[Closed] Separation/divorce etc... the man always gets f**cked, right?

But, however unfair it seems, the bloke always gets f**cked, right?

Anecdotally, yeah. Best of luck.

Sorry to hear this chap.

The man does not always get f****d. My sister is in the process of splitting up with her husband and he's keeping 60% of the joint equity/savings, she's getting 40%, and he's keeping main custody of their two boys (both teenagers). Given their situation, this is pretty fair.

It all depends on the circumstances and the ability of the two people to agree on and work for the best outcome for the children.

I've just deleted the jocular response that I had started typing and will only say that this is shit for you , your kids and your wife and that you have my sympathy and my best wishes for a favourable outcome for everyone

Sorry to hear that. I’ve been going through similar for the past year, and yes it seems so. My only advice would be to contact a solicitor BEFORE moving out. I wish I had done this!

good luck

Annecdotally i've heard or reaonable equitable outcomes and lots and lots of times where the guy got royally shafterd, but I've never heard of a sitaution where the woman got f****cked.

My brother-in-law seemed to do okay when he divorced.

Mind you, there were no children involved.

Uh, shocker.

Having been through this myself and seen my brother go through it, it entirely depends on the female side of the argument's attitude.

Brother got shafted, had to buy the wife out of the house and pay to keep her accustomed for gawd knows how many years (until she co-habits with someone else). Pays for the loss of her career (which she wouldn't have had anyway).

I, who probably deserved to be shafted, wasn't. Just a share from the house sale, monthly payments for the child (which she actually offered me to stop when I got made redundant!) and a quickie online divorce (which SHE paid for!).

Can't say much else.

Best I can say is don't agree to anything that you're not entirely happy with. You don't get points for being collaborative later down the line.

Hopefully you can do this all amicably but if not then work out what is and is not acceptable to you, go to mediation and stick o your guns. If you agree something in mediation and get that put in to an order it's very very hard to go to a contested hearing later and get something that was agreed, reversed.

Child maint is paid by the parent that doesn't claim the child benefit to the parent that does (which is frankly ridiculous)

It's shit but best of luck.

 it entirely depends on the female side of the argument’s attitude.

It's probably fairer to say that the attitude of both sides will decide whether it's an argument or a discussion.

I have to admit I don't know much about this.

I thought unless you had a fairly old-school Husband Works, Wife Housewife type relationship you didn't have to support the Wife, only provide for your Kids?

It’s probably fairer to say that the attitude of both sides will decide whether it’s an argument or a discussion.

Indeed. "Argument" was meant in the line of reasoning sense.

Nope - the man doesn't always get f**cked.

I know several women, my sister was one, who were so desperately unhappy with the situation they were "in" that they walked away with whatever was offered just to get the hell out of it, and happy to do so.

3 sets of friends have divorced. Two were amicable/even share, but one the fella got a new younger bird and royally shafted his wife - been going on three years and he still hasn't paid her the 'small' settlement nor signing off the agreement, despite being 'divorced' now. He got way more including rental incomes.

however unfair it seems, the bloke always gets f**cked, right?

I don't think that's true. There's a common perception among men that if they can't just walk off into the sunset as if nothing's happened then they're getting f**cked but it ain't so.

Child maint is paid by the parent that doesn’t claim the child benefit to the parent that does (which is frankly ridiculous)

Wut?

Yes and No ....

If she wants to shaft you... it will be easier.  If she gets advice to shaft you... and you don't get your own.

If she's willing to use the kids as leverage.  .... etc. etc.

My best advice is to do it as cooperatively as possible but with a proper family practice solicitor.

You are going to need to get all your financial stuff up to date and clearly set out...

Depending on your ages it might be worth trading some things (like part of your pension forever) against others like value of a house.... etc.

I don’t have much advice at all but hoping it goes as smoothly as possible with as little impact as possible to you all.

The only advice I would offer after the experience of a few mates is - children first.  When both parents do that, it seems to have a better outcome.

"My best advice is to do it as cooperatively as possible but with a proper family practice solicitor"

This. The more cooperative you both are the quicker, easier and cheaper the whole thing will be, it's less of an impact on your children too

Get recommendations for good local legal advice, an experienced legal exec specialising in divorce could be a better option than a solicitor

Only use a solicitor if you need to. No point paying out for them if you can agree between you.

Your fate in divorce will entirely depend on your wife's attitude. No one can predict what that will be until it happens. Prepare for the worse case scenario now and have your plans in place, legal advice taken etc before discussing the topic with your wife. Do not move out of the family home during the process and record everything.

Horrible situation to be in.

from bitter experience, i can advise you not to ever say anything negative to your kids about their mum.

you and her may well end up hating each other, but don’t tell the kids.

best of luck to you.

