[Closed] Sherlock

if you look on the iplayer there's a 7 minutes intro video - worth a look....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p01np1b8/Sherlock_Series_3_Sherlock_Mini_Episode_Many_Happy_Returns/

Got it on series link as at work until 10.

my goodness, its (IMHO) a bag of tripe so far this series. slapstick, filler scenes with very very little plot so far.

as soon as i saw the bomb on the underground i said "they will have it on a timer so they can reconcile with each other". BINGO. 2 min timer. why?

Last nights was ssslllloooooowwwwww and really dull. So why bother with 90mins of Watsons wedding? One storyline, one beer line, one outcome.
Whilst I usually love Sherlock, I even got MrsBouy into it, I found it a bit dull. So I'll wait for the next installment...

2 min timer. why?

Because it's not real.

both episodes have been dull. I watch crime dramas to see the crimes being solved, not for 90 mins of filler. proper crime, proper detection please.

Ahhhhhh well in that case Drac, lets have us find out Sherlock is an Alien!

Ahhhhhh well in that case Drac, lets have us find out Sherlock is an Alien!

Khan they do that?

I've enjoyed it, but not as much, its been some hit and a large chunk of miss for me. Its a very different show this series - more humour, but less clever, and its suffered for it.

I really didn't go for the "sherlock as T1000" action stuff. This seems to be losing touch with the roots of the show (i.e. diabolical plotting and cat and mouse detecting action).

Freeman and Cumblebinderstick and as sharp as ever as the leads, but they're struggling a bit to save the show, I think.

Time at the bar, after this series.

Only seen the first of the new series so far, and it was pretty crap. Unfortunately I don't think Moffat has the ability to keep developing characters and plots, he runs out of ideas, and the plot just becomes hollow self promotion.

Haven't seen it yet but I got married there!

Goldney Orangery? It's lovely, isn't it?
But have you had sex in the grotto?

1st episode was a bit mince tbh, but I enjoyed the script of last nights. Echoes of Dr Who in the first one about how to get yourself out of a sticky script/plot line.

Well I enjoyed it. I thought the whole programme was more about the development of the relationship between Sherlock, Watson and Mary.

Also Sherlock (self-confessed "high-functioning sociopath") struggling with his emerging capacity to have emotional feelings towards the other two was interesting and well played.

I suppose if all you're interested in is the nuts and bolts of a "crime procedural" this would have been a bit disappointing.

I thought it was bloody hilarious, frankly.

sex in the grotto?

Is this some new position I should be aware of?

Goldney Orangery? It's lovely, isn't it?
But have you had sex in the grotto?

You're joking, aren't you??! It costs £160 an hour to open the grotto!

Its a very different show this series - more humour, but less clever, and its suffered for it.

^this

[i]It costs £160 an hour to open the grotto! [/i]

euphemism of the day.

[quote=Mr Woppit ]Well I enjoyed it. I thought the whole programme was more about the development of the relationship between Sherlock, Watson and Mary.
Also Sherlock (self-confessed "high-functioning sociopath") struggling with his emerging capacity to have emotional feelings towards the other two was interesting and well played.
I suppose if all you're interested in is the nuts and bolts of a "crime procedural" this would have been a bit disappointing.

I got that but when you've spent 2 out of 3 episodes setting up the relationships, you better have a bloody stunning 3rd episode to make the BBC commission another series. The crimes in the first two episodes just seemed lobbed into the programme for the sake of completeness rather than because there was any point.

Mind you, was still better (just) than Prime Witness which I thought was lazy tripe

I thought it was bloody hilarious, frankly.

Me too for the most part. Too lighthearted for some but who cares. The pi5hed scenes in particular were chuckle-worthy.

I got that but when you've spent 2 out of 3 episodes setting up the relationships, you better have a bloody stunning 3rd episode to make the BBC commission another series.

...and this^

Fell asleep half way through, what did the dead soldier have to do with it?

previous murder committed by the would-be-killer-photographer

Prime Witness

= silent witness?

Yep. Thingy Witness. Exactly. The groundskeeper at the end was just really odd. Added nothing to the story, just felt tossed into the pot

emsz - He was killed in a specific way which was relevant to the story later. Sort of.

I quite enjoyed it

but it did drag a bit in the middle, just like a real wedding speech!

...speaking of sh&* plots and specials. jeez Dr Who!!!!

Yep. Thingy Witness

Used to be good, that.

I also liked it 🙂

...Runs Away.

Prime Witness
= silent witness?

Me likey SW. Ms Fox is also damn fit and recently back on the market 🙂

Yup ok I'll concede that I expected more from a plot of a "giz a hug bro'" episode and yes it's early days in so the "entertainment only on Sunday" seekers get to understand the characters, which I know will bind us to the relationships more than the plot lines. I guess it’s just the same format used in many series the Beeb have produced so far, but it is an entertaining programme and yes I was intrigued to see the “how he done it” in the last episode, but again the writers did run over the plot over and over again.. you know just to hammer home the simple’ness of the plot to the unread/washed etc. Etc. As for the drunk bit(s) well I thought it a bit silly..

