[Closed] The Government are now going to privatise Channel 4

I thought channel 4 was private LOL!

Its a non-profit public service broadcaster. Its profits are all ploughed back into TV production. Obviously this will never do. Profits should be going into the pockets of their mates, and more importantly news output (including programmes like Dispatches) needs to be far less critical of the government. Remember that it was channel 4 who exposed all the Brexit campaigns Cambridge Analytica data scandal, amongst many other things

It'll probably be sold off to one of their right wing chums for buttons too.

They'll probably pay one of their "chums" to take it on. All done in the name of "freeing" Channel4 from, er, something. This was nailed on when ITN stuck to their remit, rather than folding to government pressure at the last election.

I always thought it was private too! 🙂

This is at least in part the Labour Party's fault. Privatisation is not a vote winner for the Tories, things have changed dramatically since the days when former Tory Prime Minister Macmillan attacked Thatcher for "selling the family sliver".

In fact opposition to privatisation and even its reversal would in many cases be a vote winner for the Labour Party, people really don't like privatising profit nationalising loss.

Yet despite a short interlude during Corbyn's leadership this is not a theme taken up by today's Labour Party, which gives the Tories little to worry about in terms of opposition.

Btw ref : "Now that they’ve effectively neutered the BBC"

Serious and genuine question, why and how do you think they have done that? And who are you calling "they"? Boris Johnson's government? Before that?

This is at least in part the Labour Party’s fault.

🤦‍♂️

Ah yes... everything is still Tony Blairs fault then, comrade?

FFS!

Just remind me how long it's been since he ****ed off and how long the Tory's have been in power?

Don't be ridiculous.

And can we please stay on topic and not let this dissolve into another 'Jeremy Corbyn is absolutely right about everything and everyone else is a Tory' thread?

We've quite enough of those on the go.

The assault on the BBC began as soon as Dave came to power and their news output now is a shadow of what it was back then. They now clearly plan on doing the same to Channel 4 which is the only remaining outpost on TV of properly independent journalism. The Tory's have kept all ministers well clear of channel 4 news for years now. They won't go near them. Whereas they'll happily chat to Laura Kuenssberg all day

Btw ref : “Now that they’ve effectively neutered the BBC”

Serious and genuine question, why and how do you think they have done that?

Why - so they don't get called out for the nonsense the government are up to
How - by ensuring that if they don't toe the line they their will be consequences to the future of the BBC. Have you actually watched any BBC political interviews/questioning, it is embarrassing.

And he's off in a rant!

Who mentioned anything about Tony Blair? Apart from you.

I was thinking of Keir Starmer, who is actually the present Labour Party Leader.

Do you expect him to mount an effective opposition to Tory privatisation plans?

If the case against Channel 4 privatisation is as strong as you suggest Starmer will force them into an embarrassing U-turn

If the case against Channel 4 privatisation is as strong as you suggest Starmer will force them into an embarrassing U-turn

How, exactly?

What exactly are you expecting the opposition leader to do to stop a decision made by a government with an 80 seat majority?

I'm all ears....

Actually... don't bother

lets keep it on topic instead, eh?

The assault on the BBC began as soon as Dave came to power and their news output now is a shadow of what it was back then

Okay fair comment if that's how you see it. But how was that achieved? I don't think the UK government has direct control on BBC news output.

By "why" Kerley I meant why did binners think that, not why did they do it.

How, exactly?

What exactly are you expecting the opposition leader to do to stop a decision made by a government with an 80 seat majority?

I’m all ears….

Actually… don’t bother

lets keep it on topic instead, eh?

So basically this thread is just a pointless rant. As far as you are concerned nothing can be done to stop the privatisation of Channel 4

With your attitude binners it's hardly surprising that Keir Starmer is your man.

Can we have another thread about appointments to BBC bodies, department reorganisations, recruitment from other media outlets, and the effect all that has on the BBC's news output? It could run and run and isn't needed here.

But how was that achieved?

They achieved it by immediately threatening that the BBC's charter would be pretty much constantly 'under review' and made no secret of their desire to see it broken up and privatised. They then appointed their mates in senior BBC roles. This very effectively cowed the news and current affairs footage.

