[Closed] Sold Wheels - Buyer not happy

Blimey. Two year old full carbons secondhand, and Ebay (China) ones?
Has he used carbon pads?
Why did he ride them if they were indeed buckled?
Any wobble should have been pointed out.
I guess as long as they were sold as seen and the auction was truthful, then he should have bought new.

Whatever you do you might as well refund as Ebay will almost always side with the buyer.

Carbon pads were used, as I supplied them.

Just to point out the defect is on the front wheel which was not buckled.

He's sent me a photo and it does look bad, problem is I sold it working fine!

Not on eBay, was through a forum, not this one though.

Just to point out the defect is on the front wheel which was not buckled.
He's sent me a photo and it does look bad, problem is I sold it working fine!
Not on eBay, was through a forum, not this one though.

He's used them. They are his.

So He's damaged them the first time he's used them and now wants his money back ??

time to tell him where to go, they were fine when sold and he must have been happy with them to fit them and use them.

sounds to me like he never used the pads you sent, prob put them on for a quick ride ''it will be ok ill fit them later'' and now the price has been paid

but such a hard one to call 🙁

I reckon he had a set of identical wheels that had the problems you've described, he's bought yours and wants to send you his back to you claiming that there the ones you sold him.

How long had he had them before he complained?

wot tymbian said, I reckon

can you really melt a rim by using the wrong pads ?

You can melt a rim using the right pads!
[img] [/img]
Carbon resins used in rims melt at 300-400 degrees.

in the UK in April ?

Can we see pics ...I agree that he should not have used them if not happy .tell him that and had he not used them he would have his money back

Carbon resins used in rims melt at 300-400 degrees.

I know the sun was out today but I didn't think it was that warm.

I was in short sleeves so it must have been pretty warm 8)
Though my carbon rims survived stopping 86kg of me from 50mph in a hurry today (@+#?/ caravans 👿 )

Tell him to dry his eyes. They weren't sold with a warranty.

I've ridden with a guy who dragged his brakes all the way down Alp d'Huez and at the bottom his tyres fell off as the Alu rims got so hot that the glue holding the kevlar bead in place melted and the tyre separated from the bead.

Personally I'd go down the partial refund path and try and reach an agreement - depending on how much he had paid you. If it was 50 quid or something I might tell him just to do one, but for more substantial amounts I'd feel bad at his situation. Just depends how you feel I guess.

Although I'd try to make certain that what Tymbian says is not going on. For sure there are some parasites out there who would do something like that.

Thanks for the replies guys, ill upload some pics when I'm home.

I already offered a partial refund but he wasn't interested.

If he has used them, they are his.

Tell him to **** off. He's ****ed the rims, tough shit.

If your story is true, then simple email telling him to **** right off is the order of the day.

Picture attached:
[IMG] [/IMG]

I agree with the replies that if he rode them, they are his! After all I guess he could have done anything on the ride. It's just very annoying that I had been using them with no issues at all.

Think I need to send an email to him. Just want to do the right thing tbh.

[IMG] [/IMG]

were they like that when he received them i.e. damaged before you sent them or in transit? If no and no, then he's buggered them. In which case, tell him to go away.

If they arrived in that condition, why on earth did he use them? Again, I'd be inclined to tell him to go away as he's accepted and used them in that condition.

Incidently, how long between sale and complaint?

he was just riding along , pushed the brakes and the rim went like that ?

no way he could have fitted the wheel to his bike in this condition .

maybe he hit a hole on the road ? plenty of them at the moment .

After seeing pics 100% f@#k him off...he's playing games.

To confirm wheel was in 100% working order when sold and I had been riding on them just the day before, no issues.

I sold the wheels and posted on 8th April. I did however send the pads on Monday 15th, as I forget to originally include these.

You do not legally have to refund him. It wasn't a business transaction.

I'd tell him to F right off. I'm guessing you're not some jerkoff that intentionally sells dodgy goods, if that's you it's pretty poor on your part. However, as you've said above they were pretty much spot on before you sold them, he's either ****ed a pair he originally owned and done the old switcheroo or he can't ride for sh*t and has melted them.

