December to May I paid sixty-seven pounds per month, which covered my usage. Direct debit was increased to seventy-nine pounds per month in July; not sure if this'll be enough, although I did use the heating a lot during winter and was WFH earlier this year. I expect I'll be using closer to a hundred and fifty a month, but I've really no idea. Unfortunately, I live in a three bedroom Victorian terrace. which is likely not energy efficient. Could do with sorting out some of the draughts before winter really hits.
Not sure if it's been mentioned, but I'd like to see sliding scale pricing, where costs are set low up to a certain amount of units used, then they get progressively more, the more that're used. Psychologically, I think that'd encourage more people to use less, although it's obviously not going to be something that's implemented in the current climate.
There’s a geographical element to all this too.
Indeed there is
We do, every day, all those public transport subsidies for London and surroundings because too many people live in such a small area. Try public transport up north. No doubt the north will be paying for the lack of infrastructure for water supplies in the south.
Except 3 regions (inc London) in the SE run a surplus which goes elsewhere..
If you really think the top half of the country is putting it’s hand in it’s pocket for the bottom half you need to put the jingoism aside and look at the numbers, yes London received over double per head on transport (£700 v 300) but you have to look at that against the surplus generated per head and where it ends up
£15000 per head spent in scotland
£14693 per head spent in London
£18600 per head raised in London
£12100 per head raised in scotland
wind yer wee necks in, I don’t want to derail the thread just point out that the idea of paying more for power in the south to subsidise the north is moronic, however there is merit in the very well off paying more or rather the less well off paying less but not with taxpayers money but the insane profits from the wholesale energy companies. (not the distributors as their margins are tiny)
And the issue of the higher standing charge in scotland is indicative of a system that isn’t working when multiple companies and agencies are involved. Ofgen has obviously failed or is too weak to influence for the benefit of customers.
a less nationalistic view on price differences:
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-10667939/Energy-standing-charges-regions-pay-60-others.html
3ft thick solid stone walls which are a massive heatsink and take literally weeks to properly warm up after a whole summer of no heating use.
In fact stone walls have so little thermal resistance that they'll never warm up and stay warm. They'd need to be 20m thick to provide as much insulation as 100mm of insulating materials. They'll cool down in a day or so if you turn the heating off, try it.
The answer is to insulate them on the outside in which case they take a day or so to warm up when you start heating and then attenuate temperature changes. Or insulate on the inside in which case the house will warm up really quickly but the temperature will flutute more quickly. Either will be a huge heat saver.
Our bill is usually a bit below the cap so in 2021 it was aprox £1200 this October I will now expect £3300 and just heard on the radio that the April 2023 predictions are in excess of £7000. If that happens I have no idea what to do. Too nuts to worry about now.
....
not changed. I'm locked in till march 2024 and have been well before the first cap change thank god.
And the issue of the higher standing charge in scotland is indicative of a system that isn’t working when multiple companies and agencies are involved. Ofgen has obviously failed or is too weak to influence for the benefit of customers.
He never said anything about standing charges, he was talking about grid connections.
This has been raised by the SG and it's gone nowhere.
not changed. I’m locked in till march 2024 and have been well before the first cap change thank god.
What out of interest are you SC and kWh rates on that deal? And are you considering prepaying or at least putting the amount you are 'saving' aside for the end of your cap? Or spending it hoping that the situation reverses by 2024?
Was originally paying £65 a month with OVO but I upped the DD to £300 awhile ago to build a surplus. Bought two tons of smokeless Excel for £1100 as solid fuels are shortly going up again.
Old former Victorian foundry building/mill and Covid wrecked our energy renovation project so not very thermally efficient, thankfully only me and MrsRNP.
wind yer wee necks in
😎
Never stop this chat. It's the best pro independence campaign ever
Never stop this chat. It’s the best pro independence campaign ever
Grab it with both hands (if you get the opportunity again)
Hopefully the independent government can deal with this :
SCOTTISHPOWER which has been pushing for a taxpayer-backed £100bn fund to help energy firms freeze energy bills has handed over nearly £7bn in dividends to its foreign owners since being taken over, it can be revealed.The payout bonanza to its Spanish owners, Iberdola over its 14 years of control of the Glasgow-based company has been revealed as its high profile chief executive Keith Anderson has seen his pay soar by £200,000 to £1.35m in a year. Six years ago, Scottish Power Limited's highest paid director was getting almost half that at £687,000ScottishPower's dividend payments to Iberdola have amounted to nearly one billion pounds in the past two years alone as customers face energy bills soaring by three-and-a-half times in a year.
tbf the majority of people from the south and the north don't really see that much different weather, the vast majority of people live no far from sea level. If you get regular snow, it's more likely because you live above 150/200 meters rather than how far north or south you are. Spring does take a bit longer to start up here though, so the winter is a bit longer. Could be argued as well that the south has warmer summers, so air con needs will be more.
