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Its not just poor form attempting to withhold deposit
Aye we talking bumming or renting? Confused.
Same thing apparently
If His Highness is "not pleased" can He at least be Merciful?
A lot of the SMETS1 meters can have the firmware updated by the original installer which then enables them to be enrolled with the centralised DCC system just like a SMETS2 meter and be switched between suppliers.
I didn't know that. Good to know, ta.
I think it is legitimate for a tenant to have a meter changed but no drop of plaster/brickwork may be spilled in installing it. There is a legal precedent for this: Shylock vs. Antonio.
Well, if this meter's so 'smart' why don't you ask it what you should do?
I think it is legitimate for a tenant to have a meter changed but no drop of plaster/brickwork may be spilled in installing it. There is a legal precedent for this: Shylock vs. Antonio.
Nice reference and there's a serious point there.
There's a software update that will make all SMETS1 meters have SMETS2 functionality sometime.
Funnily enough the date keeps slipping.
So is there any definitive way to figure out if you have SMETS1 or SMETS2?
We had ours fitted last year by EON and clearly remember the installer having to do a network search for the best signal which ended up being EE for us. Would that indicate it’s most likely SMETS2 based on an earlier comment regarding SIM cards?
Google search not overly helpful or I’m crap!
Just to add to the actual thread(!) if the install is anything like the one EON did for us beyond the issues of not mentioning I wouldn’t worry it was certainly neater than the original install from whenever.
As to another posters comment regarding elderly relatives turning things off when they see the cost. That’s exactly what one of our relatives has done even though for years she didn’t bat an eyelid. Nothing will now make her revert to her old relaxed behaviour. Personally I’d say for her it’s had a negative effect.
I've now got this in my head but with the words changed to "I'll bum your dog"
Of all the places I manage at work, the ones with smart meters are no different..
However I am against smart meters as I believe they will eventually create a two tier electricity supply, rich people can have power when they want and poor people can only have power at off peak times.
It's sold under the "conservative" concept of "choice" giving you the ability to "save money" which really means they charge like **** for everything and force the market to buy their shit products that they couldn't sell normally (ie electricity at 2am).
So when we help tenants to understand their choices in the energy market, we encourage them not to change to them. Lots of potential tenants ask are they installed and it does put some people off if they are installed.
However I am against smart meters as I believe they will eventually create a two tier electricity supply, rich people can have power when they want and poor people can only have power at off peak times.
Eh?
My smart meter only tells me what I'm using and have spent? Theres no economy 7 type arrangement going on?
It tells the utility company what you have spent and when. It is coming I promise you.
EG read this : https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3332254/
Last line of abstract "The smart meter will enable utilities to closely monitor electricity consumption in real-time, while also allowing households to adjust electricity consumption in response to real-time price adjustments."
If that does not make you concerned then best vote Farage and get a private healthcare system that will penalize the poor too.
Also read this
https://energy-democracy.org/smart-meter-the-german-sonderweg-at-a-crossroads/
SMETS2 is the current standard. It works with all suppliers.
If it’s an older SMETS1 it will still work as a old standard dumb meter with any supplier that doesn’t use that version of SMETS1 meter.
Nothing stops you swapping suppliers other than a contract you have signed with them and even that can be broken (though there may be some termination stuff - don’t know on that).
Very interesting 5plusn8, I’m glad I told the badgering **** from Ovo to sling his hook last time he called.
However I am against smart meters as I believe they will eventually create a two tier electricity supply, rich people can have power when they want and poor people can only have power at off peak times.
What complete nonsense. Nuclear power makes electricity so plentiful and cheap it's not worth even metering. It's true. I saw this on the telly in the 1960s.
Nuclear power makes electricity so plentiful and cheap it’s not worth even metering. It’s true. I saw this on the telly in the 1960s.
: )
I will not have a smart meter for this reason.
My smart meter only tells me what I’m using and have spent?
Thin end of the wedge innit.
Whilst being able to change suppliers multiple times per day is in theory a possibility (a colleague was having a nightmare figuring out the PKI issues with the certs needed for this...) I don't think that necessarily ends up with a dystopian world with only the rich being able to afford energy at peak times.
Firstly, what do you actually mean by rich and poor? There's a whole swathe of people in between, the truly poor already have problems affording utilities
Secondly, there's competition in the market place
Thirdly, things like EVs will start to impact what peak and off peak times are and smooth out demands
Finally - as vile as a lot of Tory policies are I really don't think think even they'd risk the backlash of large portions of the population being unable to afford electricity and gas during the day, I might be being a bit naive on that though...
My old flat had white meter, or whatever the cheaper nighttime rate was. Audible clunk as it kicked in followed by several washing machines starting. For the older lady downstairs it made a difference. So there's already acceptance of two tier affordabilty.
I'll post this again as you seem to have missed it.
“The smart meter will enable utilities to closely monitor electricity consumption in real-time, while also allowing households to adjust electricity consumption in response to real-time price adjustments.”
Translation, like the trains, uber and the stock market, when its in demand we will hike prices. Value will not be related to actual costs.
It will be like uber surge pricing and some people will not be able to cook dinner when it happens and will have to do it at 2am instead. It is no where near the same as the cheap elec that comes on a midnight in the olden days.
Firstly, what do you actually mean by rich and poor? There’s a whole swathe of people in between, the truly poor already have problems affording utilities
I mean most people, check this graph. Do see what it shows you, about 5% of people on less then 20k a year. After tax that really gives you **** all to live on. That is most people. You are here because you can a) afford the time to waste on a website, b) afford an audi and a smart bike. You are not most people.