They're now repeating the same exercise with Channel 4 to get them to back off with their constant criticism of the government

Everything Johnson's government does is Starmer's fault. Including this. Obviously. 🥱

Let the will of the people be done 😉

According to the TV industry magazine Broadcast, GB News peaked in its opening minutes with 336,000 viewers, meaning it outperformed the 100,000 who watched BBC News across the hour and the 46,000 who watched Sky News

So basically this thread is just a pointless rant. As far as you are concerned nothing can be done to stop the privatisation of Channel 4

Oh go on then... lets hear it

Lets hear the exact measures that the leader of the opposition takes to stop a decision taken by a government with an 80 seat majority....

Johnson is perfectly prepared to preform u-turns if he feels opposition is strong enough.

Currently after the Chesham by-election result he is under pressure to reverse his liberalisation on planning.

At least C4 has a good new HQ - the old cinema (then nightclub) right in the centre.

Oh go on then… lets hear it

I can't be arsed now. It's clear that this thread isn't about having a sensible discussion. It's just another thread about how terrible the Tories are and how everyone should hate them for being so terrible.

(then nightclub)

Ah... I remember it well.

Lets hear the exact measures that the leader of the opposition takes to stop a decision taken by a government with an 80 seat majority….

It's difficult to lay out an 18 point plan but I think the first thing to do would be for Starmer to come out in clear opposition to it.

So, let's see if he does that.

There was a good piece on R4 this morning pointing out that C4 aren't allowed to own their own IP so the best way to raise money if it is going to be privatised is to change that rule, let them build a back catalogue for say 5 years and then sell it.

So that'll never happen.

As it stands at the moment, I don't think Ch4 would be that much of a prize for private ownership. It has to spend all it's profits on making programmes. There would have to be substantial changes to it's remit and I can't see how or why they'd do that. You'd essentially kill off all the independent film and production companies in one swoop. Not even these Tories are that stupid.

C4 aren’t allowed to own their own IP

There are other C4 not for profit companies that own IP, and plough money made from that IP into content. The channel itself has to commission its content from others, but that's what it was set up to to do... help build that sector, which it has done, and still does do, very well. It doesn't make a profit, but it has helped many others to make a living in the industry, and grown it.

EDIT: I'm out of date, looks like the other companies were wound back into the main company.

Not even these Tories are that stupid.

I'd disagree with that. Look what's presently being sacrificed on the alter of Brexit. Ideology trumps everything with this shower, and this fits in perfectly with their culture war agenda. People in independent film and production companies are all bloody lefties and remainers after all, so if they go to the wall... meh. People can watch GB News instead

You’d essentially kill off all the independent film and production companies in one swoop. Not even these Tories are that stupid.

Netflix and Amazon Prime are available to view, to name but two. The model has changed. We are all Americans now.

You’d essentially kill off all the independent film and production companies in one swoop. Not even these Tories are that stupid.

Two issues.

One: The Tories and their voters don't give a shit about independent film and production companies.

Two: Even if they did give a shit the Tories and their voters absolutely are that stupid.

I wouldn't consider C4's news output any better or worse than most of the other commercial channels from the POV of bias, mainly because it's just another channel that buys the service in from ITN (Just like ITV and Channel 5).

The bigger problem (IMO) is that some of the more interesting/controversial Comedy/Drama/documentary (and commercially risky?) content that C4 have commissioned in the past may well not be the sort of thing a private organisation funds.
C4 has made some good stuff over the years, not all of it was the kind of thing a commercial outfit would be comfortable with.

The BS about freeing them to compete with streaming services is laughable, half their content is already available via "competing services" like Netflix, why not let them continue to exploit that relationship derive some revenue and invest it in more production.
Their viewing figures for both "linear TV" and Streamed content must be well ahead of some streaming services.

We've got enough commercial broadcasters in the UK already, the Niches that C4 and the BBC occupy are somewhat unique to the UK. Institutions with less (not zero) commercial influence that arguably put more back into our nation culturally than they take out financially.

It's another skirmish in the culture war and of course part of the process by which they set a precedent for privatisation or plain old defunding (licence fee cancelation) of the BBC. A stepping stone to the goal of destroying any semblance of independent broadcasting we have in the UK, and ensuring all meeja is run by Murdoch, Desmond and other greedy, Tory aligned Shitehawks...

****ing Tories!

part of the process by which they set a precedent for privatisation or plain old defunding (licence fee cancelation) of the BBC.