Much of a much muchness really.
I don't see this as a north south problem anyhow, we are all getting hammered here. In fighting is useful to no-one.
MrSmith
Free Member
Never stop this chat. It’s the best pro independence campaign everGrab it with both hands (if you get the opportunity again)
Hopefully the independent government can deal with this :
SCOTTISHPOWER which has been pushing for a taxpayer-backed £100bn fund to help energy firms freeze energy bills has handed over nearly £7bn in dividends to its foreign owners since being taken over, it can be revealed.The payout bonanza to its Spanish owners, Iberdola over its 14 years of control of the Glasgow-based company has been revealed as its high profile chief executive Keith Anderson has seen his pay soar by £200,000 to £1.35m in a year. Six years ago, Scottish Power Limited’s highest paid director was getting almost half that at £687,000ScottishPower’s dividend payments to Iberdola have amounted to nearly one billion pounds in the past two years alone as customers face energy bills soaring by three-and-a-half times in a year.
Energy policy is a reserved to the uk. So hopefully the uk government will get its finger out its arse. Doubt it myself.
Don't know how much energy I use but my energy bills (combined gas & electricity - I am with Bulb) used to be around £45/mth in the summer time, but now it has gone up by around 90% to 100% to £80 to £85/mth. I think I will need to add another 50% to the bill for winter (when central heating is switched on).
It's a small flat and I don't earn a lot so the increase means I need to cut something else to compensate for the increase.
We spend about £1500 a year on oil and monthly DD for elec is around £55 but the house has solar panels so as well as earning money from what they create also get paid for the next energy that goes back to the grid
I have been using an energy meter thing to see what appliances are using electricity in my house. Still working my way round various appliances, but eye openers so far have been the 20+ year old freezer that is currently using 2.8 kWh per day (currently about £23 a month, but by April that could easily be £78!). By purchasing a new energy efficient freezer (and downsizing) I reckon it will pay for itself in just a few months.
Other big users are a similarly aged fridge that gets through 0.6 kWh a day, but is a 'spare', largely used for beer and drinks. So that is going too.
Currently testing the microwave (which seems fine - almost no power draw on standby at all) and then to tackle my sons gaming PC...
The podcast the big green money show by Deborah meaden covers this very subject, how to invest in your home to improve energy rating. Well worth a listen, some v good ideas.
Two gaming pc's and a hot tub. Hot tub was turned to pump only start of summer and only heated when we decided to use it - saved a significant amount of Kwh, but I'll turn it off soon - power monitoring plug has been bought so I want to see what power the pump only is using. Then test both gaming pc setups as I know my son has loads of stuff on standby.
Old fridge and freezer have just gone (knackered) and a new unit installed. Any other appliances aren't on standby now. small chest freezer will beturned down.
LED security lights will have timer's reduced - one or two can be switched off.
Can I remind all those of you with mains gas, that those of us without pay more for our electricity (no dual-fuel discount) - and our daily temperatures even in the south of Scotland are on average 5c lower than in the South East.
Oh and our oil cost has tripled over the last 2 years, spent £2000 so far this year compared to £700 for the same period in 2020.
Kiln-dried Wood unsurprisingly has also risen, looks about a +50% rise over last year.
And picking up on the Scotland Standing Charge issue, ours is 49.64p.
Cam anyone recommend a device for measuring power consumption through a 13a socket? Or, are they all pretty similar?
I think i need to assess and go on an appliance cull
Ian
I've just ordered a couple via ebay for not much more than £20. Much of a muchness. You can get smart plugs with power monitoring, but I went for the adapter plug and display, non-smart.
