[Closed] 'smacking children'...what's the STW opinion?

[i]'smacking children'...what's the STW opinion?[/i]

your own, possibly. other peoples definitely not.

Nope. Violence is not the answer.

Kids need to know why what they have done is wrong, and what its implications are for other people; not just to be afraid of punishment. There are plenty of ways to punish kids that are far more effective than simply hitting them.

There isn't neceassarily a right answer, is there though I'm sure that won't stop people claiming the one true way (TM).

I was much the same as the OP - smacked occassionally as a kid. I don't think it harmed me. Pre-kids, I've have said that I would probably do the same and smack if necessary.

Now that I have kids though, it doesn't seem to have been necessary so I never have. It could just be that my kids have personalities that work that way. Quite possibly other kids are different.

Most of the time, definitely not, but there are occasions where nothing else will work. Throwing a tantrum half-way across a zebra crossing and stomping off sideways, playing with electric sockets, that sort of thing, perhaps once a year.

I only smack other people's children

Give them a belt

And

Won't someone think of the children

That's basically the replies you'll get on here

I sit in the give them a belt camp

They don't need belts when they're young. Most of their troons are elasticated.

Just half a gram now and then, if they can't get to sleep.

I say take them to McDonald's or such like.

They won't realise it but you're actually setting them up for a lifetime of health and emotional issues.

In principle I don't think a light smack on a young child is wrong in certain circumstances (eg child running into road) but, like clubber, with my two it's never been necessary. Whether that's down to luck in having two fairly "good" kids I don't know.

Discipline not punishment.

I was smacked and worse as a kid.

I have no issue with it personally.

I never interact with kids so its of no concern to me

I was smacked as a kid and I think it did do me some harm -when it happened I feel like my mum had lost control of herself, and that things other than my behaviour at the time led to this happening

Because of this I think it's much better to have a clear "no smacking" policy - what you (as a parent) think of as "justified" smacking at the time may with hindsight not be

I was smacked and worse as a kid.

I was royally beaten for no reason as a child. As a weird bi-product I have a very high tolerance to pain.

I have absolutely [b]no[/b] issue with 'smacking' in the right context.

If you are tempted to smack your children I think it's time to improve your parenting skills. I would never ever lay a finger on my children. I think it's absolutely disgusting.

I'm not against it... although my lad has remarkably made it to 5 years old without it happening.

What *really* pees me off is parents who constantly threaten to smack but never actually do.

"If you do that again I'll give you such a smack!"

Kid does it again.

"If you do that again I'll give you such a smack!"

kid does it again

"If you do that again I'll give you such a smack!"

etc etc.

Either do it or don't do it but if both you and the kid know it's never going to happen you've lost already.

I was smacked as a kid (it would have to be exceptionally bad) and I don't think I've anything against it in principle. Luckily, I've managed to raise a 17-year old without having to resort to it myself. Maybe that's good parenting or maybe some kids just don't need it. I certainly wouldn't pass judgement on someone who did as I wouldn't have the necessary background information.

If you are tempted to smack your children I think it's time to improve your parenting skills. I would never ever lay a finger on my children. I think it's absolutely disg

So why is it legal?

I train teachers and children and young people's services employees in difficult and dangerous behaviour management and the use of reasonable force. My opinion is that smacking almost certainly wont be as effective as other options you might have because you are punishing behaviour that has already happened with an action that is completely unrelated to it. You are essentially saying "If you do this again I will hurt you again". The best way to alter a child's behaviour is to work out what is causing it (what need they are trying to meet through it) and fix that. The idea being that consistently doing this will stop all future incidents. So the message becomes; "I have fixed/explained the problem so there is no need for you to do this again." Or possibly "Here is a better response to this problem."
The other side of this issue is that as adults we should be role modelling the behaviour we want from our children, so by smacking them we are saying that violence can be the answer.

