[Closed] Scottish independence- where do you stand?

"your not welcome in our country scum"

I've been made very welcome here, and by people from many walks of life.

SD-253 - Member
You jocks are boring me now. Stick to what you are good at. Whining. No doubt you won't leave the union as you will have to put your hands in your pocket and pay your way. Something you have never done and no doubt never will.

As in the English are inferior?

Er... no. Sorry to spell it out, but I was poking fun at your poor command of language (and apparent lack of debating skills or critical thought).

Nothing like a bit of jock xenophobia

[img] [/img]

I'm English and would prefer it if the next time Farrage crosses the border WE don't let him back in either!!

and that BNP nobber as well, basically the same person any way.

dragon - Member

Northwind, this argument is mince, since Scotland doesn't have a choice if it is a signed up member of the EU. Scotland could only not fund EU students if it wasn't a member of the EU.

That's exactly what I said 😕 So, er, thanks for supporting my point I guess.

The rUK charges Scottish students. Scotland charges rUK students. rUK students in Scotland pay much the same as they would pay in the rUK. How frightfully, er, fair and equable.

"Xenophobic = Relating to a substance foreign to the body" the only word found to describe people who despise another despite being of the same race

Ever seen the video of Nigel Farage in Edinburgh? It's embedded in this article:

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/may/16/nigel-farage-edinburgh-protesters-van

You'll note that those nasty "xenphobic" protestors were holding a big sign saying [i]"Sexist, racist, homophobic, transphobic parties are not welcome in Scotland"[/i].

And the protestors in Aberdeen that he called "fascists" were in fact a group called "The Aberdeen Anti-Fascist Alliance".

SD-253 has previous.
This is him defending Bloom from UKIP over his "Bongo Bongo land" quote:

He is correct pity about his choice of words, as that just gives the politically correct middle class (so called) liberals a way of calling UKIP racist. If you given aid for the poor they just reduce there government spending on the needy by the same amount. India is prime example. If we are going to give aid at least we should choose what to give it for AND to be on the ground to see that's what it is being used for?

I am enraged by this thread.

So many: your - you're; their - there - they're, mistakes!

Argh!!!

Pedantry aside, it's actually quite difficult to understand what some are trying to say. Why don't we meet in a pub tomorrow evening and discuss more clearly?! That'd be good.

I'll have a pint a heeevy 😀

I know I said I would sign off, however felt compelled to say SD-253 appears to be showing lack of understanding of xenophobia as well as poor language skills.

On Farage, I don't understand why a protest of this sort was required. I am all for peaceful protest, which this went beyond. He is an idiot with little or no support in Scotland. This would not have changed had he been heard out. The entire event succeeded in looking ugly and legitimized Farage by giving him a platform on BBC Question Time.

On the issue on being offended by banter, we recently had an "is jock offensive" thread. Many seem to consider it was, which is perfectly understandable, but we can't say the English don't get our banter when the situation is reversed. I would probably feel offended if I went to England and saw the flags in the windows on the last page but with the arrows reversed.

Pedantry aside, it's actually quite difficult to understand what some are trying to say.

Cunning use of 'some are'. Taking no chances with the[y're/ir/ere].

On Farage, I don't understand why a protest of this sort was required. I am all for peaceful protest, which this went beyond. He is an idiot with little or no support in Scotland.

athgray - Member

The entire event succeeded in looking ugly and legitimized Farage by giving him a platform on BBC Question Time.

Yeah, I agree with that, I'm sure it was satisfying at the time but it was unproductive.

Thing is, UKIP's appeal is simple- they're the party for people who think the Tories aren't big enough **. And in england, that's a fairly large voter base. So by being bigger ** than the tories they win votes

But in scotland, the demise of the tories is because we don't like **. So trying to win votes by being even bigger ** was never going to work very well.

Of course he has no support. You already have a nationalist party running the place.

I'm not a supporter of the SNP at all, but you cannot equate the BNP(and their publicly "acceptable" face, UKIP) to the SNP.! 😀

Their respective attitudes towards immigration alone stand them miles apart.

is sd-253 a ukip sock puppet?

