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I have a single 3-pin electrical socket in the hall, and my wife has decided that's where she now wants her desk. Can I just switch this out to a double socket, or is it likely to be the end of the line/have a sensible reason as to why a single was fitted over a double?
And, whilst I'm on the subject, we also have an unsightly telephone extension cable fitted by previous owners, going up the side of the stairs. We don't have a landline and just use our mobiles. So, I can think of no reason to keep this line, but is there likely to be a future use or can I just chop it out? We have also since switched to full fiber, so doubt the line in box is even active any more.
Can I just switch this out to a double socket
Yes! If it's on a normal circuit with normal 2.5mm wire, anyway.
can I just chop it out?
Yes! The only possible future use would be if you got a landline.
Other than you may have to get a double that fit's a single backing box, no reason why you can't change it, or indeed fit a new box, but that's messy. Telephone, I'd just get rid of the extension and cut it off.
Can I just switch this out to a double socket<br />Yes! If it’s on a normal circuit with normal 2.5mm wire, anyway.
Double socket should be on a ring, so 2x 2.5mm cable.
A single socket suggests a spur, so 1x 2.5mm cable.
Pretty sure 2.5mm isn't rated for 26A continuous, which is potentially what a double socket could draw.
Although apparently most double sockets aren't rated for 26A continuous either!
I found a double socket on a spur in our house. I've kept it and couldn't be arsed the lift the floor to add it to the ring, so I just found where it spurred off (in a cupboard) so just added an inline 13A fuse to that spur.
Double socket should be on a ring, so 2x 2.5mm cable.
A single socket suggests a spur, so 1x 2.5mm cable.
nope and nope.
This is the only rule:
If the circuit is a ring circuit then an unfused spur can supply a maximum of one single or one double socket
Basically don’t spur off a spur.
OP, yes you can simply pop a double in.
If the single is chased into a wall you can buy a special back box that recesses into the single back box but gives you room (for a slightly proud) double socket.
Edit: not quite what I described above, this is genius though: 1gang to 2 gang socket.
Or just use an extension…
spurs can be doubles no issue. IIRC nowadays houses tend not to be wired in rings anyway?
goldfish has it
I've added a couple of those screwfix single to double sockets linked above. No issues. A neat and easy way to get a double socket. I does sit about 10-15mm proud of the wall compared to 5mm of a normal faceplate.
But I also agree - if for computer stuff get an extension lead. one plug per monitor, one for laptop power lead, one for a phone charger. Can easily be hidden below or behind the desk.
Watch out for the 10kV when cutting the phone line........!
nope and nope.
Did not know that....
IIRC nowadays houses tend not to be wired in rings anyway?
Can't see how else you'd do it efficiently with the number of sockets in modern houses. Rings are very efficient in terms of total cable length used esp if you have lots of banks of sockets close together. You'd not want to bring back 50x 2.5mm cables to a consumer unit and try and connect them up....
Ring mains are a no-longer-done hang over from the Post-war years. It was to save on copper in the 1950s, being able to use thinner cable and less of it than otherwise needed.
There is a flaw in using ring mains. If the socket is at the furthest reach of the ring, then yes the power is carried equally by the 2 cables in the ring. But when it's close to the consumer unit the majority of the current is carried by the shorter leg in the ring. Which can in some circumstances exceed the cable rating.
2.5mm^2 cable is usually rated to 27 amps (assuming not installed in a bundle or stuffed inside insulation etc - you do need to be aware of that) and a double socket should be drawing 26A max (2x13A).
It's a problem when it's daisy-chained to another or unprotected spur-off-a-spur, IF the cable upstream isn't thick enough.
Yep, have a 9 way under my desk and it’s completely full….
Only 9... I have x2 6 way extensions under mine and currently have...
Screen
Laptop
PC
Phone charger
Tablet charger
Fan
Router
Openreach box
Blink camera hub
Hue lights hub
Alexa
(sockets have not caught fire... yet)
Single sockets were favoured back in the day to just provide somewhere to plug the vacuum in. That's why they're often found in halls and landings of older (mid-20thC) houses.
