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Maguire has been great but he needs to calm down a bit. He's always yelling at Pickford and I think it puts the jitters up the whole defence.
Goalies yell at defenders all the time. It's a thing, even if the goalie is at fault themselves and shouting just to get their mistake out of their minds.
Defenders yelling at goalkeepers is s not a good thing. Pickford was much more composed before Harry came back into the team.
You don't half talk dung chewkw.
Lets be brutally honest, if Scotland were in the final we'd be just as unbearable. Many Scots try to justify why they don't want England to win, but, hen you cut through the crap, there is usually a fair amount of jealousy involved
I know very little about football, but it is good when something positive can unite (most) of the country. I want to be proud to be English and put out a flag, but I feel I will be tarnished as right-wing - I hate the Tories, voted against Brexit but feel sad that I can't show allegiance to the team as the flag and its imagery have been hijacked by the right-wing. That makes me sad.
If England win it will be a pub quiz favourite in 40 years time "In what year did England win Euro 2020?"
I think if you have a George's cross out right now, people won't think it's because you're a fan of Tommy Robinson.
England were the better side, soft penalty notwithstanding they deserved the win. The had Denmark on the ropes for most of the 2nd half and all of ET.
I hope they win, its a sorry state of affairs if we can't support another home nation ahead of Italy. England's manager is a class act and they have some excellent players.
not everyone waving a Saltire is a pissed-up, pasty white ginger moron with plans of invading Carlisle. It’s never that simple
How dare you call me ginger!
The knuckle draggers will only own this if we let them. This England team have done more to hold the government to account than the official opposition. They have taken a risk in standing up to prejudice and promoted an idea of national identity that is rooted in togetherness.
Their stance prompted the government to target them in their ongoing culture war (which has added to the pressure on the team and makes their success thus far all the more admirable). Though I agreed with Gary Neville's coments I thought he might have gone in a bit two footed....
That was before I realised that Doris had the temerity to not only turn up to the game in person but also had the gall to squeese himself into an England shirt (thus making himself look like offal in a condom).
Then to add insult to injury he dessecrates the number 10 (now made sacred by Raheem Sterling) by placing his own name above it. I can't criticise Neville for showing his studs, I can only commend him for not giving it the full Cantona.
"How dare you call me ginger!"
But can we still call you a pissed up moron who wants to invade Carlisle?
its a sorry state of affairs if we can’t support another home nation ahead of Italy
That's just silly. Do ManU fans shout on Citeh in the CL final?. As I said earlier, and tpbiker too, we'd be every bit as unbearable if we were as good as England, I don't really care if they win or not, in the grand scheme of things, but support them? behave!.
Many Scots try to justify why they don’t want England to win, but, hen you cut through the crap, there is usually a fair amount of jealousy involved
Partly but it's mainly just tribalism ingrained since a young age - we don't like those lot over there, they're different to us, worse than us, etc. I never experienced any hostility living in Glasgow at all, but there are quite a few even 'woke' Scots with a deluded sense that they are always the good guys, and England are the evil colonial oppressors etc.
Again, an element of truth but far from the whole story. Lots of Scottish people were instrumental in colonialism and slavery etc of the British empire, and lots of lowland Scots were responsible for the clearances but it doesn't fit the narrative.
That was before I realised that Doris had the temerity to not only turn up to the game in person but also had the gall to squeese himself into an England shirt (thus making himself look like offal in a condom).
The hypocrisy is absolutely breathtaking, if entirely predictable.
On the run up to the tournament they were basically used for cheap shots in their culture war, slating them, calling them marxists and terrorist supporters, then when they start winning, we are treated to the absolutely nauseating sight of this...
https://twitter.com/pritipatel/status/1412892001767460873?s=20
Given her way, half the squad wouldn't be here as she'd have deported their parents
Ben Jennings nailed it in the Guardian...
https://twitter.com/BJennings90/status/1411760788918964226?s=20
I'm absolutely fine with those North of the border supporting Italy in the final, should be easy for the Celts amongst you and a great opportunity for the non Celts to virtue signal how much less prejudiced you are than the English by lending your support to the Papists!
Jesus wept.
I want to be proud to be English and put out a flag, but I feel I will be tarnished as right-wing – I hate the Tories, voted against Brexit but feel sad that I can’t show allegiance to the team as the flag and its imagery have been hijacked by the right-wing. That makes me sad.
Thats the point really - that and the tories hijacking it.
Its a sad state of affairs but its where we are
Many Scots try to justify why they don’t want England to win, but, hen you cut through the crap, there is usually a fair amount of jealousy involved
Not how I see it
To me its england is the big brother and everyone wants to beat their big brother.