Extended 3 bed semi with 4 adults, used to use 13000kwh of gas, which dropped to 10000 when we fitted a Tado smart thermostat, then in the spring we added Tado smart TRV’s, looking like we’ll come in around 6-7000kwh a year, so about £1100.
Electric we use about 4000kWh with me WFH, 3 on 13 weeks a year holiday, a telly that is permanently on if the Mrs is awake and a son that spends any waking hour gaming, this should come in around £2100 but we switched on a 5.2kwp solar array last week that should take us down to around £1250, and £250-300 back in export payments.
So all in around £2000, pre price rise and pre smart TRV’s was around £1800-1900
So I get monthly bills then pay them, keeping track of them.
Last year at this time of year I got down to less than £35 for July/ August.
This year the same two months are closer to £80.
I'm too worried about the winter months, I can probably cover the increases but other things are going to be put aside to do so.
If it helps anyone this electricity cost calculator has been updated with the new price cap.
Oh and our oil cost has tripled over the last 2 years, spent £2000 so far this year compared to £700 for the same period in 2020.
How well insulated is your hot water tank? I found that the Megaflo thing in my place only needs nuking with the oil boiler every other day and can still do a hot shower 48 hours later (two showers / day). Flow rate on a thermostatic shower reduces a bit on the second day, but it's saved several hours running the boiler every day, and the water use is less too.
Don’t know how much energy I use but my energy bills (combined gas & electricity – I am with Bulb) used to be around £45/mth in the summer time, but now it has gone up by around 90% to 100% to £80 to £85/mth. I think I will need to add another 50% to the bill for winter (when central heating is switched on).
If you have them, have a look thru some old bills at what you were paying last winter. If you're on a normal variable rate....The increase this summer from your old £45 to £80 will be due to the price cap increase (now at 27.35p per kWh electric and 7.28p per kWh gas) The new cap coming in in October sees them rise by c80%. So your SUMMER bill would be c £145 (we use 3x the summer energy thru the worst months of Winter)
I'd urge you to give this a very good looking at.....
Oh and our oil cost has tripled over the last 2 years, spent £2000 so far this year compared to £700 for the same period in 2020.
Sounds impressive till you realise 2020 was pretty much an all time low. Anyone planning a budget using that as a baseline is living on a wing and a prayer.
Compared to any other energy source bar the spike in February to 1.20 oils up about 30% on its 10 year average which puts it's increases considerable lower than the others right now.
Sounds impressive till you realise 2020 was pretty much an all time low. Anyone planning a budget using that as a baseline is living on a wing and a prayer.
Go back to 2018 then, and it's still doubled in price.
We pay around £100 per month for combined gas and electricity. We have quite a bit of credit also. Our DD was about £130 a couple of month ago, but has come down. We input readings regularly. They always overestimate usage. We live in a new build, 3 bed semi detached with triple glazing and a 1kw solar setup. Over the last 6 1/2 years we have made around 5300kwh through the panels. We're about to move to another new build, but an extra bedroom and no solar panels. So I'm guessing we will see a big jump in our bill. But we don't have a dishwasher, or tumble dryer, and there is only 2 of us. We don't consume much.
Go back to 2018 then, and it’s still doubled in price.
yes the boilerjuice price graphs(i assume thats what your using since you picked 2018 as your referance and thats as far back as that goes) would certainly make you think that how ever whos paying that price ? - example its showing about 110p/l and yet i can get quoted 84p from my usual supplier.
The RPI 10 year average graphs paint a different picture
Estimated Annual Electricity Usage 2660.0 kWh
Estimated Annual Gas Usage* 15331 kWh
Interesting. ONly 2 of us, but we both work from home - me on computers, Mrs NBT makes curtains. Gas for hot water, heating and the hob. Everything else is electric. Surprised to see our usage is so high
I think I can get a full set of smart TRVs and thermostat for £300 to enable single room heating for WFH. This may pay for itself in one winter.
yes the boilerjuice price graphs(i assume thats what your using since you picked 2018 as your referance and thats as far back as that goes
Nope, when we first moved in I'd no idea what oil would cost so recorded it (and usage via a remote) - I've the data for +10 years now and it's the actual data of what we paid for each fill (3x per year = 3,000l) and usage in 100l units.
Also to check for leaks, by recording usage I'd see it.