I do agree that there will occasionally be times when some kind of force is necessary however, as described by slowoldgit. Not sure if smacking is that force, but that's another discussion.

Just half a gram now and then, if they can't get to sleep.

Is that you dad?

Like a lot of the other replies, I'm not against a light smack in certain circumstances, but have never smacked either of my two children.

I've only smacked my kids a couple of times, once was to stop her biting me which was more of a natural reaction than a distinct decision, the other occasions were down to them putting themselves in danger and a rapid response which had to be be understood by the child. Other than that i'd rather not and dont and to be honest those things dont happen any more. I cant honestly say that i would never do it again though.

Just because it isn't illegal doesn't mean it is right.

@Hora: It's legal because otherwise parents would be afraid to pull children out of the way of a bus or break up a fight, not because it's the best way to discipline a child.

Re the safety issues like electric sockets or running into roads: I don't think most kids run into roads to deliberately be naughty - they just don't realise it's dangerous. So you should be able to train them as soon as they can walk to look out for dangerous stuff.

"Car comm!" was one of my youngest's first phrases, and I think "careful!" actually was my eldest's first word, which she said herself when she realised she was in danger of falling off something.

IF you're going to smack (although I'd prefer to grab, shout and explain) do it when they are being deliberately wilfully naughty. I think shouting and grabing is fine for danger situations - they can tell the difference between anger, danger, sadness and happiness pretty early on.

maybe some kids just don't need it

We had a discussion about smacking on another forum and ^ this came up alot.

Some kids are (I know you'll argue over this) better, calmer naturally.

Our friends daughter is a joy, lovely. Soo nice. Whereas our son pushed the boundaries of everything imaginable since he could walk. Both attend the same nursery and have known each other since 6months+ (in the same nursery).

re the road/safety issues. Here you go:

Our lad would ride towards a road on purpose, turn and grin. I quickly figured out he loved the reaction it gave. So I adjusted my reaction, calm, talked to him. Again he did the samething this time it was bloody dangerous. Before he could blink I had whipped his pants down and clipped him round the leg- that was a real shock. Guess what? Hes good as gold around roads now. Same with plugs- he went through the same situation/set up with them.

So AVOID ALL ROADS then huh? No. Why. Ridiculous.

You nip bad behaviour in the bud. Some kids are naturally better than others. Don't apply your wonderful 'technique' where talking to and getting around the need for smacking as 'good parenting'.

Not all children are the same.

It just seems like you've lost the argument if you have to resort to violence - I've never felt the inclination to smack my daughter.

I did once, when she was in a mood and hit me, hit her back with the same force* to demonstrate that hitting people hurts - she just looked surprised and agreed that it did hurt.

*she's 3 - so very little force indeed.

Again, good parenting will circumvent any need to hit a child.

[i]Again, good parenting will circumvent any need to hit a child.[/i]

and what percentage of the population would fall into the 'good parent' category 100% of the time.

Some people fail to be good parents ever.

Most of us would accept we've made mistakes as parents (and have hopefully learned from them).

Maybe smacking a child (and there's a a difference between being gentle and leaving the weals of a hand print) is a demonstration that the parent has failed on that occasion but it's not the end of the world.

Again, good parenting will circumvent any need to hit a child.

No thats your experiences in your situation with a different child.

Some kids lack the empathy required to see that you shouting and looking upset is a bad thing. That's hard to deal with, for sure. Still not convinced hitting them is a good idea though.

Our youngest is a bit like that - she laughs as you try and tell her off for some things. But she knows to look out for cars coming and to get out of the way or she might get squashed. I don't know why - maybe it's because as soon as she could walk she was out walking with us and was trained on this before she was old enough for silly buggers.