Yup, that I would assume is the real goal/prize

Yawn.

Keep backing neoliberal parties - keep getting for-the-market sell-offs.

Same old Guardian type ranting and complaining about bad old Tories acting like Tories / free-marketeers and then when we're given an opportunity to push back against the market ideology in a general election ... It's bad old Corbyn, and his commies etc.

Ernie is 100% correct.

Centrists moan about stuff (On and off) but then won't get behind the opposing Ideology to see the back of this sort of thing.

But but but ideological purity.... Yeah of course. Socialism pushes back against the things you actually hate.

then when we’re given an opportunity to push back against the market ideology in a general election … It’s bad old Corbyn, and his commies etc.

I voted for the beardy communist bastard twice, so don't blame me

You lot are absolutely fruit loop if you're laying the blame for this on the labour party/Keir Starmer/Blairites/The Guardian/whatever.

This is Toy's Toryin'. Thats it. Pure and simple. End of story. No matter how much you twist it to fit your totally hatstand, conspiracy-theory, tinfoil helmet, narrative

The assault on the BBC began as soon as Dave came to power and their news output now is a shadow of what it was back then

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hutton_Inquiry

Oh christ! Its a lefty pile-on

IRAQ!!!

There goes another thread

*sigh*

🙄

FFS binners, you are just white noise on any thread thread you touch these days, you are worse than checkw just wailing like a child trying to drown anyone out who disagrees with you.

I just find it fascinating that absolutely everything ends up being Tony Blairs fault and inevitably its something to do with Iraq.

Even when we're discussing the latest salvo in Boris and the Brexiteers ongoing culture war

Just out of interest; is there anything that isn't Tony Blairs fault?

The crucifixion, perhaps?

It's you that mentioned Tony Blair's name on this thread binners.

And as far as I am aware when he was Opposition Leader Tony Blair opposed every piece of privatisation legislation but forward by the Tories.

But according to you no one can do anything about any Tory government proposals because they have an 80 seat majority.

So rant away as much as you like, and you certainly like ranting, and just be grateful that the Tories give you plenty to rant about.

In the meantime, in the real world, people like Marcus Rushford, who arent put off by a large Tory majority, get Boris Johnson to carry out U-turns.

Do we know Marcus's viewpoint on the commercial viability of Channel 4, its potential ownership and the subsequent effect on the UK independent TV production sector?

He didn't play last night, so I'm presuming he will have spent the evening formalising his proposals?

Failing Marcus's direct involvement, I'll ask again: how exactly do you propose that Keir Starmer stops the Tory's, with their 80 seat majority, flogging off Channel 4 to their mates?

In the meantime, in the real world, people like Marcus Rushford, who arent put off by a large Tory majority, get Boris Johnson to carry out U-turns.

I'm pleased you reminded me of that absolute gem, i'd forgotten that had happened. He clearly had the bollocks to stand up to Johnson where Kier Starmer doesn't.

I’ll ask again: how exactly do you propose that Keir Starmer stops the Tory’s, with their 80 seat majority

No you are right binners there's absolutely nothing that can be done, Keir Starmer, and all the other Labour MPs, might as well pack their bags and go home.

And you can carry on moaning and moaning, and when you've done that, moan some more.

I’ll ask again: how exactly do you propose that Keir Starmer stops the Tory’s, with their 80 seat majority, flogging off Channel 4 to their mates?

Any practical suggestions at all....

Any feasible way to prevent them doing it if thats what they want to do, given that every single Tory MP is absolutely nailed on to vote for it...

Any practical suggestions at all….

Well all he needs to do is get 81 Tory MPs to miss or abstain from a vote with a 3 line whip.

If you're dealing with Tory MPs you've got to lean into the corruption angle...
I think it's time for C4 management to organise a little ERG Bunga-Bunga party the night before the vote.
All the coke and hookers a duly elected individual could want. Those who aren't too Snoozy to make it in for the vote might just find a persuasive Brown envelope full of photo's from the night before brings on a pang of conscience...

Or Kier could try appealing to the "Red Bricks" asking them if this random sell off of a media organisation is what they actually voted for? Tell them Rupert would Cancel 'Bake off' and make them pay to stream 'Holyoaks'.
Perhaps suggest they might prefer Boris spent his precious time sorting out trade relations with our neighbours and maintaining the free flow of sausages from the continent...

