The joys of kitchen buying - buying online

I’m a big fan of ikea kitchens. Fitted 3 now and the quality has been better every time. Current one is 5 yrs old and ageing really well. (Kungsbacka), hardware is all Blum.

I self-fitted an IKEA kitchen. Just needs careful planning, but it’s not that hard. If you can screw one of their wardrobes together you can put their kitchen units together. I got a chippy in to fit the worktops.

none of that with our Howdens kitchen.

Joiner had a few issues along the line with the 2 NEFF ovens in tall unit popped into howdens came away with required bits and pieces required. Design person came round later to see how it was and if we required anything else. Good luck with that with on line purchase

I fitted an IKEA kitchen.
Easy as.
Planning was the hardest bit I opted for some graph paper and a scale rule as their software kept crashing at the time. We got an underglued sink,

It's 6 years old now and still fine. We only have 3 cupboards, 2 on the wall one above the microwave and cooker. Everything else is drawers. A much better idea in my mind and you can get at everything.

Search on here - there’s been a few previous threads.
I went DIY Kitchens after Howden’s best attempt at price gouging - DIY were 1/2 Howden’s ‘best price’. I didn’t actually install the kitchen as it was a new build, but the builders were impressed by the quality - even the guy that managed to install the heating cylinder and gubbins in the end cupboard.
Installation isn’t too tricky when you have flat floors, vertical walls and square corners - unfortunately most houses aren’t built like that - mark-out everything on the walls before you start and leave room for scribe and infill panels. It may be worth templating the worktop.
I bought a solid surface worktop from Worktop Express - they were a bit rubbish, despite sending them a dimensioned CAD drawing, there were errors on their drawing I had to correct. I’ve bought granite and marble direct before but WE couldn’t manage to finish some edges as their ‘process’ couldn’t do it. Worst though was delivery - they wouldn’t let me collect it myself (3m long) it went AWOL for 2 weeks and when it did arrive on a flimsy pallet it was in 2 pieces and they refused to take responsibility. Fortunately we glued it together and the join is mostly hidden by the hob.
For cooker hoods we have an AEG one that fits into an overhead cupboard with a retractable hood it’s pretty quiet.

Kitchens are the modern of 1980s double glazing selling.

We got a quote from a shiny showroom for our small kitchen. Started over £30k before immediate discount and swapping for lower range of doors got it to £19k.

I had already looked at DIY kitchens and knew a ballpark number for units and worktops before fitting was around £6k.

Ended up spending around £12k including fitting for whole thing including new lighting and flooring and appliances. Howdens units but I think the price for Howdens varies depending on who is buying. High volume fitters may get bigger discount.

The shiny showroom guy asked why we weren't going with him. When told it was price he claimed he might be able to do a special deal. No chance. He had his bid and tried to rip us off.

Only non obvious tip I would mention is our microwave is built in over our double oven. So we save the footprint of having it sitting on a counter. Same brand so it is a visual match. Perhaps only matters in small kitchens.

We had a brick-built cupboard/chimney knocked out in our kitchen which left a void and lack of storage space.

I looked around for a cheap solution to whack some usable units & worktop in.

Wren's showroom was great but the price was stupid & their 'deals' meant that I would have to buy 5 units, when I only needed 3.

I ended up using DIY Kitchens - can't remember the exact style, but it's the white handleless gloss style.
Kitchen planner was easy to use & the cost was competitive.
The units arrived when they were supposed to & are rock solid.
I've never installed a kitchen before & suspect that 3 units on one wall with a worktop is significantly easier than a whole kitchen, but the process was very easy. Took a while as I double & triple checked everything I did.

I bought one of their laminate worktops. It was decent value & seems good quality.

When we get round to renewing our entire kitchen I'll probably use them again.

I've fitted two DIY Kitchens in the past 5 years. Can't recommend then enough.

Both painted, but not MDF.

Can also couch for their quartz worktops as we've got them in the current kitchen. I noticed they were supplied by a company local to me so I phoned them but they said the discount they give to DIYKitchens meant I was better ordering from then instead of direct.

I bought the cheaper quartz rather than the branded version... however it was stamped as the expensive version when delivered (Silestone) so I assume that's some sort of con.