And 95ppl at the start of the month for us.
We're 4 adults, gas use low - efficient house, but electric is high due to gadgets. Son's room does have smart sockets but I really need to resync them (pain in the ass as they don't like the 5ghz wifi, but I'll shedule power off duering day (he's at work). Going to see what the sandby use is as gaming pc, 3 screens, VR etc all on standy !
Daughter's put her two consoles on a switched extension as she's mainly using her gaming PC, but' she's also an ipad pro and a gaming laptop
We've an IR panel heater where MrsF works frm home (two days) so she;ll use that more as it heat's you, and nt the room. My I'll be two days at hme, so will work out something - currently the conservatory or shed.
I think I can get a full set of smart TRVs and thermostat for £300 to enable single room heating for WFH. This may pay for itself in one winter.
The wife just uses an electric oil filled radiator in her office. Never run the numbers on what it actually costs to use...
Over the last 8 years we've paid between 32ppl and 47ppl for premium kerosene. In March we paid 63ppl. My price for last week was quoted as 92ppl. 3* the lowest price and almost 2* the (previous to war in Ukraine) highest. That's in the Cotswolds/SW.
But - It's followed exactly what Brent Crude is doing, so can't really complain. Sadly, the low point seems to have been August 17th and I missed it.
I think I can get a full set of smart TRVs and thermostat for £300 to enable single room heating for WFH. This may pay for itself in one winter.
Question for the massed ranks of STW...is this worth it? I have old (1980s build) radiators with older valves - they do have 'dials' on so you can choose between 0 & 6 as a heating level and my boiler is less than 10 years old. I cannot afford new radiators or £300 for smart TRVs so wondering if just going round the house turning stuff down/off will have the same effect? I suppose walking round the house may generate some personal warmth 😉 I have invested in some some smart plugs for the TVs and a couple of strategic plugs (Fazzini-jnr-jnr Xbox).
In terms of costs Shell (after we were moved to them when Pure Planet went bust) told me in January I needed to be paying £180p/mth so I upped it to £200. They have since told me my expected usage will be £175 p/mth but want me to drop my DD as I'm in credit. Nothing at all like making it as confusing as possible for folks to get to grips with. If things do get really bad I'll just start going back into the office to work to save energy/money as my commute is cycle or walk, so can avoid car use.
so wondering if just going round the house turning stuff down/off will have the same effect?
Been doing that for years!
In winter I turn all the bedroom ones off after we get up. Only downside is I occasionally forget to turn them back on at night and we wake up to an unheated bedroom. No intention of changing to smart ones.
We've kind of lucked in to a reasonable deal with EDF.
Initially with Greenenergy paying £88/month for a 3 bed semi, they went down in early 2021 and we were moved on to EDF who honored the deal we had with Greenenergy.
Fast forward to October 21 when the initial deal ended and we moved on to SVR and a monthly payment of £247.00...ouch.
By the time I started looking for a new deal there was nothing going so we accepted that we were stuck on SVR and there was no point moving on from EDF.
Fast forward to Feb this year and we get offered a deal fixed until Fed 24.
At the time this was:-
Elect ~ standing charge 49.65 (SVR 49.65) Unit rate 31.12 (SVR 27.84)
Gas ~ standing charge 27.22 (SVR 27.22) Unit rate 8.386 (SVR 7.336)
With the war in Ukraine kicking off and £100.00 exit fee on both we thankfully took the deal and from October we'll be scoring big time on the unit rate...fingers crossed it'll all calm down within the next 18 months or I dare say we'll get an awfully big financial shock in Feb 2024!
wondering if just going round the house turning stuff down/off will have the same effect?
You could, in theory.
What I'm planning is to maybe have the kitchen heated for 20 mins before we get up, then after everyone leaves for work/school I will have only my bedroom heated during the day, if it needs it (which it usually won't). Then in the evening switch to the living room and perhaps the kids' rooms. The boiler needs to come on when those rooms TRVs need heat, but the thermostat is in the hallway so that wouldn't work when heating a single room. So I'd have to go around the whole house multiple times a day turning rads on and off, and manually starting the boiler whenever it feels cold in whatever room I'm in. That's too much of a faff for me.
