Just been reading about smart TRV's as they're the last practical step we can take on the house.
Put off by stories of the noise, they would have to be in bedrooms to make the investment worthwhile. We're both light sleepers though, any experience of being woken at 5:30 by the smart TRV coming on?
That’s what I’m going for but ideally, how modern do you mean? Mine is nearly 15 years old now.
I can't recall when they became mandatory via building regs. I remember first buying one when our old pump died, before they were mandatory - maybe 15 years ago.
The sensing ones normally have a little bank of LEDs on them to indicate the pumping strength eg look at this one https://www.amazon.co.uk/Grundfos-UPS2-15-50-Central-Heating/dp/B00XEU7J5C - three little LEDs on the edge of it.
I am in Spain paying c 15c per kwh off peak, 20c peak fixed for next 3 years. Pure luck I fixed at right time. Current variable rates are about 25c I think. With a bit of planning i can get 75% consumption into off peak - dishwasher on timer, cooking before midday.
Standing charges are fairer as you pay for the kWh amount you need, so you look at peak kWh consumption and contract for that plus a bit. So small flats pay much less than big houses.
Probably already covered in this thread but the boss of British gas seemed to make a very sound and logical suggestion. Loan the energy providers the cash to buy electricity and gas from the energy companies, and keep bills down for the end user. The loan would be paid back by a gradual increase in fuel bills over the next 20 years, rather than crippling us over next 12-24 months
Possibly too sensible a suggestion for the clowns in charge however.
I foresee the only people this government will help out is their pensioner voter base, many of which don’t need assistance. Whilst everyone else will be shafted.
The loan would be paid back by a gradual increase in fuel bills over the next 20 years
Great so we're saddled with increased bills for the next 20 years. What happens when this happens again, and it will, keep adding to the debt, no thanks.
8900kWh in electricity and 900kWh in gas for last 12 months but a hybrid car accounted for 3100kWh of the electricity usage.
I'm now wondering if it would be cheaper just to run the car on petrol!!! 🤣🤣🤣
30,000kWH of gas and 12,000kwH of electricity imported for the last 12 months. 2EVs in the house and Solar on the roof. Don’t dare look what the cost will be based on new rates 😳
So, is it true that wholesale gas prices are now falling?
@molgrips it sounds like you have exactly the same setup as I do, dumb TRV's in every room except the hallway. I have the Wiser system (still to install) and looking to do the same.
My (future) setup is thus:
3x TRVs controlled by Wiser Thermostat in the living room (legacy hangover of knocking 2 rooms into one).
Both bedrooms and bathroom controlled by their own TRVs.
Kitchen has a wet kickplate heater, it does it's own thing but essentially it's another bypass.
Hall has no TRV but for the amount of difference it will make I'll live with it (ie. am I **** messing about draining the system to fit a new TRV. Plus the dog sleeps out there so it doesn't hurt to keep it warm). Hall also has the front door which would play havoc with controls, in an ideal world I'd have a porch as a buffer.
As for lockshields, with smart TRVs are they not redundant since in theory you would never be running the whole system at the same time?
@oldnpastit Maybe? Too early to tell I'd say.
Currently living on solar power electric and tank water, with the insurance company paying the rent that we’re keeping. Admittedly the house doesn’t have any internal walls so it’s not all that great.
Hiya Guys,
For many with wood burners, look to see if you can fit a back boiler to yours. It then potentially heat the whole house whilst your wood burner is running. See my wood burner back boiler add on below as an example:
This is my plan anyway. I also plan Solar and wind power because in 2011 they changed the rules for wind power for domestic use i.e. it come under permissive development providing you have one. Some of them are able to produce a fair bit of power i.e. 5Kw. Just note the permissive development only applies to England and not Scotland for some reason.
BR
JeZ
Ooh my Nan and Gramps used to have a back boiler on their coal fire. They had to come down and light it in the morning to get the house warmed and get hot water. I can still remember them doing that, as clear as day.
Great so we’re saddled with increased bills for the next 20 years. What happens when this happens again, and it will, keep adding to the debt, no thanks.
Shareholders still get paid yeah?