My mum got a Neff oven microwave combi as a second oven. After the third time the glass broke and Neff wanted big money for the replacement glass she chucked it and swapped it out for oven only. Jeff's response was that she wasn't keeping the glass clean enough. Grease splots on the window plus the microwaves was their diagnosis. Not actually designed for proper cooking. She now has a cheap microwave separately and vowed never again to buy Neff as it's overpriced and not great (she said that in the 80s too but thought 30+ years may have improved).

We did ours about 9-10 years ago now with bettaliving- they were dreadful - don’t recommend.

The kitchen itself seems to be solid enough once fitted - I got a mate who is a carpenter by trade to fit it.

We went with white quartz tops - I wouldn’t risk ordering online and hoping you get the drawings right. We shopped round 3 local stone / kitchen worktop only suppliers and went with one of those.

Once the kitchen was built and fitted they came round and templated it all in mdf and checked with us on radiuses of corners / cutouts etc. Took them about 3 weeks from then to come back and fit. Everything was perfect. Even circa 9-10 years ago it was £3.2k from memory. That’s 2 long ish sides and one island. Island with cutouts for a pop up socket and large hob. Both longer sides with a cutout for a sink and inbuilt drainer grooves.

Just be careful with white surfaces - even though quartz is meant to be non-porous it still stains if you’re not quick to wipe things up.

Have you used DIY kitchens?

Yes

Specifically the painted MDF?

Yes, Norton in Cobham Blue lower and white upper units. Doors hardwood frame, trim and end panels MDF (from memory)

Did you fit it yourself?

Yes

How hard can prebuilt boxes fitted to a new extension be???

If the room is square with straight, flat walls, easy. Victorians are not the great craftsmen that everyone thinks 🙂

What was the customer service like? Any issues

Brilliant. Lots of question beforehand, all answered well. Some additional trim needed (change of mind by my design dept) hurried through despite their usual waiting times.
Delivery was handled well, the only problem was having two kitchens in one room 🙂

Did you get them to supply your worktops as well?

Local timber yard

Wifey has also decided she would really like NEFF cooker and microwave combi thingy. Pricey and according to guy in JL, sold out and a 16 week lead time (!)

Having just fitted out a kitchen with Neff stuff, I’d say the guy in JL is being very optimistic. “Sometime in 2023” seems to be the realistic estimate for the Neff/Bosch/everyone else stuff that uses the chip no one can get hold of. We got very lucky with a combi oven that our local Howdens branch found in their warehouse. For the main oven I had resorted to a dodgy looking place that sold open box returns. They were actually ok to deal with and it only had a tiny mark on a bit of trim that as easy to replace.

We used DIY-kitchens and brought quartz worktops through them. All good, reckon I could have done a better job of fitting the units than our fitter though - either DIY and give yourself plenty of time to get it right, or find someone you trust.

The quartz worktops (silestone I think) are great, will miss them when we move. Ours are white, we haven't managed to stain them and we chuck tumeric, red wine and home made bright green glitter slime all over them regularly. (@joebristol Bar Keepers Friend is your...friend)

“Victorians are not the great craftsmen that everyone thinks 🙂”

Victorian craftsmen were great. Victorian builders were just like modern ones, I suspect.

Good feedback, thanks all, really tempted, the saving with diykitchens is significant. Need to price up ikea for a comparison. I’ve read ikea don’t have a service void? Is that right?

With quartz worktops how are the joins? We have a long stretch and part of the appeal of solid surface is the (supposed) ability to create seamless joins.

And this could be a dumb question. Any point in getting the wall plaster boarded where the units will be? If it’s going to be covered in units and tiles?

Kitchen will be going in a brand new extension, so I’m hoping it won’t be wonky. Walls should start going up next week. I,m concerned the dimensions will be slightly smaller than the plans so won’t be ordering until I have the internal walls built

Victorian craftsmen were great. Victorian builders were just like modern ones, I suspect.

🙂

With quartz worktops how are the joins? We have a long stretch and part of the appeal of solid surface is the (supposed) ability to create seamless joins.