What complete nonsense. Nuclear power makes electricity so plentiful and cheap it’s not worth even metering. It’s true. I saw this on the telly in the 1960s.
By 2020 we will all have mini nuclear reactors in our cellars. The whole smart meter thing is just a precursor to this and will enable electricity providers to monitor the reactor and - although this is unlikely - in the event of a nuclear breach, to simply shut it down with minimal fuss.
Post 5plusn8 is correct that it will create a two-tier customer structure, those soon to die from radiation sickness and those who are already dead. Remember those ancient Ready Brek ads. That's you, that is.
Finally – as vile as a lot of Tory policies are I really don’t think think even they’d risk the backlash of large portions of the population being unable to afford electricity and gas during the day, I might be being a bit naive on that though…
Ha ha ha ha etc
Missed the edit deadline - I meant 50% of people on less than 20k a year.
50 % may be on less than 20 k, but I'd be more interested in the average household income. 2 people living together on 20 k each is around 35k after tax.
Hardly on the breadline is it.
Seems reasonable to me that a landlord would be narked about having his walls drilled once a year
I'd expect them to be fitted to the same wires and hence not need new holes...?
You don't complain when they get their own broadband contract and change the router, do you? Or do you?
Go here and put in 40k total income, 2 adults 2 kids 1200 council tax. You are richer than 55% of the population.
Its about 740 a week after taxes.
With morts, bills etc. It doesn't go far.
https://www.ifs.org.uk/tools_and_resources/where_do_you_fit_in
You don’t complain when they get their own broadband contract and change the router, do you? Or do you?
Agreed its a spurious argument.
Er, I don't have a smart meter as I don't think it would save me any money, and although it's free to me I think it would have an environmental cost to manufacture and run it that would exceed its usefulness (as it wouldn't save me money).
But managing demand is a key way that current technology can allow renewables to provide a higher % of our power. Like EV's (which currently only a comfortable middle class household would manage to afford), the likelihood is that things like smart fridges etc, which only the comfortable middle class households could afford, would allow massaging of the demand to allow less surplus to be required. This is bound to be incentivised with lower bills, but unless we move to a socialist utopia overnight (where the smart fridges are given to those most needy of a new fridge rather than those with the means to buy one), then yes the poorest will fail to benefit.
This doesn't make smart meters evil, just capitalism. And the poor having smart meters installed won't be the problem.
Well said 5plus8
Its a lesson a few on here need to learn.
740 a week after taxes
740 after tax per week doesn't go far? Really? Sure you may not be driving round in a brand new Audi and going on flash holidays, but if you are struggling to get buy on 750 per week as a family, either you have massively overreached yourself on your mortgage or you are living well beyond your means.
Either way you shouldn't be having to scrimp on utility bills unless your money management is awful
I'm sure that should be £740 per month...
tp biker - for a family of four? Housing costs to come out of that and you will not be buying a house on that sort of money. £300 per week minimum for a 3 bed flat around here rental. Mortgage - not on that income
I don't really get why some people don't like smart meters. Someone comes along and says they would like to change my meter, it doesn't cost me anything, and allows me, with some suppliers to never have to read my meter again. I really dont see any downside. I can switch to any supplier I want and if the technology changes they will come again at no cost to me and change over the meter. Why would I care?
I think you are being totally irrational and should be thanking your tenant. It will actually look good for new tenants
I've just had an email telling me my energy bill has just gone up due to my smart meter. I shit you not.
They're watching me aren't they?!
I don't like them because of the cost that everyone will have to pay for them. I know that cost has been spent, but by not having one I feel just a very small bit better.
Go here and put in 40k total income, 2 adults 2 kids 1200 council tax. You are richer than 55% of the population.
Its about 740 a week after taxes.
With morts, bills etc. It doesn’t go far.
UR Boris Johnson AICM lower higher rate tax threshold!
I’d expect them to be fitted to the same wires and hence not need new holes…?
I think you might have forgotten something! 😀 😀 😀
You don’t complain when they get their own broadband contract and change the router, do you? Or do you?
In all the places I've rented in the unlikely event that I'd want to wall mount a router then I'd expect to have to make it all look good when I left or have a deduction from my deposit to make good. I've never had a router that could be wall mounted though. I'm pretty sure that's the standard for rental contracts. (In the event of a long tenancy a lot of that stuff is overlooked because the landlord expects to redecorate anyway but that's the legal position everywhere I've rented.)
Why would I care?
Dunno, but if you were looking for reasons to care you could start with the waste of sending a pair of working meters with years left in them to landfill/recycling and replacing with a new pair, one of which will be fitted with a lithium battery (lithium shouldn't be wasted IMHO for all the obvious reasons) plus a little bespoke screen thing that again is a needless waste of the planets resources and is presumably battery powered.
Not really an issue for me because I hate reading my meter more than I hate needlessly binning stuff but I can see why some people feel differently.
Not really relevant to this thread 'cos it's not a landlords job to make his other people reduce/reuse/recycle.
In my little bubble the main (only) reason stated for not having a smart meter is that everyone assumes meters are still SMETS1. If the suppliers publicized meters are now all SMETS2 I'd have though uptake would go through the ceiling.
Smart meters free? Paid via bills. Approx £474 per household. It will be many years, if ever, before any savings recoup that cost at the estimated saving of £18 per household per year. Madness.
Along with green electricity subsidies at £2500 per household in the next 5 years. No wonder electricity prices are going up.
About time someone mentioned this!
Also bum the dog too 🐩🍆
Sounds like you are getting worked up about something that has so little impact on your life.
People just need to chill out and realise what is actually important in life.