But lets be honest, they don't give a ****.

you're right, it's already a lost cause, lets stop caring.

I had absolutely no idea it was publicly owned until today.

I know that I am taking a chance in attempting to have a half serious discussion with you binners, and the likely outcome is more incoherent rants and stills from the Life of Brian, but.....

It is difficult to deal with Channel 4 privatisation in isolation. It needs to be seen in much broader terms of the whole general privatisation drive.

As I said earlier privatisation is not a vote winner for the Tories, the fact they manage to get away with talking about it is because there is so little opposition to it from the Labour Party.

In fact there is ample evidence that the reverse, ie nationalisation, is often very popular with voters, even Tory voters. And it is fair to say that Labours unexpected increased vote in 2017 was in part due to this.

The present government recognises this hence the constant talk of government economic intervention and false claims that the railways have been renationalised.

Pointing out Tory commitment to privatisating profit whilst nationalising loss isn't difficult, and it is a huge hammer to hit the Tories with.

Pointing out the utter madness of foreign governments owning British utility and transport companies for the benefit of their own taxpayers is likewise not difficult, and a fairly certain vote winner for all those who oppose it.

Labour needs to bang on and on about the Tories privatisation fetish until we get to the point that the Tories daren't even mention it.

The last year or so has been a triumph for the UK's nationalised healthcare industry, Labour should be driving that point home and making the general case for social ownership of vital industries and services.

In fact look at this quote :

"Public services should be in public hands, not making profits for shareholders. Support common ownership of rail, mail, energy and water; end outsourcing in our NHS, local government and justice system."

That's what Keir Starmer had to say when he was desperate to become Labour Party Leader, He just needs to fight for the things which he claims to believe in.

Sadly fighting and attacking is not the Labour way, being on the defensive and/or keeping their mouths shut is.

I had absolutely no idea it was publicly owned until today.

You thought it was just a strange coincidence that it is such an excellent public broadcaster?

You thought it was just a strange coincidence that it is such an excellent public broadcaster?

No.

I too find it unbelievable that Starmer is looking to change Channel4 into a profit making private company with a looser remit. That lovable Johnson and his band of lying ideologues might get some of the blame if we don’t focus on Starmer’s failure as not the PM. Same goes for the health service. Damn that Starmer fellow. Damn him for not being the PM.

So, it's been a day. Has Starmer (or anyone in opposition) made a statement against this or shown that they oppose it in any way?

It's all very well to say that they can't do anything about it. There is absolutely nothing stopping them from at least mentioning it.

It’s all very well to say that they can’t do anything about it. There is absolutely nothing stopping them from at least mentioning it.

Sums up his absolute failure to provide any meaningful opposition. The government give him open goal after open goal to put the message out to the public when crap like this goes off, and they fail, week after week. Sure, he can't do much about the government's majority, but he can reinforce a steady drip feed of information that might make the dithering voter start to join the dots.

The lack of obvious action and opposition just reinforces the average voters view that "they are all the same".

Though credit on the PMQs yesterday on the rape convictions. Pretty damning Reality Check on the BBC this morning that needs sharing and spreading so every right thinking person can see the horrific impact of austerity on the justice system.

Well at least David Attenborough is on the case

The National: David Attenborough condemns British government plan to sell broadcaster Channel 4.
https://www.thenationalnews.com/world/europe/david-attenborough-condemns-british-government-plan-to-sell-broadcaster-channel-4-1.1246990

+1 , i always thought it was private. Film 4 and all that great, if spendy guff.

So, it’s been a day. Has Starmer (or anyone in opposition) made a statement against this or shown that they oppose it in any way?

It’s all very well to say that they can’t do anything about it. There is absolutely nothing stopping them from at least mentioning it.

Plenty of Labour MP's have been very vocal about it.

Starmer had bigger fish to fry yesterday re: the above-mentioned record on sexual violence and the governments apparent disinterest in doing anything about it

Labour have got a Shadow Cabinet.

It's not a one man show.

At least it shouldn't be.

At least it shouldn’t be.

Willa: You said this would be simple.
Roarke: Should've been.
Willa: Should is a useless word, almost as useless as hope.

