The bikepacking thread

Courtesy of @scotroutes

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I think it was me who said I like this sort of thing...

And I liked that! 

The view from those roads looks superb - seems like a great trip 

I haven't really done any big tours on bikes myself this year but hoping to change that soon when time allows

A few from Islay and Arran a couple of weeks ago

The clear sky and flat calm in your second pic isn't how I remember Scotland, iainc - remarkable.

^^^ yes, we had amazing weather for our 5 day trip.  That picture is from the ferry point at Cloanaig, on Kintyre, looking over to Arran.  Was mid afternoon and around 26 degrees..

@iainc

Wow

I haven't been on a trip, just been buying and 3d printing gear for my upcoming trip on foot on the Knoydart peninsula.  Went with the Alpkit Tarpstar 1 in the end, and I also bought some new ti pans as I tested out the OEX Jetboil knock-off and found it saved barely any gas during testing.

A few more..

OEX Jetboil knock-off and found it saved barely any gas during testing.

A few people have tried similar tests with other non-jetboils (alpkit etc) and found the same, don't know if it's protected by a patent or it's just too expensive to do properly but jetboils obviously have better transfer between the fins and the base of the pot.

I worked out the payback time on the weight though and you'd need to cook something like 3 meals a day for 10 days to offset the weight of the gas saved.  And that ignores the fact that most people are probably using the small 100g cans and binning them after 4 days, not carrying 10 days of fuel. 

Meths works out lighter because the stove weighs naff all, the bottle is plastic and you can adjust how much you take easily. It just takes ............................ forever. 

@iainc - this is the bikepacking thread. Start a touring thread if you must post. 

^^^ we left our bags in the YH on the day of those pictures.  Does that not count ? 😜

Walking I only carry a stove when it's really cold and need to melt snow. The rest of the time I eat and drink cold until I come across a cafe/bar/restaurant. A coffee filter and sterilizing tablets for making what already looks clean water drinkable. An MSR XKG with a small bottle of 95 octane petrol lasts a few days above the snow line and boils in no time. Petrol has good energy density and the aluminium bottles are light

On the bike I sometimes take a stove in Winter and worry a lot less about weight than walking as you can see from the pics with a 1.7kg tent, heavy clothes, spare clothes, comfortable mats and luxuries like a whole bar of soap. 

Walking long distance weight makes a big difference to how much we enjoy it and how far we can walk in a day so it's down gear, very light waterproofs, an 850gm MSR tent and if in doubt chuck it out. No tent at all and just a mossie net for our faces for some trips.

Around 10kgs with food for a night out, like to guess where the photo was taken? :

Posted by: iainc

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the YH

I rest my case 😂

Joking aside, a piece of kit we use as necessary is a credit card. If there's a nice hotel, appartement to rent or whatever on the route our enthusiasm for camping/bivvie has its limits. 🙂 It's quite satisfying hosing down a Brompton in a hotel shower. 😉

So what’s the difference between bikepacking and touring then ?

Clothes and kit packed in bags and attached to bikes. Sleeping ranging from basic tarp to nice hotel. A few days away, with mates or solo, exploring some new routes, some on roads, some on trails. 

if it looks the same, feels the same I think it is the same…

and yes, I know scotroutes is having a gentle bait, and we know each other well, but really, it’s a broad spectrum surely ? 

Posted by: iainc

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So what’s the difference between bikepacking and touring then ?

Since the invention of bikepacking panniers, very little 😂

Meh, I don't really care. I've done it all ways and it's all good. I have promised myself a nice tour soon though. Something involving country inns I reckon. 

There’s levels of achievement isn’t there-

Riding from accommodation to accommodation and dining out - 1 point

Riding with camping kit , but dining out - 2 points

Riding with camping kit and food and cooking yourself at campsites - 3 points

Riding fully self sufficient (with added poo trowel and big roll) and sleeping wild - 4 points

Keep Smiling Adventures - LOG on a BMX and a rucksack and a bivvy - 5 points

4 points was when I was poor and now out of nostalgia or if there's no civilisation. 1 point I find restrictive as it involves planning and at some times/places booking in advance. I reckon 2.5 points is the sweet spot - a hot shower and just open a tin of sardines to put on bread with an apple for desert rather than faff cooking.

