[Closed] Should I just stay in ? (motorist confrontation content)

A few hundred yrs later

Your bike allows you to time travel?

What would you have done?

Ride past and enjoy the rest of my day, rather than failing to change his behaviour by confronting him then impotently whinging about it on an internet forum he undoubtedly doesn't read.

How were you equipped?
[img] [/img]
in reality

rather than failing to change his behaviour by confronting him

Option 1 for you then Zokes

Option one for me to.

A few years ago I had a quiet word with a chap in a red Porsche, something along the lines of "nice car, shame you were too thick to tick the handsfree phone kit option on the order sheet"

It got nasty and I ended up breaking his index finger which resulted in many months of rather unpleasant dealings with him, his solicitor and the police.

If it hasn't affected you directly then best to keep walking.

Unless you are prepared to fight, mind your own business.

Broke his index finger on your face?

I'd say there's at best a tiny chance you'll change anyone's behaviour by confronting them in the circumstances you describe. So unless you actually enjoy getting pointlessly stressed don't do it.

I'd have told you to **** off too. No business of yours to get involved.

"All evil needs to prevail is for good men to do nothing"

or something like that.

No business of yours to get involved.

So you would never confront somebody under any circumstances? I tried to stop a drunk driving out of a car park once. He could barely walk. I called the police and hopefully he was arrested.
What would you have done in those circumstances?

Bear in mind I didnt hunt this guy down it was simply that our paths happened to cross a few minutes later.

Ive been known to say things like this and it inevitably gets angry and confrontational. I need to step back from things like this as I'm going to get arrested or run over.
You wont change their behaviour because they honestly don't think they are doing anything wrong.

Broke his index finger on your face?

Heh, not far off.

I grabbed his hand to stop him hitting me which in his eyes was me attacking him.

I need to step back from things like this as I'm going to get arrested or run over.

I think thats where I am this is the second "incident" I have had over the last few weeks so I need to change my behaviour.

What outcome did you honestly expect when you chose option 1?

What outcome did you honestly expect when you chose option 1?

Thats a good question and I did think about this and thats why I didnt stop or unclip as I made eye contact. I didnt intend to corner him into apologising etc as that would be stupid I really just wanted to make a point and ride off. I suspected he would be surprised and possibly for him either not to react, ignore me or even look a bit sheepish. He simply got very abusive and shouty at me which escalated it.
I'm not proud of the next bit but given what happened should I simply ignore things like this in future?

In a zombie city you do the Bourne hit by riding close to the window of his car and let Benneli M4 does the job.

Or

In your situation you should do nothing as no one was hurt.

Or

If you have a helmet cam everything can be captured on your cam and you pass the information on.

I prefer Bourne hit but then I would be blamed for trying to stop a zombie.

So option 1 for me. i.e. do nothing.

🙄

I've never had a motorist threaten me. I suspect that

A. I'm reasonably big and ugly enough where lots of motorists wouldn't fancy their chances and

B. I generally expect motorists to drive selfishly and without consideration of a cyclists needs so tend to overlook all but the absolute worst of motorist behaviour.

As for drink driver, I wouldn't bother getting involved, but I'd probably call the police if bad enough.

Would the police really act on helmet cam footage?

I'd say there's [s]at best a tiny[/s] eff all chance you'll change anyone's behaviour by confronting them

I suspected he would be surprised and possibly for him either not to react, ignore me or even look a bit sheepish. He simply got very abusive and shouty at me

your pop psychology is not very good.. have you had much social interaction with other human beings..?

muddydwarf - Member

Would the police really act on helmet cam footage?

No sure but my guess is this may depend on the mood of the police on day to see if they need to boost their statistical findings for offenses.

I'm resolving today that unless the driver is actively harassing me/threatening my immediate safety with his driving I'm going to stay schtum. It does no good to get into an argument and I'm the one who ends up angry and stressed.

have you had much social interaction with other human beings..?