In the meantime, in the real world, people like Marcus Rushford, who arent put off by a large Tory majority, get Boris Johnson to carry out U-turns.

Well at least David Attenborough is on the case

The National: David Attenborough condemns British government plan to sell broadcaster Channel 4.

I think you've more chance of Attenborough making an impact than Starmer - not because Starmer is useless - but because everyone expects Starmer to oppose government plans and that ultimately comes down to parliamentary arithmetic. The way you get government U-turns at the moment is:

1. Kicking up a storm in the press so that focus groups / opinion polls / local tory party committees start sending a message that this would be a bad idea. It takes quite a lot of attention to do that, because the vast majority of people couldn't give a shit about who profits from C4, Intellectual Property Rights etc (and the government will probably paint "we can stop your tv license from going up" on the side of a bus!).
2. You might expect that other media channels have a vested interest in this - so to get a press/media storm it will need "respected", "independent" people with a big social media following rather than some news editor covering it for a few days in a row.
3. You distil it down to some really simple thing like "Government wants you to pay £5 per month for Bake Off and Countdown" - it doesn't really need to be the essence of the change just a possible consequence of it. You probably need a political campaign too for those who care about the substance - "funny this happens just after tories put "their man" at the top of BBC"; this is "Netflix" and "Amazon Prime" lobbying the government, and the tories bowing to commercial pressure (even better if there's a donor scandal!) etc. I'm not sure this angle works - "its no coincidence that this is the party that criticises government", if that is such a differentiator for the channel then why wouldn't it be commercially successful doing that and then government will have even less influence.

Of course probably your biggest change of success will be if the valuation / pitch for an IPO is unappealing. If, as suggested, they don't own any of the back catalogue that would seem to be problematic.

Now, here's a question for STW... lets assume that the decision has been made, the IPO is going ahead and you can put your order in for shares at midday today... are you going to buy some?

That assumes it goes to IPO. I would put money on it being auctioned and bought up by a single multinational. IPO would put too much risk onto the sale (Post Office, Deliveroo, osv). Safer to sell via auction to a select few people.

Amazon has a few spare bob. They just bought one Film studio, why not buy a TV station?

Now, here’s a question for STW… lets assume that the decision has been made, the IPO is going ahead and you can put your order in for shares at midday today… are you going to buy some?

No, because we’re out of overdraft, out of eggs and also the car has rust and a mini-service that needs sorting. Mrs P could also do with a holiday as it’s been years since. Last time/only time I owned shares was in my own company/lean startup.

Huzzah for stereotypes!

+1 , i always thought it was private. Film 4 and all that great, if spendy guff.

No shareholders taking money out of the company means more money to buy in content and invest in production that doesn't always have to pay off (think how many British films are paid for by C4).

Selling it off to one of the cabinets in-laws would potentially result in a short term injection of cash. Followed by all the profits being drained out of it forevermore. Or worse, venture capitalists buy it, saddle it with debt which it has to repay rather than investing in production and the whole independent production company ecosystem that works with them collapses.

I'd be pissed as about 2/3 of my income at the moment comes from a couple of their shows which I doubt would have ever been commissioned (or at least never been popular enough to make 17 series) by the other channels.

It has unfortunately moved away from how it started. Back in the 80's there were the red triangle films (the films aired would simply not have been aired on any other channel at the time), experimental TV programs and so on.
It seems to be a much more mainstream channel these days and the main loss for me would be the news as I watch that most days.
Just look at today
Countdown, a place in the sun, a new life in the sun, come dine with me, simpsons, hollyoaks and so on. Would any of that be a great loss as just the sort of crap that can be found on any other channel.

I reckon I've sussed out what needs to be done here

Tell all the pensioners that if they vote Tory then it's no more Countdown in the afternoons for them

There will be more letters from Outraged of Tumbridge Wells, written in green ink, than the Daily Telegraph could cope with

Countdown, a place in the sun, a new life in the sun, come dine with me, simpsons, hollyoaks and so on. Would any of that be a great loss as just the sort of crap that can be found on any other channel.

Daytime TV is Daytime TV. It fills a gap in the schedule when no one is watching. It also employs a lot of people. It's the entry-level jobs before all those people go off and work on something higher end. But that's the same across all channels.

It has unfortunately moved away from how it started. Back in the 80’s there were the red triangle films (the films aired would simply not have been aired on any other channel at the time), experimental TV programs and so on.

