Anyone ever had these? Or know someone who has? And more importantly do they work?
I've been playing guitar for 35yrs now and find myself spending more and more time on the acoustic in my old age. I can comfortably play and sing at the same time but my voice is woeful. Think getting this sorted might be a good thing to finally fix.
No, yes, and yes in that order. My son, used to sing and have group lessons as part of the youth theatre group he's been with for the last 8 or so years, and then a couple of years back as a prospective lead as he got older was invited to have some 121 lessons. It was very timely as his voice was changing at the time and now it's broken properly we've kept on with some paid for. It's a technical skill like any other and anyone can 'sing' but to use your vocal chords and diaphragm properly is a different matter.
I'm sure there are loads or famous rock singers who will never have had a lesson, equally I'm sure many have a proper vocal coach, not least because doing it right helps prevent damage.
I think he's 'quite good' now, has played leads in some decent shows. More importantly, the admissions people at Urdang Academy (kind of RADA but more specifically aimed at musical theatre types) rate him enough that they offered him a place to start their three year course yesterday, after his audition last week. Triple threat (sing dance act), especially pleased as he hasn't danced a lot since he had his op last October, only been properly back at it for 2 months or so.
I'm boasting I know. I don't care 😉
Yes. I come from a singing family and gained a choral scholarship to a college choir. I was taught to sing on the hoof as it were, but after my voice broke I had a few years away from singing.
I started again five years ago and realised I had missed singing. I took in -person lessons which were a great help in getting me back up to a decent standard. Singing is a discipline like any other, it takes dedication and practice, and there are techniques and pitfalls you need to know about.
Give it a go!
Not very rock and rollins
I've sung in a choir doing renaissance music for thirty years. Never had lessons, just growled away in the lower registers. I did learn about diaphragm support and stuff though.
Curiously when I hit sixty I suddenly found I could sing properly, all to do with shaping vowels at the front of the mouth and resonance in the roof of the mouth and upper face. Getting much more pleasure out of my singing now. Get lessons, with the right teacher it can really help.
I've sung in a choir doing renaissance music for thirty years
ooh, sounds great. Which choir?
Not very rock and rollins
Ha i'm aiming for a Justin Sullivan (New Model Army) type thing but my voice is just shocking. Just to be vaguely in key would be enough.
I’ve had some group lessons, but I think 121 lessons would be great for what the OP has mentioned - tips about staying in tune, and about what range suits your voice. I do sing with my own band from time to time, and over the years I feel that I’ve gotten a little less terrible. But this is really only due to picking songs which suit my voice and staying away from other songs which I find harder to sing. I will never be a great, or even good singer, but knowing which keys or high/low notes suit your voice, at least you can make the best of it.
@scapegoat, one affiliated to the university in Edinburgh, not professional standard though but not bad.
@scapegoat, one affiliated to the university in Edinburgh, not professional standard though but not bad.
EURS? Just listened to some of your Tallis. Wonderful.
Our modest little church choir often does Tallis. We're doing In Manus Tuas on Good Friday. Here's us doing Allegri's Miserere during lockdown.
Ye, that's the one. Nice rendition of the Allegri, not every choir has a soprano prepared to sing top Cs on their own! Hard to explain to others why I enjoy singing that sort of music more than any others though!
I think that unaccompanied polyphony is some of the purest music out there. I sing a lot of more popular stuff in an ensemble, but if forced to choose it’d be early English and renaissance.
My cousin is a professional singer and singing teacher, she makes a good living out of 1-1 lessons and does it online. She says anyone can be taught to sing.
I'm sure there are loads or famous rock singers who will never have had a lesson, equally I'm sure many have a proper vocal coach, not least because doing it right helps prevent damage.
There are three singers, two of which I’ve seen perform several times, the other released a single and an album, but never really followed up on it, and all ended up as voice coaches. One is Ginny Clee, (who’s husband was former Shriekback bass player Simon Edwards) and who was one half of the duo The Dear Janes, with Barbara Marsh, one is Sam Brown, daughter of Joe Brown and classical singer Vicki Brown, who had some chart success in the 90’s, and Stevie Lange, who was married to Mutt Lange, the recording producer. I’ve met lots of singers over the years, very few, if any, as far as I know, have had lessons, but all have a natural talent for pitch and control.
