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Settle down or prices fall?
Looking to replace a Audi A6 estate for daughter....2005 plate 2.7 TDI and it is reaching the point of constant repairs and outlay......it has been in the family for a while so been brilliant.
She drives 70 miles a day to work and back as a police officer, so looking replace with something more economical, reliable, comfortable after a long night shift but needs to transport mountain bike, dog, 2 kids and partner.....see the priority list there.
Second hand prices are phenomenal.......so is there any chance that prices will drop in next six months to a year?
I am thinking not as dealers have a lot of cash in stock. She is convinced it will.
What is STW hive mind thoughts on this?
This has been done multiple times here.
Basically prices are going no where fast. If you hadnt heard ICE cars are being phased out and electric appears to be the only way forward according to our government and car companies who want to make a killing on over priced electric cars. So a shortage of new electric components, a shortage of places to charge electric cars means that people still want ICE cars.
Cheers,
ICE cars?
Recognize e cars are the push but beyond price point of a beat bobby.
Are you doing the buying OP? Are you comfortable with a private sale?
If so, I think you'll find prices are dropping already. Traders are definitely more stubborn on pricing, but I'd strongly expect to see further price reductions.
Get busy on Autotrader and see what you can find.
Internal Combustion Engine. But back in the day ICE to me meant In Car Entertainment aka stupid big amps and subs.
Basically wot FunkyDunc says. Unlikely to see any wholescale dip in used prices. New vehicle prices are only going one way and that's still dragging the used prices upwards.
Not in the short term. But what is her budget?
The PCP on the wife's car ends in Sept. We usually buy a car a couple of years old, keep it three and go again.
Problem is the equivalent car at 2 years old is now £25k ish (we paid £16k in 2020), and my wife's car is still the same value on forecourts as when we bought it! So higher prices + higher interest rates would mean a monthly payment at least £100 a month more to get back to where we were.
We've decided to pay the balloon, keep the car and see where the market is in another 18 months.
Or throw a few grand at the Audi and refresh it's suspension/bushes/brakes etc? How many miles are on it?
I've rebuilt/refreshed MrsRNP 200k mile Volvo V70 and I'm doing a 215k XC90 at the moment due to mental used car prices and preferring to repair and reuse.
Yes I am buying and it is cash......which dealers don't want.....finance required sir, nope, ohhhh.
I used the search before posting and came up with threads from a year ago basically saying market is going up, hence the post to see if any drop likely.
Not seen anything on Autotrader much cheaper than dealers.
ICE is in car entertainment....so I live and learn modern vernacular, appreciated 👍😁
If you're happy to wait another 6 months, you might find some cars impacted by the London ULEZ expansion will reduce the price of pre 2015 diesel cars coming onto the market. If you're looking for a newer car or need to consider ULEZ, I don't think it's going to 'reset'. Right now there is a lot of demand for cars newer than 2015, especially modest petrol cars. At the same time, new all new cars have gone up in price and down in availability and that effect on the used car market will last for years as those vehicles age.
Just beware of used car prices, paying £10k for a 100,0000 mile estate car with better MPG might not work out cheaper in the long run than keeping the existing car OR loan repayments to stretch to something in much better condition for £20k to keep for a long time.
A6 is 155k, but it is the cost and inconvenience of repairs when you have to get to a shift when bobbies are already under staffed.
My A6 allroad on 136 k just had 1.7k spent on suspension and is still needing more. Engine is fantastic but.....
We’ve decided to pay the balloon, keep the car and see where the market is in another 18 months.
Wise decision. My inlaws took out a PCP about 2 years ago. They have about £15k on the final payment, but Webuyanycar etc are offering £25k for the car !
We have a lease due to go back in early May, we have been looking at Polo's as a replacement and prices of them are still steadily rising on slight second hand. Unfortunately too, any 2nd hand car with low mileage or less than 2 yrs old, is only £2-3k less than list of a new. But then even ICE cars are 9 months lead time still
What is your budget for a replacement.
At 70 miles per day commuting plus other running around that's a lot of miles per year in an old car. And Audi A6's are a premium brand so attract premium parts prices.