I guess that you want quartz? We went for a formica-ish laminated worktop which is easy to handle and is very similar in its care and low-maintenance to quartz. They also look a lot less like laminate than they used to, often cheaper than quartz and can be fitted DIY with tight joins

At least in the black colour we bought, DIY kitchen's quartz (innovo? Or something) is identical to silestone. We had samples of each and couldn't tell them apart, then we noticed that the DIY sample had residue on the back where the silestone sticker had been removed and the smaller DIY one added instead. Worktop fitter confirmed later

Hint: with some sticky felt pads, worktop samples make great coasters.

We went for Corion as we have a long run and weight was an issue as the kitchen is over the garage. It comes in 2 m lengths then they weld them together when they fit it so it is effectively seamless.

It has been in for about 8-9 years and looks great still despite a lot of use as we love cooking. If you are careless and damage it they can cut that section out and blend another section in. It was not the cheapest option but it has certainly been a very practical option. I would definitely have it again.

We stayed in a air bnb that had lovely Bosch appliances (ours are Fisher Paykell), the induction hob there was Elina which had a built in extraction system. I was impressed to the point I'd consider it for our next kitchen

With quartz worktops how are the joins?

They're not totally invisible but not noticeable if that makes sense.

Our fitters had some sort of electronic leveling machine that suctioned onto each piece and leveled it before holding it till the join compound cured.

DIYKitchens will only send the worktop templaters around once your kitchens is installed. They then measure and deliver a couple of weeks later.

I fitted a wren (with none of that nonsense you describe

16 units Belfast sink -3 lengths of 44mm oak and all appliances -(neff/AEG- dishwasher double oven induction hob and hood + fridge freezer ) for 7500 delivered complete and on the day they said they would deliver it - mid covid (which was good as we were on a 6 week build schedule)

Fitted an IKEA kitchen to my utility 6 months later and by comparison it might as well have been made of the boxes the wren kitchen came in. Was not impressed. It was also a per unit cost higher cost than the wren. - and you had to build them (which wasn't hard and not the reason for my poor review. More a quality issue) their online planning tool is great though and the main reason I went with them as it was in the middle of lock down. The other was I needed only 3 units and 5 full lengths of finished board. Worktops came from worktop express (who make the nonsense unique non standard IKEA sized worktop)

Have fitted several Howdens kitchens with the old man over the years and they are good bits of kit also.

I've fitted 2 IKEA kitchens in the last 5 years.

They both still look great despite significant amounts of cooking.

Neither of the rooms were even slightly straight. They still went up ok and have stayed up.

Purchased from DIY kitchens at the tail end of last year. Quite a few problems with doors, shelves and units, one unit a few mm larger on one side needed to be replaced, shelving cut to the wrong size, door hinge holes not cut deep enough so the hinges would sit squint (the cutter they were using was blunt by the scorching you could see. I got them to replace a few doors but because so many were affected, I just bought a cutter from screwfix for £10. A few other quality issues spotted that required additional steps to resolve. All That said, their customer service was spot on, every problem was fixed quickly, efficiently and in a friendly manner. Mistakes happen and DIT kitchens, like many companies will have been up against it with staff and demand issues at the time.

Purchased a Wren kitchen at the beginning of the year. Quote process was pretty painless and I liked being able to see and touch the various options. Yes, the fitted price was ridiculous but units only wasn’t that bad. I did a like for like comparison with DIY Kitchens and they were cheaper but not by that much and I figured wasn’t it worth it for the potential hassle of trying to sort out any issues at a distance rather than being able to walk into a showroom. Surprised about the comment of gouging on appliances, Wren had a price match guarantee and more importantly could actually supply them where everywhere else was out of stock

Delivered when they said they would, slight damage to the back of one unit that will never be seen and wasn’t worth complaining about. I suppose I was lucky that a kitchen fitter pal installed it as a favour and I was able to do the services/painting/tiling etc myself. Spoken to a few people since that have Wren kitchens and they all seem pretty happy with them

Well some of the prices you guys are quoting were either great deals or inflation on kitchens is somewhere like 50%

Wrens quote for us, 25 units of their mid range infinity 2 set of draws no fancy pants pull outs, with the cheapest laminate 3 lengths and an island, and mid range Bosch appliances , wrong side of £14k. Then 8k to fit. Quartz work surfaces instead of laminate another £8k.