And people think this is a good idea? FFS can you not see the narrative of ‘we have to get through this’ ‘it’s going to be tough’ ’the wholesale price has skyrocketed’ is to con you into thinking it’s all on you the customer while the profits/dividends/executive pay reach record highs?
being bailed out with your (taxpayers) money and asked to pay for it with higher bills in the future??
i’m starting to think some of you actually deserve what’s coming, talk about boiling frogs.
talk about boiling frogs
Can't do that - would use too much energy.
Molgrips
Ooh my Nan and Gramps used to have a back boiler on their coal fire. They had to come down and light it in the morning to get the house warmed and get hot water. I can still remember them doing that, as clear as day.
Our plan is to use gas in the morning to warm up the house, then use the back boiler thereafter. The energy companies making huge profits over the speculation are going to have a rude awakening, when they discover people are going to adapt and switch to self supply heating. I don't even want to mention the Green deal that the Tory's abolished because the house builders complained it cost them too much...
BR
JeZ
I live in a smoke free zone, but given this madness, I can see people lighting up their log fires all the time as it will be much cheaper than running the central heating.
The energy companies making huge profits over the speculation are going to have a rude awakening, when they discover people are going to adapt and switch to self supply heating.
not really - people are inherently lazy and the vast majority would rather get in debt than do some graft.
not really – people are inherently lazy and the vast majority would rather get in debt than do some graft.
also missing the point that not everyone lives in a village with a garden and a chap who delivers a load of logs or space for a heat/ground source pump or even the likelihood of ever getting permission.
There are an awful lot of properties that cannot have solar/woodburner/air or ground source heat pumps.
My current flat does not have a big enough outside space for a heat pump, the dormers and East facing roof mean no solar (and the flats below have no roof) no chimney.
Partners flat is conservation area/listed so no new glazing, solid walls so no obliterating internal features if you insulate inside (not that it would be allowed) no owned outside space for ground source, no roof for solar unless the 3 freeholders agree to share then not enough space to benefit 3 properties (not that it would be allowed) and burning wood/coal in a city is a definate no.
flat we are buying is again in conservation area not allowed to remove crittal windows but can do internal insulation, no solar space (there is a roof but not enough to work for 32 flats, heat pumps are not allowed but they will have to give in at some point. slight possibility of a big ground source unit in the communal grounds but each flat would have convert to wet heating (currently a mix of wet and warm air gas) this would potentially be £20-40k per flat and they would all have to agree.
so it’s get into debt and stay as you are or take on a huge debt to save money down the line, how many households can afford that? go tell them they are lazy...
so it’s get into debt and stay as you are or take on a huge debt to save money down the line, how many households can afford that? go tell them they are lazy…
seperate issue. The uprising the previous poster was speaking about will not happen even with the vast majority of those with the ability and the means choosing not to.
not really – people are inherently lazy and the vast majority would rather get in debt than do some graft.
...or they simply can't afford to upgrade their properties!
I could whack solar panels on my south facing roof. Not quite got the £8k stuffed down the back of my sofa to do it though.
a chap who delivers a load of logs
A lot of chit chat round these parts about getting log burners.
No one seems to have taken into account that logs are not free for most people, and as demand for seasoned wood goes up, suppliers are going to increase their prices.
knowing a guy who knows a guy, or being friendly with a tree surgeon (and having space to store their waste product for 2 or 3 years to season it) is one thing, but especially now that wood fuel has to be certified, dumpy bag deliveries are going to get pricier, and by the time youve factored in the faff and the storage issue i doubt it will be long before it just isnt worth it.
Shareholders still get paid yeah?
And people think this is a good idea? FFS
I think you completely misunderstood my post, I'm not up for paying the dividends now and taking the debt on over the next 20 years. We need to claw back money from the people making the obscene profits. Shame we're not still in the EU as they are actually talking about reforming the energy market not just kicking the can down the road.
I'd love solar panels and a heat pump. I've not nowhere near enough money to do that though.
Think £80 a month will cover my usage on the new tarifs.
If they keep the standing charge the same.
My 12mth average for electricity 1,450kwh. So £60pcm should cover that
Gas 12mth average 2,310kwh so I think that will be £20pcm.
Got £200 in credit now, and paying £80pcm already.
Got a wood burner in the lounge this year so hope to be able to reduce the gas usage a touch by running that instead.
the Muffin man:
…or they simply can’t afford to upgrade their properties!
I could whack solar panels on my south facing roof. Not quite got the £8k stuffed down the back of my sofa to do it though.