I'd be looking at a Mondeo estate.
How old are you looking at and what kind of budget OP?
What is the budget? Can make more sense buying new instead of nearly new now
Kia ceed Estate 1.5 petrol 160hp available for £19,500 through brokers if you can wait until summer. Should do 50mpg on a run and comes with 7 year warranty. Would rather finance that than pay £10,000+ for a 5 year old car with no warranty
Do they have classified ads at her workplace?
People will be considering selling to balance their domestic books and a wanted ad might help
Swings and roundabouts, just traded in our battered 2010 Fabia with 100k on the clock and got £2300 for it, mum and dad have just sold a 2011 i30 with only 28k to the local garage for £3500.
70 miles a day commute is bonkers - Id be moving closer to work.
We have put up a wanted ad....her works offered her a transit van......
Price is 10 to 15 k but flexible- ish
Mileage is approx 23k per year, so lease is not a fiscal option.
We ....I ...have always had VW, audi, bmw or Volvo....one horrendous buy of a seat Altra makes me cautious of brand. That said. In the family we had a Citroen c2 1.4 hdi that was immense, no issues and clocked up 140k when we sold it.
I've been watching the market for a while as my lease goes back in May and to replace it on the work scheme will cost hundreds more and probably a long wait.
The prices certainly have not dropped much in the last 4 months with 4 to 5 year old cars still commanding 70% of their list price, which is insane! Can't win with new either as they've gone up massively so what was 35k 4 years ago is now 50k+, which in turn keeps used prices high (based on the cars I'm looking at). I've pretty much accepted the fact we are just going to have to suck up the extra cost.
As mentioned above, ICE usually represents internal combustion engine these days, not in car entertainment, like it should.
Kia ceed Estate 1.5 petrol 160hp available for £19,500 through brokers if you can wait until summer. Should do 50mpg on a run and comes with 7 year warranty. Would rather finance that than pay £10,000+ for a 5 year old car with no warranty
Gosh. I'm on the buy second hand at 50k miles for £8 grand, put 50k+ miles on it and sell it for 4 grand and maybe change the tyres in that time, swap repeat. But now that a 50k miles decent estate is £13-15k instead of 8, this really does make sense for the first time ever! 7 year warranty is absolute peace of mind. And car will probably be worth 10k in 7 years!
Not much use for this convo but that's food for thought, for sure. Ceed a bit small, mind, for the above requirements. A6-size waft for 1.5hr commute probably needed!
If you want to stick in the VW group 15k gets you a nice Octavia or Superb estate - random Autotrader searches...
Wise decision. My inlaws took out a PCP about 2 years ago. They have about £15k on the final payment, but Webuyanycar etc are offering £25k for the car !
interested in the working around this. My PCP runs till the end of the year, and I was hoping to have delivery of a new EV in the next month or so (it has since been delayed). Current car is a Q5 and Audi are very keen to buy it back, and with it all being with one buyer/vendor/pcp organisation it appears very simple - they give me a car valuation of what they will buy if from me for, a PCP early settlement value, and the balance (about 4k when I checked around Christmas time) is cash to me.
Due to delays in my EV (not coming from Audi) the reality is I will likely be wanting rid of the Q5 about 3 months prior to the end of the actual PCP full 4 year term, so I am sure the numbers will all change, though presumably not in my favour !
I paid the balloon on my PCP in November, no brainer.
I usually pay cash but the 4-year PCP was offered at 1% so I took it.
The dealer offered me the same that I'd paid for it, 4 years earlier, but now with an extra 50k on it.
Normally I'd get a new car but Covid more than halved my mileage AND an equivalent car to what I paid £22k for 4 years ago (it was 6 months old & 10k) is now looking at £42k...
70 miles a day commute is bonkers – Id be moving closer to work
This, although I guess if moving closer means higher house prices then it's probably not an option. I did a year of 60 mile each way commuting and it was a drag, you just waste so much of your own time each day.
i recently sold my 2017 Golf R. I paid £25,500 just under 2 years ago. I went the easy route and sold it via carwow (to save tyre kickers and general plonkers). It sold via carwow for £23,705, to a VW dealer in Derby.