His name could linked be one of these [url= http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SdKfz_253 ]SdKfz-253[/url]

Or one of the these [url= http://www.amazon.co.uk/Panasonic-SD253-Breadmaker-Nut-Dispenser/dp/B00008WFDI ]Bread Maker with Nut Dispenser[/url]

SD-253 - Member - Quote
The other day I saw a Scottish flag flying in a garden in Lincolnshire, what would happen if you flew an english flag in Scotland? How long would it be before they torched your house?

I guess you've never actually been to Scotland then.

He did say earlier [i]"What makes you think I would ever want to go to that disgusting country?"[/i]

Though I'm sure he meant it in an entirely non-xenophobic way 😉

This thread needs a Doomsday film piccy

SD-253, see this guy 40secs in. You got a Scottish relative by any chance?

Warning, contains idiots and profanity.

"Their respective attitudes towards immigration alone stand them miles apart."

That's good as I plan to move to Barra or Ardnamurchan if the SNP claims UDI.

SD-253, see this guy 40secs in. You got a Scottish relative by any chance?

That's odd - he seems to be wearing an England strip in Central Scotland and yet for some reason he isn't on fire?

Terry Butcher in the Daily Record
. I'm very happy here. I drive past Loch Ness every morning from my home up on the hills and I have never known a more beautiful commute."After years of doing the M4 and M40, as well as the M25, do you know what it feels like to drive through Drumnadrochit on the A82 and look across the water to the village of Dores? Wow, it's paradise.

I don't think it's paradise more of a work in progress. .....but if there was ever a prouder more patriotic Englishman living in Scotland I don't know who he is. .Terry Butcher is also pretty popular throughout Scotland even with this celtic fan 8)

Oh right, Terry gets all the ******* praise

What about ME, ME ME ME ME ME.

Who the hell is Terry anyway 👿

Apologies piemonster should have given you credit for responding sd53 with such good sense. Sorry.

😀

I am sure he will miss that commute gordimhor. Although supporting the union I do like to hear positive views of the Highlands. Steve Peat said something similar about Glencoe in a video with Hans Rey and Danny Macaskill.

Now that he's in [s]Edinburgh[/s] Leith will Terry be commuting on his singlespeed?

An interesting observation 😯

[url= http://harddawn.com/why-america-must-say-no-to-scotlands-independence-from-great-britain/ ]http://harddawn.com/why-america-must-say-no-to-scotlands-independence-from-great-britain/[/url]

I like how they illustrate Scottish football hooligans by using a picture with an English flag in it 😉

I like how they illustrate Scottish football hooligans by using a picture with an English flag in it

And it's a German guy hitting an English guy...

I laughed just looking at the banner.

Street “hooliganism,” government welfare and alcoholism define much of Scottish culture.

Yes, I'd say this 100% accurately reflects my street. FACT. Maybe even a SCIENCE FACT.

I also eagerly anticipate liberation from Holyrood with the conquering army of Westminster. Will they bring Hershey bars?

Genius article, thanks for sharing.

Really that website needs linking into any thread where the BBC is claimed to be right wing.

They do not prize a healthy and muscled physique as boys do in the United States.

I did a laugh-wee. It was merely good til Sarah Palin weighed in. Eagerly awaiting some Bachmann.

I think it's satire - but scary that it's hard to be sure.

Wait what?

Are you seriously suggestion the Irish didn't invent gonorrhoea?

I'm choosing to believe it, the world's a better place if you suspend your disbelief.

[quote=piemonster ]Wait what?
Are you seriously suggestion the Irish didn't invent gonorrhoea?
I just googled it - twice.

To be sure, to be sure.

UKIP supporters want to leave the European Union therefore racist. Scottish Nationalist want to leave the Union but not Rasicst? The hypocrisy of the middle class politically correct and of course the jocks themselves. I wonder how long before the latter complain to the moderator and have these views removed and me blocked again? Uhmm is that called censorship?

I'll just mention the name Mike Russell and leave you to do the rest.

UKIP supporters want to leave the European Union therefore racist.