The hallways rads (3x) don't have TRVs to act as ballast - they need to shed the heat if all the rads are closed. This is rather wasteful, and doesn't account for what happens when the hallway is warm (that's where the thermostat is) and other rooms might be cold so the boiler shuts off. It's very crude and I think it will be far more effective with smart TRVs.
The Wiser system can also control electric heaters via smart plugs as part of the system, and given that my gas is now nearly the same price as my off-peak electricity it raises the possibility of using an electric heater before 7am in some rooms.
I cannot afford new radiators or £300 for smart TRVs so wondering if just going round the house turning stuff down/off will have the same effect?
Pretty much this.
so wondering if just going round the house turning stuff down/off will have the same effect?
Yep. In fact it's even better, co s you're not paying out for new 'smart' controls.
Gas: 21,000kWh p.a.
Electric: 6,500kWh p.a.
Daily that’s 59kWh gas, 18kWh leccy.
Previously £145/month, now looking likely at £300+ according to Octopus’ calculations but I expect higher.
Well above average gas use presumably due to geography and house age/style. 1870s 4-bed detached, 180sqm, ~50m ASL in part-sheltered location, 56deg N latitude, modern DG and smart thermostats, 3yr old combi boiler, but high ceilings on ground floor and limited insulation (solid sandstone walls, upper floor is attic-style with dormers so limited space to increase roof insulation). Glad we moved from previous house where costs were higher despite being a modern 2006-built property, due to very exposed elevated location (to the extent of losing our roof in a storm once) meaning we used 32,000kWh gas on average p.a.
I WFH and last winter used an oil-filled rad under the desk with old-man blankets over my legs and rad to contain the heat, rather than have the CH on. Always assumed that’d be more efficient. This winter I’ll head into the office more often for free heat/leccy despite the desk setup being crap compared to home, thankfully it’s a 15min walk so I won’t incur other energy use/cost to get there and back.
Yep. In fact it’s even better, co s you’re not paying out for new ‘smart’ controls.
Plus you get extra exercise wandering round the house switching things on / off which will heat you up a bit!
with old-man blankets over my legs
That was pretty much me last winter, I work downstairs and it's all open plan, so sticking on the CH would be pretty wasteful. Just sat with a blanket over my legs! Plus I wear shorts most of the year and whilst I'm fine walking around outside in shorts in winter, sitting at a desk all day in an unheated room was too much...
That was pretty much me last winter, I work downstairs and it’s all open plan, so sticking on the CH would be pretty wasteful. Just sat with a blanket over my legs!
I feel so old doing it but it works! Room containing my desk isn't ideal being north-facing and getting zero sun with a high ceiling and larger than ideal, but it's the only location I can use. Ideal would be relocating into upstairs storeroom that's 2.5mx2.0m but that's currently our 'attic storage'.
Today I'm sat with (very) casual shorts on lower half combined with a smart shirt - I need to remember not to stand up during my meeting later on!
Can I remind all those of you with mains gas, that those of us without pay more for our electricity (no dual-fuel discount)
You can indeed. What do you wish us to do with this newfound info/knowledge?
Gas: 21,000kWh p.a.
Electric: 6,500kWh p.a.
Daily that’s 59kWh gas, 18kWh leccy.
Previously £145/month, now looking likely at £300+ according to Octopus’ calculations but I expect higher.
My previous usage was 2800kwh electricity and 20,000kwh gas, SO Energy have me on £390 per month as of October.
To be fair we live at 900 feet above sea level, pretty exposed on the Pennines, in a converted 1800's stable made into 4 terraced houses with ours being on an end.
It's over 4 floors with the kitchen/dining area converted from the cellar (been lovely and cool in the heat of summer) and the attic opened up as a mezzanine room with open staircase so pretty limited on attic insulation.
Gas central heating, hot water and cooking, with a small electric heater to warm the room we're in a bit more in the evening, and me at home at least 4 days per week.
To be honest those figures are with no thought to economy, with only me making any effort to ever turn stuff off and the heating set to a permanent 17 degrees; living room a bit warmer of an evening with the extra heater.
I expect usage will come down a fair bit over this 12 months with my wife being more attentive.
It won't be a struggle for us to pay the increase but I'm typically tight and don't like paying for anything if I can avoid it.
Very aware we are luckier than most.