Depends on your own morals I guess. I am pretty shite at most things, but I know I'm a great parent. I barely work and don't care about it when I do work, im prob not a very good employee as it just gets in the way of the rest of my life. Being a great dad is the only thing I put loads of time into and when I look back should I live to be old, I won't have accomplished much in a career, but I know that I'll have spent far more time than most dads with their kids and enjoyed it immensely. The thought of laying even the slightest finger on my two girls has never ever occurred. Maybe I'm lucky to have always 'been there' for them, but I've no doubt that why they are the best behaved kids I've ever come across, and it wasn't accomplished through fear...

So why is it legal?

I'll always strive to be a better parent loddrik but my son will know risk, will grow up robust, fall alot, get hurt. Get back up.

A neighbour asked me if it was wise letting our son ride the national cycle centre bmx track at just 2. I said 'why not'? They'll be more to come. Hes going to live his life.

Agree with wwaswas..

@ loddrik: *bites tongue*

[i]Discipline not punishment.[/i]

I'd love to know what happens when the 1st part fails, & looking out there at lots of people (& where I work) It's blatantly obvious the discipline part has failed miserably.

A lot of prisoners I work with have violent tendencies because they were beaten as kids, others are totally undisciplined because they never had a smack, & there's a massive difference between a beating & a smack.

More interesting questions are
1. Why is it illegal to smack an adult but niot a child?
2. Why is it ONLY legal for me to smack my children?

Because if someone punched you in the street you'd rightfully feel aggrieved?

Its NOT legal to [b][i]smack[/i][/b] a child. Please make the right distinction. Smack is an emotive word that shouldn't be applied to this situation unless you are passively-trolling on such a subject.

I'm really surprised. I thought smacking was dead and gone.

I was smacked as a kid. Didn't really do me any harm but it tended to happen after a parent lost their temper.

The net result was that when I lost my temper I used to smack the crap out of my brother. I'd then get smacked myself and it turned into a bit of a vicious cycle.

I have never and would never smack my kids. They both know that hitting is wrong and they both know exactly where the boundaries lie.

Putting Lego away is a much, much more effective punishment...

Hell, smacking children SHOULD be legal. And let's make beating women legal while we're at it...

That'll learn the some respec'

Hell, smacking children SHOULD be legal. And let's make beating women legal while we're at it...

Have you been drinking? (serious question).

I don't drink. (Serious answer...)

Hoar is that to me, the Op , everyone else who used the word including the question you answered?

given the thread title and the use on here why have you waited till i posted to point this out?

I only repeated what you answered without making that point
Forgive me

If you are tempted to smack your children I think it's time to improve your parenting skills. I would never ever lay a finger on my children. I think it's absolutely disg
So why is it legal?

What next? Us 'drinkers' parents are morally-corrupt and its the reason why we 'smack' our children?

Is it..? I can't think of any other reason why anyone wold want to hit (or assault, as it would legally be classed as) their children.

I dont believe the occasional smack on the legs / bum does any long term harm if appropriately balanced by lots of love and affection if other areas of their life.

I'd say that sends out mixed messages. Why would someone who appears to love me want to hit me...

I got put over my dads lap a couple of times and smacked. hated it, but I don't think it's affected me.

That said, we've never smacked William, who's coming up to 4, but we've never needed to, he's a great little lad. he has his tantrums, as all toddlers / young kids do, but we tend to have a chat about it after it's happened.

I don't think he's ever been willfully 'naughty' tbh.

Why would someone who appears to love me tell me that I can't have X, Y or Z or do A, B or C?

I dont believe the occasional smack on the legs / bum does any long term harm if appropriately balanced by lots of love and affection if other areas of their life.

I'd add to that that you explain very quickly WHY the chastisement was delivered.

I've only needed to do this TWICE. Once with plugs (wanted to plug the tv in as I'd turned it off) and a bike on the roads.

Oh I was one of the last people to receive the cane BTW. Jesus wept I changed my ways after receiving that.

Discipline not punishment.

I'd love to know what happens when the 1st part fails

Keep trying to do it better.

Why would someone who appears to love me tell me that I can't have X, Y or Z or do A, B or C?