Mmm. Well each situation is different he was about 40, in a nice Merc and well dressed so my on the spot assesment was that he may react in the way I described, again given that I simply made a gesture and didnt stop and confront him as such.
I wouldnt expect that response from 3 bruisers in a transit van in Birkenhead hence my response would be different!

innit funny how differently we can view the world..

I would have made the exact opposite assessment, bruisers and all!
Middle aged well dressed bloke in a nice merc = obnoxious prick IME

I'm just thinking that anyone that openly flouts the law isn't likely to be humbled too much by a preachy nerd on a pushbike (their probable on the spot assessment, not mine 😉 )

For what it's worth I'm no better and found myself sneering condescendingly at a very minor momentary lack of attention by another road user yesterday.. 😳

Muddydwarf I think that is a good resolution I am going to follow your lead.

Watch me lose my rag on my next ride 🙁

My fuse is way too short and I'm going to stop enjoying my rides if i let the dickheads upset me.

I dont know why I bother going out on the road anymore

Your problems are not going out on the road but thinking that motorists behaving like this are likely to change/accept they are not correct.

but thinking that motorists behaving like this are likely to change/accept they are not correct.

OK Al. The whole thing kicked off when I pointed out that he shouldnt be driving and phoning. My question is should we never confront bad, inconsiderate and sometimes dangerous behavior? Should we always just ignore it and in doing so do we improve things or does our apathy reinforce it?

Would the police really act on helmet cam footage?

Doubt it. Unless it was very close up and clearly showed the driver speaking into the phone he might get off.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/42511/Legal-loophole-clears-MSP-of-using-his-mobile-phone-while-driving

Tracing the driver of a car afterwards is time consuming. Far simpler, if the police want to enforce mobile phone laws, for the police to catch drivers on the spot ensuring to get a verbal admission of phone use or alternatively seize the phone to get it examined.

Assuming that mobile phone use is on the radar as far as policing priorities go. Have traffic depts not been cut in the last few years?

Mobile phone use whilst driving is one of those things that makes me see red, but I'm not going to change their habits by yelling at them.
I just wish they could understand how dangerous it is, but they truly believe they are fantastic drivers and its not dangerous.

surfer - Member
should we never confront bad, inconsiderate and sometimes dangerous behavior? Should we always just ignore it and in doing so do we improve things or does our apathy reinforce it?

IME the majority of bad drivers think they are fine and are too stupid/proud to see otherwise, and those who are happy to apologise/acknowledge their wrongdoing go so without being asked.

You aren't in a position of authority in the drivers mind to give any advice. However it may stimulate discussion if the driver talks about it afterwards with people who he does respect. If you get aggressive I guess that would bias the outcome of those discussions.

I've had face to faces with 2 drivers. The first was an old fella who was very apologetic, but I was quite angry and I'm not proud of that. .The second was defused as I approached the car and realised the driver had learning difficulties. We just had a conversation about how she should be taking a particular junction (not on the wrong side of the road!). Ended with us apologising to each other 🙂

I had one driver cut me up by pulling right across me at the last minute heading into the Tesco car park. I shook my head at him and then, as i was locking my bike up i saw him walking across the car park towards me.
I tensed up ready for a barney and was most surprised when he profusely apologised for his driving, telling me his son was a cyclist. I was pretty embarrassed by my initial response and didn't quite know what to say.

No business of yours to get involved.

of course it is his business - he uses the road and the pavement next to it doesn't he.

The driver was breaking the law and not in full control of his car, hence endangering other road users and anyone near the road.

Isn't it just road rage though..? except for the fact that you are already 'out of your car' so to speak and banging on their window..

Cyclists are roundly despised enough by motorists as it is, without a mob of snotty know it all vigilantes getting all irate and waving their bicycle clips at anyone they perceive to be driving outside of the highway code..

Like I said, I do it myself, but it can't be a positive thing surely..?
Maybe cyclists should be granted special police powers..?

