual pictures of bikes in it) before I got one. Also posted a message on the electric thread about what it’s like for longer distances.
Nothing to add, except that I'd love a Buzz and am planning on getting one at some point.
It would be v tax advantageous to get the Cargo, but I'd really prefer a Kombi version.
I know some converters (IDKamper?) initially had some sort of 2nd row retrofit so that you could upgrade a Kombi, and I'm sure (although I can't find) there's the ability to do a rock and roll bed from somewhere.
The LWB version seems like a no-brainer for bikes, but I don't think the Cargo comes in LWB option.
Some good info here guys .
Specialy from the Buzz owns.
Thanks very much.
I didn't mention it but a mate has two Buzzs. A cargo for work and the car version for everything else.
What he's saying to me lines up with what's being said from the owners on here, which is reassuring.
The driving to the Alps thing really is a very small part of the equation as it's one trip for two weeks. Better to focus on the other 50 weeks.
We're going to test drive a Buzz and a petrol Caddy and then see how we feel about it.
If buying new keep an eye out for the new Kia PV5 which launched this year (don't think they've started shipping them yet though).
Issue I see with both these is the load height when you've got the passenger versions. Neither offer flip up seats so the flat load bay option is not tall enough for modern bikes.
The photos from joemgh with a set of the seats slid forward looks promising though, but still somewhat lacking for space considering the size of the thing.
These are significantly bigger than my Stepwagon but have less room inside because of the lack of flexibility in the seat configurations. The Kia looks like it will suffer the same problem from what I've seen but hoping they have some more options on release. I'd like to move over to one as the next car.
What about the Ioniq 9 for slightly less cargo space? It's a big 3 row SUV rather than a van but still big with seats down.