That's where you need to explain. Even if they are too young to understand what you are saying, it diffuses the situation, it shows them love and care, and in trying to get them to listen you'll learn about how to get them to listen in the future. Even if it fails for the first couple of years.

I've only needed to do this TWICE. Once with plugs (wanted to plug the tv in as I'd turned it off) and a bike on the roads.

So, does he not do these things now because he knows it's dangerous, or because he thinks Dad might smack him? (serious question)

Keep trying to do it better.

Either that or it goes chemical with a trip to the Psych/Doc's.

Some children really are more of a handful than others. WHAT do you do then?

I don't remember ever actually being smacked as a child, but I'm sure it must have happened from time to time, as I know if I had been REALLY naughty, I would have had a slap around the back of the legs - and my parents were great, I remember them with nothng but love. I kind of see the point of view of people saying "if you smack, you've lost control/the argument", but I also think, say I'd seen my own hypothetical child wanting to do something I knew was really dangerous, and I needed to head that behaviour off at the pass quicksharp, then I don't see physical chastisement as an option to be avoided.

As JY said, if you smack another adult, you'll end up being arrested etc. So the idea that its fine for a parent to smack a child; the smallest, must vulnerable human beings, is ludicrous.

I can't fathom why anyone would want to hit a child. I'm sure that most right minded people would spend a long time questioning and soul searching if they hit (assaulted) another adult, but hitting a kid.... No problem.

Keep trying to do it better.
How? Seriously. I know what happens the parents lose the battle of the wills and shrink into themselves. The child becomes what he/she wants (and becomes a madam etc).

That's your problem right there.

Why is it illegal for children to buy cigarettes and alcohol, to drive, to have sex, to get married? After all they are all people - right?

Ooo - just to add to the ineffectual parents thing, I've seen a couple of instances (once at a dentist, once on a boat ride) where the parents have tried (and failed) to control their children with "if you don't behave, the dentist/boat captain will be really angry with you!!" Not advocating slapping in those instances, but there's definitely folks out there who don't know how to drive their kids.

That's your problem right there.

Have any of your children been feisty or difficult (will not listen)?

Fervour - Likewise, if I starting kissing a stranger on the tummy and tickleing in them till they cried i would also be arrested.

Of course, they are children. But I am very patient with them and don't often lose my temper with them. I love them more than anything in the world, how could I possibly want to hit them. Me staying calm helps them react in a similar way.

You dont need to lose you temper to place a well timed smack. And likewise i would never hit them

+1 Loddrik - Why would you want to inflict violence on a child, it teaches them nothing other than you are hurting them.

We have managed to get ours to 14 & 16 without ever lifting a finger to them and they have had their moments like all kids, from what others say about them they seem to have turned out decent human beings.

Haven't ever had to smack any of my three yet.

Presently, one of the following seems to do the trick.

'Stop doing that or I'll wash your hair at bath time'

'Stop doing that or you won't go to Beavers/swimming/the swing park'

and

'Lose the attitude or I will pick you up in my pyjamas, and I will get out of the car'

Indeed but and this I always wonder... If it was shown that smacking (in a controlled way) was effective and lead to well balanced kids/adults, would it be ok then?

loddrik what will you do if in 3-5yrs one of your children starts getting into trouble/goes off the rails?

Pour them a cup of Chamomile tea and suggest Yoga?

I have exactly the same outlook as you Loddrick, except I have two hard fighting boys with clashing personalities..
I wonder if our reactions would be different if our circumstances were reversed?

Keep trying to do it better.
How? Seriously.

Good question. You really have to understand your kids and what's going through their minds when they act up - and if it's worth making a fuss over. Maybe some parents can't do this, in which case it's going to be difficult

My sister has a fairly hyper 6yo. When we were camping the other weekend, we had a raised fire basket thing. He had been told not to mess about whilst sitting around it, but there was another kid there and of course his mind wandered and there was a bit of very mild pushing and playing. My BiL told him off once and that he was being dangerous, then the second time shortly afterwards he was made to go and have a time out for punishment.