Here's my short level 4 effort from the end of last week. Out the door (SE London) to the South Downs for a damp bivvy in a cloud followed by a drop down to Brighton for coffee before cheating and getting the train back. In the spirit of Keep Smiling Adventures, left the stove behind and dinner and breakfast was a garage raid: Ginsters, chocolate milk, snickers and jelly babies... 

Mostly a road ride, but an enjoyable bimble for the most part, even Ditchling Beacon was ok.. Would have liked more SDW and less main road but that's for another day.

Some phone pics:

Campsite views

Still murky the next morning

and back to the smoke

So what’s the difference between bikepacking and touring then ?

In bike packing the sum of the cost of the bags should equal or exceed the cost of the bike. 

My experience so far is the CDT, Jennide, Traws Eyryi and NYM Ramble 200. 

CDT, carried my tent on day 1 for a night on the campsite where my wife was meeting us all as she loves to be involved and was happy to Sherpa anyones gear who wanted to ride light. Great decision as one or two riders had underpacked and arrived in the dark, cold and shivering so we got them in the van to warm em up.

On day 2 I left my tent and my fatbike was much more fun to ride.

Jennride, proper bikepacking, slept above Coniston, very satisfying.

Traws Eyryi, my wife met us each night bringing beer, food and Simons tent. This meant carrying very little gear and made the riding a proper pleasure. Also allowed us to take a few techier options along the way.

NYM 200, my wife, a bell tent, bunkbarn and a pod. Resupply spots aren't very good so we had to carry plenty of snacks and still needed warm clothes for the evening, etc.

My conclusion, for me, bikepacking/touring/whatever is about the riding first and foremost, I am a mountain biker and want to take the most lines on my chosen route. For one night, anything goes but after that I like a shower.

It's all good, its all riding bikes 🙂

When I find the time to finish writing it up I will post a bit more about the NYM 200.

Ah, so we need to add a new level I hadn’t thought of, cycling where your kit is being sherpa’d along between overnight stops! So only carrying typical dayride gear on the bike - 0.5? 😉 

I guess we could average out the scores for the days we were carrying kit. 

and extra marks to downshep for his colour coordination 😎

Anyone following Timmy Mallet on his bike tour around Ireland - he's done the Wild Atlantic Way, comfortably with an e-bike but carrying plenty of kit and staying in hotels etc. - wonder what his score will be? He's logging it on Strava and social media, doing some lovely paintings on his way. 

Keep Smiling Adventures - LOG on a BMX and a rucksack and a bivvy - 5 points

Keep Smiling is brilliant. What amazes me is that he seems to go as far each day on the BMX as he does on his other bikes… and all fueled on the worst diet ever and with a complete disregard for comfort.  And he’s six and half foot tall. 

I love the lack of “look at me I’m living the dream” vibe in his videos and his straight forward approach to the whole thing.  

Definitely a "1" here. Marches and Castles tour. Write up and a few more pics here: https://www.pickled-hedgehog.com/marches-and-castles-tour-subtitle-hills-so-many-many-hills/

After which I sold my gravel bike 🙂 But only because I'd much prefer to ride a lightweight HT instead. Any purchase shall have to wait tho until I have a one piece collarbone again 🙁 

Nothing wrong with eating out for everything if you have the facilities, but you don't always which is also fine.  On my upcoming trip there won't be.  The calculation is a bit different if you're on a bike because you can cover more ground and/or take detours to visit shops or restaurants.

A few people have tried similar tests with other non-jetboils (alpkit etc) and found the same, don't know if it's protected by a patent or it's just too expensive to do properly but jetboils obviously have better transfer between the fins and the base of the pot.

I don't think so, there are many knockoffs that are the same, with integrated stove/heat exchanger. Mine was just a pot with a HX on the bottom, used with a standard stove, and this put the burner much further away from the pan.  It still helped, just not enough to justify the extra weight since the pot's also quite big.  Something like an MSR Windburner makes more sense since you don't need a windbreak, but I'd put that and the Reactor more in the expedition category, especially where you might be melting snow, not summer bikepacking.

My current 50l pack with all my camping gear in it is 4.3kg but no food or clothes. and not including the waking pole that the tent needs.  I will bring a few luxuries because I find weight when walking much less bothersome than when cycling.