You're joking, aren't you??! It costs £160 an hour to open the grotto!

I don't know about that. I lived in Clifton Wood as a student, & was quite good at climbing walls. Perhaps they didn't have bars on the grotto back then. I've not been in the gardens for 5 years or so, but have many happy memories of the them.

I thought it was a bit slow and lackingng direction but rather enjoyed how it all pulled together for the climax.

The best description I've seen of last night's episode so far: "like an episode of Spaced, if Mike and Brian occasionally solved crimes in Spaced".

I wish they were doing 4 or 5 one hour episodes, rather than three 90 minute episodes.

I thought last night's was funny. I was starting to worry that they'd completely lost the plot, but then the final crime solution pulled together all the threads from the episode. I assuming that the third episode will pull together seemingly-inconsequential stuff from episodes 1 and 2?

the plot just becomes hollow self promotion.

Couldn't agree more... It not just Sherlock who thinks he's the bees knees... it's the whole production.

Shame and unfounded.

No one likes annoying drunks, why did we have to watch two of them for 20 odd mins?

I suppose it [i]is[/i] about time for the usual English "we've set 'em up, now let's knock 'em down" syndrome to kick in... 🙄

I'll add to the dissenters and admit I really enjoyed it. Yes it was a bit lightweight in terms of cerebral crime fighting but it was very good from a character development point of view.
I do think that they're setting it up for a fairly tumultuous climax though as there were (big) hints of relationship changes afoot and I'd be surprised if Mr Watson lasted the series if they want to keep things going.

Well Mrs Watson dies in the original books so maybe that'll be part of the climax?

Yes it was a bit lightweight in terms of cerebral crime fighting but it was very good from a character development point of view.

Surely the whole point of Sherlock Holmes IS cerebral crime fighting though?

Mr Woppit - Member

I suppose it is about time for the usual English "we've set 'em up, now let's knock 'em down" syndrome to kick in...

Not really - the first six were excellent and bore a passing resemblance to the originals, in terms of plot ideas, set up, characterisation etc.

Apart from a few character names, the last couple have no resemblance to the original canon, were paced very differently and seemed to have been aimed at a different audience altogether.

Is disappoint, tbh.

@wwaswas has it!

Now then...If they developed the curly haired Kids "character" and matched him with the ****less Major who stood at the shower cubicle door, I think they might just have something.. 🙄

But I'll agree, the next episode with be about Mrs Watsons death, the death of the impending child and Watson going off on one (or off on an OnOne...)

Quite like the Doctor/Pathologist Woman though 😉

Apart from a few character names, the last couple have no resemblance to the original canon, were paced very differently and seemed to have been aimed at a different audience altogether.

So what?

I'm going to have to tune in now for the next episode (not sure I was going to bother).... as Mrs Watson has been the highlight for me so far.

They've changed it.
For the worse.

That's what.

Oh, and if they do decide to remain a little more faithful to the originals, Watson's wife will die soon and he'll be back at Baker Street.
Before getting married again to someone who's never named. 🙂

The last episode sounds like it could be based on Charles Augustus Milverton. Let's hope for a bit more fidelty and a decent plot this time.

You're only saying that because it's different.

Demanding adaptations be precisely the same as the originals. Dull, dull, dull, dull....

Surely the whole point of Sherlock Holmes IS cerebral crime fighting though?

Nail, head.

So what?

I guess there's lots of existing tv around that does pretty much what sherlock did this series. There wasn't a lot doing quite what it did in series #1 & #2.

Mr Woppit - Member

You're only saying that because it's different.

Demanding adaptations be precisely the same as the originals. Dull, dull, dull, dull....

Yes, well spotted - change is very similar to difference.
Have you been drinking?

And no, I don't want it to be exactly the same as the originals - the Jeremy Brett series did that superbly.

But this series is so far removed from the originals they might as well have resurected Holmes & YoYo rather than Holmes and Watson.

Yawn...

Mr Woppit - Member

Yawn...

So I've answered your points but you can't be bothered to provide a constructive response?

Nice to see some things don't change, year after year.

And if it had been the same as last season, we'd all be going "well, it's crap, it's just the same as last season." There's only so long they can spin out "Holmes does something really clever" crime-of-the-week tales before it gets stale.

Well, Conan Doyle managed 60 stories and the character was more popular at the end than he was at the beginning. 🙂

Some became a little rambling toward the end, and a couple were quite similar, but still.

I reckon MG & SM could at least have managed 7 decent plots.

So I've answered your points but you can't be bothered to provide a constructive response?

I'm sure you're right.

See?
I knew you'd come round to my point of view eventually. 😀

Well, Conan Doyle managed 60 stories and the character was more popular at the end than he was at the beginning.