Its now up for sale there for £27,299.
I think thats a good indication of where prices are currently.
I replaced the Golf with a 2018 Fiesta ST, which cost me £14,300.
The kia ceed Estate has a bigger boot than a 2007 A6 estate
15K for an 8 year old skoda linked above is just madness when compared to the kia unless I am missing something?
15K for an 8 year old skoda linked above is just madness when compared to the kia unless I am missing something?
The desire to stay in the VW/premium car brands? Only reason I posted.
I'd be going for a Kia with warranty still remaining though.
Recognize e cars are the push but beyond price point of a beat bobby.
You might be suprised
Electric cars are actually the ones seeing some of the largest depreciation at the moment.
High home electric costs mean they arnt quite as cheap to run as they used to be.
this Nissan leaf RRP would be 28kish. pre reg delivery miles ones can now be found sub 20k.
at the higher end of the market used prices on teslas are also dropping. Tesla have just announced another price cut to try and stimulate sales, the second price cut this year.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-64867287
edit
dealer mag highlighting the depreciation being seen by some EVs
Skoda we looked at and I discounted due to the 2.0 tdi engine which does have issues and dsg needs a proper service record but thank you.
She may transfer at some point but not yet, plenty of folk have to travel to work especially if you live outside a urban area.
Kia, interesting and will look at.
Has she looked at offers through Blue Light card or similar OP? Or does the police service have a salary sacrifice offer?
her works offered her a transit van……
Now we're talking serious money
😀
After two failed Land Rovers (both bought new) I persuaded my OH to test drive a Kia - I'd organised a top-spec Sportage.
She bought it.
5th year now and her only complaint is the 'badge'.
The superb is a decent car but calling Skoda a premium brand is stretching it a bit
The Kia is available through drive the deal for £19,236 or £19,790 if you want a non offensive colour
It seems to match the requirements perfectly apart from over budget but the overall cost of ownership over 100,000 miles could end up being less than other cars mentioned
Basically prices are going no where fast. If you hadnt heard ICE cars are being phased out and electric appears to be the only way forward according to our government and car companies who want to make a killing on over priced electric cars. So a shortage of new electric components, a shortage of places to charge electric cars means that people still want ICE cars.
I'm completely unconvinced by this.
The supply chain issues weren't caused by electric cars, they were due to COVID lockdowns all over the world and you only needed one supplier in one country to have a lockdown to screw up an entire production line. And there's still 'new' fossil fuel cars being launched, albeit usually with a caveat that they're the "last" which might make sales of a 911 surge slightly, but I doubt the Kia Picanto market really cares.
The bottom has already fallen out of the bangernomics market. The market for small (older/cheap) petrol hatchbacks and Berlingos for microcampers in particular seems to have evaporated.
I bought a Kia Carens, dull as dishwater but never missed a beat. Only bought it as it was only 18k new c 8 years ago, which is what I was going to spend second hand.
Kia are mechanically sound, well specced, but plastics and trim are cheap. Also the 7 year warranty can tie you into dealer network, I did for 2 year servicing, after that I got my local indie to do Kia spec services.
Carens is a Sportage underneath, stopped making it as Kia make more selling sportages. I d get another Kia deffo, 19k for the ceed estate is a good deal.
There are many reasons for prices being where they are but I think the main one is that we're hopelessly addicted to cars, and willing to pay extraordinarily large chunks of our income to own one, or several.
Until that changes, the prices aren't coming down a lot. Inflation is one way.
Out of all the reasons, I reckon the push for electric cars is low down the list too. Cars lasting longer, more refined, larger trading platforms, supply chain issues... All way above.