I have also planned out a credit-card trip where I carry absoutely as little as possible - preferably using only back pockets and a saddle bag.

Great idea for a thread, will follow for further inspiration.

If we can avoid it being derailed by a debate about bikepacking vs touring even better.

I’m attempting a “1” coast to coast next week and will appreciate the lack of additional weight going over Wrynose and Hardnot passes.

Is it ok to talk about gear?  I feel like it's useful, and I find it a pleasing diversion whilst working along with the scenery and trip reports.

This weekends going to be a difficult score then 😂

Thursday -140km bikepacking bags, but on the road, and ending at a campsite, only about 600m of climbing.

Friday - 225km, but only carrying audax kit, tent is being dropped at the finish. But there's 3700m of climbing.

Saturday - circular ride, only 174km, and only 2900m of climbing, even lunch is being provided! Nil points?

Sunday - 221km, tent is being dropped off again, but there's 3900m of climbing (and a bonus 200m if anyone still has legs and fancies a diversion to watch the Mach loop)

Monday - back to full bikepacking, 140km / 600m but  ending at home, so I'm carrying cooking gear now, but not cooking?

And judging by the forecast rule #9 applies.

I will bring a few luxuries because I find weight when walking much less bothersome than when cycling.

I think backpacks in general make things easier. Last trip I did I put all the heavy stuff on my back and just the sleeping bag and tent on the bars and in the frame bag.  It made the bike actually manageable offroad.  For racing off-road with the bare minimum kit then going bareback makes sense, but for everyone else I'm not convinced not being able to ride the fun stuff is a tradeoff worth making to avoid a bit of back sweat.

Next year I fancy a go at the North Wales 400, but doing it on a 'proper' MTB with just a ~20l pack, the bare minimum of kit and enjoying all the trail centers on the route not just enduring ticking them off or having to stash heavy bags at the visitor centers.

I’m 2 and a bit weeks into my bikepacking trip from Tallinn Estonia back to the UK. Have just ridden through Lodz in Poland after doing the Baltic states. Had the rear tyre split terminally in a rainstorm in the middle of nowhere in Latvia that took an adventure to sort out, crank fell off in Riga and boar hunters spent the night blasting away around me in a forest on Saturday. Poland is pretty boring tbh, I’ll be glad to get to Czechia in a couple of days.  

I've visited relatives in Wootch, you've photographed the most interesting sight. 😉 I've ridden some of the Danish and German bits of the Baltic bike path but missed the opportunity to ride all the way round. Are you managing to find off-road or quiet routes because Polish driving made me nervous?

A lot of gravel tracks and minor roads. Polish drivers aren’t that bad compared to Italy, say. There’s a surprising number of bike paths compared to the UK. 

Thanks, that's encouraging.

Re: gear I've got some new really, really mimimal gear to try out:

A mountain equipment ion bivy bag -280g.VERY minimal

A robens mountain bivvy (bigger / more comfortable than the ion, with bug net! But not totally waterproof. list at 495g but I weighed it and IIRC it was sub 400g which was a nice surprise.

A tiny 3ful tarp. About 160g but that's without any pegs or guys.

A Featherlight 700 stove kit 144g without fuel.

So that lot coupled with

....my existing lightest sleeping pad (naturehike job not very comfortable but about 370g)

...my lightest sleeping bag (sea to summit spark sp1 long version 385g )

Should mean I can have an excruciatingly uncomfortable and cold night BUT it'll weigh <2kg once I've chucked bags and a head torch into the equation so that's surely a win?

Someone has started a bikepacking gear thread on the bike forum which leaves this thread for the actual bike packing. It might be a like the guitar thread though where talking about guitars is more popular than playing them. 😉

This weekend was forecast unpleasantly hot on the plain so we headed up the hill leaving Pau on the cycle route through Gan to Busy:

There's an old railway trail from Busy to Les Eaux Bonnes:

Then up the Col d'Aubisque:

First snows of 1991 in the same place:

Stayed in the resort then walked up a hill:

Another night in the resort then over the Aubisque and Soulor:

And along the old railway trail to Lourdes:

And along the cycle route from Lourdes to Pau. A couple of kms are being worked on but still rideable:

Great pics and good idea for a thread. I'm a seasoned backpacker but new to bikepacking. I'm loving it though. A couple of recent trips.  First, a local solo saunter into the Shropshire hills with a camp on the Long Mynd.