Jesus wept.
Even Jesus hates England?
Possibly! Na, Jesus is pretty cool, he's not a hater, he's got long hair, a beard and that.
To me its england is the big brother and everyone wants to beat their big brother.
But you'd cheer on the kid from the next street that's beating your brother up?
You don’t half talk dung chewkw.
Yes, same with everyone not on the football pitch. i.e. not actually coaching/playing it at that level. Everyone is just sofa critics.
Could we just have a "Culture Wars" thread that I could avoid, so all the other threads don't get filled up with all this "woke snowflake vs gammon" bickering?
Also, could we borrow Denmark's 'keeper for the final?
Just sicked up at that Priti pic/post. Rotten as.
I used to really enjoy football. Went to matches and all sorts. These days I only really pay attention during major international tournaments and the more I watch the less impressed I am with the spectacle. It just seems to be 22 very well paid young men trying to cheat their way to victory. The ball goes out and everyone's hand goes up. Even the guy who knows full well that he was the last to touch the ball. If you can't get past your man with the ball you fall over and try to con the ref into giving you a free kick. That's expected and doesn't really draw criticism any more. Maybe I'm being overly romantic about the days when hard men kicked lumps out of each other on a Saturday afternoon, but I'm really finding it hard to care who wins and the guff that was coming from the commentators last night about how it would change my life and I should call in sick just made me more determined never to watch another game on ITV.
But Rashford has done some good things on child poverty, they've taken a stand on the knee thing that I can respect, Southgate appears to be a decent human being who has developed a system that works and having watched a few of the Italy games I can't see myself supporting them either. So come on England.
Also, could we borrow Denmark’s ‘keeper for the final?
Just listening to a podcast now with one of the stats nerds from OPTA saying according to a type of xg which measures how difficult chances should be to save, it was the best goalkeeping performance ever in a euro championships.
But its the display of jingoism that the others create that is unpleasant to me and a lot of other folk
Me too. So don't let it. Reclaim the game. Football is about more than fans who are ****ers.
Yes I mentioned the laser earlier in the thread. You could see it on the goalie during the penalty.
But Rashford has done some good things on child poverty, they’ve taken a stand on the knee thing that I can respect, Southgate appears to be a decent human being who has developed a system that works and having watched a few of the Italy games I can’t see myself supporting them either.
Don't really give attention to all the politics gesturing of the game.
If they play well they are good but if they play badly then they are shite.
At the end of the day they are judged by their performance.
If they win they are national treasures etc, but if they lose they are a pain.
Rashford is a national treasure. Even if he gives away a penalty that loses them the game, he’s still a national treasure. As is Sterling. As is Hendo. All players that have taken a stand in recent years have my support. I couldn’t care less what they do - they’ve all stood up and been counted and Sterling and Rashford have had to face countless incidences of racist abuse. I’m just picking these in particular - there are other examples I’m sure.
I’ve enjoyed that there’s been way less jingoism this tournament. There’s always going to be some - it’s unavoidable. But I think politicians and right wing rags are having to be very careful with trying to own this team. Because people like Sterling and Rashford will wipe the floor with them in front of their base. I also think Southgate holds himself very well. I thought when he got the job that he was lucky - but hey, I and countless others was wrong. Still probably neutral for the final - but I think England will do it.
Well done England! The best team won, although I think diving for winning penalty may come back to haunt them 😉
I really like Southgate, always have, ever since his penalty miss tbh. He just seems a nice genuine guy and really want him to do well.
The "national media" especially the BBC can get in the sea though! Radio has been turned off for the day here as it'll be utterly insufferable, it was bad enough yesterday!
Sure much as I despise ****s who shine lasers, Klassper saved that kick and nearly the rebound (watch how quick he gets up and goes the other way). Conversation would’ve been justifiably different if he hadn’t saved the initial shot.
I know very little about football, but it is good when something positive can unite (most) of the country. I want to be proud to be English and put out a flag, but I feel I will be tarnished as right-wing – I hate the Tories, voted against Brexit but feel sad that I can’t show allegiance to the team as the flag and its imagery have been hijacked by the right-wing. That makes me sad.
Cheer up, it is fine to have a flag out this week without people thinking you are some sort of tory ****er.
Just take it down soon after the match or maybe at half mast after England have lost.
Yes I mentioned the laser earlier in the thread. You could see it on the goalie during the penalty.
Earlier in the second half the Danes went to take a throw in in their right back position and the player recoiled and then called the ref over, who then went to the 4th official and gesticulated almost like signalling four in cricket, I speculated at the time:
I think they’re saying there’s some nob with a laser in the crowd.
