[Closed] That BA/Vegas Aircraft Fire...

Top work by the cabin crew getting them off. If someone was ferreting around in the overhead lockers stopping me and my kids getting out, they'd get a punch in the nuts.

Here is a photo of Ms Bugmuncher in action:

[img] [/img]

As usual, the only injuries sustained were as a result of using the slides.

Good work by the BA crew and airfield emergency services.

[url= https://clyp.it/jrvdzhrw ]ATC recording of incident[/url]

If someone was ferreting around in the overhead lockers stopping me and my kids getting out, they'd get a punch in the nuts.

it depends how urgent the evac was

It's a plane, full of jet fuel, that is on fire.

I'd assume PRETTY ****ING URGENT! 😯

Screw the hand luggage - I'd be choosing my favourite kid and legging it.

I believe the urgent evac simulations they do result in broken bones and ripped up seats...
Keeping people calm, not clambering over each other and leaving through the right exits may look slower but be quicker and safer for all involved.

t's a plane, full of jet fuel, that is on fire.

I'd assume PRETTY ****ING URGENT!

Apparently they deployed the slides on the fire side - again and stopped crosswind (wind blowing the fire towards the aircraft) - again. Shades of Manchester...

not clambering over each other and leaving through the right exits may look slower but be quicker and safer for [s]all involved[/s]. [b]those near the exits[/b]

mikewsmith - Member
If someone was ferreting around in the overhead lockers stopping me and my kids getting out, they'd get a punch in the nuts.

Reckon I could get my bags out and be on the slide before people managed to move with their kids
I guess it depends how urgent the evac was.

Yup, agree with that.

Good work by all the crew though.. Must have been a tense few moments.. 😯

Which bit? My ultra-aggressive protecting my genetic material, or his devil-may-care protecting his passport and iPad? 😀

Let's not rush to judgement with the crosswind thing: if this happened while he was taxying out he may not have had a good idea where the wind was coming from. It would also require a 180 turn which may not have been advisable with the engine on fire.
Can't believe there are people carrying [b]two[/b] bags off the plane. They should be prosecuted.

those carrying bags off should be prosecuted for endangering lives.

this might sound far fetched but I fly a lot and think this is the only way it would sort numpties out. I also think over head lockers should be automatically locked for taxi/take off and until the seatbelt signs go off after landing and park up.

I also think over head lockers should be automatically locked for taxi/take off and until the seatbelt signs go off after landing and park up.

Ditto. And carry-on sizes and weights are not policed enough as it is (other than easyjet!). I also think lockers should be locked on initial embarkation, and only opened once everyone is on the plane at their seats, but thats just because i get annoyed by idiots who cant seem to short their stuff out and block aisles.

I also think over head lockers should be automatically locked for taxi/take off and until the seatbelt signs go off after landing and park up.

That sounds like an excellent idea. I've seen the stewards have to shout at people who stood up to get their bags when the wheels had literally just hit the tarmac and we were still hurtling along the runway!

Where do think they are going?

those carrying bags off should be prosecuted for endangering lives.

This. Absolutely. Some people!

those carrying bags off should be prosecuted for endangering lives.

Given that the plane was full of people who think Las Vegas, a place so utterly full of banality, shallowness and materialism, is a good place to visit, this does not actually surprise me.

Given that the plane was full of people who think Las Vegas, a place so utterly full of banality, shallowness and materialism, is a good place to visit, this does not actually surprise me.

To be fair there are a lot of conferences held there, due to the cheap (subsidised) hotel prices.

True. And I shouldn't make fun of what is an incredibly serious situation. But seeing the pictures of people taking luggage is just incredulous.

As incredulous as the King Knuts who blithely sit reading their paper whenever the safety briefing is given.

Its location irrelevant, the same happens on many many flights. Like ants in pants.

EDIT: if you fly a lot the safety briefing is almost irrelevant, you could repeat it back word for word. I could. However I also feel its fairly irrelevant cos if the plane is about to crash, yer pretty much doomed.

ut seeing the pictures of people taking luggage is just incredulous.

Definitely, if they can be prosecuted they should be.

As incredulous as the King Knuts who blithely sit reading their paper whenever the safety briefing is given.

If you're a regular flier why would you listen? I don't fly much more than once a year, but even then I can tell you exactly what's in the safety briefing. The only point of interest is the location of the exits, and again that's pretty obvious.