DIY kitchens, more units, (chose more smaller ones to fit the space better) more drawers, 5 fancy pull outs. £8k, laminate is about £1.5k, cheaper quartz is £3.5k.

I will probably head back into wren and show them the quote and see if magic happens, but, part of me doesn’t want to give them business if they try it on that much. I really don’t like that business practise, everything I’m trying to do for this extension seems to be suffering people trying to price gouge, makes you start not trusting anyone

Obviously need to add appliances to diy kitchens quote, so probably all in similarish budget but would seem for much more, more pullouts, better surface etc..

Some appliances from wren were similar prices others were not. Biggest difference was on insinkerator tap, 759 from wren, 433 at plumbworld,

For simplicity I would much rather get it all from one place, and local, however saving seem to be significant

I also trying to check if wrens Infinity range is foil wrap MDf or painted nothing on the quote tells me, which makes me assume it’s foil

Infinity shaker is what I have it's foil wrapped.

Meant to say in my.original post that one.of the advantages of DIY Kitchens & Wren is that they have a great range of widths.

IKEA and others would have been cheaper but wouldn't have fitted into the space we had, as well as the DIY Kitchens option.

The Wren Kitchens showroom in Peterborough is a pretty good place to go for ideas and inspiration even if you are probably gonna buy from somewhere else.
I dunno if all of their showrooms are that good.

I have a friend who has moved more times than I can remember. I think he's fitted at least 6 IKEA kitchens to date. And if he ever moves again he'll be fitting another

Then 8k to fit.

Is a massive piss take. Most of our fits are £2-4K plus VAT. Unless you’re having loads of plastering and tiling done?

no tiling or plastering included in that quote. kitchen only. in a big empty newly built room. they also tried to charge an undisclosed sum for disposing of waste, the cardboard and foam packaging, by that stage I'd had enough!

showroom is fantastic though, we are in Southampton and I think it's one of the biggest ones.

ikea is tonight's project

Wow! Wish I could get those rates, and we take out the old kitchen and provide a skip for all the waste for the price…

I very much doubt the fitters see anywhere that much. I expect wrens mark up is something like 150%

samples have turned up from diykitchens. doors look great quality. handles, one is really badly chromed, bubbles. whilst cheap it doesn't bode well for their QC.

90% I will go with them and just deal with the fact a few bits will need sorting. also 90% I will fit it myself.

brand new space and brand new kitchen should be doable. plan to order a few of the cabinets dry fitted in case there is a problem with measurements. potentially can cut the cupboard down and only pay for a new door.

obviously ideally I would get it planned right but I like to worry about the things I'm most likely to mess up!

now. latest fun seems to be quoted £1.5k to fit solid surface worktops, and there appears to be a massive problem with cookers. 16 weeks wait was the guy in JL estimate....ffs

latest fun seems to be quoted £1.5k to fit solid surface worktops, and there appears to be a massive problem with cookers. 16 weeks wait was the guy in JL estimate….ffs

Seems about right. Our fabricators charge about £500 per linear meter but it’s changing all the time at mo. Appliances from big brands have been a horror show since Covid. we still have a Miele fridge on order from over 12 months ago, every time the delivery date arrives, another month delay!

Buy your own handles; DIY kitchens don't drill their doors for handles (from memory) unless you specify.
You should get a kitchen-worth of laminate/wood top for less than that fitting charge, you know you want a new router 🙂 One cutter per two ends in 40mm laminate is plenty
Square-edge is easiest to join, no fancy 45 angles necessary

Wife is sold on mistral, so no chance I can switch to wood. From what I’ve read it’s similar to wood in terms of cutting and then you have to fill and sand the gaps to make it seamless.

Supply is £3.5k, fit is £1.5k on top. The island would be a single piece and shouldn’t need cutting, so its 3 joins and 2 cutouts along the wall, which should be plumb so no need for scribing (he says…..)

Big fancy router would be nice though. Have had alerts set up on trend for some time. I have a little makita lxt one which I doubt would

I have a kreg jig for door handles and hinges already so hoping that will be straight forward.