Sounds like they didn't find him then.
You've got to feel for the right wing nationalists who fly the flag of St George as an emblem of identity because at the moment there's a danger for them that they'll be mistaken for 'woke, Marxist England supporters.'
What a flag represents is mutable. As art students we were taught as part of (marxist) critical theory that 'meaning is subject to context and use'. A bit like wot kerley says.
I know we should get back to talking about the fitba and how Sterling is probably the player of the tournament but to divorce the England team from what is happening in politics is naive. Imagine if England had gone out in the group stage, taking the knee would definitely be taking the blame.
The tories called a war on woke and chose the Euro's as a battleground and it's a battle they've lost. The England team have succeeded in reclaiming the flag for the moment, those that chose to show their patriotism by boo-ing can't really take the credit for, or the shine off the teams achievements. Unless we let them.
Should the team triumph on Sunday don't expect the Sun headline to read "IT WAS WOKE WOT WON IT", even though that is demonstrably the case. The Tories could only have extracted political capitol out of this if the team had failed and deep down the public knows this now.
After the Germany game, every England victory became a defeat for the government and I find that rather delicious.
Oh Jesus H Corbet!!! You thought that Boris's shirt was bad, and Priti's new found love of Football was cynical, then prepare to uncurl your toes as you check out this cringefest
https://twitter.com/BBCPolitics/status/1413105912064135170?s=20
I think this counts as cultural appropriation now, doesn't it?
Wheres a gang of Old School footy hooligans when you need one?
After the Germany game, every England victory became a defeat for the government and I find that rather delicious.
What did I miss that made this the case? I've not been keeping on top of the governments shithousery recently.
@binners:
At least he didn't do it in black-face.
Many Scots try to justify why they don’t want England to win, but, hen you cut through the crap, there is usually a fair amount of jealousy involved
Not so, it's just that England won one championship 55 years ago and have never shut up about it since.
Anyway, if we're supposed to be one united Britain, then surely this is Scotland, Wales and Irelands win just as much as it's Englands? or does that only count when Andy Murray wins Tennis and becomes British?
"What did I miss that made this the case? I’ve not been keeping on top of the governments shithousery recently."
See the post directly above your own. JRM and Doris's trolling antics are usually a winner but they're over reaching now and look like complete and utter fools. Even their new found Northern Nationalist constituents aren't buying this tripe.
Not so, it’s just that England won one championship 55 years ago and "the media" have never shut up about it since.
I think is more accurate. But yes if they win it'll be horrendous 😆
I think it was unfortunate for GB news to launch at the same time as the Euro's as in a way they tethered their fate to success or not of the team. Had England disgraced themselves then GB News and the like would be having a field day.
As it is, their target market doesn't want to hear about woke and cancel culture at the moment, they just want to have a few beers and enjoy the football. The Tories and their shills have mis judged the mood of the Nation, or at the very least taken a gamble with it. They have shown their misunderstanding of what football means to most people because they aren't like most people.
Remember how Aston Ham United supporter David Cameron called a referendum during the last Euro's? A little fissure has opened up that they might now find hard to close. Ironically every time the Tories go near the football they make Kier Starmer look more like a man of the people.
Not so, it’s just that England won one championship 55 years ago and “the media” have never shut up about it since.
So, pretty much like any teams who win anything… apart from Scotland who have to talk about Archie Gemmill’s goal against the Dutch.
I think that the next time Priti Patel or Boris Johnson is on camera, talking about how much they're enjoying the football, any reporter worth his salt needs to ask them to talk them through the offside rule, or ask them their opinion of the new handball protocols for next season
If England win it, they'll get to never shut up about how they were the only team in Euro 2020 that we played and couldn't beat.
So, pretty much like any teams who win anything…
No, it's actually nothing like that. If it were it wouldn't be an issue.
If England win it, they’ll get to never shut up about how they were the only team in Euro 2020 that we played and couldn’t beat
You got that right! 😉
No, it’s actually nothing like that. If it were it wouldn’t be an issue.
How do you know. How much time do you spend listening to others country’s sports programmes?
apart from Scotland who have to talk about Archie Gemmill’s goal against the Dutch.
Sounds like jealousy to me
they were the only team in Euro 2020 that we played and couldn’t beat.
Strictly speaking, we drew against Denmark in the equivalent 90 minutes. Not that we would have beaten the Scots in extra time, the way we were playing.
Anyway, if we’re supposed to be one united Britain, then surely this is Scotland, Wales and Irelands win just as much as it’s Englands?