Nope

http://harddawn.com/why-america-must-say-no-to-scotlands-independence-from-great-britain/

Very surprised when back home to Inverness to hear most of the family saying no to independence, far cry from what everyone used to say when I lived there.

saleem - Member
Very surprised when back home to Inverness to hear most of the family saying no to independence, far cry from what everyone used to say when I lived there

But will they vote? Odds are the one's that are for it are more likely to vote. While the one's against won't bother. Or am I just being hopeful!

They'll vote, thats for sure.

SD-253 There is no doubt that some people really do feel their way of life is threatened,or that the EU is taking away their independence and some of those people have turned to parties like UKIP to express their concern. Its not their policy of having a referendum on EU membership that makes UKIP racist but the utterances of Mr Bloom, and their policy on immigration. UKIP in my opinion will do nothing to improve life for ordinary people and may well make it worse
The SNP said in their white paper

"Scotland's differing demographic and migration needs mean that the UK immigration system has not served our interests,"

Scotland needs more immigrants

*waves at the Scottish contingent

Just for the record.

As far as I'm aware, the actions of 'Moderators' on internet forums pose no infringement on free speech.

Somebody owns this website site, and its not you. It's their right to control what is posted.

If you wish to post missguided inflammatory bile. You'll need your own website forum. Or you could nip over to the Mail.

If we send all the Scottish Diaspora back North, will that solve the population problem?

If we send all the Scottish Diaspora back North, will that solve the population problem?

Not if they send the English Disapora back in return.

I'd quite like to keep the English diaspora here if they want to stay :-)...but were not having T Blair.

Michael Gove?

athgray:-potty mouth

http://www.bbc.scotlandshire.co.uk/

in other words Scotland needs more immigrants.

Very surprised when back home to Inverness to hear most of the family saying no to independence, far cry from what everyone used to say when I lived there

that's coz us Invernesians are an informed clever bunch 🙂

What does it say then Konabunny?

"Scotland's differing demographic and migration needs mean that the UK immigration system has not served our interests,"
in other words Scotland needs more immigrants. Supporting independence does not make a person or party racist.Knowing that many Scots find the term Jock irritating you chose to use it imo that shows you are not serious about wanting to put forward those views you claim to hold. Perhaps you should practice some self censorship in order to put your opinions over more effectively.

SD253 you do know that the last time the UK had a population of 30 million was in 1860. What's the case for a return to that number? And how would you implement a reduction plan, who goes and who stays?

PS BTW there are also more people who have left these shores to go live elsewhere than have actually came here. So the whole immigration thing balances itself out really(it's known that immigrants are net contributors to the economy). I saw something the other day, currently there are around 5 mil British nationals living abroad and around 4 million immigrants have came to the uk.

Gordimhor: it says

Scotland's differing demographic and migration needs mean that the UK immigration system has not served our interests

It doesn't say

Scotland needs more immigrants

. piemonster - Member
Just for the record.

As far as I'm aware, the actions of 'Moderators' on internet forums pose no infringement on free speech.

Somebody owns this website site, and its not you. It's their right to control what is posted.

If you wish to post missguided inflammatory bile. You'll need your own website forum. Or you could nip over to the Mail.

.seosamh77 - Member
SD253 you do know that the last time the UK had a population of 30 million was in 1860. What's the case for a return to that number? And how would you implement a reduction plan, who goes and who stays?

PS BTW there are also more people who have left these shores to go live elsewhere than have actually came here. So the whole immigration thing balances itself out really(it's known that immigrants are net contributors to the economy). Saw something the others day. Currently around 5 mil British nationals living abroad and around 4 million immigrants have came to the uk.

PS BTW there are also more people who have left these shores to go live elsewhere than have actually came here. So the whole immigration thing balances itself out really(it's known that immigrants are net contributors to the economy). I saw something the other day, currently there are around 5 mil British nationals living abroad and around 4 million immigrants have came to the uk.

just as a matter of fact there is a huge amount of working class who get no where near minimum wage because according to the Labour party mass immigration has reduced working class income. On the good side (irony) the middle class have cheap labour reducing there cost of living so that evens it out! PS let me be more precise vast amounts of the working class get nowhere near minimum wage. Of course you gain enormously by that... Lucky you!

