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Disgusted and worried by a short exposure to LBC just now
A) Grant Shapps; It’s Putin fault and and fortunately this is the price of freedom that we all need to pay. Change to LEDs, and don’t worry we are trying to cap bus fares at £2. What a ****er.
B) A global industry expert - this issue will not be resolved before 3-5 years if Putin stopped his war and reopened gas supplies today. The emergency will go away. But the demand issue and high prices will mirror over that period what we are seeing for fuel, a slow trickle down to a higher base. Holy crap.
Basically, whichever right wing **** gets picked, we’re screwed anyway. And I’m not entirely sure that things would be much better if Labour magically got in, as Sir K S has refused to consider closer ties with Europe. Not that I’m entirely certain that rebuilding a relationship with Europe would help much, but it would go some way to relieving some issues.
The same Europe / EU that are in process of agreeing a unilateral cap on Gas pricing for personal use and for electricity generation for all member states?
We're about to be the mugs of the world... again.
We’re about to be the mugs of the world… again.
Possibly not as the wholesale gas prices are currently falling as a result of the EU action. We may benefit from our neighbours concerted action. Source
20%! Thats good news - if it gets passed on.
This BBC video shows how detached from reality some of the Tory members are. Not one mention of the energy, cost of living or climate crises.. or Ukraine
Is there a chance here that Joris is cementing his legacy by doing an Alex Ferguson? AKA a Terry Leahy.
By choosing a successor who has few cards to play, and who may be considered something of a lame duck, he suddenly seems so much... better.
Where might that lead? Well, Winston Churchill got re-elected after being ousted, so maybe he's got half a braincell focused on that.
Or as Rory Stewart more accurately referred to it at the weekend 'Doing a Berlesconi'. Someone he's repeatedly compared him to in the past
You have to admit that he's played a blinder on that score if that's his plan. And you just know that as he stews and sulks at a Chequers, indulging his Churchill delusions and manufactured grievances that it probably is
He used Brexit to purge the Tory party of anyone remotely sane, leaving only rabid right-wing fruit loops on the backbenches and thick-as-mince nodding dogs in cabinet.
Everyone knows Sunak (probably as sane as you can be in BlueKIP) had no chance and Truss, out of her depth on a wet pavement, is going to be an absolute disaster as she's totally devoid of ideas, intelligence, empathy and so much more.
Matthew Parris was probably fairly accurate in the Times today...
"An over inflated bubble of misplaced confidence and ambition balancing on a pin head of intelligence and self awareness."
https://twitter.com/algy04/status/1560915782963535872?s=20&t=48ewQLfdqpTklfFE8CkIlw
Yup poor Liz truss will have to go to country she was just heaping shit onto it's democratically elected leader as her first job.
Too trolling I salute you my queen.
@Binners - Did you go to Manchester last night and if you did, how was it?
It was a very interesting evening. It was packed and they had to broadcast it on screens outside to thousands of people, which was encouraging
I think what was refreshing was the mix of speakers. A few union leaders who would be considered to the left of the party, then Andy Burnham and a couple of others who would be considered centrists. All vocalising that they understand what's coming, which is a lot more than we've had from our hopeless government
So I live in hope that the upcoming crisis may be of a big enough magnitude to unify the Labour Party and get both sides to unite in opposition to the real enemy...
The Judean Peoples Front!! bloody Tory's!
😀
If you want to sign up for info, they're here
It was a very interesting evening. It was packed and they had to broadcast it on screens outside to thousands of people, which was encouraging
So I live in hope that the upcoming crisis may be of a big enough magnitude to unify the Labour Party and get both sides to unite in opposition to the real enemy…
It's interesting that it didn't make it on the BBC Manchester news page!
I only heard about it on Twitter.
It’s interesting that it didn’t make it on the BBC Manchester news page!
The BBC only ever reports protests and demonstrations if they turn into riots. Then they get on their high horse and do the whole 'violent lefty/anarchist mob, enemy of the people blah blah' thing. Something tells me they're going to be busy in the next few months.
Something tells me they’re going to be busy in the next few months.
Can you share your plans with us? Or is it too early?
If it doesnt kick off soon it wont happen until next summer, people dont riot when its cold and wet.
If it doesnt kick off soon it wont happen until next summer, people dont riot when its cold and wet.