Fun fact, when post-war Britain was being rebuilt the thinking was that people only needed one socket per room, as a household was generally thought to only have one or two two-bar 3kw electric heaters which they would move around the rooms with them. Also ring final circuits were developed as copper was very scarce and expensive, so 2.5mm could be used when connected in a ring as there were two routes (legs) for the current to flow. The larger 30A fusing allowed for both heaters to be plugged in.
Also, one pendant light was put in a bedroom just in front of the window to make it harder for people to see in if there were either no curtains or just net curtains, so affording a degree of privacy. I think the idea was that the glare of the (bare) lamp would obscure anything behind it.
I'm great at parties...😑
Thank you!
More outlets are always a bonus, but in this case, she will just be plugging her laptop in and a desk lamp, and I want to put a socket in with a couple of USB outlets which will power ideally a wireless charger and iPad.
Single sockets were favoured back in the day to just provide somewhere to plug the vacuum in. That’s why they’re often found in halls and landings of older (mid-20thC) houses.
That interesting. I'm currently doing up a flat for my MIL and was wondering at the weekend why there is a single socket near the front door.
Next question then is why they put the landline socket halfway along the only wall that isn't suitable for a sideboard, table or any sort of unit. Literally, the worst possible place for it. Its not even on an outside wall so not as if it was the easiest spot for BT.
But when it’s close to the consumer unit the majority of the current is carried by the shorter leg in the ring. Which can in some circumstances exceed the cable rating.
Although as the shorter length heated up, it's resistance would rise, thus more current would flow via the longer length. Be interesting to see how much an effect this actually had, probably not much unless it got really hot.
Ring mains are a no-longer-done hang over from the Post-war years. It was to save on copper in the 1950s, being able to use thinner cable and less of it than otherwise needed.
Still super efficient in terms of wiring in the consumer unit eg our kitchen has 10 double sockets, but only a pair of 2.5mm to fit into the breaker. I'd hate to bring back 10x 2.5mm (or thinner) and try and cram them all in...
Also, one pendant light was put in a bedroom just in front of the window to make it harder for people to see in if there were either no curtains or just net curtains, so affording a degree of privacy. I think the idea was that the glare of the (bare) lamp would obscure anything behind it.
I always wondered why they put a light there!
Also, one pendant light was put in a bedroom just in front of the window to make it harder for people to see in if there were either no curtains or just net curtains, so affording a degree of privacy. I think the idea was that the glare of the (bare) lamp would obscure anything behind it.
Interesting all our pendants are exactly central to each room. House is Victorian with original ceilings and the pendants haven't been moved (you'd see where they'd tried to repair the Victorian pebbledash effect).
the 20s house I lived in in manchester had the bedroom lights close to the windows
Footflaps, you wouldn't be bringing lots of 2.5 cables back. Modern practice is 2.5mm radial circuits, with 20A breaker. Can serve a smaller area than rings (50m2 Vs 100m2), but overall not really any more cable, and twice the number of breakers but they're only a few quid, and large CUs common cheap too.
Radials arguably safer. It's surprisingly common to find a break in ring (wire loose or popped out the back of a socket), but joe public would be totally unaware of the fault. A fault like that in a radial and downstream sockets stop working, so gets investigated.
4mm radials on 32A rcbo ftw. It's definitely the way forward, I half expected ring circuits to be abolished when the current edition of the Wiring Regs was published. I'd imagine the committee who decide such things are all old school, but once they are all gone ring final circuits will be gone too (btw, they're not ring mains, that's the name of the feeder cable supplying houses externally, usually under the road). The added benefit of 4mm T&E is that, despite being slightly thicker, it's more flexible as it's stranded, whereas 2.5mm is a solid conductor, therefore easier to terminate in back boxes.
One thing that can help is having a monitor which in itself is also a USB-C docking hub that can power your laptop and have all the usb peripherals connected along with phone chargers and so on. Can really help on cable clutter and would obviously reduce the wall socket requirement.