The bottom has already fallen out of the bangernomics market. The market for small (older/cheap) petrol hatchbacks
I'm not entirely sure. I paid £5k for my bottom of the range petrol Mazda 3 in 2016. It's now 14 years old, I've put about 50k miles on it, and Autotrader suggests it's now still worth something like £3000. That doesn't sound like the bottom falling out of the market!
if you're whacking megamilage on a car (as the OPs case) I'd be looking at unpopular brands that have already depreciated a tonne. For £7k or so you can get a lowish-miles, 70mpg astra diesel (euro6) thats perfectly nice enough. £20 tax too. In 5 years/another 100,000 miles it'll be worth £2k, so the depreciation is £1k a year.
The superb is a decent car but calling Skoda a premium brand is stretching it a bit
They're basically VW's but without every extra being a costly option. And VW's are basically Audi's.
Maybe not the previous gen MK2 superb linked, but current Skoda's are a premium brand now, especially when compared to a base spec Kia. And the prices reflect this.
Skoda’s are a premium brand now
vw themselves consider skoda a "volume" brand.
In terms of strategy, ŠKODA AUTO is bringing its expertise to bear in growth markets, with the aim of expanding the brand’s presence over the coming years, playing to its strengths in the cost-sensitive entry-level segment
https://www.volkswagenag.com/en/group/brands-and-models.html
Yes I am buying and it is cash……which dealers don’t want…..finance required sir, nope, ohhhh.
Then take out the finance to get the best deal and then take advantage of the cooling off period and pay it in full using your cash.
If it's going to do a big correction downwards can it do the t in the next few weeks please?
Got rear-ended last week in my Fabia and it's touch and go whether it's written off or not and I can't afford to buy anything remotely similar with the valuation they've given it. Still has to go for assessment for repair but as it's 9 years old, a lower spec (1.2 SE) and has 169k on the clock they have given an indicative value of £1300. The closest to it for sale is up at the £5k mark. Even going for unpopular makes doesn't make much of a difference, anything small and petrol with an MOT around 9-10 years old doesn't seem to dip below £4k. Those that are for sale are not exactly in good condition either. Hopefully I can buy it back as salvage and repair it myself as I have had the car from new (£7.7k, anything new is now double that!) and know exactly how it's been treated, serviced properly and what it needs soon (front dampers and top mounts, front brakes and a pair of drop links) which will all be a lottery on a second-hand purchase. I'd be wary that anything being sold currently has been punted on for a reason, people are keeping good cars right now so stock is of poor quality.
I'm in the same boat, my Merc C-class estate is touch and go as to whether it will survive Friday's bump. Waiting for assessment as to whether it's an economic repair as a replacement will cost about £1k more than I paid for mine 4 years ago.
VW's aren't basically Audi's rather Audi's are basically VW's
As mentioned above VW isn't a premium brand never mind Skoda
Not a vauxhall fan but that astra looks good value compared to some other options and could be cost effective if turns out to be reliable. But modern cars, especially diesels can throw yous £1000s of repairs easily
VAG group reached "aspirational" status in the UK some time ago. Along with BMW and Merc.
@ Vondally, if your daughter is near to Carlisle, this dealer has some excellent cars, and is a really trusted guy. He's got the 2020 Honda Civic for sale, over average miles, but still a bargain for someone. The civic can take an MTB, dogs, and people in them too.
https://www.usedcars4less.co.uk/Showroom#/details/6
I am up in Keswick tomorrow so may look in at Carlisle, cheers
I do not regret moving to a small turbo charged petrol after 15 years in diesel. I get as many mpg's from it (so cheaper fuel and servicing) and it was cheaper to buy than a diesel.
Yes the prices are silly.
But so may be your trade in value - I was astounded yesterday to see an identical car to our small & old one - 2012 Ibiza estate 1.4 16v with 110k on - currently for sale for £3k. We paid £7k for it at 20kmiles/9 years ago...
I miss the Volvo for all sorts of reasons - but the rational 'I need a reliable car, and it needs to cost less on repairs' has been (so far!) the right decision.
I suspect the incresing number of ULEZ / Clean Air Zones (CAZ) in city centres is going to contribute to prices being adjusted. Sheffield has implemented a CAZ and this doesn't (currently) affect personal vehicles, but other cities may well do. If many more cities introduce CXAZ's then non ULEZ diesels aren't going to be pariculalry attractive to city dwellers.