I don't till next year either. Since the last disaster in 2008 I just speeded up paying my mortgage off earlier. Next year I do it! Then I have the money to pay for it.
Onto the issue of not being able to this goes back to my other comment about the green deal and what Cameron did...
JeZ
My estimates are showing as:
Electricity - 3200kW/h
Gas - 8000kW/h
(single in a 1 bed coach house/flat)
With Shell Energy on their Flexible 7 plan
Electricity - 28.4p kW/h & standing charge of 51.6p per day
Gas - 7.47p kW/h & standing charge of 27.2p per day
@FuzzyWuzzy - Those are the old prices. As of September 30th, you’re going to be paying almost double that. Electric will be ~50p/kWh and gas ~15p/kWh.
A lot of chit chat round these parts about getting log burners.
No one seems to have taken into account that logs are not free for most people, and as demand for seasoned wood goes up, suppliers are going to increase their prices.
They're also an environmental disaster - pumping out loads of PM10s into the environment. Stopped using ours now as can't justify using it anymore.
@footflaps - we're exactly the same. I've kept our woodburner in just in case we've got oil supply issues, but last year, we lit it 3 times.
This is really the issue when it comes to sustainability - it's almost always trumped by economics and the latter is near term and tangible and the former is abstract and long term.
Any idea when the new direct debit emails are likely arrive. I've a pretty good idea what mine is going to be but I'd have thought that the energy companies would have been sending these already. I guess they may be waiting to see if Truss does anything that quickly that would affect these
Just looked ours up.
Currently paying £230 a month, elec 4.5kwh, gas 16.5kwh. Not sure on the next big jump but I can fix at £660 a month. Ouch.
Any idea when the new direct debit emails are likely arrive.
Nope, I guess they're waiting (for a miracle) as they have until the end of Sep.
I had mine yesterday. 3 bed semi, 2 adults and 2 kids. Both gas and leccy with Ovo. They want to increase from 192 to 320!!
I’d not be fixing right now, Gas prices are falling:
But they won't be for long - it's getting colder.
Our average bill for the 6 months to September is £145/m and we're currently pay £204/m DD. They're estimating that we'll be at -£1200 by year (despite a small £400 current balance) and are recommending that we pay £284/m.
I just noticed taking shower for 20 to 30 mins cost me £1.10 per shower during summertime because that's the only gas I used. 🙁
You shower for 20-30 min!?! What the **** are you doing in there?
Probably already covered in this thread but the boss of British gas seemed to make a very sound and logical suggestion. Loan the energy providers the cash to buy electricity and gas from the energy companies, and keep bills down for the end user. The loan would be paid back by a gradual increase in fuel bills over the next 20 years, rather than crippling us over next 12-24 months
That assumes that prices will drop like a stone back to 2020 levels - otherwise it's just another Ponzi scheme plus vast profits to the energy companies.
Yet more Tory "capitalise profits / socialise losses" ideology.
That assumes that prices will drop like a stone back to 2020 levels
Most of the price rise is to do with phasing out Russian gas from Europe at short notice. Eventually the market will settle with a new distribution between countries and prices will fall. There isn't a shortage of gas, there is a shortage of non Russian gas available at very short notice. This is just a temporary blib.
But will it settle back or will oil and gas producers just reduce supply to keep prices high? The Saudi's have so far refused to increase production. From their point of view, it's got to be better to make more money on less export than the other way around. If no-one tries to capture market share by dropping prices...there's no reason for anyone to drop prices. We'll settle into a new high price where almost 30-40% of the worlds oil and gas are completely off limits to us and we're left outbidding each other for what's left. It's like covid and PPE all over again.
You shower for 20-30 min!?! What the **** are you doing in there?
Certainly Not spanking the monkey. 🙂
I ain't doing the 5 mins army shower.
Also not shower everyday. LOL!
There isn’t a shortage of gas, there is a shortage of non Russian gas available at very short notice. This is just a temporary blib.
Define "temporary blip". 3 years? 5 years? 10 years? It is still a tiny blip in the infinite time.
p/s: I told my father I didn't shower everyday and he said I could smell like his British army colleagues in Malaya ... sour milk and cheese. He said you lot didn't like to shower (even the officers). Smelly so and so ... LOL!