FWIW I'd be cheering on Scotland, Wales or NI if they got to this point in a major comp
As indeed we were cheering on Wales during their semi-final run last time out.
The context in which 1966 is usually mentioned is along the lines of 'we haven't won anything for so long' it's not really boasting about it.
It's totally fine if you don't want to support England or even want to see them lose but some of the justifications for why are pretty spurious.
Re the nationalism & flags waving- surely it's a sign of multiculturalism that they're waving the Genoese flag & the 3 lions come from association with Normandy, Aquitaine & Leuven!
The context in which 1966 is usually mentioned is along the lines of ‘we haven’t won anything for so long’ it’s not really boasting about it.
You can't say that - it doesn't fit with the narrative the bitter ones among us choose to roll out.
Has anyone mentioned Narey v Brazil in '82?
How do you know. How much time do you spend listening to others country’s sports programmes?
Unfortunately too much as we get all the English news lumped in with the national news. And if it were just sports programs that would be fine and easy to avoid but it isn't.
Oh Jesus H Corbet!!! You thought that Boris’s shirt was bad, and Priti’s new found love of Football was cynical, then prepare to uncurl your toes as you check out this cringefest
Were there any similar antics in the Spanish parliament?
Lads, it's just football. 22 overpaid kids running around kicking a ball. That's all. Whatever other people project onto says everything about them and nothing at all. Although having seen that Priti Patel pic I feel a need to burn my shirt. Everyone loves a winner, though.
Jingoism is awful and everyone does it. You don't want England to win cos it's close, not cos it's England. If you were in France, Germany, Poland etc. If you were in the US you'd have topped yourself long ago. They don't even have to do anything, it's their default setting.
Sterling isn't the best player on the England side. Mount was superb, It won't be the ref from the other day, if you do a semi, you don't usually get the final. Probably Kupers. Southgate is a smart, thoughtful guy. IpHe out the wind up the football establishment by choosing advisors that were not from football. Because he knows what they know. He needs to know what he doesn't already. A lesson for anyone in any organisation.
Yes the government will turn this to their advantage. No one ever succeeded in politics without that. Yes, they are pulling the old "my people are marching, I must rush to the front to see where I am leading them to". Stuff them. Ask them repeatedly how they feel about being done over by Marcus Rashford, who wouldn't have got a job scrubbing floors at Oxbridge.
I will agree that Any other side dives as much as Italy when 7 of their starting 11 has received a hand check to the chest and gone down holding their face at least twice and pointed to the imaginary mark. Until then....
Get out your St George. Don't boo. Don't make racist comments. For Gods sake don't mention the war.
4321 or 3 at the back do we think?
^ I don't think I have read such an incoherent post on this forum as that one.
don’t think I have read such an incoherent post on this forum as that one.
Just answering a lot of questions in one go. Saves time.
Don't be a dick.
^ I don’t think I have read such an incoherent post on this forum as that one.
Erm, what about this load of old shite from the previous page?
You’ve got to feel for the right wing nationalists who fly the flag of St George as an emblem of identity because at the moment there’s a danger for them that they’ll be mistaken for ‘woke, Marxist England supporters.’
What a flag represents is mutable. As art students we were taught as part of (marxist) critical theory that ‘meaning is subject to context and use’. A bit like wot kerley says.
I know we should get back to talking about the fitba and how Sterling is probably the player of the tournament but to divorce the England team from what is happening in politics is naive. Imagine if England had gone out in the group stage, taking the knee would definitely be taking the blame.
The tories called a war on woke and chose the Euro’s as a battleground and it’s a battle they’ve lost. The England team have succeeded in reclaiming the flag for the moment, those that chose to show their patriotism by boo-ing can’t really take the credit for, or the shine off the teams achievements. Unless we let them.
Should the team triumph on Sunday don’t expect the Sun headline to read “IT WAS WOKE WOT WON IT”, even though that is demonstrably the case. The Tories could only have extracted political capitol out of this if the team had failed and deep down the public knows this now.
After the Germany game, every England victory became a defeat for the government and I find that rather delicious.
Don’t be a dick.
I'll try as long as you make an effort too. 🙄
I’ll try as long as you make an effort too. 🙄
Wasn't addressed at you. It was a precis to make the post more coherent for you.
If it struck a nerve......
I play the ball, not the man.
I will agree that Any other side dives as much as Italy when 7 of their starting 11 has received a hand check to the chest and gone down holding their face at least twice and pointed to the imaginary mark. Until then….
That is why I also support Italy because they are so determine to win they try all tricks including diving, which to me is very funny and entertaining. They make me laugh when they dives but it is part of the game if they can get away with it. Why accuse them of taking the dives when VAR cannot even detect them LOL!