Second, with apologies for boring peeps as I did post a thread on this, the Woods Rat Run with my son and daughter. I have to credit my daughter with the best of these photos!

.

Love the family pics, blokeuptheroad. Both junior and his girlfriend are into bikes/touring and It's great going out together.

Last weekend did the Traws Eryri route over 4 days with 2 mates.

Set off on Saturday form a very wet Machynlleth 

To a much sunnier Barmouth 

Next day was sunny to start along the Mawdach estuary the over a big hill to Coed y Brenin (no cafe anymore) wheryit started to rain. But stopped by the time we got to Traws with one of the guys needing some TLC due to cutting his leg falling off on the descent.

Day 3 was dryish all day with a big climb in the morning over to Penmachno then round the forests to Bettws

Final day was up to Ogwen, down to the coast and a final big climb over to Conwy

A good 4 days of riding 🙂

Traws Eryri is on my to do list! How did you manage the start/finish transport logistics? Where did you stay overnight?

Left a car at the Premier Inn in Llandudno junction (£12 for 5 days parking) and 2 of us took the train to Machynlleth (need to book bikes on TfW services).

Stayed in a 'bothi' at Glyndwr campsite above Mach. Basic but cosy.

Barmouth stayed in Bunkorama after fish and chips in town (the main food option in Barmouth). Nice bunkhouse with cosy kitchen / living room but about 150m of extra up from town!

Stayed in the Cross Foxes in Traws. Evening meals were ok and the staff friendly but the place was generally grubby and the most expensive of the trip by a good margin. 'continental' breakfast was cereal from plastic storage containers and a loaf of sliced bread. Village shop was well stocked and friendly.

Final night was Vagabond bunkhouse in Betws which was fine and did good pizzas. Breakfast at Alpine cottage in Betws was a good choice.

Ride from Conwy back to car was only about a mile and a half.

Third guy parked in Shrewsbury did train to Mach on Saturday morning and back from Llandudno Junction on Tuesday.

Barmouth stayed in Bunkorama after fish and chips in town (the main food option in Barmouth). Nice bunkhouse with cosy kitchen / living room but about 150m of extra up from town!

Ha! I stayed there on the return leg of a 600km audax last month. It was biblically wet and I managed a luxurious two hours kip before I had to get going. As you say, the extra climb is a bit annoying but it's a glorious location.

Having walked Stevenson in early July it was time to go cycle camping. Checking out the weather forecast central France seemed a good bet so we booked tickets on a BlaBlaBus to Paris with the idea of cycling south and taking a train when we'd had enough. That meant Bromptons. The bus got into Paris as light appeared in the eastern sky and we made for the Seine:

The bike route is a mix of roads tracks and even singletrack. At the Loing we turned right up the canal:

Then over the hill to the Loire and upstream to just before Nevers. The municipal campsites were excellent with lots of happy cycle tourists to chat to. That's our green tent in the background:

The Canal du Berry took us to Montluçon and the "Vagabonde"

https://www.francevelotourisme.com/itineraire/la-vagabonde

The Vagabonde is on shared roads apart from about 5kms of cycle path but there's very little traffic in la Creuse or la Corrèze. We sometimes used Mapy.cz to take variants. We should have avoided Rocamdour where we were treated to our only close pass - frustrated tourists in traffic jams. Your may have seen Indurain or Lemond on the Tour time trials around Lac de Vassivière:

Tempertures were perfect until Rocamadour, sometimes even chilly, but then it got a bit warm which combined with loaded inefficient bikes and 1000m+ days wore down our enthusiasm. We arrived in Cahors with a forecast of 39°C for the next days:

and took the train home.

Final night was Vagabond bunkhouse in Betws which was fine and did good pizzas. Breakfast at Alpine cottage in Betws was a good choice.

 

I'm not a particularly OCD type person but that image has me twitching. A bacon sarnie eaten with knife and fork? Wtf is the garnish? It's cheap, sliced bread, the provider has deemed that a mug isn't the preferred choice, but a teapot and cup and saucer*. Cafe trying to be posh and failing completely. 🤣 Don't forget to stick the pinkie out....

* I hate cups and saucers!