Depends, if your house is cold then I imagine some flaming torches and pitchfork's looks like an appealing activity.
Someone on Radio4 earlier said that working at home was going to cost a lot more than commuting, so go to the office this winter. It's cheaper than heating your own house
Someone on Radio4 earlier said that working at home was going to cost a lot more than commuting, so go to the office this winter. It’s cheaper than heating your own house
Dont you think employers will catch onto this premise of them footing an increasing bill and doing something about it? I can foresee so arguments about offices closure vs WFH vs “I want a WfH allowance if Im told I can’t come to the office”
Oh wow, suddenly I can see the 4d chess game being played!
Let all the small/local independent takeaways, cafes and coffee shops fail due to energy bills.
At the same time make it more appealing to go into office more often to reduce energy bills, back into the grasping hands of all the remaining Prets, Greggs and McD's still standing.
The local takeaways in our village (technically 'toon' 😎) are barely open 5 days a week as it is, soon I'll be commuting in just because I fancy a chippy!
This BBC video shows how detached from reality some of the Tory members are. Not one mention of the energy, cost of living or climate crises.. or Ukraine
I showed that clip earlier to my mum, her very sweary response followed by string the ***** up would get me a quick ban if I repeated it word for word.
They really are delusional if they think either of those two ****tards can unite the country
AKA a Terry Leahy
Some proper insider info there 😉
so go to the office this winter. It’s cheaper than heating your own house
Well. Our office used to be 3 floors, now closed down to 1 floor and canteen, ancillary areas on ground floor as 60% of folks WFH. I, for one, will commute to the office if bills get daft as I have a zero/minimal commute cost as I can cycle or walk.
This morning's Tory topic of the public conscience: Smart Motorways. And excitement of removing the green levy.
Do **** off.
It works though - lots of clapping. Fruit loops.
Evidence that the right has no good answers to anything important or remotely complex.
Just listening to the R6 news where they had a clip of someone (member of public) who said they preferred Liz because she seams more stable - I actually laughed out loud - we have no hope if your average tory voter thinks she's more stable
Well. Our office used to be 3 floors, now closed down to 1 floor and canteen
The office I go to when I go in (which was never regularly) used to have a big canteen with loads of food options. Since it re-opened though they only have a skeleton staff that makes sandwiches. Shame, in some ways, but people are WFH.
Spend 150billion+ now or face collapse. The only topic in town.
This morning’s Tory topic of the public conscience: Smart Motorways.
Do **** off.
To be fair, (and I can't quite believe I just wrote that in a thread about the Tories) I think this was just part of an answer at last nights hustings that has been reported by the media, and not a major policy announcement.
To be fair, (and I can’t quite believe I just wrote that in a thread about the Tories) I think this was just part of an answer at last nights hustings that has been reported by the media, and not a major policy announcement.
But that's its purpose to distract and wind folk up, especially those that can afford a good living.
They know what they're doing with stuff like this.
It's capital punishment day next.
Hanging it's to good for them ECT ECT.
Maybe it's tighter than the bookies have it.
How often do the bookies get it wrong?
I live in hope that the crap they're spouting at the moment is just to get the votes off the Tory members. And that there'll be some more sensible dialogue once they're elected in.
I mean, I don't truly believe that, but one has to have hope...
I live in hope that the crap they’re spouting at the moment is just to get the votes off the Tory members. And that there’ll be some more sensible dialogue once they’re elected in.
I still remember the people who said 'Oh, Trump will change once he's elected, and he actually has to govern. He'll become more presidential.'.
The more Thick Lizzie makes commitments now, the quicker her leadership collapses and hopefully we get a GE in the middle of the Winter Of Our Discontent.
Truss, out of her depth on a wet pavement, is going to be an absolute disaster as she’s totally devoid of ideas, intelligence, empathy and so much more.
Perfect front for the ERG then.
What are the odds on the entire cabinet and senior positions being all ERG members?
She's already said that she intends to appoint Iain Duncan Smith and *shudders* John Redwood to cabinet positions as well as *checks notes* Suella Braverman as Home Secretary and Kwasi Kwartang as Chancellor
In a few months time we'll be fondly looking back at the gang of useless imbeciles presently around the cabinet table as a golden age of political stability and bold, decisive, forward-thinking leadership
The ERG Brexiteer Nutjobs will tell Lizzie to jump and she'll ask how high.