I also think over head lockers should be automatically locked for taxi/take off and until the seatbelt signs go off after landing and park up.

Agree in full! Also, if you can't carry it, you can't have it as carry on.

Given that the plane was full of people who think Las Vegas, a place so utterly full of banality, shallowness and materialism, is a good place to visit, this does not actually surprise me.

I hate the place, but have to go there a few times a year for work. Leave your judgement land side, thanks! 😉

(FWIW, though, I always take the LHR flight. I prefer the 747 )

If you're a regular flier why would you listen?

LOL, the briefing doesn't even tell you where the exits are. I could probably recite them back these days, my ears did pick up when they declared the life vest was infact a floating pillow that was the seat cushion...

A320/330/767/777/dash 8 and a few more. Do this, don't do that and get out the doors

DP

Whenever I hear the safety briefing I always think of Fight Club and the more realistic "safety" cards used in it..

If you're a regular flier why would you listen?

I fly fairly frequently, I even work in aviation and I make a point of listen to the briefing. Out of courtesy to the people doing it if not for anything else.

Same here. Also, I find I get better service in return by being courteous and polite when travelling.

It's all in the presentation

Why would you not listen? Got something more important to do?

Whenever I hear the safety briefing I always think of Fight Club and the more realistic "safety" cards used in it.

"When disaster strikes, there may a slight loss of cabin pressure, and a reduction in the number of wings"

"Next, remove any sharp objects from your person - like red hot fragments of engine casing - and make your way to the exits"

Why would you not listen? Got something more important to do? It only takes a minute, you might pick up something useful, it pushes the info to the front of your mind and it's polite.

Why not listen? You're reading your book, trying to fall asleep, keeping your kids quiet, loads of reasons really. Although I should say that I do usually listen despite knowing it pretty much off by heart already. It's a fair point about it being polite, though.

Same here. Also, I find I get better service in return by being courteous and polite when travelling.

think of the extra fuel wasted trying to achieve an altitude that safely clears your moral high ground without scaring the high horse your sitting on, though.

LOL, the briefing doesn't even tell you where the exits are.

Were you being ironic or a ****?

I hate the place, but have to go there a few times a year for work. Leave your judgement land side, thanks!

Point taken. Apols.

LOL, the briefing doesn't even tell you where the exits are.

Were you being ironic or a ****?

Exits are blah, make sure you know, lights will guide you, signs tell you. Though waving hands a bit don't really help, but as usual they are front. back on wings and easy to find

How many have you gone through in the last 3 months?

Enough to know that they make a point of telling you where they are located and then pointing them out.

Personally I make a point of first noting which is really the closest and then second, counting the number of seats infront/behind I need to go before I get there.

I can't remember the last time I didn't have an exit row seat in economy (as a cheap way of getting a bit more space), but this has further validated my decision 🙂

How many have you gone through in the last 3 months?

8 flights (5 long haul) in the last 3 months. Number of different planes, sitting in different locations means exits were different (last long haul nearest exit was in another class behind curtain). Life-jackets were fastened in different ways (or non-existent for US planes). Illuminated low level lighting was different in them too, also how to open the overwing doors.

All I get is hand wafting, again front/back/wings, it might be that I spend my time on very similar planes and I remember where they all are. I could give row numbers if you want but I'm happy to sleep through it when I'm absolutely knackered.

Do you check where the exits are on the bus?

I couldn't believe it when I saw the passengers standing on the apron with their luggage. Completely agree that they should be fined and named and shamed.

Always, always listen to everything said during the safety briefing. I've witnessed brave cabin crew tapping passengers on the shoulder for not paying attention.

peterfile - Member

I can't remember the last time I didn't have an exit row seat in economy (as a cheap way of getting a bit more space), but this has further validated my decision

Looks like the wing might've been a bit burny on this occasion 😉 50-50 chance I suppose!

Having a listen to the ATC audio... how calm are all concerned.

All I get is hand wafting, again front/back/wings, it might be that I spend my time on very similar planes and I remember where they all are. I could give row numbers if you want but I'm happy to sleep through it when I'm absolutely knackered.

Well perhaps you should try listening to the what they say as that will tell you how many exits there are and the rough location. Knowing the row number isn't very helpful but knowing the number of rows inform/behind is. Personally I always have quick look at that, check the brace position for that aircraft in case it is different and have a quick check that the life jacket is where it is supposed to be. Then again I work in offshore industry and have to sit through safety briefings for every flight and if you don't look like you are paying attention you get thrown off the flight.