Tell him to take you to court if he wants to, otherwise spin your junk around and shove it right up.

Probably wise to not use that verbatim.

Absolutely Jon, never set out to rip him off in anyway, and like to think I'm honest and decent.

From his point of view yes I'd be annoyed, but the fact he's ridden them means anything could have happened. I can't be responsible for how somebody rides.

If you received wheels in that condition you'ld be on the phone right away and not even fit them. Offer parti refund for the rear wheel only as it did have a small buckle that you didn't disclose. Otherwise he had to do one as something's not right.

As others have said, there is no way that could happen on the bike.
It looks more like someone has stood on it, even the inner rim looks buckled!
If someone hasn't stood on it (most likely), then he's maybe left it laying against something very hot.

I have seen quite a few damaged carbon wheels and I would never believe that braking or hitting a pothole could do that.
Wouldn't surprise me if he dropped a dumbbell on it!

sold as seen.. mtfu and tell him to skip along..

tell him no

he fitted them and fudged them himself.

second hand stuff may break, and it sounds as if them used the incorrectly.

if you want a warranty, pay full price for new ones!

Pretty much agree with everyone else. He bought them second hand. Sometimes second hand stuff goes wrong very quickly, it's the risk you take for cheaper kit.

I also agree that he's probably either trying to take the p*ss, or a numpty.

Surely you have pics that were taken just before the sale that prove the rim was in good condition?

Aye, wot funky just said.

Might even be able to spot some differences to identify whether they are different wheels.

Did you make him very aware to use the correct pads?

Did he admit to using different ones?

Ask him to clarify.

'A ride'. 50miles of brake use/ride and an admission would absolve my conscience. You cant give a guarantee on peoples actions.

I reckon thats been on a bike rack and hung in front of the exhaust?

Sweet Jesus those pics look awful!

If you can honestly, 100%, hand on heart, say they were fine when you sold them then the buyer has ****ed them and that is his fault. However, you do acknowledge the rear rim was buckled beforehand and that wasn't disclosed to the buyer.

In your shoes I'd refund 50/50. He's ****ed the front wheel, you ****ed the rear one.

I reckon thats been on a bike rack and hung in front of the exhaust?

I think you might have something there. There's no soot on it, but it sure looks like a localised area got warm

If you part-refund him please do so in entirely 1p's..

It's moments like this which really put me off using eBay

Skint student (awful Sofa, garish carpet, generally untidyness). Bought posh wheels, screwed them & now wants his cash back.

Tell him firmly no. Wheels were posted as good, received & inspected as good, then rejected after being ridden god knows how many miles, in god knows what conditions, with god knows what pads, fitted by god knows who, checked by god knows....etc, etc.

Too many god knows.
Tell him that on reflection you are not prepared to refund.

Hitting a pothole normally chips the rim, seen plenty of carbon wheels damaged that way road racing. The way it has just warped, rather than cracked looks likes over heating to me. However, that's the first warped carbon wheel I've ever seen!

If he's ridden them he's accepted them. Tell him to do one, he's being a chancer.

Ive got to say I agree If i bought something second hand and I broke it i wouldnt dare ask for a refund! cheeky so and so tell him to jog on 😛

This is what hitting a pothole at 30mph in a road race does to a £2000 carbon wheel:

[url= http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8541/8667988830_645fcce323.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8541/8667988830_645fcce323.jp g"/> [/img][/url]
[url= http://www.flickr.com/photos/brf/8667988830/ ]Pothole damage to Lightweight carbon wheel[/url] by [url= http://www.flickr.com/people/brf/ ]brf[/url], on Flickr

Thanks for all the replies. I've sent him an email saying I'm not willing to refund however as a good will gesture ill give him £20 to sort the minor buckle.

Ill update when I get a reply...

Bit of an update...

I gave the chap £20 partial refund for the issue he had with the rear wheels. He thanked me and that was that.