I did a WBAC quote on our car (Euro 5C) and they offered £7k, whereas Autotrader suggests £10k is the going rate. Are WBAC clever enough to look at my postcode and deem that local resale is going to be low due to the CAZ (even though they operate nationally), or are they just offering me a price for a quick sale?
I did a WBAC quote on our car (Euro 5C) and they offered £7k, whereas Autotrader suggests £10k is the going rate. Are WBAC clever enough to look at my postcode and deem that local resale is going to be low due to the CAZ (even though they operate nationally), or are they just offering me a price for a quick sale?
Sounds about right, that's a normal WBAC price. Mine comes out at £17k from WBAC and dealer prices are from £19k-£23k.
WBAC will aim to pay you a lot less than £7k, of course - that £7k offer is for a mythical "never driven off the forecourt" condition.
In your daughter's position, I'd probably look for a decent 10+ year-old Mondeo for £2-3k - then potentially change to something newer later if the market does drop (or just stick with it).
I’m not entirely sure. I paid £5k for my bottom of the range petrol Mazda 3 in 2016. It’s now 14 years old, I’ve put about 50k miles on it, and Autotrader suggests it’s now still worth something like £3000. That doesn’t sound like the bottom falling out of the market!
Maybe optimistic, there's loads of ~2008 Mazda 3's on eBay up for £950-£1400.
you might find some cars impacted by the London ULEZ expansion will reduce the price of pre 2015 diesel cars coming onto the market.
I don't know if I buy this. ULEZ has grown twice in London and there wasn't a reduction in prices, and people didn't dump their cars overnight.
I do not regret moving to a small turbo charged petrol after 15 years in diesel.
Have you checked your intake manifold? Does it need walnut blasting? 🙂
Have you checked your intake manifold?
It's due it's first service under my (and my fussy mechanic John's control), I'll let you know in a fortnight...
Maybe optimistic, there’s loads of ~2008 Mazda 3’s on eBay up for £950-£1400
That's a good deal I reckon! Maybe OP should cop one, it's a great little car...
I think the main one is that we’re hopelessly addicted to cars, and willing to pay extraordinarily large chunks of our income to own one, or several.
Of course we are, when public transport outside of any given city remains woefully inadequate, and is getting worse by the day, leaving people in rural areas without a car absolutely stuffed if they need to actually go shopping, go to a bank and have an appointment f2f with a real, sympathetic human, (sometimes), or just for social purposes.
I challenge anyone who claims they can manage without a car to live with my friend in her cottage near Castle Combe for a couple of months. It’s a mile walk to the nearest main road where a bus might be caught once or twice a day, and that’s either across country to Castle Combe, or along the Fosse Way, a narrow road with no footpaths or lighting, and with a couple of steep hills and sharp bends. I’ve walked it, it’s bloody scary. It’s two miles in the other direction to the A420, just as dangerous to walk, but more buses.
That civic above is a good deal as done 80k in 2 years, I once bought a car at auction that had done 50k in 1st year, all dealer services. Properly run in and all motorway miles, went on for about 10 years never missing a beat.
finance required sir, nope, ohhhh
We generally buy a car on finance and then pay it off early. Usually within the first year, but sure you could do it in the first month.
2nd hand prices are bonkers. We've been trying to replace an E39 535i since it munched its timing chain guides. 15-20k for 5-8yr old stuff nowhere near as nice. There are plenty of idiots prepared to pay these prices, but I refuse to join them. Chucking a couple of grand at it to fix it. Probably only worth that when repaired, but hey.
I challenge anyone who claims they can manage without a car to live with my friend in her cottage near Castle Combe for a couple of months. It’s a mile walk to the nearest main road where a bus might be caught once or twice a day
Sounds cosmopolitan compared to where I used to live 🤣. As part of some EU regional funding we (the Parrish council) were told we were getting a bus stop as there was finding for every village to have one.
The fact that the nearest bus route was 3 miles away and technically in another county wasn't a problem for the person with the funding. (And yes I had to walk/ride for the bus every morning).