They largely invented the fixed rig format, before it was fixed rig. Remember when Big Brother was shot by actual camerapeople behind mirrors. That's still one of the biggest growth areas in TV even if you no longer notice it (Ambulance, Supervet, Dog House, The Job Interview, 24 hours in A&E, 24 Hours in Police Custody, One Born Every Minute, etc etc).

Then while the BBC and ITV are largely commissioning dramas that focus on straight white middle-class profesionals (Line of Duty, Silent Witness, The Bay, Broadchurch etc etc etc) C4 are making Small Axe, It's a Sin, etc, and the other really good stuff like the This is England series.

I can't really see ITV making Naked Attraction, however cringe-worthy it is sometimes it's still probably a better portrayal of average bodies and dating than Love Island.

The news as you said.

Then there's all the less mainstream stuff they buy in from abroad. Handmaids Tale, Rick and Morty, Deutchland 83/86 , and just about anything from their tie in with Walter Presents.

Sell it off and you've just got another ITV.

Just look at today
Countdown, a place in the sun, a new life in the sun, come dine with me, simpsons, hollyoaks and so on. Would any of that be a great loss as just the sort of crap that can be found on any other channel.

Ahh... "the good olde days" effect.

Countdown - started on the very first day that Channel4 began broadcasting.
Hollyoaks - I don't watch it, but isn't this just a modern day update of Brookside (also broadcast on day one), but aimed at a younger demographic than the UK soaps on other channels?
a place in the sun, a new life in the sun - Dunno.. pass... daytime TV for retired types? Haven't they always broadcast stuff for these people?
Simpsons - yeah, that's imported filler, for sure. They've been showing that for a good while now though, haven't they?

Sell it off and you’ve just got another ITV.

It's worse than that. The model that the Tory 'culture' minister asked about it last night (ironically on Channel 4 News) stated was Channel 5

Just thinking about recent programming, I can't imagine any other channel making 'We Are Lady Parts' other than Channel 4 and that was absolutely brilliant

Whatever, what % of TV viewing is Channel 4?

Mine is a lot lower than it was years ago as the content is crap. Yes, there are a few things like "It's a sin" but that could have just as easily come from Netflix.
Channel 4 should be offering something different otherwise there is no point in the public part. Most of it's revenue comes from advertising so it is already at the mercy of that.

They are commissioning and showing a lot of different stuff, that only some of it is for you or me isn't neccesarily a sign that they're doing it wrong.

Channel 4 should be offering something different otherwise there is no point in the public part. Most of it’s revenue comes from advertising so it is already at the mercy of that.

It's not publicly funded, it's publicly owned.

The difference between it and ITV is ITV has to appeal to the lowest common denominator to maximize it's dividends to shareholders. So that money flows out of the channel.

C4 don't do that, in essence it only needs to sell enough adverts to fund the next production. Which is why it can make TV that other channels can't. On one hand because it can spend more on niche programming because there's more in the pot as it's not been paid to shareholders, and on the other because it doesn't have to turn that profit so it can make more niche stuff.

Or put the other way, ITV makes I'm a celebrity to sell adverts to pay shareholders. Channel 4 make the Bake-Off to sell adverts to pay for It's a Sin and Small Axe.

Whatever, what % of TV viewing is Channel 4?

It's not publicly funded, so it's not really relevant?

The very fact that you don't watch it, probably means it's doing it's job of not making the same mainstream TV as whatever comercial channels/services you do watch.

the content is crap. Yes, there are a few things like “It’s a sin” but that could have just as easily come from Netflix.

If we're going to make a scale of crap content, Netflix production is the top of that steaming pile (but you can really see the detail of the steam in 4k).

C4 and BBC are two sides of the publicly-owned broadcasting coin. C4 are to an extent beholden to their advertisers (although I cant think of anyone ever spotting a conflict of interest, but it's hypothetically there), the BBC are unfortunately indirectly beholden to the government which means they get beaten with both the bias and VFM sticks at every oppertunity.

Bread, circus, and smiling brown boxes.

We lived through interesting times.

The way you get government U-turns at the moment is:

The government doesn't have to carry out a U-turn for Channel 4 not to be privatised. It just needs to drop the idea.

No decision has been made. All that has been announced is a consultation period.