[i]I wouldnt expect that response from 3 bruisers in a transit van in Birkenhead hence my response would be different!
[/i]

When I used to confront people, guys in vans were always the most willing to respond favourably. It's the cocks in expensive cars who are most likely to want a fight.

I was following some d1ck on a brompton in London in the week and he would go up onto the pavement at the slightest provocation to avoid some lorry parked at the kerb.

Felt just as much 'rage' and would normally have chased him down to tell him what a d1ck he was, but I have a knackered ankle atm.

I might also have told him what a d1ck he looked on the brompton as he was bobbing up and down severely, I think he needed a stiffer elastomer...

banging on their window..

Easy Yunki, I wasnt "banging" on any windows

without a mob of snotty know it all vigilantes getting all irate and waving their bicycle clips at anyone they perceive to be driving outside of the highway code..

Well thats a bit pjeroative. You say "Highway code" I say "law" I dont go around looking for people who drive at 31 in a 30 so dont misrepresent me. I have made it clear what I did and I wouldnt call what he did as "trivial" I am not proud of my response but I am interested in what others would have done in the first instance ref pointing out or not that he shouldn't be using his phone, whilst speeding !

Maybe cyclists should be armed?

Apologies surfer.. I wasn't attacking you.. Just playing devil's advocate..

I reckon its pretty impossible to say what anyone else would have done... some days, some moods, some circumstances you would be confrontational. Other days... meh, walk on by.
You did what you did, probably made no difference to the knobber in the Merc. Can you imagine [i]anyone[/i] who would react differently to how he did though?

No worries Junki 😀

This has been quite interesting reading for me.

I commute (by bike) daily through Bristol and my opinions have changed as the years have gone by. I would consider myself a pretty battle hardened city cyclist and was very militant at one point but found that regular confrontation was gaining nothing but stressing myself out.

Nowadays I don't sweat the small stuff, i've found eye contact and a disapproving headshake is just as effective as banging on the window. If someone cares if they have done wrong they will learn from having it noticed.

Can you imagine anyone who would react differently to how he did though?

Yes I did. If I thought it would kick off like that I wouldnt have got involved TBH. I thought he would just maybe reflect at least for a second. We all make mistakes on the road and occasionally get the head shaking treatment etc and most timed you just suck it up if you know you are in the wrong. What I find more prevalent on the road is people who are aggressively indignant if you have the affront to be a bit pi**ed off with their behavior.

If illegal behaviour like this guy's was challenged more frequently then maybe we'd have fewer than 5 dead people a day on UK roads.

This kind of low level law breaking - speeding, mobile phone use, sat nav fiddling etc etc is pretty much the social norm and considered acceptable behaviour. Despite the dead people.

Drink driving and smoking have been tackled in part because they became socially unacceptable. Pretty much everyone cares about what other people think of them, so I'm with those like the OP who challenge such irresponsible driving. If we all did it, maybe there'd be fewer dead people and maybe our world would be a little more pleasant, and driving and cycling would be that bit more enjoyable...

I was following some d1ck on a brompton in London in the week and he would go up onto the pavement at the slightest provocation to avoid some lorry parked at the kerb.

I'd do the same. Minus the Brompton though...

a few occasions when i have told drivers to get off the phone, never polite, never quiet, and always in the middle of town.

Most drivers are scum.

see plenty of drivers jump red lights, as for obeying speed limits or parking restrictions!!!

If i could report every driver i see driving dangerously or breaking the law to the police i would, i just tend to report one or two a week.

Numbers game, screw the police statistics and maybe they will actually do something about driving offences.

Smashed his face in,then shot him,then burnt his car out but I do reside in the 'Pool.
Really I would have ignored it. I see such appalling driving whilst riding and driving it amazes me but as stated he's a moron and would never see your point. Only winding yourself up I fear.

[i]We all make mistakes on the road ..[/i]

USing a phone in the car isn't a "mistake". It's being an arrogant dick, so you'd always get the arrogant dick response.