Define “temporary blip”. 3 years? 5 years? 10 years? It is still a tiny blip in the infinite time.
I suspect 1-2 years.
Currently we're all trying to buy LNG (mainly from the ME) as Europe is trying to fill it's reservoirs to max whilst not taking any gas piped from Russia. There are plenty of buyers for Russian gas (India, Asia, China, Turkey) but Russia don't have the LNG capacity or pipelines in place to deliver it immediately. So, Europe's increased demand for LNG is maxing out LNG prices. Russia will increase LNG capacity and just sell elsewhere and those buyers will stop competing for ME LNG which Europe is mainly buying. The market will re-normalise.
I suspect 1-2 years.
A bit optimistic but let's hope that's the case.
As my mum used to say once the price has gone up it hardly go down again for a very long time. Someone somewhere is rubbing their hands with glee.
As my mum used to say once the price has gone up it hardly go down again for a very long time. Someone somewhere is rubbing their hands with glee.
Oil goes up and down all the time....
An interesting aside is India is doing very well out of this. They are buying Russian Oil at a discount of $20/barrel as so many countries don't want to touch it. They then refine it into Petrol & Diesel etc and sell back to Europe at current (inflated) market rates!
3 bed semi, 4 adults.
Last 12 months
11,500 kWh Electric, 9,000 KWh Gas.
Gas use unlikely to be much down, but we've cut electric to around 700KWh a month on average since March (20 KWh a day), so hoping somewhere around 8,000 to 9,000 KWh for the next 12 months (maybe less). It's still going to be near £400 - £500 per month, currently just around £200.
21 year old son still not listening to 'turn it off' message. Got home yesterday (been away) and all downstairs lights had been left on overnight and his PC. He went to work today with PC still running (not on sleep) and two chargers plugged in. This is where the leccy is going. Smart Plugs in his room, so all power is now being cut during the work day !
What’s just as shocking as the price rises is how people go days without a shower??
something tells me they must be single and have no intimate contact with other people.
Tell me about energy monitoring plugs.
I was thinking of something I could plug into each socket for a while to measure the consumption of various appliances. Some come with a display, but there are also "Smart" plugs available that can be used by Alexa/Assistant and show consumption via an App. Any opinion on which would be best? (The latter appeal as they at least have an ongoing use).
I was thinking of something I could plug into each socket for a while to measure the consumption of various appliances.
Google the appliance, it'll give you the consumption, or at least as near as you need to work out which ones use the most (and you probably know that already anyway)
We have a smart power meter clamped to our supply, so can see in real time (and going back years), how much we use.
[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/693/21427094454_de0d917d04_c.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/693/21427094454_de0d917d04_c.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/yDrsF1 ]Neurio Energy By Minute[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/brf/ ]Ben Freeman[/url], on Flickr
I have used it to hunt down where we were leaking power etc and switch things off / change things.
We pay about 200 pcm for 3 bed semi, 2 adults, 2 young kids.
Going to properly insulate the loft.
Whats the deal with cavity wall insulation? I've seen to many conflicting views I'm not sure if it's worth it due to potential problems. We are on South Coast, lots of wind, sometimes with heavy rain (like last night!)
I have used it to hunt down where we were leaking power etc and switch things off / change things.
Any useful insights??
My gut feeling is leaving stuff on standby costs pennies. Really most of the energy is used whereever heat is generated, baths, showers, cookers, kettles, TVs, computers and monitors when they are on.
So Liz truss confirmed as new pm as from tomorrow and the firm rumour is that she will freeze energy prices....so possibly all back to staying on the present cap? Still a 54% rise on last winter iirc, but a big worry lifting for many people, if confirmed.
Any useful insights??
My gut feeling is leaving stuff on standby costs pennies. Really most of the energy is used whereever heat is generated, baths, showers, cookers, kettles, TVs, computers and monitors when they are on.
Nothing you probably wouldn't guess. It does rank your 'Always on' power by household size, so you can see how you stack up.
Main always on are fridge and freezer, which you can see cycling their pumps on and off through the night.
I do occasionally leave the attic lights on and forget and have spotted that via the power meter - they're fluorescent things so quite energy hungry. Biggest change we made was moving all lights to LEDs. Although I still use CFLs for main overhead bulbs in hallways etc as LEDs just aren't bright enough.