Hoping for a mild winter for everyone's sake, despite my love of snow, but looking at the insane extreme weather stories from pretty much the entire world this summer I suspect it'll be a bastard.
Gas: 21,000kWh p.a.
Electric: 6,500kWh p.a.
Daily that’s 59kWh gas, 18kWh leccy.
Previously £145/month, now looking likely at £300+ according to Octopus’ calculations but I expect higher.
Octopus haven't said yet what they're going to do but the Oct cap figures put your usage at £544 pcm (plus daily charge bumps it to £566) I suspect the octopus calculator is based on prices as of now. Some scary numbers
Daily that’s 59kWh gas, 18kWh leccy.
18 seems a lot, there's got to be significant saving you can get there. We've averaged about 10, and that's for two of us working from home.
We average around 20kWh/day across a year. About a 6th of that is just base load (fridges, wifi, security, pond pump, etc). But as a family of 4 who shower daily (school decontamination shower) and cook everything from scratch using electric, we end up using quite a lot. My wife also seems to only wear clothes once, no matter what it is, how long it was worn for or how dirty it got, so the washing machine is usually on at least 5 times a week and the dryer/dehumidifier in winter.
French electricity - just fixed ours to €0.21 peak, €0.11 off-peak. Smugness offset by the fact that I took out our first contract in a bit of a hurry and before I had much practice speaking French. The ‘pay a monthly direct debit which would then be adjusted at six months’ scheme turned out to mean not just adjusted for consumption (which I was expecting) but also for price. I had no idea I was being charged at a market rate that changed every month. Upwards due to market circumstances. The adjustment was €1,600. Ouch. I speak better French now and this new contract can only be changed twice in a year and leaving has no penalty. There’s also a regulated government rate which is similar but we charge the car off peak and this balance suits us better. I have no idea how this is going to work out for the French government but speaking to neighbours they are generally not too worried. The price of firewood has gone up which is more concerning.
There’s been quite a lot of investment in solar round here (government subsidies made it a no brainer for many) so I think there will be some insulation from price rises. We have solar thermal for hot water which is eye-openingly efficient (I’ve even wondered whether you can run heating off it - there are many cold clear days when we have more hot water than we can use which would reduce the amount of energy you needed to input to make heating work. I am not an engineer though.).
Our elec is about £60 per month, oil heating has climbed from around £400 for 1000 litres to £930 currently! Madness!!
Currently £60 a month using Octopus go tariff from last year, however that expires October so been fretting what to do. Taken a gamble on renewing now on a higher rate GO tariff in the hope that it’s cheaper than what would be available when the fix ends. Will cost a bit more over next month or so, but hoping better over long term as we use majority of electric for off peak car charging.
Hopefully this keeps bills to £80-£100 rather than £200+
The gamble has caused a little friction in the house, so I am also hoping to be proven right for the sake of general harmony at home!
Then there is the heating oil problem to come - hopefully got enough to see out the winter…
We’re kicking ourselves as it was down at 73p per litre a while ago, knew it would go up but you just don’t know when…. Just when you think it can’t go higher so we’ll wait a bit and it just kept rising….
I don’t know how some are affording it, my Mum is currently paying £140 pm and I heard some pensioners are fixing at £400 a month as it’s the lowest they can get. Someone needs to find a way of getting rid of Putin
Isn’t EDF owned by the french? amazing that we (UK) are subsidising french energy bills.
I also found out that Spanish company Iberdrola (who own Scottish power) charge € 0.23 plus tax so €0.28 per kWh in mainland Spain on variable contract. How much is it in Scotland?
We are all being conned and it’s sanctioned/enabled by our government.
"Someone needs to find a way of getting rid of Putin”
you drank that Kool-aid then? what makes you think this is all his fault?
(I’ve even wondered whether you can run heating off it – there are many cold clear days when we have more hot water than we can use which would reduce the amount of energy you needed to input to make heating work. I am not an engineer though.).
You can, just need a thermal store or similar and some slightly clever valving. Basically feed the hot water from the roof into a loop in the store (when its at the right temperature/level) and take it out from the other end as you need it (either for hot water, or heating).
I've seen a few homebrew installations, and a couple of professional ones with multiple heat sources.