The thing is, he's really a good kid, but he's been punished far too much for things he doens't understand, he always has been. If they do try and explain to him what he's doing wrong, he thinks he's being punished so he shuts down and can't listen. He's also incredibly sensitive and can't handle his feelings of hurt when they are telling him off or punishing him. So he goes from fun to misery without really understanding why. I don't think it makes for a particularly secure environment.

They don't really understand how he works and how they need to deal with him, but they hand out (non physical) punishment when it's doing more harm than good.

I think the comparison between assaulting an adult and smacking a child is a bit irrelevant? The kind of force you'd use when smacking (open hand) a child would be laughable to an adult (obviously if you are using the same force that you'd hit an adult with than that is majorly wrong - and you need help!).

I don't remember being smacked but I did get the odd flick around the ear which provided a suitable short, sharp pain that was unpleasant enough to act as a deterrent without being mentally scarring and strangely I was still able to tell my dad loved me!

It is also perhaps a valuable a life lesson that if you wind some people up enough they will react violently (wrong as this may be).

All that said I don't have kids yet and not sure how I'd feel about if and when I do.

Fervour - Likewise, if I starting kissing a stranger on the tummy and tickleing in them till they cried i would also be arrested.

So, in other words hitting strangers bad, hitting people you know fine?

I think the comparison between assaulting an adult and smacking a child is a bit irrelevant? The kind of force you'd use when smacking (open hand) a child would be laughable to an adult (obviously if you are using the same force that you'd hit an adult with than that is majorly wrong - and you need help!).

Of course but its all relative isn't it. What is an acceptable amount of physical pain to inflict on a child then relative to the amount of physical pain you'd inflict on an adult?

Imagine how you'd feel if one of your colleages started pushing you in the chest whilst looking angry?

loddrik what will you do if in 3-5yrs one of your children starts getting into trouble/goes off the rails?
Pour them a cup of Chamomile tea and suggest Yoga?

I certainly won't be assaulting them.

I was brought up with, and (therefore not surprisingly) of the opinion that it's a good option to have as a last resort.

However, my routine brings me into contact with some mental health and paediatrics people, and their opinion is it [b][u]isn't ever[/u][/b] required. Now, that could be political correctness talking (the same phenomenon that gives us infant genital mutilation, as long as they are male), who knows, but I'd be extremely silly to completely dismiss their views.

Mol - if I'lld just scrapped a set of car keys down his car, I'll have said he has a good point ??

loddrik what will you do if in 3-5yrs one of your children starts getting into trouble/goes off the rails?
Pour them a cup of Chamomile tea and suggest Yoga?

Hora - tell me you are kidding, would hitting the kid help develop the rapport needed to get them back "on the rails"?

I would suggest it is more likely to cause them to step further away and be even more unruly.

I think it all boils down to circumstance... if a child is biting you and inflicting pain, then it is reasonable to give them an inclination of the pain they are causing, so they understand that it's not nice.

I'm quite confident that in the years between them being born leading up to the time of them biting, they'd have been educated to understand that biting anyone was completely unacceptable and therefore no biting would have occurred.

My kids know what is acceptable and what isn't. They know that hitting and telling anyone to shut up is not acceptable. They've known this from a very young age. I don't need to use violence to instil such boundaries.

Theres been a couple of knee jerk moments, one time when the daughter was very angry about being put in the car. When i picked her up she, lunged for my eyes and managed to hook her finger in. Purely on instinct, i "swatted" her arm away. One other time she was having a tantrum about leaving the swimming pool and then punched me in the knackers, again my arm was in motion before i'd thought about it. In neither case was the smack hard, but it was more of a shock for both her and me.

I'd not smack her in a premeditated way though, i think there are better ways myself.