Sorry jambourgie,
Some of that was tounge in cheek, some of it wasn't.
I'm not expecting you to work out which is which but thanks for re-posting.
If it was a bit to difficult for you to get your head around try this for size.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/jul/08/england-and-southgate-stop-divisive-politicians-hijacking-euro-2020-success
/blockquote>I wonder how other government would react if their national team has achieved something, probably the same. Yes, you could hear the guardian reporter's inner thoughts of wanting the outcome to be different. LOL!
Why isn't there a third place play-off game?
Surely UEFA must know that it's a small money spinner?
Because it is almost always dull. Two teams of folk who are by definition ultra competitive dragging themselves through a match they don't want to play in the losers final
But they're not a bore fest, there are usually lots of goals in them. Look at the results Sweden 4-0 Bulgaria, Netherlands 3-0 Uruguay etc
They usually end up more open and with more goals than the final. Belgium 2-0 England in 2018 was quite dull though
My point about the flag waving and jingoism has been totally borne out by the tories on this. Johnson and patel both of whom critised the team now supporting them
foul
all the more reason why proper fans shouldn't withdraw and leave it to them.
I wonder.... if they win (maybe even if not) they'll be invited to a reception at #10. I'd be tempted to make that a matter of choice for the players. Like Johnny Marr telling Dave Cameron he'd rather he doesn't play his music, Sterling and Rashford and all saying that they'd rather not thanks, would send the frothers into super froth.
Or turn up, for a lovely reception in the Rose Garden, and insist on the team photo being taken with the team taking a knee.
That is why I also support Italy because they are so determine to win they try all tricks including diving, which to me is very funny and entertaining. They make me laugh when they dives but it is part of the game if they can get away with it. Why accuse them of taking the dives when VAR cannot even detect them LOL!
Because football is 'the beautiful game' and teams that win by playing clever intricate football are much nicer to watch than those who roll around on the floor?
Your troll character is at least consistent and not limited to politics, though.
My point about the flag waving and jingoism has been totally borne out by the tories on this. Johnson and patel both of whom critised the team now supporting them
Tbh it can be seen as the opposite up here, I remember when us Rangers fans made up the biggest segment of the Scotland support, but a lot of them now see the national team as being hijacked by the nationalists for their own agenda.
I'm a nationalist and a Rangers fan (there's lots more of us than the dam busters boys would have you believe) so it doesn't bother me, but even if I wasn't, bloody sure I wouldn't be letting anyone hijack my nation, if that was the way I felt.
I remember when us Rangers fans made up the biggest segment of the Scotland support, but a lot of them now see the national team as being hijacked by the nationalists for their own agenda.
Ah yes - the logic and sense of the rangers fan!
insist on the team photo being taken with the team taking a knee.
Despite my earlier point about this thread degenerating into more culture wars tedium, this is a magnificent idea.
Perhaps someone could take a picture of Rashford spontaneously taking a knee in front of BoJo (instead of shaking hands) when they inevitably meet. That would be so great.
Looking forward to Sunday! The football fan in me wants Italy to win - they have the best anthem by far, one of the classic kits and this Italy team plays beautiful football, they've been so good to watch.
As a Scot, by default I want England to lose. Someone earlier made the point that an England fan would cheer Scotland on if we were in this position. That's nice, but reflects the historical power imbalance between us, it's no skin off your English nose to grant us your support.
I like this England team though, especially as they're the de facto opposition to the Tory government, and there's plenty of admirable role models in your dressing room. Politics is inseparable from football, just as it's inseparable from everything else. Those who would suggest otherwise just don't want you thinking about it. I'd be delighted for this England team if they won, just as I'd be delighted for the vast majority of England fans. If only there were some way to separate the minority of boorish racists and shameless opportunists so they don't get to feel they've won!
Can't see England prevailing though - too one-dimensional going forward, albeit a pretty effective dimension. Italy's full-backs won't be so easy to get in behind and I'd be surprised if it was as easy to win as many free-kicks around the edge of the box. Rice and Phillips will be England's key players, as so much of Italy's invention comes through Insigne and Chiesa. If they get the chance to play, you're up against it. Good luck though!
Ah yes – the logic and sense of
thesome rangers fans!
FTFY
Don't you mean one Rangers fan?
I won't be sorry if England win. I think it could go a long way to ridding them of the old hooligan/flag bothering element. Somebody on the radio the other morning talked about how the atmosphere was much friendlier. My other half now wants to go to a football match, she'll be in for a shock if we take her to an Aberdeen - Rangers match.