Some became a little rambling toward the end, and a couple were quite similar, but still.

I reckon MG & SM could at least have managed 7 decent plots.

I think I read somewhere that they weren't confident of getting a second or third series, so wanted/needed to jump to some big story lines pretty quickly. Sadly, this means they've glossed over a lot of 'minor' stories and compressed others down.

I thought last night's was the best so far.
The density of the info/script was pretty impressive.
Laughed a lot too.

I thought it was excellent, and very well written. I was laughing a lot.

Okay, it wasn't very plotty I admit, and the stabbing part was implausible but the dialogue was extremely good IMO.

I get that is wasn't all about the crimes, it went a bit Emo for a while, I still enjoyed it though, particularly the interviews with the wedding guests.

Anyone been watching Elementary with Johnny Lee Miller and Lucy Liu?

But... but... but... 😆

I will say I like Sherlock the acting is top notch, some of the lines sublime, Mary Watson is an excellent character BUT they need to have a sharper editor/producer. Last nights was 30 mins too long.
short sharp sweet would have produced a better episode.

Conan Doyles Sherlock was able to be physically athletic as well as cerebal, and this reworking has been brilliant but Moffatt and Gatiss have become maybe too smug on some elements of the reworking of the characters particularly Mycroft, better as a shady character lurking.

Still brilliant but so was
[b]
Ripper Street[/b] and I think that was not recommissioned as jungle get me out if here got more votes pah boo

I thought it was a bit slow and lackingng direction but rather enjoyed how it all pulled together for the climax.

Sounds like a quality Sunday night in to me. Was there anything on the telly?

vondally - Member
.........but Moffatt and Gatiss have become maybe too smug on some elements of the reworking of the characters particularly Mycroft, better as a shady character lurking.

Totally agree - way too much Mycroft in this adaptation.

And where are Gregson & Athelney Jones? Seems a shame that Lestrade gets all the screentime. 🙂

miketually - Member

I think I read somewhere that they weren't confident of getting a second or third series, so wanted/needed to jump to some big story lines pretty quickly. Sadly, this means they've glossed over a lot of 'minor' stories and compressed others down.

It's a bit odd really.
I'd love to know how they decided how to approach the adaptation - which stories to incorporate, who to leave out etc.

I'd love to see elements of 'The Man With The Twisted Lip', my favourite Holmes story, incorporated into one of the episodes, but I think the storyline would be seen as unecessarily provocative.

Let me sum it up:

First and second series : Great!
This series : Poor

Fact.

I thought it was self indulgent garbage. The previous ones have been excellent, but this just seem to be full of twaddle that lacked any internal consistency.
Very disappointed.

It went down well in Chrispy towers, great Sunday viewing.

Anyone know where the reception was filmed?

Wallop & Moses mentioned the venue back on p.1; Goldney Orangery, down Brizzle way, apparently.

As Wallop would tell you, & I did : the orangery and gardens of Goldney House, in Clifton, Bristol. It's owned by the university who built halls of residence in parts of the grounds in the 60s.
There's a marvellous C18 grotto in the grounds, all decorated with exotic seashells. If you're into leylines, there's also a decorative tower which is at the intersection of several.

The opening scenes in this episode were outside the Victoria Rooms, also part of Bristol University.

And Holmes got married in our local church. St Marys, Stoke Bishop.
At least they are not filming it all in London..

I was really disappointed with the first episode of the new series. It was smug and pandered to the show's phenomena with the focus on theories about Sherlock's faked death. The time in the first episode which could have been spent on character development (which is welcomed) went on simplistic stereotypes of people who use web forums. This meant more had to be jammed into the second episode which then spent too long on the bonding over drinks to set up a pretty weak joke about Sherlock and Watson being lightweights.

I also thought Mycroft's involvement in yesterday's episodes was unnecessary. We're not going to forget who he is! And don't get me started on what the director and editor thought they were doing with the transitions as Sherlock and Watson marched off to the barracks.

Anyway, it is still much better than most stuff on TV.

It's all gone a bit smugly up its own bum.

And, the plotting isn't brilliant. So many dumb errors in the Tube train bit last week. This week the method of death was just stupid.

Elementary, the US version, is probably better. Another English actor, but one who is acting rather than adopting a pose. And Rhys Ifans as Mycroft infinitely better than Gatiss.

Did like the drunk bit though.

I really like Elementary, it's got Lucy Liu in it.
With freckles!

I like elementary, but a good elementary still doesn't compare to a bad Sherlock.

I have watched both episodes and find it poor ,rambling and disjointed.Looks likeit was produced for daft arty camera work ,just horrible !

mrchrispy - Member
Anyone know where the reception was filmed?

Goldney House in Bristol I believe.

Interesting foreshadowing?

[img] [/img]

[img] [/img]

^ I do really hope that wasn't by accident 🙂

Yeah I saw that too. Mary is disconcerting. Sherlock knows she's a liar, she has no family background and she plays them both too easily.