Yet despite that the OP has decided that it's not worth the Labour Party getting involved as the government has a 80 seat majority. He's already decided that the privatisation of Channel 4 will go ahead.

The case against the privatisation of Channel 4 is a political battle which of course the Labour Party should be involved in.

Ironically Channel 4 came into existence under Margret Thatcher's premiership, presumably she saw the value of a putting quality minority interest broadcasting sometimes before narrow commercial interests. Presumably she saw the value of publicly owned broadcasters.

Ironically Channel 4 came into existence under Margret Thatcher’s premiership, presumably she saw the value of a putting quality minority interest broadcasting sometimes before narrow commercial interests. Presumably she saw the value of publicly owned broadcasters.

This lot make Fatcha look like Tony Benn.

She thought privatising the post office was a step too far, this lot casually handed it to their mates for buttons without a second thought.

It’s one of life’s ironies that they all claim to idolise her but I think she’d despise every last one of them and be absolutely appalled at the shameless nationalist populists presently calling themselves the Tory party

That’s how far we’ve come in the last decade.

Probably a good thing. The Chanel 4 app is pretty poor. So many things I want to watch but it doesn't work most the time. Add add add add add add add, more adds, 2 mins of the program, add add add add. More adds. Give up.

Can't get any worse.

You're having a laugh binners, Thatcher was far more right-wing both economically and socially than the present government.

You can pay not to have the ads when streaming Channel4 content.

To be fair Ch4 content is not what it was, it's nothing like as groundbreaking these days as 15-20 years ago.

I couldn't care less really.

There are much bigger issues out there.

You’re having a laugh binners, Thatcher was far more right-wing both economically and socially than the present government.

Sorry mate, but you’re talking nonsense. These lot are way, way, way to the right of Fatcha

You think she would have had any time for Brexit and this nationalist nonsense. She was one of the main architects of the single market

You’ve just said yourself that her government launched the public service broadcaster that is channel 4

This lot endorse GB news, are selling off channel 4 and want to dismantle and sell off the BBC, so I’m not sure what you’re basing that theory on

I struggle to think of an issue with which you can safely say there is no bigger issue.

When you have identified it rone I would be grateful if you let me know.

Sorry mate, but you’re talking nonsense. These lot are way, way, way to the right of Fatcha

I'm going to have to agree with you again binners

You’re having a laugh binners, Thatcher was far more right-wing both economically and socially than the present government.

🤣

I'm with Binners.

I’m not sure what you’re basing that theory on

The present government is the first Tory government since before Thatcher which is committed to stimulating the economy not through tax cuts but through government investment. That clearly puts it to the left of Thatcher's governments.

On social issues I know how much some people like to bang on about the comments made many years ago concerning piccaninnies and watermelon smiles, but these were the musings of a pompous Eton educated toff writing in a publication for pompous Tory toffs.

If you ignore silly archaic words which Johnson presumably uses because he thinks it's funny, and instead look at the present government's cabinet you will see that it has the most BAME Cabinet Members in UK history.

Compare that with Thatcher's infamous public comment that she didn't want the UK "swamped" by immigrants.

On homophobia again Johnson makes comments about "bumboys" because presumably he thinks it's funny, and to be fair it's a term which I might well use, but it is inconceivable that he would introduce anything as disgraceful as Thatcher's Section 28.

On crime the present government isn't coming out with all the usual right-wing bollocks that Thatcher's governments churned out about law and order and how "prison works".

I don't know why they are suggesting privatising Channel 4, I suspect that the real target is very likely the BBC. Nor do I know if Johnson is behind the proposal.

Neither do I know if it is an attempt to placate the Thatcherite wing of the party which is known to be deeply concerned with the economic direction the government is taking with its heavy emphasis on government spending.

It would appear that there is a battle going on inside the Tory Party between Tory MPs in the traditional Tory heartlands of the South which want the government to remain true to Thatcherism, and the new Tory MPs in what once Labour Northern heartlands who want the government to take a more left-wing interventionist direction to safeguard their newly won seats.

What worries me most about Johnson however is his committment, or lack of, on issues concerning democracy, accountability, and human rights. On those issues I wouldn't trust the fat bastard further than I could throw him.

He is dangerous and self-serving and I have no doubt cares nothing about what he leaves in his wake.