First thing in Lizzies intray: Dump NI protocol and start a trade war with the EU
In a few months time we’ll be fondly looking back at the gang of useless imbeciles presently around the cabinet table as a golden age of political stability and bold, decisive, forward-thinking leadership
I've thought that with each incarnation of the Prime Minister. Surely this one can't be as bad as the last...?
Oh they're worse.
You're right, this country is going to be utterly, potentially irrevocably, screwed after a year of a Truss Government.
Still not sure how much of the batshit mental mess of words coming out of her mouth is actual policy or simply some form of early AI trying to learn question / response type stuff.
What are the odds on the entire cabinet and senior positions being all ERG members?
Under the UK PM system, they don't need to actually do the job, the PM controls the Cabinet.
live in hope that the crap they’re spouting at the moment is just to get the votes off the Tory members. And that there’ll be some more sensible dialogue once they’re elected in.
I mean, I don’t truly believe that, but one has to have hope…
I think there is truth to that.
The battle the right have got on their hands is the country needs left-wing solutions - so ahem - they're taking an accelerated version of the Starmer approach which is to wow your team with Express and Mail type disgust and then probably do some other unrelated stuff when they take power. This sort of campaigning is de rigueur.
The other stuff is my concern but I'm largely ignoring all hustings - because when they actually sit down and look at the state of things they will have to do lots of things they don't want to.
Looking back Johnson's biggest single issue was he was an actor out of his depth - and actually did very little. I suppose that's small state for you. I do think Truss will do things.
This is not to say she will do the right things or be competent...
I can't see how this Government is going to survive the winter.
The hustings are absolutely insane, she just anything that get the racist pensioners clapping.
Last night, when asked about removing motorway speed limits, she said she would consider it.
because when they actually sit down and look at the state of things they will have to do lots of things they don’t want to.
This. Truss is the same as Johnson and is driven by blind ambition and narcissism. She has no ideology beyond saying and doing whatever it takes to win and maintain power. When the civil servants sit her down and soberly describe the consequences of her idiotic economic policies she will lose her nerve and do what Johnson did and execute a massive bailout. Or maybe she won't and she'll be gone by the spring as the population revolts and the cities burn. It's a pretty simple choice.
Or maybe she won’t and she’ll be gone by the spring as the population revolts and the cities burn.
Isn't that the prelude to The Hunger Games...?
Last night, when asked about removing motorway speed limits, she said she would consider it.
To be fair to her, that's surely the standard reply by any parent to their children's requests 😀
Handily, Boris has just made Lizzie's life a bit easier by solving the energy crisis
https://twitter.com/AdamBienkov/status/1565303365508251648?s=20&t=1jB-b4c3UCwlvMr0yXYk2A
He's right you know.
Last night, when asked about removing motorway speed limits, she said she would consider it.
Whoa! I'm not a racist pensioner but she's got my vote 😉
And unlike the racist pensioners I'll actually take advantage of it - or more exactly, it'll mean I'm driving at legal speeds now.
Not overly useful though who cant get a friendly donor to handle the upfront cost. Back to vimes boots theory.
Handily, Boris has just made Lizzie’s life a bit easier by solving the energy crisis
He's made me want to go back to school to learn everything again just in case I've missed something.
Where to start...
Given kettles are so simple, and efficient in terms of energy - and assuming they're not covered in limescale then I'm calling nonsense on a new kettle over an old one. (What's an old one?)
And on top of that at least ArTICUlatE your point properly.
And on top of that - £10 a year not really enough is it?
Tories - save the pennies ... and you will still have pennies.
"Isn’t that the prelude to The Hunger Games…?"
We're on season 2 already.
"soon I’ll be commuting in just because I fancy a chippy!"
You'll be better off investing in your own fishing rod.
"I still remember the people who said ‘Oh, Trump will change once he’s elected, and he actually has to govern. He’ll become more presidential.’"
That'd be the Spectator, who greeted the Trump 2016 victory with an editorial entitled:
"Why a Donald Trump presidency won't be as bad as you think"
Don't bother going looking for it in the Spectator archive though, they redacted the article on January 7th last year.