And more importantly, just imagine how much better things would be for the 1% who probably can't survive without a car, if the other 99% stopped kidding themselves it was them.
leaving people in rural areas without a car absolutely stuffed if they need to actually go shopping, go to a bank and have an appointment f2f with a real, sympathetic human, (sometimes), or just for social purposes.
Rural Cumbria here. 6 hilly miles to the nearest shop.
One community bus per week that gives you a couple of hours in Penrith.
You can however get on a bus with the secondary school kids I believe before and after school. Term time only of course.
We generally buy a car on finance and then pay it off early. Usually within the first year, but sure you could do it in the first month.
My ex did it after week. Got a nice discount off the car and some extras (good deal on a service plan, mats, new tyres, roof rack etc) because she took their finance.
Waited until the paperwork arrived and paid them the £20k outstanding balance the following day.
I challenge anyone who claims they can manage without a car to live with my friend in her cottage near Castle Combe for a couple of months. It’s a mile walk to the nearest main road where a bus might be caught once or twice a day
Should move to a tiny flat in the nearest city that costs three times as much and then she could have all the benefits of living in a city... noise, pollution, overcrowding, building damage due to the 26 buses an hour that trundle past her bedroom window 24 hours a day, 7 days a week...
But so may be your trade in value – I was astounded yesterday to see an identical car to our small & old one – 2012 Ibiza estate 1.4 16v with 110k on – currently for sale for £3k. We paid £7k for it at 20kmiles/9 years ago…
I'll have one of these to sell in next month or so. 85K 13 plate. Very surprising what they're going for - similar on autotrader over £4k. Cost me £6500 3 years old 25k miles from a SEAT dealer in 2016.
Skoda are a normal brand now, not a premium brand, same as Ford, VW, Peugeot, etc.
BMW, Audi, Lexus, Merc, etc, premium.
We generally buy a car on finance and then pay it off early. Usually within the first year, but sure you could do it in the first month.
So long as the early termination and apr charges dont count for more than the cost of the discount. Most apr through garages at the moment is getting on got 10%. I would be surprised if discount would be 10%
Not sure prices will fall but there may be some divergence on regional prices.
With many cities implementing ULEZ schemes - the London extension will impact 200,000+ cars in London and several times that for drivers crossing the border of the new zone, there will be more demand (higher prices) for petrol cars and less demand (lower prices) for diesel cars in these areas.
Outside of London / other cities this could mean a new diesel car will be a good bet so long as it's used out of the current / proposed ULEZ schemes.
Isn't there a loophole where you can cancel the finance within the first 14 days with no charge?
Might need to have a read of terms and conditions...
Ex had no early termination charge. But this wasn't in the UK.
yes, it's the 14 day cooling off period.
Pretty sure with ours we've never had to pay any early repayment charges, perhaps it depends on the type of finance you take?
If you cancel the finance during the cooling off period is there any come back from the garage? The car sales reps probably give stuff away as they'll get paid on the finance, so if you use the cooling off period do they still get paid?
I have read that if the finance is cancelled within the first three months, then the dealer will lose their commission on the sale, which is fine if its not the dealer you potentially will be using to service the car or process any warranty claims through.
Do we have any car salesmen here who would like to comment on that?
We've done this 3 times now. Use their financial deals to get the discount and then pay it off within the 14 days.
Easy to do and no issue at all. We've gone on to use the service/warranty over the years with each car and also not been an issue. You never deal with the sales team again post purchase. It moves over to customer service department.
I'd look at something like this:
Naturally aspirated, cam chain, 39mpg, every chance it will be rust free, mine of the same age sails through MOTs with no advisories, family size with a good boot. I'd say it'd be good for a few years and cost v little.
If the finance deal is cheap no reason to use up cash and pay it off early, especially with double-digit inflation.
But then even ICE cars are 9 months lead time still
Where are you looking, or are you being picky. I walked into the dealer at the end of my PCP last November and had a new car in a couple of weeks. Just buy what's in stock. What is shocking is that a lowly specced Polo is now 20k. It'll do what i need and be fairly cheap to run.