The Deeside Trail should be on every mtb bike packers to do list. So much sweet singletrack 🥰

I rode it last weekend and will be back again at some point 👌👌👌

I’ve never bikepacked in my life, and honestly, I have very little intention of doing do. But this is a great thread, and very inspiring. Maybe someday, this will actually be me (but I doubt it!!).

There is something very liberating knowing you are carrying everything you need for a day or so, and can sleep pretty much wherever I fancy (within reason, but as I live in Scotland, there are ample places IME). 

When I do the Deeside Trail again I might stay in a b&b in the middle and not carry any bags as they do limit how fast you ride over rough terrain.

Just found this thread, and it's great for information and inspiration. 

I've decided to dip my toe into the bikepacking world, so have spent the last few months curating various kit from ebay/FB marketplace/drunken online impulse purchases.

I'm pretty much there now other than a stove and recommendations welcome for one or two night trips

For short trips you can either go for a simple BRS 3000 or Alpkit Kraku stove and small gas canister, or my usual preference is for a trangia meths burner, stand & windshield.

The meths stove is slower to boil water, but is cheaper to run, packs smaller and is completely silent, which is nice when you're relaxing in your tent.

The gas stove is better in cold weather when you want to get a brew ready asap. Always feels a bit wasteful due to the gas canisters.

Have a look here for superlight/packable stoves. For solo trips up to a week I never use anything else. Longer trips and and trips with Mrs Spin, something a bit more versatile like the Kraku may be better.

https://speedsterstoves.co.uk/

I tend to go with a tiny gas canister, smallest burner attachment I can find, packed away inside a ti mug of some kind. You can get the weight down a bit with a meths burner and tin foil windshield, but I found it a bit more faffy and actually less compact once you start taking meths containers and the need to take precautions in case of leakage into account.

The annoying thing about meths burners, i find, is their tendency to blacken the outside of pots with soot, which then finds its way onto everything else. Otherwise they're a good option. (Longtime user of an old Trangia)

The annoying thing about meths burners, i find, is their tendency to blacken the outside of pots with soot,

Have you tried small meths burners like this https://www.bearbonesbikepacking.co.uk/product/ultralight-22g-meths-stove/ ?

They don't produce soot ime, I think because they burn under some pressure. Drawback vs the Trangia is they're a one-shot thing, fill and burn and hope you got the volume of fuel right (generally do if it's just boiling a mug of water) so not ideal for proper cooking. Small gas burners win there.

For sooty pots I normally scrub it with a freshly used tea bag, or a wet wipe which I'll be carrying some of anyway. The pot also goes in it's own stuff sack so the worst of the grime doesn't get on everything else. Some people add 10% water to the meths, but I've found it doesn't make enough of a difference to be worth the less effective heat output.

Agree it's not as straightforward as a little gas stove, this is definitely the easiest/best starter option!

Bearbones do 'rechargeable' meths stoves too

https://www.bearbonesbikepacking.co.uk/product/ultralight-22g-remote-feed-meths-stove/

BRS 3000 stove and small gas canisters for me. I don't use it often enough to worry too much about waste. I have a little thingy what's it that can refill one canister from two part filled ones which helps.

Posted by: boxelder

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Bearbones do 'rechargeable' meths stoves too

https://www.bearbonesbikepacking.co.uk/product/ultralight-22g-remote-feed-meths-stove/

 

Currently out of stock.

Posted by: blaggers

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There’s levels of achievement isn’t there-

Riding from accommodation to accommodation and dining out - 1 point

Riding with camping kit , but dining out - 2 points

etc etc

I offer my alternative points system. Did you go for a bike ride that felt adventurous? Did you get to see/do stuff that you woudln't do on your normal everyday bike rides? Then you can have a billion points from me once you've finished telling me how awesome the ride was.

Did you get to see/do stuff that you woudln't do on your normal everyday bike rides?

On my last overnighter I camped out on a headland, about 50m from the high tide line. It's a place where we get lots of rare birds blown in at this time of year, so I took my monocular. When I woke up at 6.30 I walked down to the edge of the water, scanned up and down the water and got an eyeful of an old bloke with long grey beard skinny dipping about 100m up the beach. He looked like the hermit in Life Of Brian, except naked. You don't see that every day!

Luckily...