[Closed] Smart Light Switches

What sort of lights and do you have a neutral wire in your switch box?

Why does it need to be 'smart' i.e. what's wrong with how lighting in every other clinical setting works?

Dimmer switch?

The LightwaveRF stuff is Smart/Remote Controllable/Dimmable
Also very easy to control from Unix/Linux etc so easily BASH scriptable

https://lightwaverf.com/pages/smart-lighting

This is for a research project, currently the clown tasked with design has placed a Philips hue bulb into a ceiling tile and a separate programmable box from what wife informs me. The switch he is currently using isn't up to the job as need toggle through some modes to get to emergency/ task lighting which is not fit for purpose for the environment.
@cougar Not sure if has neutral but have seen for a lot of the smart switches it is needed - this will be in an intensive care unit so have limited knowledge of what there already.
@airvent - as per above it is a trial being conducted, attempting to improve patient experience and sleep using programmable lighting and circadian rhythms. As part of this they are trying to have different functions/ settings, including ability to go full light when needed, often in a rush.
Not sure standard dimmer will work as there appears to be defined separate programs turn on/ off.
Thanks @colp will point her in that direction.
Just trying to see what is out there already, the guy tasked/ pitched for designing it seems to have overpromised and underdelivered to date 🙁

If it really is emergency lighting you need then I would add emergency lights that are designed for the purpose.  They override the dim lights by virtue of the fact that they are brighter

If it isn't emergency you can still do the same, just add a second brighter lamp that will switch on when you need it even if the Philips hue is still on as well.  Way simpler than messing around trying to control the brightness of another bulb and way more robust

Thanks @leffeboy like that, keep simple with second task light and let fancy circadian one do it's thing. Maybe a double gang switch, on/ off for 2nd bulb and dimmer/ smart for other one.

Wiring through a relay with your smart switch and permanent supply would then allow you to position N/C switches around the room/area so when one is operated the relay changes over and put the perm supply to the lamps, reset the switch and it goes back to normal

@markspark like the idea of that nice and simple, will add to the list of potential fixes.
Cheers all

If you have a Philips Hue and a Hue hub you can buy a switch that turn the light on with a button press. It takes 2 or 3 seconds to go dark to full on the dimmer adjust bit. Works in parallel to any fancy app control.
We have one on our hall lights as it avoided chasing in switch cables. Works fine all the time, even when the phone app has an off day.
Apparently you can also get Hue to talk to Alexa and any other smart system.
Link below. Ours has the dimmer on 2 buttons not 1 but probably just this year's model.
https://www.argos.co.uk/product/8817680?clickSR=slp:term:philips%20hue:6:79:1

I’m pretty sure that the Shelly relays / dimmer would do exactly what you want. I’ve not used them but you can set up a button to control dimming and I’m pretty sure another button to switch everything on full when needed.

However from a casual reading of the FB support group I wouldn’t go near it for any kind of commercial project, let alone a medical one.

I’m pretty sure that the Shelly relays / dimmer would do exactly what you want. I’ve not used them but you can set up a button to control dimming and I’m pretty sure another button to switch everything on full when needed.

However from a casual reading of the FB support group I wouldn’t go near it for any kind of commercial project, let alone a medical one.

In the STW tradition of recommend what you use, they would be my vote too! Regarding the reliability, IMO they are absolutely fine - I've been using lots of them for a while now with zero failures. They require some competence to wire up correctly & with best practice... incorrect wiring or badly made connections can (and does) lead to overheating & melting, which is what you see sometimes on the FB group... don't think I've seen an example that wasn't likely down to user error though

Although you [I]could[/I] do everything through their cloud app/service, IMO this is the weakpoint, I'd definitely run a Home Assistant server (free, open source, very mature home automation software) to handle everything locally. This also allows you to program all the logic using a visual, flow based tool called Node Red (that isn't exclusive to HA though, you can run a NR server independently) It's very efficient & can be run on a Raspberry Pi (or any other linux computer). I've been running it for best part of a year now with zero failures.

Wiring through a relay with your smart switch and permanent supply would then allow you to position N/C switches around the room/area so when one is operated the relay changes over and put the perm supply to the lamps, reset the switch and it goes back to normal

I definitely agree with this though... have a hardwired switch (or switches) using relays to get everything back to "normal" with zero fuss. (No reason you can't use WiFi relays though to give both an automatic & manual backup option). You're probably going to want to install separate lighting anyway for the circadian stuff, in the form of 12/24v LED strips or panels which will allow you to get exactly the effect you want. (I wouldn't bother with trying to get the regular lighting to do dual-purpose)

I don't think this is something you can satisfactorily accomplish 100% with off-the-shelf solutions though, tbh better off outsourcing the job to someone who at least understands what all the different options & has some existing experience of implementing them! Can you get a local university involved, for example? IMO someone who already understood the hardware & software requirements could order the bits needed and then get this up & running in a day, the requirements sound pretty straightforward.

What happens to your smart light switch when you have an emergency and the WiFi's down? I'd leave the emergency light on a separate switch (maybe a nice big red one covered with a clear flap) and just use a Hue or whatever for the rest of the time.

What happens to your smart light switch when you have an emergency and the WiFi’s down?

in the case of a Shelly relay (and other systems) which are - they will still work as on/off without WiFi (although the fancy colour changing stuff won't function). (Phillips Hue would also work as long as the hub's powered that's RF not WiFi). That said, I installed a decent WiFi system (Unifi) in my place before Christmas and have enjoyed 100% uptime since, so although I've allowed for WiFi outage, it hasn't actually happened (yet).

For the circadian bit there are various options that fit into a consumer unit, just done similar for swimming pool lights (they go on/off with daylight). For the emergency lighting, there are lighting products that allow a simple three way single switch that work, dim / bright / off. Again fitted lights that do this, think they were collingwood (very good brand, fitted thousands of their lights), but might be wrong

The Hue dimmer switch doesn't need the hub to be on to work, according to Philips (see FAQs)
https://www.philips-hue.com/en-gb/p/hue-dimmer-switch--latest-model-/8719514274617#faq

The Hue app can have rountines programmed into it. There is also a sunrise and sunset feature that may do your circadian rhythms thing.
https://www.philips-hue.com/en-gb/support/faq/apps-and-software#How_does_the_SunsetSunrise_feature_work
Standard software will probably do 80 or 90% of what you want and something like if this then that will do the rest.
I should admit that we use few of the features. We turn our on, off and dim it using switch or phone depending of what is easier.

I'd be interested in finding out how he has done the Circadian rhythm bit - I've seen it done by connecting Hue to Samsung Smartthings or Apple Homekit, am sure there are others as well.

With the other bit, I'm assuming that he has set up either a switch like this Hue Smart Button:

or this Hue Smart Dimmer (that probably looks like a programmable box):

Both work in the same way, by setting the On button to cycle through 4/5 different "scenes". You do this in the Hue app. So that's probably what he's done. He could change it so that only 1 scene triggered the Circadian effect and all of the others were the emergency one, but that's a bit hacky.

The thing is, that a hue bulb needs power going through it all of the time, so likely there is still the old light switch somewhere near by. In the Hue app you can set what the default "On" state is - this is so that if your less technologically inclined household members just use the switch you can make it so that the default isn't BRIGHT WHITE. As this is actually the behaviour you want, then I would stick the Hue dimmer or button next to the old light switch and label one "Circadian Smart Lighting" and the other one "TOGGLE FOR EMERGENCY LIGHTING", and call it a day.

The whole thing sounds a bit mad though. I hope the NHS hasn't paid this guy to put in a Hue Bulb and switch.