Honestly, I do about one in 4, it's the same. I know where the exits are to the step really.

Pretty depressing really - be interesting to hear more witness accounts in the coming days...

[img] [/img]

There's another photo of a guy with 2 suitcases that must have been in the overhead lockers 🙄

I couldn't believe it when I saw the passengers standing on the apron with their luggage.

+ 1

Was gobsmacked they all seemed to have trolley bags with them!

[img] ?w=620&q=85&auto=format&sharp=10&s=c22eade235352e3c404413b27948a549[/img]

Happily for Rolls-Royce the engine was a General Electric. Phew.

those carrying bags off should be prosecuted for endangering lives.

Some of the people have forgotten their luggage ... 😯

globalti - Member
Happily for Rolls-Royce the engine was a General Electric. Phew.

edit: ... I thought they were Pratt & Whitney PW4000? Yes? No? ([url= https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pratt_%26_Whitney_PW4000 ]Quick Ref here[/url])

be worth checking where the exits are, even on similar or same family type aircraft.
Take the Airbus A319/A320/A321 family basically the same aircraft, just longer in length to carry more people.
A319 has 2 exits front and rear and 1 small exits over wing
A320 has 2 exits front and rear and 2 small exits over wing
A321 has 2 exits front and rear and NO over wing, the have extra door just in front and behind the wing (making 4 doors per side)

Then you also have to take in account Airline configs and diff specs.
Like Easyjet have a load of A319 aircraft with 2 over wing exits as they crammed in more seats and need to meet air saftey regs etc.

the usual..
Exit and shitter front
Exits 14&15
Shitters at the back with the other exit

seat in row 5 or 6 so decide if you battle the chavs or the business class for an exit, front every time, less fat people. Less idiots with kids.

None of this comes over in the briefing though

To be fair to some of the passengers and to give them the benefit of the doubt, it is OK to put a small bag on the floor under the seat in front of you, so if they evacuated it is no issue to pick it up on your way out - probably best to in case you kick it out a bit and impede someone elses exit.

The most worrying thing is that the cabin crew initially opened doors on the side of the aircraft of the burning engine thereby letting smoke into the cabin. Post ringway I would have thought that there should be a check before deciding which side of the aircraft to evacuate on since most, if not all fatalities in Ringway accident was from smoke and toxic gas inhilation.

I'm also gobsmacked by the people in the photos who seem to be standing about to watch or just calmly sauntering away.

[img] [/img]

I'm no fireman but I'm assuming that a 777 full of aviation fuel has the potential to make quite a large bang!

It's only an engine fire and aviation fuel isn't especially flammable. This isn't the movies.

On the classic B777's there were offerings from all engine manufacturers but on the updated B777 model they are exclusively GE. In BA's fleet they have RR on their older B777 classics and GE on their newer ones (and maybe on a 2nd tranche of some B777 classics).

Also on some aircraft alrlines can spec the number of exits on their aircraft to suit their cabin configurations and how they intend to operate the aircraft e.g. high density, sort/medium haul routs vs. lower density long haul aircraft. Airlines sometimes operate sub-fleets of the same aircraft type, so could have a mix of these configurations so it is always important to familiarise yourself as it can vary between aircraft of the same type even within the same airline.

ti_pin_man - Member

those carrying bags off should be prosecuted for endangering lives.

What if the fire was in the bags?

Happily for Rolls-Royce the engine was a General Electric. Phew.

I'm at GE Greenville just now. I'll let you know how pointing it out to them goes.

It's only an engine fire and aviation fuel isn't especially flammable.

Ah right, just a fire in the engine, attached to the wing full of fuel.

[img] [/img]

No worries.

This isn't the movies.

Neither is this.

Ah right, just a fire in the engine, attached to the wing full of fuel.

Bit of polish and it'll be fine 😯

[img] [/img]

Looking at the photo, the fire seems to be blowing back into the plane, rather than along it.

I was under the impression that the cabin crew would open the exit [i]if they can't see fire outside[/i].

Entirely possible they opened everything to start with then decided it was actually too dangerous on the "fire side".

Yep, exactly that. That's a fair description of how it spends most of its working life.

Yeah good point, all completely normal.
I'm surprised they even bothered to evacuate them. 🙄

I'd consider myself a 'frequent flyer'. I check where the exit is relevant to where I am sitting and check for life jacket, etc. It's a habit I've got into.