I’ll ask diy kitchens to replace the one they sent, will give me a chance to test their customer service :). Have looked at ironmongerydirect for the handles, they seem to be the same but more expensive, but not as expensive as wren

You need a meaty old router to sort worktops out. I’ve got the Rolls Royce of routers in the Festool OF2200, hot knife through butter! A used Makita 3612c would be my call.

Shop the stone price around, someone will be able to beat that price. I’ll find out who were using these days, used to be R.O. Arnold’s but they had a big price rise recently.

Wife is sold on mistral, so no chance I can switch to wood. From what I’ve read it’s similar to wood in terms of cutting and then you have to fill and sand the gaps to make it seamless.

Just watch the videos from cutting to finished join  Good luck.... can you do a Tally ho type video for this please

Just finished fitting a DIY kitchen install a couple of weeks ago.

We did the whole Wren, Magnet, Ikea search and wasted lots of time.

We ended up going over to the DIY kitchen showroom and having seen the quality of the units we went ahead.

The planner is a bit of a faff so set aside a day one weekend to get it all done, my advice would be double and triple check things before hitting order.

We had a problem with a couple of items in the plan which we'd spotted after putting our order in, and had to really push the customer service team to resolve. Despite one of their kitchen planners reviewing the plan they still missed this - so it does feel like the major onus is on you to get everything right first time.

We went for the DIY Kitchens quartz - just couldn't be touched on price.

Me and my brother fitted the kitchen, and after 5 kitchen installs he said he'd get his next kitchen through them as well.

In the end we're really happy with the end results, just the floor to do now!

ooo great first hand experience!

we're the quartz tops precut for you based on the planner?

and yep I'm finding it a bit of a fiddle. like how it resets your handles whenever you switch style. that's a pain.

waiting on an answer from them re our workspace

did you have any quality issues?

I’ve fitted the same gloss white ikea kitchen to 3 houses and have been happy with them.

Current house warranted something more grown up and I didn’t like anything they had to offer

Looked at DIY.kitchens after recommendations here and I’ve been delighted with it. Shaker style job in lamp room grey with oak worktops from worktops direct.

Easy to install. I got a pro in for the worktop but having watched him do it I’d have a go myself next time

My recommendation would be get your basic layout nailed then go in to see them to sort out any questions you have - they were very helpful in suggesting hacks that may not be obvious (we’ve got a breakfast bar that sits on a wall unit with base unit feet on it)

Nice guys to deal with generally

As for playing the quote game with wren and howdens - balls to that! Why deal with a company you know are out to fleece you!

16 weeks wait was the guy in JL estimate….ffs

As I said the first time you posted that - that estimate is very much on the optimistic side.

@DT78 when they did our quartz worktops they came out after the units were fitted + everything plumbed in to template it. Took about 2-3 weeks for them to come back after that to install them and it looks great.

Really useful information

Sadly the showroom is over 200 miles away so going to struggle to make it there unless I sort a weekend out with the in-laws looking after the kids. Could be worth it though

we’re the quartz tops precut for you based on the planner?

I’ve never used DIY kitchens but quartz and the like are usually templated after all units and sinks etc. are installed and then fitted by the fabricator. The DIY options come in lengths which need cutting by the fitter and then polishing etc. once glued up. Don’t ever buy precut worktops as they’ll almost always not fit somewhere Unless you’re design is very straight forward and your room 100% square.

And those worktop vids were useful. “Just treat it like wood without the end grain”. Well, there is a bit more to it!

I actually have a festool tracksaw and extraction, so was tempted by a router. Oooof. Over £1k plus cutters Could justify by selling it on for £800 after the job. However I know I won’t…

Given the cost of the worktops I’m leaning towards someone who has fitted lots

Vid didn’t cover fitting the worktop to the cabinets

I’ve read ikea don’t have a service void? Is that right?

What are you going to put in it? Serious question.

I've bought & fitted 3 IKEA kitchens in the last 5 years (Mum's, ours and used one for our large utility room), each time though I've used a carpenter to cut/fit/seal the worktops as it's just too easy to get it wrong.

They're very easy to put together and are logical in both fit and 'build'. For example, We've a 3m island and IKEA supply a specific set of supports/braces to ensure it's securely bolt down.
Only cupboards in our kitchen are on the wall, the rest are all drawers.