I’ve met lots of singers over the years, very few, if any, as far as I know, have had lessons,
Maybe not as many in rock and pop, but in the theatre where you have to sing a range of songs every night, and twice a day at the weekend, it's far more likely for a singer to be taught. Many 'stunt' actors in the musicals - the term for the guest from the rock and pop or cinematic world who's ported in to play a lead role in a musical often can only do short runs and half the shows etc., because they don't have the stamina of the trained voices to be able to last the pace, and comment how hard it is.
Which is also sort of why I'm also so proud of my lad - I've made no secret he's trans and so he socially transitioned just as Covid happened and switched to playing male roles at that time. He was a tall 13/14yo then and so got cast into older male roles (youth theatre, the adult roles are all played by the older kids) and was forcing his voice into lower registers than it was really capable of, which wasn't good for it and was where the vocal coaching really helped. Since we managed to sort out hormone treatment (blockers and T-gel) as well as the effect on 'girl problems' which is very welcome, his voice then broke and he had to relearn to sing properly, but now his voice has settled to a decent tenor. No, it's more than decent, it's Urdang quality good. Then as soon as possible after he was 18, we went through the counselling / psych testing that approved him for top surgery and he had that done in October which is why he didn't audition to go last year and is now doing it as a 19 yo but also recovery meant he couldn't do as much dance until it had all healed properly so he was going into auditions a bit undercooked on that too.
Sorry, going off topic but telling the world because he is amazing and has achieved this by a lot of hard work and some brilliant teachers. None of whom are MTBers, so won't see this but thanks anyway.
This is what I mean:
I’ve seen them work in baby singing groups. One dad was never in tune, like totally going the wrong way for every note, and he got better!
My friend does online lessons if you want to know you’re giving your cash to someone outdoorsy and nice: https://ailsanicholson.co.uk
I've recently returned to taking a guitar to jam nights in a local pub. I found there were some people who "performed" and some who just wanted to grunt their way through and were happy to get to the end unscathed. Unlike the listeners.
I wanted to be in the first group, and I think I was doing ok, and that people were pleased when I started a number. However, as it was quite a non-judgemental thing it was difficult to tell.
I just emailed a local music school and had about 12 lessons. One to one. I loved it, my range improved, I learned which parts of my chest and head voice to use, I was given confidence that my natural sound was fine, and yes, loud is good. You might hate hearing your weird voice when played back, but a lot of the best singers have weird voices objectively. Think Brian Ferry, Edwin Collins, Willy Nelson Tom Waits etc.
Never too late either, I'm 71.
As ive delved into this world a bit deeper i stumbled across a video where someone explains posture in relation to the guitar, and the importance of being upright rather than hunched over the fretboard looking at your hand. This is such an obvious thing that i'm annoyed i didnt think of it sooner. It has made a a world of difference. Proper night and day stuff.
Thanks for the link @stwhannah i'll give that a look
@bigjohn thats the kind of story that is pretty motivating. And i always love theotherjonv's updates on his lad.
OP I think I was in a similar position to you: been playing guitar for 30ish years, always been able to sing a bit but totally untrained, not very confident in my voice, never particularly liked the sound of it, etc.
Then I started playing in a doom band and wanted to do distorted vocals, and every sane teacher on YT says the same thing: don't try this unless you have a decent clean singing technique as it's easy to hurt yourself if you don't understand what you're doing.
So I found a teacher. She mostly teaches musical theater I think, but was unphased by the doom/screaming thing.
We've mostly been working on my clean singing and mechanics and it's honestly been revelatory. I think I sound a lot better than I did before: my resonance, stability, and range are all much improved. Equally importantly I'm a lot more confident in my singing now, which is a game-changer in itself. Being happy to try something, have it go wrong, and laugh it off before tweaking the approach to make it work, is like a superpower compared to how I used to feel about vocals.
I think if it's something you're interested in doing, a good teacher is definitely worth it.
Tomparkin's comment reminded me of one of the biggest benefits of a good teacher: breathing. Where I used to mark up my song sheets with chord changes I now also remind myself where to breathe when coming up to tricky passages.
Anyone ever had these?
Yes
Or know someone who has?
And more importantly do they work?
Yes
I had some from my brother in law who's a pro music teacher and singer. They were very helpful and now I'm significantly more tuneful 😄