I usually only take a smallish bag for hand luggage and might be tempted to grab it as I get out, assuming my seat wasn't on fire, for no other reason than my blood tester is in it and it's pretty essential for making sure my insulin pump is working OK. I'd more than likely just take the meter in reality. Anyway, thanks to the professionalism of the staff involved, everybody got out, and that's the most important thing.

Personally I make a point of first noting which is really the closest and then second, counting the number of seats infront/behind I need to go before I get there.

+1

We have to do a 'safety moment' in each and every meeting, usually something relevant, occasionally something left of field. One guy told everyone to close their eyes, then talked about something else entirely, then got people to point as where they thought the meeting room door was (about 20% actually managed to point somewhere near it).

The message being, if you think about something else whilst the safety briefing's given, even in a room/plane you've been in before, do you actually know where the exit is? And could you find it in the pitch dark, after you've bumped into a load of other people who were asleep during the presentation?

We don't have any PW engined 777 at BA. 777-200 a mix of GE & RR, 777-300 are GE.

Boblo - absolutely nothing like the Manchester British Airtours disaster. Time was the biggest factor in that, and many other ground fire incidents. Trying to manoeuvre a large wide body aircraft to get it into wind enough to make a difference can take quite a while, and may need to leave the paved surface. This may also leave the slides off the side of the runway, making broken legs/ankles far more likely, and access for the emergency services more difficult.

......just calmly sauntering away.

Lolz, have you ever walked behind a standard non exercisey person on the stairs? They're ****ed half way up, most of 'em probably ran 10 metres then seen stars in their eyes from the effort!

Cant believe we're at page 2 of this thread already and no one's hinted at banning this sort of thing on safety/risk grounds. So here we go, lets ban engines on planes, lets ban anyone daring to overtake another vehicle on their way to the airport, in fact lets ban flights to Vegas full stop - far too risky!

On the subject of evacuating on the side of the fire and the turning the aircraft to blow the fire away, note that ATC didn't say the surface wind again. Not a critisicm, having had the odd emergency in ATC myself I can understand forgetting that.

Also echo dantsw13, going off the paved surface isn't a great move to make IMO as it causes far more issues than those you are already dealing with.

Having just seen the video for the first time , it also seems that doors 2L and 3L weren't opened, due to proximity of the fire, but 1L & 4L were. Spot on in the circumstances, under time pressure IMHO.

Great result, all walked away, beautifully handled.
I'm flying down to Heathrow later, I suspect passengers will obey the seat belt sign, switch phones off when told to and maybe even listen to the safety briefing. By tomorrow, it'll be business as usual.

Always, always listen to everything said during the safety briefing. I've witnessed brave cabin crew tapping passengers on the shoulder for not paying attention.

That footage of big bags being carried out is really quite shocking (as is how much you can actually get in as cabin baggage in first place...)

when told to and maybe even listen to the safety briefing. By tomorrow, it'll be business as usual.

I reckon you're right.

Personally, tomorrow I'll be settling into seat 1A and nursing a large G&T in preparation for my 10.5 hours enjoying the hospitality of the BA cabin crew

1A transatlantic Westbound?

Wrong side if it is! K is better as it's more out of the sun for looking at Greenland. 😉

Wrong side if it is! K is better as it's more out of the sun for looking at Greenland.

Seat numbers transatlantic?

Surely you just charter your own executive jet and can sit where you like?

For those flying frequently I'd highly recommend doing the [url= http://www.britishairways.com/en-us/baft/flight-safety-awareness/flight-safety-awareness ]BA flight safety awareness course[/url].

OK, so you have to pay, but it's an interesting experience and also reinforces how seriously they take flight safety.

Personally, [s]tomorrow[/s] [b]Sunday evening[/b] I'll be [s]settling into seat 1A and nursing a large G&T in preparation for my 10.5 hours enjoying the hospitality of the BA cabin crew[/s] [b]crammed into a clockwork Dash8 for the short hop to Southampton avec FlyBe staff offering a can of Coke. [/b]

FTFY

😕

Is it okay to punch people who are still on their phone as you taxi up the runway?

zippykona - Member

Is it okay to punch people who are still on their phone as you taxi up the runway?

Or strangle them with a shoe lace from behind ... ?

Or stab them with a pen in their eyes ... ?

😈