(ASHP, Solar electric, mains electric and pellet fired, all running into the same 800-1000 litre tank)
I'd love to have the cash to put something like that together as i have 60 sqm of almost perfectly angled south facing roof.
18 seems a lot, there’s got to be significant saving you can get there. We’ve averaged about 10, and that’s for two of us working from home.
Yep, that was my initial thoughts too but I've been round the house and TBH not sure on the exact cause. Nothing on standby other than the A/V amp which loses all the settings if we switch it off at the wall, chargers unplugged etc. There are 2 + 2 in the house though and I'm continually on at Mrs a11y and the kids to switch things off as, apparently, only I care...
I suspect it's simply circumstances. A lot of washing of work uniforms - Mrs a11y goes through 4 sets of scrubs each week, all washed at home at a high temp - and 2 x young kids who love the outdoors, i.e. mucky buggers, but I'm not complaining about that at all. One undercounter fridge, one undercounter freezer plus a fullsize upright freezer. Some tumble dryer action (NOT me, I'd disable the bloody drying function if I could). A bit of hot tub use but not huge amount.
You're right though, definitely savings to be made.
A bit of hot tub use
I think we found the issue. probably 1/3 of your electricity bill is that
1,400kWh ish of electricity per year and wood stove with a back backboiler.
My wood is free.
My electricity has gone from just over £300/yr to just over £700/yr but with the £400 rebate thing should be about the same.
.
I suspect that I am in a very small but fortunate minority who are mostly unaffected.
.
Some of the consumption figures up there ^ are startling though, what do people do with all that electricity?
breninbeener
Free MemberCam anyone recommend a device for measuring power consumption through a 13a socket? Or, are they all pretty similar?
I think i need to assess and go on an appliance cull
Ian
I've got a few Tapo P110 and they're really good and only a tenner each and often on sale for less than that on Amazon.
The main benefit over the cheap static display ones is that you can see the history on a graph but you can also remotely switch them on and off with the Tapo app or using "okay google" or Alexa etc.
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Some of the consumption figures up there ^ are startling though, what do people do with all that electricity?
I must confess to wondering the same thing! I've done some rudimentary calculations based on Shell's bills, which BTW are an absolute ball ache to decipher but anyway, and in the 6 months I can decipher 'accurately' (I've ignored anything before switch-over and smart meter installation as far as I can tell), my usage stands at:
E = 1495kWh
G = 3097kWh
Admittedly this is not during the coldest and darkest times of the year, but does include 3 adults + one child, me WFH most of the time, 4 TVs, 2 xBoxes, 3 VM boxes, 1 fridge, 1 fridge freezer and 1 freezer in the garage. Fortunately we have no dishwasher but does include tumble drying. Maybe my cavity wall insulation does work and so does the stuff in the loft hidden by boarding out and 3 tons of useful stored stuff/junk* (* delete as applicable). I've also invested in some cheap smart plugs for the TVs and have become somewhat retentive in my use of the app to turn said devices off. In some cases even whilst folks were watching stuff...#oops
all washed at home at a high temp
If that's for anti-bacterial/sanitation reasons, you could use an oxygen bleach stain remover in the wash (like Vanish, or any other own-brand similar one, they're all Sodium Percarbonate based) at a much lower temperature, and that'll sanitise the washing (but won't 'bleach' stuff like chlorine bleaches)
If that’s for anti-bacterial/sanitation reasons, you could use an oxygen bleach stain remover in the wash
@IHN it is and yes, I know. Mrs a11y knows that too - well, she bloody should cos I've mentioned it enough times . We've got a supply of Napisan but she persists with the higher temp washes for the scrubs. Can lead a horse to water etc. Believe me, frustrating.
Just got a 4 pack of those Tapo P110 smart plugs for £27.
I haven't been through this thread but anyone installed a full set of smart TRVs to heat a single room?
I haven’t been through this thread but anyone installed a full set of smart TRVs to heat a single room?
We didn't install it for that reason, but I've used ours in the past to do just that. Honeywell Evohome, 9 separate zones for us. We're happy with it.
So you have a hub, a thermostat that goes where the traditional one goes, and TRVs? I'm struggling to work out how the hallway thermostat interacts with the TRVs.