Given kettles are so simple, and efficient in terms of energy – and assuming they’re not covered in limescale then I’m calling nonsense on a new kettle over an old one. (What’s an old one?)
There must be a very minor difference between say an old metal one and a new plastic one perhaps?
It's a bit like when British Gas say "could* save you £20,000 a year compared to your old boiler", or when Specialized claims their latest socks can save you 5 seconds in a timetrial**.
*calculation assumes exiting boiler is coal fired and does not take into account any redundancy payment to the stoker.
** old socks must be novelty items worn on your ears along with pencils up the nostrils in an attempt to get out of the war, whilst riding at a speed that would trouble Doc in his Delorean.
Given kettles are so simple, and efficient in terms of energy – and assuming they’re not covered in limescale then I’m calling nonsense on a new kettle over an old one.
I believe heating elements become less efficient as they get older. And this also true of immersion heaters.
So Johnson takes a swipe at the two contenders to replace him.
Liz Truss:
"Tell everybody who thinks hydrocarbons are the only answer and we should get fracking and all that: offshore wind is now the cheapest form of electricity in this country … Of course it’s entirely clean and green.”
Rishi Sunak:
After being accused by Rishi Sunak of ignoring the harms of lockdown during the Covid pandemic, Johnson said the criticism that it had caused the huge backlog of NHS surgery was an “inversion of logic”.
Instead, he said, the opposite was the case; if the three national lockdowns had not been ordered, the NHS would be in an “even worse” position.
****! I agree with Johnson on two points.
He’s right you know.
As usual, he's not.
CBA with going into reasons.
I believe heating elements become less efficient as they get older. And this also true of immersion heaters.
They remain 100% efficient until the moment of failure.
They remain 100% efficient until the moment of failure.
I am fairly certain that isn't true.
The heating element is in the bottom of the tank. It slowly gets burried in calcium carbonate sediment. The water is heated more slowly because of the insulation provided by the sediment and the sediment gets very hot leading to higher heat loss from the bottom of the tank and the pipework than without sediment. The resistance is still 100% efficient but the tank loses more heat for a given water temperature at the tap.
I believe that constant and significant changes in temperature affects the properties of metals and their conductivity/resistance, but its not a subject which I have any expertise on so don't ask me to explain it.
Plenty on stw will undoubtedly have the expertise but whether they bother to click on political threads is another matter.
I believe that constant and significant changes in temperature affects the properties of metals and their conductivity/resistance,
In which case it might work at a lower wattage so not heat as quickly but it'll still be 100% efficient in terms of converting electrical energy into heat. There's nowhere else for the energy to go.
So an older heating element will use the same amount of electricity but over a longer period of time - everyday's a school day!
Although presumably there is a constant amount of heat loss so the longer time it takes to reach a desired temperature the greater the total heat loss. Not that I imagine it would be a problem in the case of electric kettles
.
So some old boiler is going to be our next PM?
Immersion heaters? Is it 1975?
Are you now going to have an argument about the best 4 star petrol to put in your Allegro?
Well if you read the thread carefully you will probably be able to see that there isn't an argument concerning immersion heaters, only whether heating elements become less efficient with time.
And dispite your bizarre out of touch Tory politician type dismissive comment, suggesting that this isn't 1975, millions of people in the UK currently rely on immersion heaters to provide them with hot water.
Oh. Ok comrade. I thought it was a thread about the Tory leadership, but apparently it’s now about the relative merits of electrical heating elements
A heating element will become less efficient as it furs up, this is why boilers need cleaning and water treatment. A totally furred up kettle will take longer to heat up and use more energy to do so (as the scale has a higher thermal resistance). Typically the worse the scaling gets the higher the likelihood of failure (be that heating element of boiler tube) since it can't shed the heat generated quick enough.
So yes, he is correct.
And dispite your bizarre out of touch Tory politician type dismissive comment, suggesting that this isn’t 1975, millions of people in the UK currently rely on immersion heaters to provide them with hot water.
My father in law being one of them. As an aside, I'm not sure how else to heat up a tank with solar PV either.
A heating element will become less efficient as it furs up
In which case a sachet of descalar would be just as effective and rather cheaper.