Agree with the comments about how amicably you can do it will affect the outcome. Having just been through this it has all worked out pretty fairly. 2 kids, but we didn’t have a house and I took on our debts when we split to give her a clean start. Do get a solicitor involved if there’s a house, saving and pensions involved as their advice and the ability to get a settlement sorted will pay for itself

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Yeah, sound like you’ve got a lot to think about.. sorry to hear about the issues but you do have lots of experienced folks on here that have been impacted by divorce..

But, however unfair it seems, the bloke always gets f**cked, right?

Anecdotally, yeah. Best of luck.

My mates going through a divorce, been 4 years since the split. Wife gets the house and contents, he  gets a rented accommodation in a shithole, but he does keep his windsurfing gear and the cat.

Sorry to hear DrP. Hope it all works out for all of you.

I could offer you a second opinion but I fear it will be the same as the original diagnosis!

One positive thing I can say is that one day this will no longer be something that is happening to you but something that happened. And remember that if you do come out of it feeling hard done by it will most likely be because your priority is your kids.

One positive thing I can say is that one day this will no longer be something that is happening to you but something that happened.

To some extent that is a choice... on one side whatever is agreed will keep happening... (obviously kids)

Whereas other stuff like pension can be debated and traded for a clean break.

This is why you marry a woman who earns more than you. Can't keep her in a lifestyle she's accustomed too, if she already has a better lifestyle than you when she leaves.

 I’ve never heard of a sitaution where the woman got f****cked.

Mmm - no. Not appropriate to give details on a public forum, but a friend is being royally shafted by (ex-)husband who has been awarded all kinds of stuff despite the years she supported him while he was trying to be an artist, including large part of house, pensions, assets left in wills by her relatives etc etc.

Depends on what you think is ****ed - I took a less lucrative career to work from home, told my ex if she wanted a divorce then she better be the one to move out & <span style="font-size: 0.8rem;">over 23yrs later & I'm still paying the kids back for the equity in the house that we agreed they'd have. All done amicably and meant we kept the family home for the kids and I spent way more time with them growing up than I would have if I hadn't got divorced.</span>

Good luck, try to keep it civil and don't get hung up on the petty shit - friends spent £8k arguing over £10k while everyone around told them to divide it amongst their kids 😞

Sorry to hear that DrP having went through similar a few years ago.

It did seem to me that the system, particularly where kids are involved is massively weighted towards "Mum".

I took a massive financial hit, but most importantly, the kids are happy and i am too.

The whole process will depend on how "decent" your partner plays things.

I pay a decent wedge for maintenance, but i still need to buy clothes for when they are at mine, as they are sent to me like tramps. My ex also likes to inconvenience me at every opportunity when its my time with kids (enrolling in additional activities etc). The latest at the weekend was from my youngest who said "Mum says i don't need to be a *mysurname" anymore, i can be a *exessurname*".

Anyway, get legal advice, but scrutinize it too. My Solicitor missed <span style="font-size: 0.8rem;">a few relatively standard points out of the separation agreement which i now have to live with. An example being festivity and holiday child care periods weren't explicit, meaning i haven't spent a Christmas day with my kids since the split.</span>

Sure, there have been plenty of ball aches on the journey, but i wouldn't swap my life now for the married version.

Yeah...I got bent over properly. Had been dumb enough to build a house on her fathers land with MY equity...But hey; not a Christian but "better to live on the corner of a roof than share a house with a scolding woman." And when she dies, I get a chunk of money from the equity. Oh wait...I am 5 years older...

Hey all... cheers for the replies and support...

I honestly feel like I’m (and other forum users too!!) constantly airing relationship troubles here! I guess it’s a bit like group therapy, whereby you know a few people, but most are strangers...

Like I said, it’s something we MIGHT be going through... I just contacted Nedrapier (cheers buddy) stating that our whole situation is a jumble of emotions/confusion/anger/love (yep..still love there, which makes it a hard decision.. I said to my father in law “the decision would be easier if I hated your daughter..”)

We actually had couples counselling last night, and I really thought that afterwards and this morning there was no hope (given her response) but in the “up-down saga” of my relationship, we actually had a long hard chat today about happiness, mutual respect for the other,  and CAN we actually focus on bringing us forwards... almost ‘starting again’ with new foundations.

I personally want the counselling to continue - no denying, she bloody hates it as she feels she’s “always the bad one”... I tried explaining counselling isn’t judging, and actually the questions the counsellor asks REALLY are answers I want to hear from her..to better understand why we act in the way we do to each other...

WHat is often quite cathartic is to actually get to the point you accept that you might no longer be staying together; a sort of ‘peace’ comes over me, and it helps me think a bit straighter...

I’ve explained that unless something changes and improves, then the outcome is obvious (for my own happiness)...

I think the long and short of it is that we kind of both have ‘issues and insecurities’ that possibly we’ve just been concerning ourselves about, rather than accepting the other’s issues.