We did buy an air con unit this year and leaving it on all night on low power used less than I expected - only 900W:
[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52325144715_1be80ebd76_c.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52325144715_1be80ebd76_c.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/2nHN3xv ]Aircon unit at night[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/brf/ ]Ben Freeman[/url], on Flickr
Those spikes are the kettle. I have up to 20 cups of tea a day....
How much energy does an energy-monitoring smart plug use? 🙂
Seriously though, I'm tempted by some as I'm the only person/fool in this house who seems to care about switching stuff off. I can't continually keep on top of it, so some smart plugs on schedules might be sensible. On a mission at the moment to cut our electric use back - as alluded to earlier, it seems excessively high for our use (barring that occasional hot tub which is, genuinely, rarely filled let along pump or heat on).
Those spikes are the kettle. I have up to 20 cups of tea a day….
You're also describing Mrs a11y. I bet if I bought an energy meter I could work out which days she's at work and which at home simply from the electric use fluctuations.
Those spikes are the kettle. I have up to 20 cups of tea a day….
Have you considered a one cup kettle. Boils and dispenses a cup of water at a time.
try googling Breville Hot Cup (I'm sure other brands are available)
Footflaps, what monitoring system do you use?
20 cups of tea per day, you may well be more efficient getting a boiling water tap. They are ace and more economical than kettle if used frequently.
You shower for 20-30 min!?! What the **** are you doing in there?
That's insane!
Even when i was full roadie, i could do a full post race shower, including scrubbing off sunblock, shave my head, face AND my legs in less time than that.
I ain’t doing the 5 mins army shower.
I started doing it. Heated water has to be one of the biggest costs. I think they're called "military showers" - quick blast of hot water all over, water off whilst you do the lathering up, hot water back on to risne off. Probably using 3 mins of hot water. That's got to be at least 50% reduction in energy used to shower.
Re. the one cup kettle thingys, how are they/are they more efficient than just boiling a normal kettle with enough water for one cup??
We've just got two non-smart power monitoring plugs - mentioned earlier in the thread, but just ebay them, that are about £10 each. Also got two TP Link Tapo smart plugs with energy monitoring - these are really good if you can't get to the plug.
The smart plugs themselves use about a watt.
The coffee pod machine uses 1500w for about the minute it needs to brew the cup - I'm using re-useable pods ! Far cheaper than boiling a cup in the kettle.
Home office, laptop, hub and two monitors, somewhere between 35-55w depending if it's charging the laptop !
Slow cooker - 250w low, 360w high.
Toaster 1500w
Hot Tub.... 45w on filter pump only, 2000w if heating, and it can take 12 hours to get to 39c from around 20c - stopped using it for now on current prices.
We've got BG Home smart wall sockets in my son's room. Only 'pain' for setting up is you've got to knock off 5ghz wifi first which is a bit of a faff during set up, then turn back on. The TP Link Tapo plugs didn't need anything doing, total doddle.
scotroutes
Full MemberTell me about energy monitoring plugs.
I was thinking of something I could plug into each socket for a while to measure the consumption of various appliances. Some come with a display, but there are also “Smart” plugs available that can be used by Alexa/Assistant and show consumption via an App. Any opinion on which would be best? (The latter appeal as they at least have an ongoing use).
A couple of pages back I posted screenshots from one of my Tapo P110 plugs. That shows basically what it can do. You get a longer term view showing "by day" and roughly the last 24 hours in a finer grained graph. You can control them with the Alexa, Google Home voice control or the Tapo app.
A nice function the app has is the ability to set them to come on and off at random times for freaking out your other half security when you're away.
Footflaps, what monitoring system do you use?
It is called Neurio. I sponsered them on Kickstarter many years ago.
Available via various retailers etc.
https://www.amazon.com/Neurio-W1-Home-Energy-Monitor/dp/B0149EE5KS
It is very cool, although the detecting which device uses what doesn't work as it's set up for US devices - they'd never heard of a 3kW kettle....
I bet if I bought an energy meter I could work out which days she’s at work and which at home simply from the electric use fluctuations.
Yep, I can see when someone comes in etc, if I'm away, as turning lights on etc shows up really clearly.
20 cups of tea per day, you may well be more efficient getting a boiling water tap. They are ace and more economical than kettle if used frequently.
I've seen those advertised in the Sunday Times etc - they look like an expensive toy which will just die after a couple of years of our ultra hard water.