 

You never quoted anyone. You suggested it. Attenborough is wrong if he said that, you got linkage? Curious to see his actual wording, I know he has issues about overpopulation, that I don't agree with.

Of course you gain enormously by that... Lucky you!

A lot of Scotlands young bright folk move to south or abroad for work. Our Nurses and Doctors all go to australia. Some come back.

Most of the clever migrants I have met have been amazing and are often professionals we should be keeping. Teachers working in bars etc.

There are a few not so desirable ones however. But they pick your scottish strawberries. and live in terrible housing owned by Asian Slum Landlords next door to middle class low paid Scottish semi professionals like me. No migrant would work in the arts. Not paid enough.

The anti english extremism is total bollocks. Even my parents are talking about it increasing with independance and they brought me up as the most tolerant balanced reasonable person ever. Totally media led. They think war over Faslane and a Gibralter/ Northern ireland situation is imminent.

Maybe we will get some English/French/Swiss/Alpine owned MTB Holiday companies operating in Scotland?

konabunny - Member
Gordimhor: it says

Scotland's differing demographic and migration needs mean that the UK immigration system has not served our interests
It doesn't say

Scotland needs more immigrants

+1

You could read that sentence which every way you want, "differing" could mean we want more or we want less.

Being Welsh I don't have that much of a say in this, but I certainly think there are plenty of lose ends and inaccuracies to be tied up before anyone should consider independence it a viable option.

.seosamh77 - Member
You never quoted anyone. You suggested it. Attenborough is wrong if he said that, you got linkage? Curious to see his actual wording, I know he has issues about overpopulation, that I don't agree with

.seosamh77 - Member
Of course you gain enormously by that... Lucky you!
I'm as working class as you can get. HeeHaw wrong with immigration. Newsflash not everyone in the world wants to come here.

SD-253 With an ageing population and shrinking population of working age,Scotland needs more immigrants of working age. This is from the FT
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/1ff49154-4ab9-11e2-9650-00144feab49a.html#axzz2pTtgsw88
I would welcome immigrants from anywhere.
Konabunny The whole aim of coalition immigration policy has been to reduce net immigration. The article in the FT says that a policy allowing more immigration would be an aid to economic growth in Scotland. The Scottish government has set population growth targets which it will not achieve because of aUK immigration policy which takes no account of the situation in Scotland.

SD-253, I get paid £6.31 an hour. You?

SD I don't know if you are racist or not, I do think you are a tadger though!

konabunny/wiggles. It is generally accepted by both sides of the Indy debate that iScotland will want to allow in more immigrants than rUK. In fact, one of the scare stories is that this will result in a need for border guards at Carter Bar (neatly ignoring the fact that Eire and the UK currently have different immigration policies and a shared travel area without any problems)

.konabunny - Member
Gordimhor: it says

Scotland's differing demographic and migration needs mean that the UK immigration system has not served our interests
It doesn't say

Scotland needs more immigrants

Since when does the UK set the rules for immigration? And do please tell me how Scotland is affected by UK immigration rules. Surely Scotland can get the immigrants it needs from within the EU? Or are you saying you need non EU immigrants? Your answer IF it is forthcoming will be interesting!

[quote=SD-253 ]
Since when does the UK set the rules for immigration? And do please tell me how Scotland is affected by UK immigration rules.
Immigration policy is not currently devolved to the Scottish Government.

.scotroutes - Member
SD-253, I get paid £6.31 an hour. You

scotroutes - Member
SD-253 »
Since when does the UK set the rules for immigration? And do please tell me how Scotland is affected by UK immigration rules.
Immigration policy is not currently devolved to the Scottish Government.

Immigration law is reserved to the UK government, not devolved to the Scottish government. As I already mentioned Scotland needs immigrants of working age from anywhere.

[quote=SD-253 ] you haven't answered the question why does Scotland need immigrants from outside the EU?
Who has said it needs immigrants [i]specifically[/i] from outside the EU?

.seosamh77 - Member
SD I don't know if you are racist or not, I do think you are a tadger though!