Anyway... i hope today’s ‘breakthrough’ (it’s the most open she’s been with me for ages) IS related to the counselling, and we can continue with it...

Hmmmm...

DrP

I’ve never heard of a sitaution where the woman got f****cked.

A friend was close to being made homeless after leaving her abusive husband. She is trying to keep her poorly paid job while raising her young children. He has effed off.

IME it depends on the other half.
A female friend of mine was very generous to "disappearing" ex-husband in terms of giving him a divorce, selling the house etc. She could have put her foot down and refused to leave the house esp as children were involved but chose not to.

She is now happily remarried in a new house so it has worked out for her, so in the end she made the right choice.

Men can also make it hard for a woman...the best thing is to avoid a war but that is easier said then done when children, money and houses are involved.

No personal experience but my sympathies all the same. I know a few guys who have been through it. While starting out cooperative is great if it can be kept up, have a back up plan.

You know that scene in every 80s action film where the hero grabs a large black hold all and fills it with a massive selection of weaponry? Be ready for a battle like that.

Fingers crossed for the counselling and new start approach. If it works that would be a win all round!

There’s a common perception among men that if they can’t just walk off into the sunset as if nothing’s happened then they’re getting f**cked but it ain’t so.

Hallelujah Brother.

Chin up DrP, fingers crossed it all works out well.

Having just come out of the financial process, I believe it’s very dependent on which court you go to. My legal team were absolutely adamant that Joint Life Maintenence (JLM) orders were no longer de rigeur, however the hearing was in a different county and the judge seemed to think my highly capable ex was ‘doing her best’ at £9/hour three days a week.... He was so incorrect in many aspects it was terrifying. Women clearly didn’t work in his world.....

Problem was I couldn’t actually prove her business was capable of more (although we all knew it) as she ran it down and she played a good game. My lot were speechless.

She got exactly what she wanted, but I managed to offset the house versus the JLM, so I’m only financially crippled until kids are 21, not forever. Grateful for small blessings!

It’s totally geared up for the woman. At least my kids can never say I didn’t provide.....

In Scotland I'm led to believe it's a relatively fair process. The only part that's causing me consternation so far is

a) her opinion (fairly unfounded) that we're only in debt because of me. Despite the fact I had no debt when we met and she has started several unsuccessful businesses when she can be arsed working, all funded by my debt of course. This should be fairly easy to overcome.

b) That she gets a portion of my pension, a more fair portion than she would in England, but still in line with the above, she's never bothered to have a career or even a job where she's accrued any pension (actually just thinking about it she may have a pension from one job... Gotta make a note of that!).

c) Because she lined herself up to look after the kids and do **** all else, she's ended up being able to see them more days than I can manage around my work.

I don't think I'm getting ****ed over, in fact my life is much better than it was when I was with her, and as long as there are no surprises in the process it'll be mild resentment but relief that she doesn't get to continue to manipulate me and bleed me dry as she did when we were together...

Anyway, do your research, don't try to be nice as she'll feel hard done by anyway, it won't get you anywhere, she'll hate you for a bit at some point. Fingers crossed I manage to stay out of court...

Best wishes DrP. No actual advice, but I hope it works out as best as possible for your kids and you.

Good luck with the counselling, hopefully that will work out and you'll be spared the need to divorce....

KBO DrP

This is why you marry a woman who earns more than you. Can’t keep her in a lifestyle she’s accustomed too, if she already has a better lifestyle than you when she leaves.

This is what I’ve done. Problem is, she’s called Louise.

32 years ago for me ..and yeah we had one for old times sake the day we left the house for the last time..it was fantastic and almost made me change my mind ..

Almost !

Good luck ..ours was a very amicable break with no kids involved ..hope things work out for the best .

Good luck with the counselling, if there's something worth saving in the relationship then do your best to save it. I went for counselling with my ex, but by then it was too late by then.

I didn't get screwed in the divorce settlement, although it felt pretty bad at the time, and it was somewhat galling that when her parents die she'll be a multi-millionaire, when my parents died they left me a bit of dosh of which she got half. I paid her a lot of maintenance and kept 50% of the assets, I was lucky to be in a position to offer that, but I guess if you're a doctor you have a reasonable income.

The best decision I made was to buy solicitor's advice an hour at a time from the best divorce lawyer in the area. I applied that advice in my correspondence with her solicitor. It didn't stop them from sending me a massive bill for "managing my case", fortunately I had our agreement that I was just buying advice in writing so I told them where they could stick their bill.

Good luck.

I have been informed by my accountant that i would end up near destitute if i choose this route .... the other half would do very very well.....

All depends on circumstances around house, pensions value of any business and the lack of the other half having a career or job etc.

It appears as if the less you have the better off you end up.