Got an email this morning saying he is now opening an official Paypal dispute and wants a FULL refund.

Don't know what Paypal will make of this?

Paypal would (should) side with you providing you have an admission via e-mail that he has ridden the wheels.

I know the whole 'side with the buyer' thing is generally true, but from reasonable experience, stick to:

- He rode them, he would not have been able to ride them if they were like that when they arrived (point out factually, why would he even try?)

- It's not possible to warp carbon like that though normal use, wear and tear or structural failure.

Keep totally factual - avoid any accusations, just stick to reasons why it is not possible.

Best of luck.

Thanks. 100% agree with sticking to facts and the truth. I have submitted my reply via Paypal so will see what they say.

Also the fact the formal dispute has only just been opened should be in my favour?

Also, could acceptance of the partial refund be taken as having reached a settlement? I would certainly see it as such.

I'd be withdrawing any money from your account and cancelling your direct debit with them as a safeguard

V8 - That was my thought.

Tom - No funds in my PP account, but it is linked to my debit card. Although my PP balance is now minus £217!! I guess it will be until the dispute is resolved?

I'd be withdrawing any money from your account and cancelling your direct debit with them as a safeguard

That's what I'd do. Easy enough to never use that account again and open another one.

And if they won't let you unlink your debit card from your account, call your bank and cancel it saying you've lost it.

Sadly it seems that Paypal have a nasty habit of siding with the scammers and stiffing the honest users.

Buyer in Leeds?

thats fubar.

never seen a carbon rim that bad , thats seen some heat.

Yes, call your bank and tell them to stop any Paypal direct debits until you tell them otherwise. I've done this a couple of times, just explained I had problems with a dodgy buyer and they (coop bank) were fine with it. Just a phone call later to reinstate it again.

[i]No funds in my PP account, but it is linked to my debit card.[/i]

Why in gods name would anyone link their PP account to a debit card, that comes straight out of a bank account?

I use PayPal for quite a lot of online stuff and its very useful and quick. Ill ring the bank tomorrow

Paypal are like a bank but not governed in the same way so denying them payment will see them pursue you very nastily through the courts to get their money, at very least they will screw your credit rating.

I had an issue selling a set of CK hubed wheels, they had a little run out but hardly anything but were only 6 months old with light use, the guy was not happy so as you did I refunded the cost of a wheel re-truing and he was very happy with that.

Your guy seems like a joker who toasted his rim with the wrong pads, as has been said stick with the facts, you could not mount a tyre to that and not notice it

Good luck

Thanks Feisty. I'll update when I get a response from Paypal.

notmyrealname - Member

Sadly it seems that Paypal have a nasty habit of siding with the scammers and stiffing the honest users.

So people say- I've had a load of fraudulent claims against me and paypal knocked them all back. It's sometimes difficult to jump through the right hoops though.

Blatant false claim. He broke them, he needs to take responsibility. Fact is he accepted them "as is".

I sold a bike the other week and made the new owner sign a printout of images of it with "sold as seen" in his own handwriting, to protect me against this. Here's the very problem we face with online sales - it's hard to force someone's hand to do that.

That's not a bad idea Andy. I've sold and bought a lot of SH stuff online and never had an issue, got to admit this has really put me off. Which is a shame.

I went throgh a very similar process with an eBay buyer, in the end Ebay and PayPal were brilliant through the dispute process.

Buyer bought my lense, after a few weeks said "I've used it a few times now its broken". I pointed out it worked fine when I sent it, but perhaps damage in transit so offered to assist pursuit of an insurance claim with the courier. He declined and accused me of beig a fraudster blah blah, he opened the dispute. eBay found in my favour in the end, no doubt my polite manner and offers of assistance had helped, whilst his conduct never looked good.

Keep your conversations inside the eBay messaging system, don't use private mail.

Good to hear that Goldfish. Unfortunately the sale was not on Ebay, but another bike forum.

I have a record of our conversation through the forum, and now any more communication will be just through Paypal. Really do hope Paypal can see my side of the story! As I really don't want to be £225 out of pocket!