There does seem to be a case that fast boiling kettles are more effective than slower ones but thats not really the argument he was making as you can have slow boiling new ones.
Plus the claim about how much it saves seems to have been pulled out of his arse.
Oh. Ok comrade. I thought it was a thread about the Tory leadership
So why aren't you talking about the Tory leadership instead of rabbiting on about 4 star petrol and Allegros?
Which even more off topic than how to deal with rising energy bills and what provisions people use for hot water.
Plus the claim about how much it saves seems to have been pulled out of his arse.
According to an article that I read in the Guardian an electric kettle typically represents 6% of a household's energy bill, iirc more than an oven, which surprised me a little.
Could you give us a rundown of the what proportion of energy use other household appliances represent comrade?
It’s fascinating
Do Rishi or Liz have a favourite?
I’m going to go for
Rishi - Hot tub
Lizzie - Fondue set
Could you give us a rundown of the what proportion of energy use other household appliances represent comrade?
It’s fascinating
Well you need to thank whoever it was who posted that clip with Johnson talking about electric kettles.
Personally I think my post concerning Johnson's swipe at the two Tory leadership contenders is far more fascinating. Have you got an opinion on that?
Perhaps you missed it in your rush to find something to get worked up about, so here it is again:
So Johnson takes a swipe at the two contenders to replace him.
Liz Truss:
“Tell everybody who thinks hydrocarbons are the only answer and we should get fracking and all that: offshore wind is now the cheapest form of electricity in this country … Of course it’s entirely clean and green.”
Rishi Sunak:
After being accused by Rishi Sunak of ignoring the harms of lockdown during the Covid pandemic, Johnson said the criticism that it had caused the huge backlog of NHS surgery was an “inversion of logic”.
Instead, he said, the opposite was the case; if the three national lockdowns had not been ordered, the NHS would be in an “even worse” position.
Hey, Binners, I like reading your contributions but here you're playing the man not the ball. Well done for playing straight in the face of provocation, Ernie.
Edit: I found your quotes and the links interesting, Ernie. If Starmer had come out with those quotes I'd have applauded - finally some conviction! And I agree with Boris on those two points.
Well you need to thank whoever it was who posted that clip with Johnson talking about electric kettles.
LOL! I've just checked who posted that clip and suprise suprise it was you!
You really are a muppet mate! 😁
Rishi – Hot tub
He thinks a tad larger than that. According to his local rag builders are busy with a new indoor swimming pool plus hot tub.
Nothing says ‘man of the people’ like installing a swimming pool at the height of an energy crisis, that’ll probably cost more to heat than most households annual income.
He’s not learnt much, has he?
Though I do get the feeling that Liz is waiting in the wings saying ‘hold my pint bolly’. She does like her private planes, after all
That electric kettle crap from johnson...
What the actual ****?
Did he skip science class at school?
I know he did history in uni so I'm guessing maths and science are not his strong point..
****ing hell.
It takes a specific amount of energy to heat 1 litre of water from say 15c to 100c.
What he should have said is only boil enough water that you are going to use.. Like 1 cups worth or 2 cups worth.
I'm guessing he's one of those that puts 3 liters of water into the kettle and then wonders why it takes so long to get hot ;/
Your fuel bills are going to exceed your wage. Don't worry, buy a new kettle.
We're beyond parody.
What's a wage?
It’s what, if you’re lucky, you used to be able to live on
She does like her private planes, after all
Doing her best to get the G7 upgraded to G6.
and use more energy to do so (as the scale has a higher thermal resistance)
Nope.
You've fallen into the kettle trap; whether that was expertly set or daft to use it as an analogy, that's all it was, an analogy. Not even Boris is stupid enough to suggest a £10 pa saving is the solution to the crisis, and if we all say that it is there's an easy rebound coming for the tories. Actually what he said is to be welcomed, not vilified. Play the ball, not the man.
If you look at the full clip, he actually was announcing £700M for a new nuclear plant, which sounds like a lot right now but if it reduces your costs and reliance on gas in the longer run..... it's a bit like (see where this is going) spending £20 on a kettle that'll save you £10 per year.
Very selective editing by the MSM, I'm afraid.
(obscure link, but the MSM pointing this out are the Mail and Express and don't want to link them)
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/no-boris-johnson-didnt-buy-143939836.html