Makes you kinda wonder why we get married dunnit 🤨🤦‍♂️

Good luck with the counselling, if there’s something worth saving in the relationship then do your best to save it.

On the other hand, beware of any seemingly quick results. Your other half might be buying some time to sort her war plan.

Makes you kinda wonder why we get married dunnit

Makes me wonder why other people do. I was smarter and never did, not a week goes by where I'm not glad for that.

Just going through the last stages of separation myself, divorce was finalised a couple of months ago and house sale is currently going through.

No kids involved and not got solicitors involved - agreed on a 60/40 split in her favour on the house equity as she put more money in deposit wise.

She ran off with a work colleague 9 months ago and is now expecting his baby, so no chance of a last hurrah for me!

Managed to stay surprisingly amicable under the circumstances!

Onwards and upwards!

It depends really. If you've brought in the most money then you'll lose out financially as her lack of earning power is considered a sacrifice to support yours.

Part of the reason I left my wife is that I felt she didn't pull her weight - either at work or around the house. It was all "too hard". This from a graduate of Yale and Cambridge who was pulling in around £14k a year.

I didn't get screwed in the divorce - it was my house, so she moved out and I gave her a couple of grand towards things we'd bought together I was keeping. I had given her half of my savings the year before (about £10k) as I was fed up paying for everything and being unequal in the financial power balance. So I was still paying for everything, but she had her "own" money she'd pay for half of things with. Never saw those £££s again.

Still, I went from owning half a house to owning all of one, so I guess I won there.

Twice divorced so guessing most of these things only apply to England because Scotland seems fair to me.

I’ve been seeing busses with written on the side “ divorce, get us on your side “

I’ll take a note next time and pm you.

😝

I can’t comment as I do not fully know your situation nor am clung together by a piece of metal in form of a ring.

Thank f as marriage is long dead in the water these days.

chin up though and seems you have priorities namely your children. 👍

Not gone through divorce but have been through the family courts over my lad.

As far as children go, if you both *truly* put the kids first it won't be so bad.

If one of you doesn't it will be a living hell.

I went through the courts twice just to see my lad.... she could break court orders with impunity with no realistic deterrent as he lived with her.... hence they wouldn't fine her/imprison her etc. Not that I wanted them to do that! I just wanted to see my son.

My solicitor warned me that the court process would be like going back to Victorian times.... The woman looks after the child, the man earns the money.

He was spot on in my case.

Now? My lad is 21, lives with me and by all accounts he is a fantastic young man with a truly kind heart.

He is still close to his mum which is great and is just how it should be. All kids should be allowed to love both their mum and dad.

Just put the kids first. At all costs.

I have no advice, but you're always welcome if you fancy a holiday in New Zealand with bikes to borrow.

Rich

ime whatever is agreed isn't adhered to anyway. my ex still hasn't paid me back the legal fees for our divorce 8 years ago & it was her idea! in hindsight though it's worth every penny.

so my moral is don't rely on the word of the other party get it agreed via a solicitor. good luck

Recently published research by the Marriage Foundation has been doing the rounds as apparently the divorce rate is down. They think it's because people are taking their marriages more seriously, but most people know its because most people can't afford to divorce, especially in terms of buying new houses, so are staying put and having affairs on the side.

I'm not saying I got screwed over, but when I divorced my ex-wife (7 year marriage, abusive alcoholic) she walked with over 200k thanks to me having savings, my work pension and an inheritance from my father. She only had debt, so the balance sheet looked like I was loaded. It was less than she wanted, but given that she originally said she was not going to touch the inheritance...

I feel for you and really hope that the counselling can help sort things out. Do take care of yourself though, especially your mental health, these things really mess you up.

Reading this, it's no wonder that men die earlier than women.

As has been said by many other posters, it’s not a forgone conclusion. It depends on the attitude of both parties. I left my ex just over a year ago and it was pretty rocky to begin with as she started a ‘new relationship’ (yeah right 😂) a few days later. With a bloke in San Francisco!! The kids suffered more than they should have done as she was away seeing him pretty frequently and it scared and unsettled them to the point where they both were referred for counselling by their school. Amusingly, he dumped her shortly afterwards.

However, fast forward 12 months and things are amicable between us, the kids are thriving, we’ve split everything 50/50 (even though I’ve probably put more in) and, most importantly, I’m happy and moving on with my life. Getting divorced is one of the best things that’s ever happened to me.

A couple of things I’ve learned (from my situation - yours might well be different)

1. Put the kids first no matter what and get a co-parenting agreement in place at the earliest opportunity that spells out clearly your access agreement.

2. Ask yourself honestly whether you want to be with your partner. If you come back with anything other than an emphatic yes don’t bother with relationship counselling, save it just for you.

3. Be prepared for your ex to make bad decisions and be even more prepared for them to be none of your business/out of your control.

Good luck