Current usage per annum:
Gas: 17,000 kWh
Electric: 4,500 kWh
Current avg. monthly dual fuel bill = £235. Here's where i think we'll be per month with the next few rises:
October'22 cap = £430
January'23 cap = £670 (est)
April'23 cap = £820
£10,000 per year on fuel is a terrifying prospect. A couple of years ago (and in a smaller home) we barely spent £1,000 a year.
Isn’t EDF owned by the french? amazing that we (UK) are subsidising french energy bills.
@mrsmith We're not, trust me on this. Theres a reason they're being renationalised and it's not because of how much money they are raking in from the UK.
I also found out that Spanish company Iberdrola (who own Scottish power) charge € 0.23 plus tax so €0.28 per kWh in mainland Spain on variable contract. How much is it in Scotland?
Totally different market. They only generate around 18% of their power from gas, we are more like 35%.
So you have a hub, a thermostat that goes where the traditional one goes, and TRVs? I’m struggling to work out how the hallway thermostat interacts with the TRVs.
@molgrips Assuming it's the Wiser system, the TRV's can be set to work indpendently OR the thermostat takes over as master with X amount of slave TRV's. It's basically there to control a number of radiators at once rather than having them all working independently of each other.
I’m struggling to work out how the hallway thermostat interacts with the TRVs.
Ideally you'd want the thermostat to be controlled along with the TRVs, so if all the TRVs are off, the thermostat is also switched off. Otherwise you can fire up the pump and boiler without any load - which isn't very efficient. Modern CH pumps are supposed to be flow / resistance sensing, so back off if there are few / no radiators open and the boiler should just heat the heat exchanger and then trip out once the water gets to max temp - still not ideal.
So you have a hub, a thermostat that goes where the traditional one goes, and TRVs? I’m struggling to work out how the hallway thermostat interacts with the TRVs.
Basically, yes. With Evohome the main control panel/screen is also a thermostat and you could use it like a traditional non-smart system without adding any smart TRVs. We don't use that thermostat to control our heating as the zone (hallway) ours sits in also has a rad with smart TRV - the smart TRV also being the thermostat/controller for whatever zone/room they're in. In Evohome's case you can add a remote thermostat to put in a more convenient place if the TRV's buried behind a couch or something (which wouldn't be an ideal location to take a representative temp of the zone).
We barely use the main control screen as the app works brilliantly.
Just checked how much I spent on electricity and gas in last 12 months, £1200 quid up until June this year.
So by my estimations that’s going to cost me around 3600 next year if I use the same amount
Luckily i have savings to be made, I spent the last 12 months not giving a crap about energy usage, I work from home and had the heating cranked up to 21 all day every day over the winter. That won’t be happening in future so I’m fairly confident I can get the costs under 250 per month. Still a big increase however and it’ll definitely be felt despite earning well above average wage
I do wonder how some of you guys are running up such huge bills however. Although I live alone I’m in a 4 bed house, albeit a new build. Some of the figures you guys are throwing about are absolutely crippling😬
Ideally you’d want the thermostat to be controlled along with the TRVs, so if all the TRVs are off, the thermostat is also switched off. Otherwise you can fire up the pump and boiler without any load – which isn’t very efficient. Modern CH pumps are supposed to be flow / resistance sensing, so back off if there are few / no radiators open and the boiler should just heat the heat exchanger and then trip out once the water gets to max temp – still not ideal.
That's what I'm going for but ideally, how modern do you mean? Mine is nearly 15 years old now.
I thought that you could simply run one rad and save loads of money but it may not be that simple. The rad has to siphon off a certain amount of hot water from the circuit, controlled by the lockshield valve (the one on the other side). But whilst you are only heating one room, the rad will get nice and hot but most of the water will still have to bypass it, returning to the boiler still hot. So I guess you still need the ballast radiators in the hallways, which is what I wanted to avoid as I do not need a warm hallway.
Unless the TRVs are smart enough to figure out how many rads are open and adjust the flow accordingly to distribute the heat?
I'm going to have to talk to Drayton.
I do wonder how some of you guys are running up such huge bills
1930s 4 bed detached house , has decent roof insulation,but no wall insulation and an ancient boiler from 1992 , plus WFH = 30000kwh of gas per year.
Arguably a new boiler and some wall insulation could reduce our gas bill substantially and given current prices could pay for itself within a year or two I would guess, so I might get that sorted out this winter.