If you've got a smart monitor, you don't need anything else to monitor energy usage. I can tell you exactly what each of our devices uses in each of it's power phases. Oven - 150w when not actively heating - 1.8kw whilst heating. lights are 6.7w per bulb for the downlighters. TV is 100w on at level 17/20 brightness and 45w at level 10. Skybox uses 40w in STANDBY! etc, etc. It's probably not massively accurate, but it's enough that I know from the baseline house draw, what may have been left on in an evening before I go to bed.
Ours is two years old and been faultless, but we are in a soft water area with no limescale at all. I always thought they were a toy until we got one, it is really good. But I agree, in hard water area could get spendy.
Skybox uses 40w in STANDBY!
That is insane, our total standby usage is about 80 Watts - 2 wife boxes, half a dozen Sonuses, half a dozen IP webcams, oven, microwave, half a dozen Nest etc etc
That is insane, our total standby usage is about 80 Watts – 2 wife boxes, half a dozen Sonuses, half a dozen IP webcams, oven, microwave, half a dozen Nest etc etc
Are you providing heat to your wives when you put them in their boxes? Perhaps just give them a blanket instead. Could they share one box and stave of hypothermia by sharing body heat, like when peasants kept livestock in the croft house.
Could one of your 6 Sounesses help warm up your wives by going in their box?
Are you providing heat to your wives when you put them in their boxes?
Good spot, I'll disconnect the heating elements immediately.
Good spot, I’ll disconnect the heating elements immediately.
I assume they need to be warm though when performing for the six webcams. Its a balancing act for sure. These are the issues facing people up and down the country
Fossy - can you help me get our Tapo 110 plugs up and running?
I’ve tried to use the “schedule” option to set an automatic turn on / turn off time but it doesn’t seem to work.
When I have programmed “on” to 08:00 using a “custom time” I then find there is no option to set an “off” time - if I set the “off” radio button it shows 08:00 and if I change it to 18:00 and go back to the “on” radio button the time on that has been changed to 18:00.
This is on the IoS app. How does it work on yours assuming it works properly?
I’ve tried it on two plugs and it’s the same on both…
Won a little battle with OVO today that I've been fighting since they took on all the SSE customers about my usage and DD size. Got a small rebate and the DD has gone down from £190 to £92 with nearly £600 in credit on the account. Should get me through the winter if I'm sensible. Biggest costs for me are the oven and the storage heaters, hoping for a mild winter!
I started doing it. Heated water has to be one of the biggest costs. I think they’re called “military showers” – quick blast of hot water all over, water off whilst you do the lathering up, hot water back on to risne off. Probably using 3 mins of hot water. That’s got to be at least 50% reduction in energy used to shower.
My shower runs from the hot water tank and that's on for an hour during the night only, any less and the water isn't warm! Means I can have a longish shower and not worry about it, still leaves plenty of water for washing the dishes. Annoyingly the washing machine has provision for a hot water intake but there's no piping for it so that has to heat it's own water.
My shower runs from the hot water tank and that’s on for an hour during the night only, any less and the water isn’t warm!
If you had a less long shower .... It wouldn't need to be on so long.
And 80w standby with all the tech stuff on + general house stuff. What's that measured on ? Inline meter or CT clamp.
What’s just as shocking as the price rises is how people go days without a shower??
something tells me they must be single and have no intimate contact with other people.
Some of us aren't inherently smelly buggers.
Seriously though, I switched from shower gels full of shite to normal soap and don't reek any more. Same with shampoo, switched to bars and can go days without getting greasy and manky.
It is also possible to wash without showering.
@olddog my provider is offering the same prize. What a time to be alive.
And 80w standby with all the tech stuff on + general house stuff. What’s that measured on ? Inline meter or CT clamp.
Inductive clamp.
Fairly similar process for all makes (my BG Home plug sockets are similar.
Click Schedule then the + button.
Custom time then on.
SAVE
THEN click + again, custom time and Off.
You set up two schedules, one for off and one for on.
If you had a less long shower …. It wouldn’t need to be on so long
Surely it would?
The time it's on for is how long it takes to get to temperature, rather than to do with the volume of water.
The volume of the tank is fixed (it's not like a kettle where you just put in what you need) so leaving it on longer makes it hotter