Note, thee IKEA units are deeper than most, so either buy their worktops or ensure the ones you get are deep enough.

I used the Erbauer 1/2" cutters from screwfix. Top job and half the price of Trend
The router was a DeWalt, I'm guessing 2300W (I borrowed it but can check if you want model, etc) and a Trend jig (also borrowed)

Like I said before, the old Makita 3612c workhorse is the one I'd go for for a one off worktop, less than £80 on the 'bay. My old Makita cut 1000's of worktops over it's 20 year service until I retired. I bought the Festool, which is obviously a much more deluxe machine and collects a lot more dust at source so a more professional tool, I only really fit 10 Kitchens a year these days and only cut about 20 sets of worktops so the Festool was a bit of an extravagance but I'm a sucker for a bit of grey and green!

Given the cost of the worktops I’m leaning towards someone who has fitted lots

It's not technically that difficult with a bit of thought and learning how all the kit works, but there's lots of little tricks and techniques to make it a better job. you can damage a very expensive top really quickly with a blade spinning at 10,000 rpm!

We've just had a mostly IKEA kitchen fitted (we customised the look with some non-Ikea doors and fronts) and you're correct that there are no service voids. Our fitter batoned the cabinets out from the wall about 15mm and apart from leaving the back panel off the sink cabinet and notching an under sink drawer to fit round the U bend, there weren't any difficulties. We had loads of fitters refuse to touch IKEA - even though we were doing all the assembly ourselves - whilst others would only do it for a higher cost.

IKEA cabinets are also taller as they're based around 8cm legs, not 12cm. So the insides are cavernous. Which makes sense in many ways: why make all your cabinets 50+mm shorter just because one or two may have pipes behind? Similarly, beneath the cabinets is usually dead space.

We didn't like anything in Wren but we did get an extortionate quote from Magnet in their February 'half price' sale. The AEG appliances and worktops were actually very well priced, showing just how overpriced the cabinets were. Surprisingly they never followed up either.

We visited DIY kitchens in person and made a weekend of it, staying over in Sheffield. Everyone at the site was very helpful and we'd have happily used them if they'd had some different styles. They've got loads of in-frame and shaker styles which might have suited an older property. We wanted something slightly more modern, but not handleless and definitely not gloss, so we had to look elsewhere.

We had a local granite firm supply our quartz tops (Affordable Granite in Surrey). They quoted based on our kitchen plan measurements, took a deposit about 6 weeks in advance, came to template on a Thursday and fitted on Monday. All very smooth.

The Neff/Siemens appliances were a challenge. We signed up to alerts everywhere we could and got very lucky I think - all sold out again within an hour of us ordering online. Marks Electrical and Appliance City I think - so be sure to look at the smaller places. 16 weeks is optimistic - many shops quoted us indefinite delays or couldn't take an order as they already have large queues for the first few batches.

Ikea kitchen here. Fitter said he would never fit one again (this was 10 years ago). The wall unit is particular were a pain to get square due to the type of fixing they used. In the end it was big screws and lots of packers. They haven't fallen down yet despite my wife loading about 2 tons of Denby in them.

We went granite top and like above got a local firm to come and template, supply and fit. Its all lasted really well with just a little fading of the doors compared to the pelmets. Doors and real wood but pelmet/cornice are all mdf with 'wood' effect covering which seems to not fade.

Daughter has just got a Wren quote for 15k (supply of units, worktop and some appliances).

Anybody know if you can buy replacement cabinets from howdens if you already have a kitchen from them? We didnt purchase the kitchen direct obviously but the house we've bought has a howdens ktichen and a belfast sink which we hate. The rest of the kitchen is perfectly fine but we just want a normal sink back so I'm thinking replace the worktop/sink cabinets and 2 either side of it.

Or does anyone know of a replacement model for the Chilcomb range from Howdens but from DIY Kitchens, last 2 I've done have been from there and we're just not in the right place for a full kitchen refit!

Anybody know if you can buy replacement cabinets from howdens if you already have a kitchen from them?

You can if you have an account, failing that you’ll need to ask nicely in branch or find someone who has.